# 1954 Renault 4CV #R4eCV



## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Dear colleagues,


as suggested by fellow forum-member brian_ in the new members introduction, I will start a thread for my EV-Conversion of a 1954 Renault 4 CV. For those of you who are not familiar with this nice little french car (rear engine and RWD), here's a picture together with its great-granddaughter Zoe, who is already fully electric and won't need any surgery ;-):












My plan is to document the whole conversion process here step by step. 


With this first post I'd like to give you an idea on the rough lines of the conversion. My plan is to keep as much of the originality and driving dynamics of the original car as possible. This will mean that some key values will have to stay within a band of +/- 10% of the original car, e.g. power output in KW and weight. I might make an exception for torque though ;-) 


Also for the same reason I want to keep the clutch and gearbox, with the added value of some "classic" feedback and noise. This will be the main difficulty on this car, as the flywheel/clutch assembly is integrated into the engine, so the gearbox comes without a bell housing... so there might be the need to fabricate a custom solution there. I will talkt to you later about that and include some specific pictures for better understanding. 


But to start with the simple things, here you can see how easy it is to separate the drivetrain from the chassis on this type of car: 












For the technical details, here's my rought plan: 


Battery System: 
4 x Tesla Modules in 4s configuration, most probably one in the petrol tank compartment, two in the back and one in the front. 

No decision yet on the BMS and charger. 


Motor: 
FIMEA Engineering N50D1, 15KW @96V, 140 Nm of torque, 7500 rpm max. 












Controller: 
Curtis or Sevcon, tbd. 


Looking forward to all your questions, comments or suggestions - I might also have some questions for you too while moving along!


Best regards, 
Remi (R4eCV)


PS: Not sure if any of you ran into a similar problem: I had originally written a much longer text as the one above, but once I got to submit it, the system had logged me off and I lost all of my work. Note to self: The next time I will preparte the text offline and then paste it into the forum!


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

Keep the gearbox / clutch is probably not the best idea.
What about reuse a complete drivetrain of an i miev / peugeot ion?
Or another transmision if this is simpler. My Smart fortwo use a VW golf transmission without clutch and I can drive only in third gear from 0 to 100 km/h. I ususally use 2e in town and 3e at highway.

Anyway, this is a nice little car and good luck with your project.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Yabert said:


> My Smart fortwo use a VW golf transmission without clutch and I can drive only in third gear from 0 to 100 km/h.


If the operating range of the motor is wide enough, driving in a single gear is practical... after all, that's how production EVs work. If the transmission is not shifted while driving (because one of the stock gear ratios - presumably first or second - is suitable), the clutch is not required... and without the clutch, the flywheel is also not needed.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello Yabert and brian_


Thanks a million for your replies and for your thoughts about the transmission setup. 


There are three main reasons why I want/need/should keep the original gearbox/clutch assembly: 


1) The main philosophy/strategy of the conversion. I want to keep everything as close as possible to the original. This includes driving dynamics, feedback, noise and even some "sluggishness" of the response of the drivetrain. Also, all changes must be reversible (at least in theory). 


2) Local technical regulations for Motor Vehicle Testing in Switzerland: As long as I limit the changes to an "Engine Swap", the testing process is somewhat overseeable (I still wouldn't say easy though). Bigger changes will call for a complete re-homologation of the vehicle, which leads to tremendous cost (in excess of $5'000) just for the testing and certifications. Also, other upgrades (e.g. braking system) will be needed, which would completely alter the character of the car as per bullet 1). 


3) I am living in the middle of the Alps, with steep mountain passes over 2'000 metres of height. On a car with such low power (15KW) the possibilty to adjust the power band of the motor through a gearbox can be very welcome in some situations, resulting in less amps and therefore less strain on the system, including batteries. 


So for these reasons, the original gearbox is set. 


I went down the other road already to check other options. E.g. I had a complete drivetrain of a Renault Twizy on hand, which would have been in the target values as well with a Letrika/Mahle motor with 13 KW. But it just doesn't fit in with the selected conversion strategy, especially regarding originality and reversibility. 


Hope you understand where I am coming from







. 


Will post some updates regarding gearbox asap, just need to find out which is the best option to include pictures in this forum. In my first post I tried to link to external sources, just found out here that we can also attach some pictures, will try it with this post just to see how these images would show up in the thread.... 


