# First EV build



## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

The quad bike stripped, only ice mounted. When i remove it i can try to mount one of the electric motors on the chassis. Probably i will try them both to see which one preforms best.


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## madderscience (Jun 28, 2008)

interesting build. your biggest challenge may be figuring out where the batteries go.

For the best range, a couple of 12V golf cart batteries (160lbs or so), for best performance, a lighter pair of 12V AGM deep cycle batteries (anywhere from 50 to 150lbs).

as for motor selection, the drive motor is more likely to be designed for continuous duty, but for your purposes it may not matter. probably the motor with the bigger brushes and bigger commutator would be the better bet. (better current handling capability).

the motors may have a splined output shaft on them, it could be fun to figure out how to interface that, but for quick and dirty, you can fit almost anything together if you just weld it.

Good luck.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Here are some photo's of testmounting the pumpmotor.
Its mounted without making any adjustments to the motor or chassis, just to see how much space it takes. The holes on de mountingplate of the pumpmotor correspond exactly with the holes in the chassis for the original motor, what a coincidence 
I'm planning to do the same testmount with the drivemotor but for this i need to make some adjustments, its not going to be as easy as the pumpmotor. 
My idea is to mount them both and see how they preform, first just with a 12v battery, then a second in series to have the 24v they had in the forklift. This with no controller, transmission mounted temporarily (probably with a quick weld as you said) to see which one moves the quad the most, maybe do a little spin round the car park, just by holding the battery cable to the battery. The most powerfull will be the one that i'll use.
The drive motor is a bigger series motor than the comp pumpmotor but i'm not sure about its condition. It has bigger, double brushes, windings are heavier but it just doesn't run very smooth. I'll post some pictures of it when i open it up to drill the holes for mounting it on the quad.
For the batteries i'm planning of using deep cycle gel batteries, 12v, connected in series to obtain the necessary voltage. First i thought of using 250ah,12v batteries, i could put 2 on the inside of the chassis easily but i think i'll first decide on which motor at what voltage to use (probably 48v) and do some testing before planning the battery pack.
The 250 ah batteries would be great for range, but they weigh a lot (about 70kgs a piece).If i use 100ah batteries(29kgs a piece) maybe i could fit 4 of them where the original ice and gas tank where, would be just fine, but that's something to worry about later.
I appologize if my english isn't a 100% correct, doing this conversion is actually a good exercise to freshen it up a little


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## bblocher (Jul 30, 2008)

Very cool build. Following along...


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## Twilly (Jan 22, 2008)

Both of those motors seem a little big for your build. When looking for a forklift motor myself, I was looking for about a 9-10 inch motor ( 120-160 lbs ) for a mid sized car. I am currently working on a small dune buggy project, and I want with a 6.5 inch motor ( 50 lbs )

Just the weight of those motors are going to kill your range. Maybe you could consider trading someone who has a small motor and a car project?

Just my 2 cents

Twilly


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## Alchemist (Apr 16, 2009)

I like it!! More pictures please - Thank you!


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hey,
Thx for the replies guys, alway nice to communicate with people who share the same interests.
Its true that the motors are a bit big but i hope one of them will have enough power to provide a fun torquey ride.
The forklift they came from was already 30 years old with 7000 workinghours on its clock but easily picked up a load of 1000kg (approx 2000 lbs that is i think), so although the rating on the motors was a little dissappointing, they should both be powerfull enough to move the quad bike with me on it.
Range is not that of an issue to me, a rage of about 20km (approx 12miles) will do, but i would like good acceleration and a decent top speed, aiming for about 60mph (approx 90km/h).
The size of the motors is an issue because it is not easy to mount them firmly to the chassis, but i think the weight of the batteries matters more (4 bats weighing approx 30kg a piece = 120kg or about 250lbs) than the weight of the motor (about 60lbs).
For the moment i don't know how the motors preform, i first want to find that out. I don't know yet what i'm going to do with the spare (if they are both good, something i doubt very much). 
I attached some photo's of the interior of both, windings and brushes.
The drive motor doesn't run as smooth as the pump motor, i noticed that the first time i tested them without a load. On the picture you can see that it is rather black on the inside, also i think the brushes aren't properly aligned, maybe this is the reason why is doesn't power up as well as the pumpmotor.


