# Re: [EVDL] EV charger map



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

The emails could be sent individually - John didn't suggest (that I saw)
that it be a bulk email. That's why the soul in question would have to be
so enterprising - it'd be a heck of a lot of work. 

Grassroots campaigns like this always are. Hours of work weekly over years
rather than a few minutes here and there.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Morely Dotes
> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 10:48 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map
> 
> > From: Neon John <[email protected]>
> >
> > Some enterprising soul could take the electronic Woodall's, compile a
> mailing
> > list and send a letter to each RV park suggesting that they hang a
> sign
> > advertising EV charging and suggesting a fee structure.
> 
> What seems like a good idea isn't always. This would be unsolicited
> email, sent in bulk. Unsolicited bulk email *is* the definition of
> spam.
> If you don't follow strict Government guidelines, it's a criminal
> offense, and even if you do, it's still cause for getting your Internet
> account terminated at every reputable Internet service provider.
> 
> What you need to do is figure out something would attract the RV park
> owners to a Web site, build a site like that, and provide a link for
> them to *ask* for information about charging outlets.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*



> Morely Dotes wrote:
> 
> >> From: Neon John <[email protected]>
> >>
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Ha! My reply was smug because I spotted someone making the assumption of
*bulk* email - while I was myself assuming email! Blinders are funny
things.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Doug Weathers
> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 1:24 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map
> 
> 
>


> Morely Dotes wrote:
> >
> > >> From: Neon John <[email protected]>
> > >>
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

I don't think I'd email. I think I'd start locally, calling campgrounds on the phone. John's idea is a good one. It seems to me that RV parks and campgrounds would be the easiest to recrcuit. As fewer people travel far from home or go RV'ing, this would be an opportunity to make up for lost revenue. They wouldn't have to do anything special except hang a sign and maybe put a line about it on their websites.

I'm familiar with Woodall's and it still exists. I have a login for their website. I'd start on this right away but I'm on reserve duty for the next couple of weeks.
________________________________
Message: 13
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:09:24 -0600
From: "Rod Fitzsimmons Frey" 
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map
To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" 
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

The emails could be sent individually - John didn't suggest (that I saw)
that it be a bulk email. That's why the soul in question would have to be
so enterprising - it'd be a heck of a lot of work.

Grassroots campaigns like this always are. Hours of work weekly over years
rather than a few minutes here and there.



________________________________

Rich A.
Maryland
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/371.html
http://patriotfuel.blogspot.com/




_________________________________________________________________
Making the world a better place one message at a time.
http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_BetterPlace


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Not to dampen the spirits....butttttttttttttttttt.......
The camp sites for the RV's and Trailers have 220 already available.
Im sure from the site owners perspective its already done....just rent
the appropriate site. 

Of course it shouldn't hurt business for them to put up some signage
'EV'ers Welcome' 


> I don't think I'd email. I think I'd start locally, calling campgrounds on the phone. John's idea is a good one. It seems to me that RV parks and campgrounds would be the easiest to recrcuit. As fewer people travel far from home or go RV'ing, this would be an opportunity to make up for lost revenue. They wouldn't have to do anything special except hang a sign and maybe put a line about it on their websites.
> 
> I'm familiar with Woodall's and it still exists. I have a login for their website. I'd start on this right away but I'm on reserve duty for the next couple of weeks.
> ________________________________
> Message: 13
> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:09:24 -0600
> From: "Rod Fitzsimmons Frey" 
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map
> To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" 
> Message-ID:
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> The emails could be sent individually - John didn't suggest (that I saw)
> that it be a bulk email. That's why the soul in question would have to be
> so enterprising - it'd be a heck of a lot of work.
> 
> Grassroots campaigns like this always are. Hours of work weekly over years
> rather than a few minutes here and there.
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> 
> Rich A.
> Maryland
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/371.html
> http://patriotfuel.blogspot.com/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Making the world a better place one message at a time.
> http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_BetterPlace
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 

-- 
lyn williams <[email protected]>


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*



> On 14 Jul 2008 at 11:09, Rod Fitzsimmons Frey wrote:
> 
> > The emails could be sent individually - John didn't suggest (that I saw)
> > that it be a bulk email.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*



> lyn williams wrote:
> 
> > Not to dampen the spirits....butttttttttttttttttt.......
> > The camp sites for the RV's and Trailers have 220 already available.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Sorry for venturing so far off topic so early in my relationship to the
list... but there would be no business relationships if there was no
unsolicited communication. Email is no different than a phone call, IMO -
if you're polite and have something to say that's of interest to the
recipient, then it's not bad manners, it's human interaction. (It's very
clear that individual emails aren't spam in the legal sense, as you note
below). It's not a stretch to suggest advertisements on billboards or TV
are unsolicited as well - we're just accustomed to them.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of EVDL Administrator
> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 10:44 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map
> 


> > On 14 Jul 2008 at 11:09, Rod Fitzsimmons Frey wrote:
> >
> > > The emails could be sent individually - John didn't suggest (that I
> > saw)
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Although the campsite idea is great, I agree about the rent.