Best regards, 
R.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> Motor:
> FIMEA Engineering N50D1, 15KW @96V, 140 Nm of torque, 7500 rpm max.


I found a manufacturer's web page for the N50 motor series, but it's short on information. Do you have any performance curves, showing how available torque or power varies with speed, at your design voltage? The rated power values at all voltages and speeds correspond to torque well below the stated maximum torque, so it's not clear if the power is continuous and the torque is for a brief period, or the torque peak is at a much lower speed, or what is going on.

It does look like a heavy motor for the power, perhaps only because it doesn't (in the base form) have any forced cooling. It should be possible to use a smaller motor with forced cooling; if a suitable motor is more powerful than desired, it should be possible to limit the power to suit legal requirements by a controller setting.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

With that nearly flat engine-side housing plate (where there would normally be a cast extension of the housing or a bolt-on bellhousing), the transaxle certainly is unusual... but this design is so old that the conventional layout was not yet well established. This feature does raise the possibility of replacing that plate with a custom mounting plate for the motor (and a clutch if desired).

The transaxle's input shaft presumably protrudes a substantial distance beyond the housing, to reach into the clutch hub. That means that any motor mounting needs to include a spacer (a function normally provided by the bellhousing), unless the motor has a hollow shaft allowing the motor to mount over the shaft instead of beyond it. YASA makes motors which would fit well, but they don't have anything small... their P400 is much more powerful (and therefore expensive) than required.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello brian_

Again thanks a million for your thoughts. 

Regarding the motor options: I am well aware that there would probably better options available worldwide. But in addition to the strict power requirements, the vechicle testing department of my local authority also requests the motor to come with full documentation on CE-certification, EMV compliance and so on. This rules out all the likes of e.g. HPEVS motors, which would be much lighter. The Fimea motor has been successfully used here, e.g. in the conversion of a Mini, and are therefore certified to be used as traction/conversion motors. As it is mounted in the back of the car, the cooling could be a bit of an issue, so maybe it's not even the worst option even seen from that angle. 

As said, my favourite would have been the Letrika AMV 7122. 

I have been in touch with the owner of the converted Mini who confirmed that the Fimea is a very good motor with a good performance curve. I don't have the full documentation here with me at the moment but will be glad to share it as soon as I can. 

For the clutch bell housing I am currently working on the CAD for the transfer case between the motor and the gearbox. Will also share it here asap to get your thoughts on it. 

Thanks again & best regards,
Remi.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Btw - this is the front side view of the actual gearbox with the protruding input shaft:










Best regards,
Remi.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> ... in addition to the strict power requirements, the vechicle testing department of my local authority also requests the motor to come with full documentation on CE-certification, EMV compliance and so on. This rules out all the likes of e.g. HPEVS motors, which would be much lighter. The Fimea motor has been successfully used here, e.g. in the conversion of a Mini, and are therefore certified to be used as traction/conversion motors.


That's certainly an important factor. 



R4eCV said:


> As it is mounted in the back of the car, the cooling could be a bit of an issue, so maybe it's not even the worst option even seen from that angle.


Given the desire to stay close to original where practical, I assumed that you would place any required radiator (whether it is cooling the battery, inverter, or motor) in roughly the same location as the original radiator, which appears to be over the axle. The complete electric powertrain should need less cooling than the original engine.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> For the clutch bell housing I am currently working on the CAD for the transfer case between the motor and the gearbox. Will also share it here asap to get your thoughts on it.





R4eCV said:


> Btw - this is the front side view of the actual gearbox with the protruding input shaft...


It really does look like a typical transmission, but with no bell housing installed. Fascinating...

If you don't modify the input shaft, its length plus the length of shaft protruding from the motor sets the minimum length of the bell housing / spacer required, and a flywheel will add to that.

If you don't need a clutch, and if you are willing to modify the transaxle input shaft, and if the input shaft doesn't need support at the end... you could cut off much of the protruding shaft length and build a coupler which goes onto the remaining splines, reducing the length of the housing and how far back the motor must sit.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

brian_ said:


> With that nearly flat engine-side housing plate (where there would normally be a cast extension of the housing or a bolt-on bellhousing), the transaxle certainly is unusual...
> This feature does raise the possibility of replacing that plate with a custom mounting plate for the motor (and a clutch if desired).