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## Twilly (Jan 22, 2008)

I was not trying to talk you out of using the motor, That is part of the fun here. But keep in mind, you are using a motor larger than the warp9 I used in a Ford Contour. And my car had more get up and go than it did with the ICE... So imagine having a 200hp V6 on your 4 wheeler... Just be careful


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hmm, that would be nice 
Just kidding, since this is my first build i have a lot to learn so any advice is much appreciated.
I'm planning of testing it (when i get it mounted with a proper chain transmission) with the wheels off the ground before i take it for a spin, i'll be careful, don't worry 
I don't know where you live but here in belgium it is not easy to get dc motors with controllers, i went to several shops but they all seemed very confused when i asked information, that's why i use these motors from an old forklift, a cheap way of experimenting and learning new things.


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## Twilly (Jan 22, 2008)

Find yourself a good Golf cart repair shop... They should be able to point you in the right direction, As most EV's are just golf carts on steroids


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

That's a good idea, thx


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Did a testmount of the drivemotor today. Although it is quite big, it fits rather well in the chassis, didn't have to do that much modifications.
Also did some experimenting with it, it's a six terminal motor, so two fields, i wired them up in parallel and tested it with a 12v battery, wow, what a difference in running, smooth and powerfull. 
The original forklift wiring used 1 field coil for moving forward and one for moving backwards, so half of the motor's power, that's probably why is rated so low on the tag, now i understand why people are warning me 
I was planning on using the potmeter of the forklift as a controller, but that may also be a reason why before (using the forklift setup) the drive motor didn't preform well, should probably try getting a decent controller with twist-grip potmeter.
Next thing to work out is the chain-drive, should be doable, but i don't want to mess up the original chain transmission so i'll start looking for parts that i can adjust to my needs.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

First milestone achieved !!! Quad bike EV1 moved for the first time on electric power.
Because it was easier to fit a chain wheel to the pumpmotor i returned to this setup. Chain wheel fitted nicely to the axle of the motor. It was a bit of work to position the motor just right to give the chain enough room to pass to the rear but it worked out fine, didn't even had to adjust the chain length, the chain of the ice-transmission was just right, so far no problems, time to do some testing.
First test : 12v battery, wheels off ground : wheels started spinning fast, as expected, chain transmission works perfectly. Did notice an increase in amp use. No load motor only pulled 15A, with chain and wheels around 80A steady but a huge spike during the start. I guess it's normal.
Second test : 12v Battery, wheels on the ground, battery cable in my hand as a contactor : 12v was enough to move the quad with me on it, no exciting acceleration but it moved for the first time on electric power.
Third test : 2x12v batteries (strapped them to the sidebars) to get the 24v the motor had in the forklift : woooow, the added voltage makes a huge difference, this time a very good acceleration, maybe not as good as the 200cc engine but pretty close. For the first time i really felt the potential of the motor, this looks very promising.
The only thing that worries me is the huge amp draw on 24v, i didn't measure it (a bit tricky while test-driving) but the cable's i used from the forklift got quite warm, also the battery terminal suffered a bit of damage, i hope the contactors i have don't weld together.


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## bblocher (Jul 30, 2008)

Gene said:


> The only thing that worries me is the huge amp draw on 24v, i didn't measure it (a bit tricky while test-driving) but the cable's i used from the forklift got quite warm, also the battery terminal suffered a bit of damage, i hope the contactors i have don't weld together.


You'll be fine, you have to remember the contactor(s) will close before you give it any throttle. The controller will then be responsible for slowly adding that power and in a safe way. I did a bit of battery terminal "welding" with my 12v tests as well. 

