# Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*



> On 26 Nov 2011 at 6:09, tomw wrote:
> 
> > Plug-in hybrids use both the engine and motor all the time.
> 
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

not to bring up a sensitive subject but isn't the the sort of confusion Bruce was trying to avoid with the term Pish?

The advertisers have been allowed to dictate terms so they are not consistent and confusing.

it all started with the original prius and insights.
as I understand it they are both single fuel "hybrids"

The Prius (gen 2 at least) came stock as series-parallel hybrid drive, where the ice could work in series (generate electricity to run motor to propel vehicle) parallel where ice and electric both put power to the wheels or ice only.

A plug in Prius is now dual fuel series parallel.

A the volt was marketed as a pure series electro motor drives the wheels, and electricity comes from batteries or ice. Then it became apparent that the ice was coupled to the wheels meaning they could not market it as electric only drive. I think GM wants the public to believe the volt is more like a BEV, therefore if they. one out with a new (Prius like) design the marketing guys need to spin it as different from their "advanced extended electric vehicle" model.

FWIW I think the volt concept is a great idea. as I interstate it the marketing side wanted o connection between the drive train and the ice, but the engineers determined that was not the most efficient solution. Rather than try and explains how the volt system is different/better that the Prius system, they made up a new term that was. it technically accurate.

Still waiting to see how the model S, Leaf, and Focus match up before selling/ parting out my conversion and one of our 2 Prius.

John O'Connor
(a new resident of Boston Mass) 



> "EVDL Administrator" <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > On 26 Nov 2011 at 6:09, tomw wrote:
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

It's pretty simple, or was before GM became involved and started calling
black white. A hybrid has both an ice and an electric motor and gets all
its energy from gasoline. It cannot be plugged in to charge its batteries
from an electric outlet. They are charged by an on-board generator powered
by an ice. 

A Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle (PHEV) has both an ice and an electric
motor and can get energy from both gasoline and from an electric outlet,
though typically has a smaller battery pack than a BEV so cannot travel as
far (30 - 40 miles in the case of the Volt) if it runs only on energy from
an electric outlet into its battery pack. 

A Battery Electric Vehicle (BEV) (redundant if you ask me) has no ice, only
an electric motor, and all its energy comes from an electric outlet used to
charge its battery pack. Its range is totally dependent on the size of its
battery pack.

Hybrids and PHEVs typically cannot aggressively accelerate or travel at high
speed (say 70 mph) without use of the ice. My understanding is the electric
motor in the Volt is large enough that it does much better in this regard
than a typical hybrid, and can run on all electric with fairly aggressive
acceleration.

--
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*



> On 27 Nov 2011 at 6:45, tomw wrote:
> 
> > A hybrid has both an ice and an electric motor and gets all its energy
> > from gasoline. It cannot be plugged in to charge its batteries from an
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

I have 3 Priuses, and repair the batteries. When I have repaired a battery I
often end up with a fully charged pack and the engine does not run until the
battery comes down to the normal operating range if it is hot enough, but
the acceleration like this is the best you ever get with it, it is much more
responsive than another model with the same capacity engine.

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of tomw
Sent: Monday, 28 November 2011 3:46 a.m.
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid

It's pretty simple, or was before GM became involved and started calling
black white. A hybrid has both an ice and an electric motor and gets all
its energy from gasoline. It cannot be plugged in to charge its batteries
from an electric outlet. They are charged by an on-board generator powered
by an ice. 

A Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle (PHEV) has both an ice and an electric
motor and can get energy from both gasoline and from an electric outlet,
though typically has a smaller battery pack than a BEV so cannot travel as
far (30 - 40 miles in the case of the Volt) if it runs only on energy from
an electric outlet into its battery pack. 

A Battery Electric Vehicle (BEV) (redundant if you ask me) has no ice, only
an electric motor, and all its energy comes from an electric outlet used to
charge its battery pack. Its range is totally dependent on the size of its
battery pack.

Hybrids and PHEVs typically cannot aggressively accelerate or travel at high
speed (say 70 mph) without use of the ice. My understanding is the electric
motor in the Volt is large enough that it does much better in this regard
than a typical hybrid, and can run on all electric with fairly aggressive
acceleration.

--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-GM-Chevrol
et-Cruze-plug-in-hybrid-tp4110235p4112598.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

Maybe the problem is with the shortening of the term to a single
ambiguous word. I would call my 2000 Honda Insight a hybrid drive
system because its motive power can come from two types of power
systems. I would not, however, call it a hybrid fuel system because it
only consumes gasoline. An EV could technically be turned into a
hybrid by installing a hydrogen fuel cell to charge the battery but
still retain the standard wall charger. Maybe adding a solar panel to
the roof and having this dribble electrons into the traction pack
would technically make an EV a hybrid, too. This also would mean that
my brother-in-law's pickup then would be considered a hybrid because
it can run on diesel and vegetable oil. He carries both fuel sources.



> EVDL Administrator <[email protected]> wrote:
> > On 27 Nov 2011 at 6:45, tomw wrote:
> >
> >> A hybrid has both an ice and an electric motor and gets all its energy
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

David wrote -
> I would not, however, call it a hybrid fuel system because it
> only consumes gasoline.

I too have an Insight, actually 2 of them now... (one is not running well, bat pack has been 
repaired 2 times and a cylinder is not working properly, so I want to turn it into an EV!!!).

And there is another 'fuel' that it consumes, I'm not sure what the technical name is but it is the 
energy that comes from the regenerative system. In fact it is the regenerative system that actually 
charges the 12v car battery.

Rush
www.TucsonEV.com

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

My EV has regenerative braking. It still only uses one fuel, electricity
from an outlet of some sort. It wouldn't get any regenerative energy
without this "original" source of energy. In the same way my Inight does
not get regenerative energy without the consumption of gasoline. Therefore
it isn't a hybrid fuel vehicle. Neither is my EV.



> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> > David wrote -
> >> I would not, however, call it a hybrid fuel system because it
> >> only consumes gasoline.
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

So, I guess, if we follow this logic, then there are really no other fuel sources than the sun, 
since all the 'energy' of coal, petroleum, etc would not be here if it weren't for the sun. Actually 
I guess we could follow 'this logic' down to the atomic and sub-atomic level.

> My EV has regenerative braking. It still only uses one fuel, electricity
> from an outlet of some sort. It wouldn't get any regenerative energy
> without this "original" source of energy. In the same way my Inight does
> not get regenerative energy without the consumption of gasoline. Therefore
> it isn't a hybrid fuel vehicle. Neither is my EV.
>
>


> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> David wrote -
> >>> I would not, however, call it a hybrid fuel system because it
> >>> only consumes gasoline.
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: GM Chevrolet Cruze plug-in hybrid*

If you want to take it beyond the vehicle's fueling source, yes. The
vehicles fuel inlet is inherently implied by the context. It doesn't
matter where I get the electricity to fuel my car, it is still not a
hybrid and it is still only an EV. By the context it isn't logical to
say only the sun is the fuel source. Don't illogically add to the
system being discussed. Besides, geothermal is not energy from the
sun, neither is nuclear for that matter.



> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> > So, I guess, if we follow this logic, then there are really no other fuel=
> sources than the sun,
> > since all the 'energy' of coal, petroleum, etc would not be here if it we=
> ...


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