R4eCV said:


> Btw - this is the front side view of the actual gearbox with the protruding input shaft...


So it looks like the sensible plan would be to design the bell housing or other extension to seat on the machined face and bolt through the provided holes (where the engine bolts to), leaving the transaxle case intact... especially if you're operating a clutch, but even if eliminating the clutch and thus not needing the throwout bearing and fork.


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## Eddie49 (Dec 6, 2018)

brian_ said:


> ... and if the input shaft doesn't need support at the end... you could cut off much of the protruding shaft length and build a coupler which goes onto the remaining splines, reducing the length of the housing and how far back the motor must sit.


The great length of the non-splined part of the transaxle input shaft suggests that it does need support - presumably from a very long or very deep-set spigot bearing in the end of the crankshaft.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello colleagues

it is always a good sign when my ideas match with the suggestions from you experienced guys! 

My plan is to build a transfer case to house the flywheel and the clutch assembly. 
The transfer case would consist of two round aluminium adapter plates (not sure yet of the required thickness, I started with 15 mm for now), each plate with the specific bolts (for gearbox or motor respectively) on an inner ring and the holes for connection bolts on an outer ring. I would like to mount the gearbox-side adapter plate on top of the existing machined cover as seen on the previous picture. 

In between the two adapter plates I would insert a cylindrical tube of 5mm Aluminium, held in place by a milled groove on the inside of the two adapter rings, and bolt everything together on the outer rings.

Here's my first sketch of my idea:














What do you think of this concept guys? 


Thanks & best regards, 
Remi


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Eddie49 said:


> The great length of the non-splined part of the transaxle input shaft suggests that it does need support - presumably from a very long or very deep-set spigot bearing in the end of the crankshaft.


Yes, there's a good chance of that, but it's also possible that it only needs support if the is the clutch disk hanging on it.

An internal drawing of the transaxle would help.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> My plan is to build a transfer case to house the flywheel and the clutch assembly.
> The transfer case would consist of two round aluminium adapter plates (not sure yet of the required thickness, I started with 15 mm for now), each plate with the specific bolts (for gearbox or motor respectively) on an inner ring and the holes for connection bolts on an outer ring. I would like to mount the gearbox-side adapter plate on top of the existing machined cover as seen on the previous picture.
> 
> In between the two adapter plates I would insert a cylindrical tube of 5mm Aluminium, held in place by a milled groove on the inside of the two adapter rings, and bolt everything together on the outer rings.i


That looks to me like it should work (as long as the bolts don't interfere with the transaxle housing); an alternative would be to use weld the adapter plates to the tube... skipping the clamping bolts entirely. For this welded fabrication to work, one set of bolts (presumably the ones on the transaxle side) would need to be accessible outside of the tube; if both sets of bolts (into the motor and into the transaxle) are inside the tube, then it must be a two-piece housing to be able to assemble everything.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

I have checked with a first printout if it would work on the front plate with the bolts and it looks pretty good to me (you can see the outline of the gearbox cover plate on it): 










So I will most probably pursue that way. It will take a while as I'll need to identify a good machine shop... I have none on hand at the moment, so will have to investigate further. 

But will look into some other stuff in the meantime. One question that comes to my mind: Are there standard boxes for Tesla modules available or do I need to design them from scratch too? 

Thanks and best regards, 
Remi.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> Are there standard boxes for Tesla modules available or do I need to design them from scratch too?


I think you're starting from scratch. Although Tesla (like every other EV manufacturer) sees the need for an extensive and substantial enclosure, many DIY builders think the plastic cases on the modules are fine, so they don't put in them in a proper enclosure... there's not even agreement on what level of enclosure is needed, so with every conversion having different packaging requirements, there's no market for a standardized enclosure.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Thank you brian_!

Will look in the battery section if I can find some good practices on battery enclosures. I absolutely agree on the need of a proper enclosure, especially for the underfloor modules, but also in the motor compartment, as they would be exposed to some extent.

I can see that you seem to have a great knowledge in EV conversion there, and you got me intrigued: Would you like to share the link to your projects with me so I can have a look at your own stuff too?