What size of cables are you planning on using?


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

The cables of the forklift where the motor came from are 30mm2, i was planning of using those for the conversion. If they get too hot i can double them for each connection. I'll also use the circuit breakers (300amp) that i recovered.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Here are some pictures of the contactors installed and a testmount of the auxiliary battery that'll be used to feed the contactor coils and all the auxiliary features.
It still needs some work but is seems this 45ah batt is the largest i can fit under the seat, should normally be enough to power contactors and lights for sufficient time. I used the contact switch to turn this circuit on/off and also wired the former starter button to power the coil on the main contactor. Wired this one to the motor so i could take it for a spin using the button as a throttle, not really a throttle, because driving this way is full power or nothing but this way i was able to control the motor a little better than before with the battery cables.
Test drive went really well, used 24v as before, contactor preformed well, no damage of the contacts although during switching it sparked quite a bit. 

Later on, when i drove the quad inside, i noticed sparks coming from the motor's brushes and it smelt burned too .
Is it possible that some dirt entered the brush comm area? Or am i burning the brushes because i'm not using a controller?


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

I'm still trying to determine what caused the arcing of the motor. Here are pictures of the 4 brushes, i noticed that the contact surface of the brushes isn't that smooth as before, all brushes have some form of 'pitting' (dark spots on the photo's), one more than the other where before they were smooth and shiny. Also the comm had traces of something i don't know what on it that wasn't there before. 
My best guess is that during the testdrive some water and dirt splashed in the motor causing the arcing because the lowest brush is affected the most. I'll clean the comm, sand down the brushes' contactsurface with fine sanding paper (p1000 or so) so it's smooth again and let the motor run a while with no load on 12v to seat the brushes before i'll try it again on 24v. If this doesn't resolve the arcing i guessed wrong ...


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## willsr (May 20, 2009)

Jaguar is apparently planning to attack the upstart Fisker Karma head-on with an extended range electric version of the all-new XJ. The completely reworked XJ is due to arrive in July and hit dealers in December with a look heavily influenced by the smaller XF. A year later, the Indian-owned British luxury automaker will reportedly launch a plug-in version with 30 miles of electric only range that should help the big car get 47 mpg (US) and a CO2 emissions rating of less than 120 g/km. 

Jaguar will be able to introduce this new model now that it has approved for a new EU loan for developing greener cars. Jaguar already has an advantage over some of its competitors because the full-size XJ is comparatively light thanks to its aluminum construction. Lotus Engineering and Caparo are helping Jaguar with development of the ER-EV powertrain. 

Additionally, Jaguar and Land Rover are rumored to be developing micro-hybrids, full parallel hybrids, smaller diesel engines, and boosted gas engines along with even more weight reductions for the full lineup.
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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Got the brushes out, sanded them down an tried them on the motor. Arcing is a little less, but still present, so it wasn't just a little dirt in the motor that caused the problem.
While i was sanding them down i noticed that there are tiny cracks in the brushes too and the brushes are a little colored near the contact area what it my opinion means that they got really hot (perhaps near melting point, what would also explain the traces on the comm).
Maybe it's the combination of high current and old age (i guess they are about 30 years old) that caused them to fail.
I have some big enough brushes lying around, i'll modify them to fit the brush holder of the motor. These have a different composition than the original ones, they seem harder (more dense material) and are not pure carbon (have more like a dark silver color instead of black), maybe these ones better handle high currents, i'll find out soon.
If anyone has some experience with brush problems, feel free to comment. 
I'm also e-baying to get a controller, thinking of buying an alltrax AXE4834 programmable controller so i can adjust it to my needs, in this case limiting the current so i don't burn brushes all the time.