I've done quite a bit of camping at RV parks, both with tents and 
travel trailers.

And to be honest, with some of those folks behind the counter, it 
will take quite a bit of convincing that you only want to charge for 
a couple hours instead of spending the night.

I'm sure the majority of them will say after you go through your EV 
spiel. "Sure, you can charge up but the fee for the space is going to 
be $35.00. Do you need water and sewage too?"

Even if you did send out messages to places like KOA. The message may 
not get to the people behind the counter who will be completely 
oblivious. They'll look at you with the same blinding stare a deer 
gives when it's caught in your headlights.

But I guess it doesn't hurt to ask. That's the only way to get the 
word out.

Alot of these places use golf carts as utility vehicles to get 
around. You could say the car basically uses the same type of charger 
as their golf carts and you just need a couple hours from their golf 
cart charger outlet to get back out on the road.

I tried to charge up at a Shell Station one time and they wanted to 
charge me like they would charge anybody for a battery charge. $35 
per battery. And the stupid grease monkey started to count all my 
batteries! Even after I tried to explain that I only needed a couple 
kilowatts which at the time was 8 cents per kilowatt hour and I 
offered to pay them $1.00 for the electricity. Nope. They wanted to 
charge $35 per battery. I had 6-volt batteries at the time so the 
cost would have been $280 to charge up for a couple hours!!

So it's going to take alot of convincing to get these people to 
understand. That's the biggest problem I see.

Same with Marinas.

My advice if you bring your EV to a campsite: Bring a pup tent along 
too.

There is a campground about 6 miles from my house. I may drop in to 
see what they think just to test the idea out.

Chip




> [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > Message: 17
> > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:53:37 -0700
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*



> Chip Gribben <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >Although the campsite idea is great, I agree about the rent.
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

The problem is that the huge numbers of buisnesses and people that
abused the "unsolicited phone calls" made me get rid of my land line.
The ones that abused unsolicited faxes got shut down by law. And the
email ones are automagically routed to /dev/null.

Buy an ad in the back of a magazine that RV places will see.
I donnu, sell them a plug or meter that enables them to tap into
multiple EV accounts per day with limited space and a place for them to
advertize their new service.


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

These might be relevant. Not specifically camp ground/park related...

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4184/is_20080701/ai_n27885194

http://www.pge.com/includes/docs/pdfs/shared/environment/pge/cleanair/evmanual.pdf

No relationship to PGE/PG&E except as a customer.

Greg
-- 
View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Re%3A-EV-charger-map-tp18448037p18467672.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

A couple of friends of mine that drive EVs (usually Sparrows but they have
other E powered cars as well) charge at different KOA sites in CA. 
They tell me they have it down to a $5.00 flat fee for 240v 50 amps at all
of the KOA campgrounds they use. They usually plug in for about 3 hours. 
This is in Northern CA from the S.F. Bay area north to the border.
shred


Chip Gribben wrote:
> 
> Although the campsite idea is great, I agree about the rent.
> 
> I've done quite a bit of camping at RV parks, both with tents and 
> travel trailers.
> 
> And to be honest, with some of those folks behind the counter, it 
> will take quite a bit of convincing that you only want to charge for 
> a couple hours instead of spending the night.
> 
> I'm sure the majority of them will say after you go through your EV 
> spiel. "Sure, you can charge up but the fee for the space is going to 
> be $35.00. Do you need water and sewage too?"
> 
> Even if you did send out messages to places like KOA. The message may 
> not get to the people behind the counter who will be completely 
> oblivious. They'll look at you with the same blinding stare a deer 
> gives when it's caught in your headlights.
> 
> But I guess it doesn't hurt to ask. That's the only way to get the 
> word out.
> 
> Alot of these places use golf carts as utility vehicles to get 
> around. You could say the car basically uses the same type of charger 
> as their golf carts and you just need a couple hours from their golf 
> cart charger outlet to get back out on the road.
> 
> I tried to charge up at a Shell Station one time and they wanted to 
> charge me like they would charge anybody for a battery charge. $35 
> per battery. And the stupid grease monkey started to count all my 
> batteries! Even after I tried to explain that I only needed a couple 
> kilowatts which at the time was 8 cents per kilowatt hour and I 
> offered to pay them $1.00 for the electricity. Nope. They wanted to 
> charge $35 per battery. I had 6-volt batteries at the time so the 
> cost would have been $280 to charge up for a couple hours!!
> 
> So it's going to take alot of convincing to get these people to 
> understand. That's the biggest problem I see.
> 
> Same with Marinas.
> 
> My advice if you bring your EV to a campsite: Bring a pup tent along 
> too.
> 
> There is a campground about 6 miles from my house. I may drop in to 
> see what they think just to test the idea out.
> 
> Chip
> 
> 
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> Message: 17
> >> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:53:37 -0700
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

???? After all isn't that how the infamous 4 hour nap got stated in the Motel industry. You could turn over that room (campsite) 4 times per day and make some cash without ever changing the sheets. Just make sure that the receptical is sanitized for your protection. 
???? Most of the campsites I visit come with 50 A? 240Volt recepticals. You could collect a lot of juice in 4 hours. 
??????????????? Rick


All we have to do is get a few converts who realize that they can make $5 for
a couple of hours and a dollar's worth of electricity in an otherwise
unoccupied slot and the momentum gets started. They talk to other campground
owners and it grows exponentially. Isn't the current buzz-word for that
"viral marketing"?