Cheers, 
Remi.


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

I have 1980 Renault le car (lecric leopard)

It has torsion bar suspension as i believe yours dose

The previous owners brother said it was lowered with just a wrench

Its so low cant get in or out of driveway

Any easy way to raise it back at least a few inches???

Thank you


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

swo said:


> I have 1980 Renault le car (lecric leopard)
> 
> It has torsion bar suspension as i believe yours dose...


I don't think the Renault 4CV has any suspension parts in common with a Renault 5 / LeCar; you're probably thinking of the Renault 4, which is much like a 5 / LeCar but very different from a 4CV.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> I can see that you seem to have a great knowledge in EV conversion there, and you got me intrigued: Would you like to share the link to your projects with me so I can have a look at your own stuff too?


Electric cars are just the latest variation of my area of personal interest, which is vehicles in general; it's also an overlap with my technical background. Being curious, I have looked into the mechanical and electrical power solutions in many different EVs and plans for conversions... but I haven't converted even one myself.

I started in this forum because I need to replace the engine in our Triumph Spitfire, and was considering an EV conversion (rather than just an engine rebuild or swap, which I've done with other vehicles). I learned a lot about the options... enough to decide not to do it! Seriously, there are some good Spitfire conversions in this forum, but there are also lots of reasons not to do this, at least for my situation. I do have a plan for the Spitfire (with a Chevrolet Spark EV motor), but it is unlikely to be executed at this point, for various reasons.

People come into EV conversion with many different backgrounds, from being able to build electronics and program embedded computer systems but having no idea how anything in a car works, to being able to rebuild an entire car but having no idea about concepts such as current, voltage, power, and energy. Some are very knowledgeable in a single brand or type of hardware but seem unaware of alternatives. I think an important function of the forum is to help fill in the blank areas.

For me, these conversion planning discussions are a great opportunity to learn something new. For instance, I was familiar with the general layout of the early rear-engine Renaults, but I didn't know about the truly bizarre choice of rear suspension (the swing tubes or "trumpet castings" as very narrow-based arms) until I looked at it more closely for this thread.


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

one day when a car dies
I want to make an electric boat
out of the parts
but for now just want to get these cars working
cheers


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

ok I thought someone said it was 

must be the r4 as you said


have any info on how to raise the suspension/torsion bars on r4/5?


I looked in some books and they show bolts under the seat inside the car
and some flanges to put vise grips on but cant see any of that on my lectric lepord/R5






thx


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

hello brian_

Your story is very impressive. I think I've never met anybody in an online forum just going around helping other people, with over 3'000 posts and no project on his own. Hats off to you sir!

I have quite a collection of different Renault vehicles, from 1924 to today! So eventually I might be able to introduce a few of my other cars too - and having said that I can include the picture of another car of mine today in answer to the question of member @swo regarding the torsion bars. Brian is of course right that the 4CV and R4 have nothing (or, let's say, not much) to do with each other. They are a few years apart, in between them there's even another car: The Dauphine. 

Here's a direct comparison. This is my 1976 Renault 4: 










and this is the car I am currently converting as per this thread: 










Regarding the torsion bars I will need to check the workshop manual. I might even have the one of the R5 somewhere in my office. As soon as I'll get something I will let you know @swo!

Best regards, 
Remi.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Oh, and despite being fully aware that nobody wants to watch youtube-videos: 
Here's my explanations for less technical viewers on the missing clutch bell housing on my 4CV. 

https://www.youtube.com/embed/Lc9Ukcfueqw

You guys are a step ahead here and know that I am close to a solution for that in the meantime.

Best regards,
Remi.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

...and then I nearly forgot to also give some feedback to @Eddie49 on the non-splined end of the input shaft: As you guessed, there is a pilot bearing/bushing on the crankshaft side holding the whole lengtht (about 30mm) of the non-splined part of the input shaft. Here you can see it: 










In my understanding I will need to include some sort of a similar bearing/bushing on a coupler between the motor output shaft and the flywheel in order to support the input shaft. Do you agree? 

Best regards,
Remi.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

R4eCV said:


> ... As you guessed, there is a pilot bearing/bushing on the crankshaft side holding the whole lengtht (about 30mm) of the non-splined part of the input shaft.
> ...
> In my understanding I will need to include some sort of a similar bearing/bushing on a coupler between the motor output shaft and the flywheel in order to support the input shaft. Do you agree?