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## Joe of Loath (May 25, 2009)

Hi, my first post 

I have a similar project on the go. I have a 24v pump motor from a forklift, and an even cheaper quad (swing axle suspension rear AND front, and it came with a 49cc engine that just about got me up to 15-20mph.)The problem is I'm having a little trouble with the motor, as the end bearing is mounted in the pump. But when it's done I'm going to fit a sound system and flood lights and it becomes... PARTYQUAD!

Good work there though! RE the brushes, if you have a friend with a lathe you can cut a tiny layer off the commutator (colour it in with a sharpie and cut it until all the black is gone), and replace the brushes and springs. Then run it at 12v so they bed in, and it should be much smoother.


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## Vitkur (Oct 10, 2008)

I think you are drawing too much Amps with that gear ratio, at start:








Is it possible that this is causing the arcing? I do not know...


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

For the moment i'm using a ratio of 14/37, selected this ratio because i got the front chainwheel cheap from the local bike shop and it fits the axle of the pumpmotor rather well without modifying it.
You're right that a smaller ratio would lower the ampdraw at start, certainly the duration of it, also it would add acceleration what would be nice but lower the top speed.
The wheels of the quad measure about 40cm in diameter, so 1.256m/rev. When the motor runs at 2000rpm i should get about 750rpm on the wheels with current gear ratio that should result in a top speed of approx 56km/h (35mph), assuming that the motor gets up to 2000rpm so not calculating drag, which is lower than what i aimed for but for the moment i could live with that. 
With the wheels off ground i measure a huge ampdraw at startup (my meter goes OL) but it decreases after a few seconds to stabilise at about 50 amps, with no load it stabilised at 15 amps, motor is rated at 185 amps. With the wheels on the ground and me on it it will draw a much higher current but i haven't measured it.
The owner of the forklift i got the motor from told me today that the motor smelt burnt before so it is possible that the brushes were on their last legs already, not impossible, i think they are as old as the forklift, that's 30 years. Me hitting them with a ton of amps clearly finished them off.
So it looks like i have to replace the brushes, i'm modyfing some i had (2 finished, 2 to go) and let them seat running the motor on 12v with no load so they make good contact with the comm, normally when they are properly seated arcing should be gone. For the moment i'm not going to work on the commutator,cleaned it with a rag, but i'm no specialist so it is certainly something i will keep in mind in case the arcing continues.
I think that it would also be sensible to use a controller next time, so i can control the current at start up, now the motor draws all the amps he can get from the batteries and i don't think its good for either of them.

The pump on the pumpmotor i use was easy to remove, only had to loosen 4 bolts to get it off and used a small angle grinder to remove the support it was mounted on. If the endbearing is in the pump itself it's a little more challenging. You do have to see if the axle exiting is long enough to hold some kind of transmission. Also look if the motor has some kind of cooling fan in it.
Nice to see someone with a similar project  If you make a building/conversion thread i'll certainly follow along.


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## Joe of Loath (May 25, 2009)

Gene said:


> The pump on the pumpmotor i use was easy to remove, only had to loosen 4 bolts to get it off and used a small angle grinder to remove the support it was mounted on. If the endbearing is in the pump itself it's a little more challenging. You do have to see if the axle exiting is long enough to hold some kind of transmission. Also look if the motor has some kind of cooling fan in it.
> Nice to see someone with a similar project  If you make a building/conversion thread i'll certainly follow along.


Unfortunately the shaft is only just long enough to protrude through the bearing, and that's with the output yoke I found inside the pump! I might extend the shaft, it's not too much trouble to mill up a new one, but then I have the problem of mounting the gear. There's no fan on it either. I could machine up a new endplate, but I have been advised to junk it and try again. It also needs new brushes and springs (AFAIK the motor was thrown out originally because of 1 broken brush spring!).

I know once I get the motor mounted, and the quad stretched it'll be plain sailing. I have a garage full of car batteries, and I'll use 4 in a 2s2p arrangement. I think I'll be OK using a relay to switch the motor...