-----Original Message-----
From: Neon John <[email protected]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Sent: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 7:31 am
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map





> Chip Gribben <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >Although the campsite idea is great, I agree about the rent.
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

> From: "Rod Fitzsimmons Frey" <[email protected]>
> 
> Email is no different than a phone call, IMO 

You are incorrect, sir. The user (in the USA, indirectly; in most 
foreign nations, directly) pays to receive email. The ISP *always* pays 
to receive email. In most cases, it is an incremental cost per Kb. My 
own Internet business is one of the very few with a flat-rate monthly 
cost for bandwidth.

With some exceptions (cell phones, collect calls, and metered usage 
landlines), a phone call in the USA comes at no cost to the recipient.

So, while I am sure that's your opinion, it differs radically from the 
facts.


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Facts are subjective. Without exception, phone calls costs money too....
Even if there was no charge associated with the actual call, people are paid
to answer phones? Are we discussing and debating business ethics now? Maybe
its me but this topic is taking a fork in the road. Business' use email and
phone interchangeably now, as with all the misguided threads floating
around, just use common sense. Opinions and facts, lots of gray area.....

I pay a flat rate for my business land line. I pay a higher per month than
the metered usage to save money, but some how, money is still paid.... I'd
love it if it didn't as you suggest. Come on now...... Thats just my
radically different opinion...

On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 10:09 AM, Morely Dotes <[email protected]>


> wrote:
> 
> > > From: "Rod Fitzsimmons Frey" <[email protected]>
> > >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

I do a lot of email broadcasts (news letters) and can give you some guide
lines. 
1) The information needs to be relevant to the recipient (should be OK
here)
2) You need an opt-out ( so you need a database and need to track replies)
3) Content needs to be information rich (should be OK )
4) Keep it short and to the point, inform don't sell.
5) Once per quarter seems OK, if appropriate.

If it were me, I'd set up a web page with details, manuals and opt-in. Plan
out a quarterly news letter with opt-out. 

Make the news letter information rich, maybe a story on someone already
providing $5 charges with an profit breakdown. Give them the link to the web
site.

Send one copy of the news letter out. If you target it tightly, I can't see
how you would have a problem. If anyone opts-out, be polite and thank them
and remove them from the list.



Greg
-- 
View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Re%3A-EV-charger-map-tp18448037p18471188.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

My email sorted weird today so this probably isn't the last in the thread.

Instead of viral think organizational. Send a letter to the KOA organization
and explain
what you want and how it would benefit the KOA member campgrounds. Include
some simple
calcs so that the campground can see how much profit they make just for
letting someone
plug in. i.e. the 3 hrs at 240/50. Show them that the most the line will
supply is 36kw
for that 3 hour charge and that at say 10 cents a kwh the cost is 3.60 and
the profit is
$1.40 for something that is already there. And how they don't have any wear
or tear on
anything and in 3 hours the customer is gone. As well as mentioning how they
could spend
money while hooked up etc. Don't try to sell them just try to explain to
them this is a
way to make a few extra bucks for the site owner. Plus a few other good
points someone
had mentioned in the other msgs I can't find ;-]

Then people can just ask KOA where or look at the book. And instead of
slowly spreading 
the entire organization has the info. 

Dave


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

On Tue, 15 Jul 2008 10:50:05 -0700 (PDT), gregj888 <[email protected]>


> wrote:
> 
> >
> >I do a lot of email broadcasts (news letters) and can give you some guide
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*



> Dave King <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> 
> <good points snipped>
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:47:39 -0700, Morely Dotes <[email protected]>


> wrote:
> 
> >> From: Neon John <[email protected]>
> >>
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Last mounth I stop at a county park in fl. Manatee park, they wanted $15 for 
sewage dumping. Not cheap for getting rid of your sewage. I hope electric is 
cheaper
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neon John" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 6:05 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV charger map


> On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:47:39 -0700, Morely Dotes <[email protected]>


> > wrote:
> >
> >>> From: Neon John <[email protected]>
> >>>
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EV charger map*

Think about how you would react if someone asked to plug in their EV for a
few hours at your house, compared to how you would react if they wanted to
dump off 30 gallons of sewage at your house....  I'd gladly allow the
first......... and not the second.



> Jack Riggi <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Last mounth I stop at a county park in fl. Manatee park, they wanted $15
> > for
> ...


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