Yes, with a clutch on the input shaft that support should definitely be provided.

Thanks for the photo, which is a reminder of how small this car is... the crankshaft flange and main bearing housing look like something sized for a lawn tractor, rather than a car.  The principles are all the same, though, including that the flywheel bolts onto the flange as with any typical car.

Usually the centre of the crank flange includes a boss so that the face of the pilot bearing is closer to the clutch than the bolting face. In this case, it is actually a bit recessed, which may explain why the end of the input shaft is unusually long... to reach the pilot bore. It doesn't look like there's a (needle) bearing in there, so I assume that it just has a bronze bushing.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

*R4/5 suspension sidetrack*



R4eCV said:


> I have quite a collection of different Renault vehicles, from 1924 to today! So eventually I might be able to introduce a few of my other cars too - and having said that I can include the picture of another car of mine today in answer to the question of member @swo regarding the torsion bars. Brian is of course right that the 4CV and R4 have nothing (or, let's say, not much) to do with each other. They are a few years apart, in between them there's even another car: The Dauphine.


The naming can be misleading, which is what tripped up swo. The 4CV (like the better-known 2CV and a bunch of larger cars I had never heard of) is from Renault's era of naming by nominal horsepower; the Renault 4 is from a later era of numerically-named models which started in 1961 (oddly, apparently with the "3").

Mechanically, the 4CV is one of the rear-engine cars, and the 4 and 5 are the later front-engine style. The design differences go far beyond the engine placement, so there will be little if anything in common. The 4 and 5, on the other hand, are similar to each other.



R4eCV said:


> Regarding the torsion bars I will need to check the workshop manual. I might even have the one of the R5 somewhere in my office.


I think the Renault 5 is fascinating, because of the unusual engine placement for a front-wheel-drive vehicle (behind the front axle and transaxle), the novel rear suspension configuration (one side is ahead of the other, to allow for long lateral torsion bars), and the car is the basis for the awesome mid-engine R5 Turbo. But I've never worked on one. I thought I might find the front torsion bar adjustment in a quick web search; I didn't find anything clear, but it looks like it might be necessary to push the bars out of their splined sockets and re-insert them after rotation by a spline tooth or two to change height. Too bad if that's the case - I was expecting something like my 1985 Honda CRX, with adjustable bolts on the levers at the bar anchors.


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

I hope not the guy said it was lowered with just a wrench
So hope easy to raise up a few inches

The lectic lepord was imported to american car company.?
As a glider or electic car has volt batteries in it and small motor
It the one low to the ground
The other one is a convert with kodiak controller and 10-11” motor
Had yellow tops in it putting lg pacifica batteries into it
Now
Trying to figuar out a bms for it
Never had one befor


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

swo, would you be willing to start a separate thread about the R5? There's some interesting discussion there, but it's really not related to Remi's 4CV. I'll keep some notes about the issues that you've raised.


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

Yea be great to have le car/ r5/ lectric leopard
Thread going
Not sure how to do that
Thank you


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

swo said:


> Yea be great to have le car/ r5/ lectric leopard
> Thread going
> Not sure how to do that
> Thank you


If you are using the regular web browser view of the forum, go to the All EV Conversions and Builds section, click the *Forum Tools* dropdown, and then click on *Post a New Thread*.

There will be something similar in the mobile view.

An administrator or moderator could also move the relevant posts from this thread to a new one, but there's no need to ask for that and it's always a bit difficult to decide which posts should move.


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## swo (May 17, 2019)

i see forum
but no forum tools
thx


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

swo said:


> i see forum
> but no forum tools
> thx


@swo: If you are working on a desktop, you should see the button to create a new thread here: 












Cheers, 
Remi.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

swo said:


> i see forum
> but no forum tools
> thx


In the mobile browser view, when you are viewing the desired section of the forum there is a plus sign in a circle: click it to add a thread.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello friends, 

I thought it's time for a little update, just realised now that I completely forgot to keep this log here up to date. So let's go with a few developments: 

Here you can see the FIMEA-motor and the flywheel/clutch-assembly in front of the car:


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

On the next picture here you can see the machined flywheel coupler, mounted on the motor output shaft: 










If you go further up in the posts you can see the original coupler from the old engine - so the new one looks pretty OK. Also, I machined a hole into the centre of the motor output shaft and put in a bronce bushing, just in the way it was on the original coupler. This is the pilot bushing, taking in the shaft from the gearbox.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

So let's have a look at the other side, the gearbox side. As you know by now, the car doesn't have a clutch bell housing. So as you can see from the drawings further above I decided to machine two adapter plates, connected with a round metal tube to create the missing clutch bell housing. This is the adapter plate on the gearbox side: 










As you can see, the adapter plate is bolted directly onto the gearbox cover, and I had to machine a groove for the control arm of the clutch release bearing, which you can see in the middle. 

So this is the whole newly developed clutch bell housing finished: 










On the near side you can see the gearbox cover, so from that hole the gearbox splined shaft will go into the the new transfer box, and on the far side the motor will be attached. Stay tuned to see!


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

And then it was time for a dry test, if everything fits together. 

The gearbox there is actually not the one from my Renault 4CV, as it was already in the car, but a nearly identical one from a later Renault 4. Some parts were used for quite a long time within the Renault model family! 










Again, on the near side the gearbox, then the transfer box (clutch bell housing), and on the far side the FIMEA motor. You can also see the protruding control arm for the clutch on the right side (and on top of the gearbox the stick for the gearbox lever of a Renault 4, some of you might remember that the lever would protrude from the dashboard of the Renault 4 in a very typical way, this was due to the fact that Renault decided to just turn the gearbox around for their FWD models so the gearbox position resulted well in front of the front axle, so the control lever needed to go horizontally all the way over the engine to the very front of the car. On my earlier 4CV, the engine is in the back and the gearstick in a traditional way on the floor, so the gearbox is slightly different to the one shown here).


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

And then the moment for an actual assembly in the car came. The assembly is a two-step-process: First the adapter plate and cover plate have to be mounted on the gearbox side which already sits in the car, then the round tube will go on top of that, and finally the motor/flywheel/clutch assembly has to be slid onto to the gearbox shaft. As I don't have an engine jack I used the forklift to carry out that last step:


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

So this is the situation right now: The new electric motor/clutch assembly is in the car now, and the motor sits on the original motor mounts in the back, as required by the authorities: 










So basically that was the motor mounting part. Still have to modify a few details, the height needs to go down a few millimeters, so will modify the mounting brackets, but in general I am pretty happy on how things turned out in this phase. 

Next step of course will be the mounting of all electrical components. I will take it step by step and hopefully keep you updated a bit more frequently. 

In the meantime, please let me know your thoughts - and of course I am always open for your tips and suggestions!

Best regards, 
Remi.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

It looks like everything is going as planned, which is rare. 

Thanks for the updates.


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Cheers brian_ ! Still waaaayyy to go, and I have a feeling that the more difficult part is yet to come. 


The following parts are on the waiting list to be mounted: 


4 x Tesla modules 
SimpBMS Battery Management System 
Elcon 3.7 KW Charger
Curtis 1238-7621 AC Motorcontroller
A small DC-DC converter (96-12V), open for suggestions
Type 2 Chargeport
Wiring, wiring, wiring…


Does that configuration make sense so far?


Best regards, 
Remi.


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## aquabiologist (Sep 8, 2017)

Hi Remi

Very nice build!

I have a question regarding approval of your car by the Strassenverkehrsamt here in Switzerland. Do you need an electromagnetic compatibility test for approval?


Gesendet von iPhone mit Tapatalk


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello aquabiologist, 

what a pleasure to read from you! You're the first Swiss that crosses paths with me here on this forum - although I have to admit that I haven't been very active on here.

The EMV approval is a huge issue indeed, and I am glad you are mentioning this, maybe we can even share some experiences.

This is what I understand:
Although the EMV compliance has always been part of the legislation, most vehicles that have been tested before January 2019 didn't have to pass a full EMV test if they were built exclusively for private use and not for resale. As far as I know these vehicles have a "REMARK 178: CHANGE OF VEHICLE HOLDER PROHIBITED" in the field 14 of the vehicle licence. According to some sources, this practice has been abandoned as from 2019 on, requiring all builds to certify their EMV-compliance. I couldn't find out exactly what were the reasons for that change, as nothing in the legislation changed in that period of time. 