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hi guys, a little update.
I abandonned the idea of using a large auxiliary battery, it's much easier to install a small dc/dc converter to keep the original starter battery fully charged, won't be using that much auxiliary power anyway.
I'm also trying to figure out which batteries i'll buy and how to mount them because there isn't much space. Initially i thought of using 250ah 12v gel batteries but they are way too big to fit, still something to think about ...
Somebody heard of this company http://www.evdrives.com/index.html ?


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Below is a picture of the dc/dc convertor to aux battery setup. Works really well, keeps the battery charged at 13,8v when the battery pack is connected.
Also installed an hour meter to keep track of running time.
I'm seriously thinking of installing a new motor with controller, what do you guys think of this http://www.evdrives.com/mars_motor_me0708_etek-r.html.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

In recent test i burned the brushes, now i fitted new brushes and tested it with the potmeter that came out of the forklift as a controller.
It's a simple system, a bit big to mount on a quad but i tried it nevertheless.
It has 3 positions, in first is puts a large resistor in series with the motor, in 2nd a smaller and in 3rd no resistor, so full battery power to the motor.
I know it is not very energy efficient but i just want to go easy on the new brushes, that's why as a test i wired this dinosaur. It's best described as an high amp potmeter, with copper brushes that move accross copper bars to change between the resistors.
In first position, quad doesn't move, second position it moves slowly (like i run the motor on a 12v battery) but in 3rd (so full power) it takes off real nice, even better than before but this is because there are new brushes in the motor, has nothing to do with the 'controller'.
So this ancient system works but the brushes in the potmeter spark really badly, so they won't last very long. Motor brushes hold up fine for the moment.
Conclusion : nice test but not usable in definitive setup.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Managed to build a battery rack that holds 2 100ah 12v gel batteries. It's a very thight fit as you can see on the pictures. The quad is slowly becoming an EV. 
I also modified the transmission, used a motorcycle transmission with 14/42 ratio, chain wheels and chain are a lot heavier than the original ones i used before. Acceleration is really great with this ratio, in the dirt rear wheels spin nicely on take off, real nice to fool around with .
Still running on 24v for the moment, with the better transmission i think it's time to upgrade.
I ordered this motor http://www.evdrives.com/mars_motor_me0708_etek-r.html with matching controller to run the quad on 48V.
One of the next things to do is to get the tacho up and running, i don't know why yet but although i'm using the original wiring the thing doesn't work. It would be nice to know my speed and distance of travel ... if anybody has any idea's you can always let me know. I tried it with the motor lying next to it, all wires connected and motor grounded to the chassis with jumper cables but still nothing. It's a nice lcd tacho with build in battery monitor for the auxiliary battery.
Signal lights for headlight, direction lights etc work, but that's it, very strange.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

Congrats on your progress! I just came across your build, it brought back memories of building my second project. 
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
I am not sure you will be able to get to 60 with 48v, mine topped at 46mph and a pretty high current, almost 200 if memory serves me. I geared down for 40 mph and a bit more low end for towing and spinning the tires. it would have been nice to use a transmission.
I am using a different motor but I see over 400 amps at hard acceleration. I smell the brushes on the motor if I do a lot of fast starts and the motor will heat up a bit.
I will be watching your build for possible upgrades to mine, lol. I think lipo batteries will replace the agms when they die.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hi Jerry,

Before i started this build i saw your quad on evalbum and is was quite inspiring to me, so nice to meet you here.
I'm in the testing fase, still need to work out some bugs. For the moment i'm using parts (contactors,cables, potmeter) from an old forklift and it works but it's far from ideal. Contactor starts to stick, brushes in potmeter are suffering quite some damage as you can see in the picture, so current setup will not last long due to the amps the motor pulls, but new parts are on the way.
As for preformance on 24v it accelerates very good, i don't really know the current top speed because tacho isn't working but i estimate it's about 35mph.
Didn't really measure the amps at top speed, at start it's very high (my ampmeter measures max 250A and it goes OL so above 250). I have a fuse of 300A installed (also from the forklift) and that holds, so i guess i'm pulling 250 to 300 amps, maybe briefly a little more at start.
The pumpmotor i'm using gets a bit warm but not hot, you can easily touch it, but i'm only doing short testdrives for the moment.
Nice to know someone with a very similar build, always nice to share experiences.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

Hi Gene,

Looks like a lot of current did the damage to those brushes  
A note on the contact welding, you may want to install a mechanical disconnect for the battery in case of contact welding in a contactor, something I need to put on mine as an afterthought.
I think you will be very pleased with the 48 volt motor and controller, should make it much more controllable.
I will stay tuned to the progress, I had been away from the forum for a bit and trying to catch up on all the new projects.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Another milestone achieved today, first drive on public roads.
Since tacho isn't working my neighbour followed me by car to get a reading on top speed and range. I was very curious about this, note that i'm only running on a 24v configuration with very lowtech and old components.
Top speed was 60kph (37mph) on the tacho of the car with a full charge, later on when batteries were a little discharged and motor a little warmer it dropped to 55kph. I drove around the neighbourhood where i live for about 8km (5 miles) before i felt that the batteries started to give less power. I started the testdrive with 25.6v, finished with 24,6v, didn't discharge too deep to prevent damage to the batteries.
Not bad for a 24v system with only 2 12v 100ah batteries i think, nice to drive also.
It's very amusing to see people looking the quad drive by and wondering what there is missing, it makes no noise other than the rolling sound of the tyres, a very nice experience.

Jerry, as an emergency disconnect i was thinking of using the electric plug of a forklift, you know the one you pull to connect to the charger. It's simple, lowtech, cheap and very effective. Perhaps a bit big to mount on a quad but this way you can't miss it in case you need to use it. If i have a few free hours i'll try to mount it next to the batteries on the side, easy accessible and easy to use, just pull in case something goes wrong or when you park it somewhere to prevent power loss of the pack.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

Very cool! got that EV grin yet? That is good speed for 24 volts, I was tearing around on mine today taking advantage of a nice day and hauling some stuff to the curb.
I tested my controller today, inadvertently switched to reverse at full throttle Score one for logisystems, groaned a bit but nothing blew up
I like your plug idea, sounds like it would work fine.
I still get looks when I run noise free, neighbors seem to like it.
I wonder what kind of speed you will see with 48 volts, should be pretty fun..


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

yeah, i'm curious about the 48v setup too, certainly because by using a controller the extra power will be more controllable.
Today i did a little testdrive but batteries weren't fully charged (i'm charging by solar so it takes a while to charge completely) and preformance wasn't as good as yesterday due to lack of juice in the batteries, but ev grin was there nevertheless


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

A first edition of the emergency disconnect is finished.
It's a forklift like plug that i adapted to fit the quad. I changed the internal pins that make contact to fit 32mm2 wire so it won't get warm when a lot of amps pass through it, originally it's only meant to be used with 16mm2 wire.

The bonus i have with this system is that i'm able to charge the quad with a 24V30A forklift charger that i had lying around, just plug it in the charger and let it charge from my offgrid powersystem, before i swithed batteries everytime, a lot easier this way.
Also installed a temporary voltmeter to monitor how the batteries behave under load (while i'm driving).

When it stops raining i'll take it for a spin to find out how these modifications affect performance, i don't expect a big change but wiring is a bit longer so i might experience some extra losses.

I got word from carl from evdrives that new parts are shipped so i can upgrade to a 48V system hopefully very soon.


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## goglahey (Jul 8, 2009)

This is a nice built and great post. Keep up the good job.

Im thinking of converting my streetlegal atv to an EV.
I was thinking about using 2-4 dc l-91 4003 (one pr. tire or just RWD) like the ones in the http://www.killacycle.com/ a zilla lv 1k and se how many lifepo4's i can afford.