I am currently following the following approaches: 

- I have been in touch with my local MFK back in 2018 asking them what would be required, and at the time they didn't mention EMV compliance, but just CE compliance of the components. Based on this answer and on the fact that the underlying legislation didn't change from then, I will try to base myself on the principle of legal certainty. A very daring approach I know, but worth a try. In my experience, it's always worth trying and speaking with them rather than just complaining. I once imported a 1983 Renault 4 from France that apparently didn't meet the emission standards, and everybody told me that there's no chance it will ever be driving on Swiss roads... but see what happened: 










- I am also documenting the build as good as I can in order to have all the technical documentation ready for inspection once the project will be finished. This might be important to prove that the CE marks are present also on hidden parts etc. 

- I am trying to use components that have been used before in Switzerland and have the relevant CE marks and other certifications available. This is e.g. the problem with HPEVS products, as they don't have this kind of documentation available. My FIMEA motor e.g. is european built and has the relevant marks. 

- If everything fails, I might have the possibility to export the car to my second home in Ireland, pass the NCT there. 

- I also hope in changes of legislation and harmonisation with the rest of europe, although it is still patchy there as well, as the example of France showed recently. 

I would be very interested to share some experience with you or other Swiss builders on that very topic - I think that we need to act together in order to solve these flaws in legislation or practice. Luckily, Switzerland usually approaches these kind of problems with some common sense. Not always, but most of the times ;-) !

Looking forward to hearing from you again!

Best regards,
Remi.


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## aquabiologist (Sep 8, 2017)

Hi Remi

Nice to hear from you!

Actually I am in a group of swiss vw T2 and T3 owners that are looking into the certification of ev conversion. If you are interested, send me your email. I would forward it to the admin, so he could invite you to our group. Its in schwiizerdütsch though ;-)

Meanwhile here is a document, which contains the current regulation in Switzerland.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TpbwxAENP2ImdF_UrZGbzyvyMyJ6Kngt/view?usp=drivesdk

As you said, EMV is mandatory now, according to this document. Registering the car for personal use is no longer an option. But as to why the rules changed and are not the same as in the rest of europe is a mistery to us too.


Cheers!

Daniel


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Thank you Daniel!

I know that group and I even know one of your colleagues there personally, we've been discussing these issues just recently. 

As said, I don't have a firm plan yet but looking into options. The last and least preferred would be an export and re-import. 

I'll keep you posted if I'll be able to find out more here. 

At what stage are you with you T2 anyway? 

Best regards, 
Remi.


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## aquabiologist (Sep 8, 2017)

crazy! small world hey 

was that Marius?

anyways, i am using my bus for weekend trips and holidays.

i will not start before its clear, that i can get the conversion road legal. having watched countless youtubers converting (including yours!) i am aware that the conversion itself is hard enough.

but i do have a fully equipped garage with other hobby vw enthusiasts, so theoretically, i am ready ;-)

so for now its an all virtual conversion, runs great [emoji23]


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Hello guys,
just a quick update on my conversion which is finally nearing completion! All components are in the car now, and the first test drive has been completed. Here's a few updates the build: 

On this picture you can see the dry-fitting of the rear battery encosure and other mounting brackets. I cut these from alluminium with a waterjet cutting machine. All components use the original mounting points, not a single additional hole has been drilled into the historical metal. 










On the next picture, there's some low-voltage and signalling cabling going on. 










(...continued)


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

And then finally I could go into (preliminary) programming the Curtis 1238e-76xx Controller and BMS: 










Looks utterly weird to attach a computer to a 1954 car, right?


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

And then finally the car rolled out of the workshop under its own electric steam for the first time! Still lots to do and details to solve, but what a great moment! I will post a rolling video soon. It's just awesome!!!


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## R4eCV (Jul 25, 2019)

Guys, I actually just noticed now that I never shared the short 60 second maiden voyage video of this car, which happened more than a year ago! So sorry about this, but here it is:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="



" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

If there's any questions about this conversion, please just ask.

Hope you're all enjoying summer, working on a new project right now, so stay tuned!

Best regards,
Remi.


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