But then i realized that i probely need a test project like yours first, just to get to know the all the specs in a descent build EV 

Regard from Denmark


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hi, thanks for the encouragement.
I started this project as a total newbie in the world of ev's but by discovering this forum and asking advice i picked up enough things and tricks to start my own modest build without spending a lot of bucks.
People here are very helpfull (thanks for that) so if you want to start your own build feel free to ask information, no problem.
Killacycle is awesome but i guess so is their budget.
I think it's a very good idea to start out small, getting a feel of the technology, finding suppliers (not easy in europe),tinkering everything together before investing big bucks in an ambitious project. You might be in for a surprise feeling the power of even a small dc motor, i know it surprised me. Looking at figures to assemble a system is one thing but letting it come to life and feeling it's potential is very rewarding.
So if you want to convert your atv to ev go for it , you can always start with a small inexpensive system and upgrade later. 
The system you are talking about will make your atv go like a rocket, i doubt there is enough room to fit the zilla and the necessary batteries to feed it's hunger but i'm all for experimenting and trying new things.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Added another feature, since i can't get the tacho working i improvised. I mounted a bike computer, sensor on the rear sprocket and entered the rear wheel circumference in the computer and it works great, i think it's even quite precise, finally i get readings on distance travelled and speed.
Top speed of current configuration is 58kph, range is about 5kms.
Range is a bit disappointing but i'm still running on 24v with no real controller. While driving i noticed a serious voltage drop so i did an current reading while driving and found out that i'm pulling more than 250A all the time. Also motor starts smoking when i drive the quad a few kms (due to high current), new brushes i installed hold up fine but i think i'm burning the old windings this time.
In order to give the motor some extra cooling i installed the former radiator fan above the motor, changed it's polarity so it blows air into the motor to provide some additional cooling. Haven't tested it yet on the road, but when it blows i feel a good airflow coming out of the brush area so it should provide some good extra cooling of the motor.
Because it's not normal that i'm pulling so much amps all the time i started searching that there was nothing dragging and found out that the front wheels don't turn smooth at all. 
After demounting the wheels and brakes i noticed that the interior brake pad was very used because it rubs constantly against the brake disc and this on both front wheels. Also bearings aren't that great (chinese make), so these two things are causing a lot of friction that's holding back the quad. I'll try to resolve these problems and see if i get any improvement in preformance.
I also noticed that the gel batteries i'm using aren't that great. I get better preformance with the fla's i used before than with the gels, greater range (8kms), better top speed (65kph) and better acceleration, gels are 12v,100ah, fla's are 12v,105ah, so except chemistry very similar batteries but a significant difference in preformance.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Forgot to mention that the 48v mars motor has arrived, haven't received the controller yet 
It's bigger than i expected so it will be a challenge mounting it on the quad, a little transportation damage to a terminal but nothing serious. Once the controller gets here i can upgrade to 48v.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

I think the current draw will go down with the Mars motor, as well as a proper controller. I'm sure it is hard to be waiting on the controller at this point, but it gives you time to get the new motor mounted.
I am only using 75 AH gels in mine and performance is pretty good. I think the new motor will help some of your battery issues as well


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## miniUMM (Jun 25, 2009)

Gene where are u from?


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

I live in Belgium, near Brussels.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

As i hope to upgrade to a 48v system soon (mars motor has arrived, alltrax controller seems to be stuck at belgian customs for the moment) i started to modify the current setup.
The picture below shows that it's going to be an even thighter fit than the pumpmotor, but thight is good enough. I'll also have to make an adapter piece to fit the mars motor and hold the front sprocket, probably the same way i fitted the sprocket to the pumpmotor.
Also made extra battery racks to fit 2 more batteries on the quad, chose to place them on the luggage rack for now, not ideal because of the weight distribution but it'll do for now.
For the moment i wired the 2 extra batteries in parallel with the batteries already installed to double the range with the 24v system.
During the testdrive with the extra batteries i noticed that the voltage drop on start is a lot smaller, normal because i draw the same current from a doubled batterypack so i abuse the batteries less. The added weight doesn't really affect acceleration and top speed but the motor heats up more, even blew a fuse. 
So the biggest concern that made me decide to abandon the pumpmotor setup is cooling it, even the extra fan doesn't do the trick, although it forces air through the motor constantly. This keeps me from using the pumpmotor to build a reliable ev, the marsmotor i have has a lot more cooling openings than the pumpmotor.
Also bought a second quad, the same i'm using for my conversion with a broken gearbox. Put the engineblock i had lying around from the other on this one so now i have a good reference point to compare performance with and later on i can still sell it to recuperate some of the conversion costs.
As i thought acceleration of the 24v system is pretty much the same as the ice, electric even a little faster, but top speed of the ice quad is better, not that much but still about 20kph.
Maybe i can use the broken gearbox to figure out some kind of transmission, if the damage to it isn't too big an if there is a way to attach the electric motor to it, even clutchless, with not too much hassle it would be a nice, something to consider.


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Alltrax controller has arrived, now i can start tinkering the 48v system together


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

Always exciting to get the parts for the build.
so going to be busy on the weekend,


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Hi Jerry, yeah i'm eager to start but i have a very busy week and week-end, so probably the upgrade to 48v will be done in bits and pieces.

By the way thanks to Carl from evdrives for shipping the parts.
It took the packages about 2 days to cross the ocean to brussels and then it took 2 weeks to get from the airport to my doorstep, i wonder what belgian customs did with the packages during that period (the airport is only 5kms from where i live, so distance certainly wasn't the problem).


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Below the last pictures of the forklift 'controller' before taking it off the quad and installing the alltrax 4844 controller.
I mounted the potmeter for the controller where the original ice throttle used to be.
When i get the wiring done i'll check the settings of the controller before testing it with the pumpmotor, i don't really know if it can handle a compound wound motor but i doubt if i will be able to resist testing it


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## Gene (Apr 8, 2009)

Before mounting the mars motor i tested the controller with the pumpmotor of the forklift. With wheels off ground it spun real hard on 48v, 152kph on bike computer. Wheels on the ground was a lot less, didn't ride it on the street but in de garage it barely moved the quad so i got working on mounting the mars motor.
First setup wasn't strong enough (just 2 metal bars holding the motor, they bent immediately when i powered up the motor) so i had to make a 4mm thick plate to bolt the motor on, now it holds just fine.
Only did 1 testdrive with it till now. Acceleration isn't what i expected it to be, controller was only set at 200A max, maybe setting it a little higher will help. Perhaps i can also change some of the other settings on the alltrax controller like throttle curve to improve acceleration. I'll try that before adapting the gear ratio, still using 14/42 for the moment.
Top speed with wheels off ground is 120kph, on the road i got 70kph at 200A.
The testdrive was 6,5 kms, pack voltage was 51v afterwards (started at 51,9v) so power comsumption with controller is a lot less than before, i'll do a range test later but i think i can easily go 20km without discharging the batteries too much.
Motor heats up quite a bit (but not as much as the pumpmotor) and acceleration is even less when it gets warm, so i added the fan i used on the pumpmotor to force are though it and this helps quite a bit, not a pretty sight but as long as it helps it's ok.
Controller also warms up but i could easily touch it after the testdrive, if with longer drives i does heat up too much i can always attach a heatsinck with fan to it, but for the moment it works just fine.
Also added a few voltmeters, one for auxiliary battery, one for battery pack, always nice to now how much juice you have.


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## nigelvan96 (Oct 22, 2011)

hello men

i really like your quad conversion
im in my 5th year electro mechanic
and i need a project
i also live in belgium in limburg
can you write a step plan what youve got to in total
for conversion of a quad
what you ve done in all your time whats right

nigel


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