# 1988 CRX with a DIY controller and nissan leaf motor



## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Hi everyone. I come on here once in a while. But spend most of my time on endlesssphere forums. I have been on here a fair bit lately deciding how to build my own charger. Right now I just use 8 meanwell HLG320 led power supplies.

But non the less I spend 2.5 years developing a 3 phase inverter and used another guys brain (dspic30f4011 with his code) to make it all work.

I have it ripping really well. The Battery is a 112s 5c cont. 10c burst and the pack under the hood is 25ah and right now I am just adding another 50ah to the rear for a total 30.5kwh of usable energy.

I drove the car for about 2 months with just the 10kwh pack under the hood and this car flys! I have played with a app for my smart phone and registered 5.5sec 0-60 but it seems the GPS on the phone is to slow to be acuarate. I am adding a speedo off of 1 rear wheel to use to be more acurate soon. I can roast the tires a any speed from 0-~70km/h with just the battery under the hood and the phase current set to 60% but the rear pack will add another 275hp of usable energy so soon it will be amazing. I have a set of M&H street legal drag slicks coming. 
SO This should do very well. 

I will try to add lots of info soon. feel free to ask any questions. I did the controller open source. Over on ES. I am just cleaning up the files now. 
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=63982
Cheers.
-Arlin


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Some pictures


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

more pics the oem inverter was full of salt water and corroded.

Here is the last video I made. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYO59Lun2Es






Will make more soon.


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## Moltenmetal (Mar 20, 2014)

I hate the Endless Sphere forum interface, so I'm very glad you posted over here with a link.

You have done amazing work...absolutely amazing!


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Woo arlo!  

Great job, and can't wait for full power run!


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## palmer_md (Jul 22, 2011)

Wow, fantastic work.

I'm a bit confused about the components. I see you have your own driver board and control scheme for the IGBT's, but are they the stock Leaf IGBT's or did you also replace those as well and are just using the housing from the original Leaf inverter.

It would be awesome to just remove the Nissan driver board and install yours to gain more control and power from the stock IGBT's.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

palmer_md said:


> Wow, fantastic work.
> 
> I'm a bit confused about the components. I see you have your own driver board and control scheme for the IGBT's, but are they the stock Leaf IGBT's or did you also replace those as well and are just using the housing from the original Leaf inverter.
> 
> It would be awesome to just remove the Nissan driver board and install yours to gain more control and power from the stock IGBT's.


Thank you.

I reaplced them with 1MBI800U4B-120 IGBTS from fuji. they are 1200 amps at 25 deg C and 800 amps at 80 deg C

I think the oem leaf IGBTs are 900 amps at 25 deg C But the oem igbts were corroded from the salt water. I will post more pictures soon.


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## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

Hi

Do you have any data about Leaf motor thermistor values above 40°C? Is there some reference which sensor it uses?

tnx

Arber


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

arber333 said:


> Hi
> 
> Do you have any data about Leaf motor thermistor values above 40°C? Is there some reference which sensor it uses?
> 
> ...


I assumed it was a 10k thermister... But I will measure it.

I have not even watched the motor temp. The IGBTs get hot faster then the motor. I will be hooking up the liquid cooling this week as well.


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## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

Arlo said:


> I assumed it was a 10k thermister... But I will measure it.
> 
> I have not even watched the motor temp. The IGBTs get hot faster then the motor. I will be hooking up the liquid cooling this week as well.


Well here i have the Nissan docs and they say its a 20K some termistor. While in my garage i measured 25K, but it is cold out now. Attached is the page from Nissan.
What i would like you do for me is to hook up one known temp sensor into water cooling, so you know the water temperature and then measure motor thermistor when water reaches 70°C or so. This should be still survivable temperature for IGBTs if you used same water cooling for motor and inverter.

With my ACIM inverter i get to 45°C for inverter only. Johannes says his inverter reduces power at 80°C. With Leaf motor we have to be careful not to demagnetize neodim metal...


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

arber333 said:


> Well here i have the Nissan docs and they say its a 20K some termistor. While in my garage i measured 25K, but it is cold out now. Attached is the page from Nissan.
> What i would like you do for me is to hook up one known temp sensor into water cooling, so you know the water temperature and then measure motor thermistor when water reaches 70°C or so. This should be still survivable temperature for IGBTs if you used same water cooling for motor and inverter.
> 
> With my ACIM inverter i get to 45°C for inverter only. Johannes says his inverter reduces power at 80°C. With Leaf motor we have to be careful not to demagnetize neodim metal...


I will see what I can do.

I have my controller cutting power 20phase amps per deg C startign at 79 deg C

I spent a bunch of time the last 2 weeks installing another 20kwh of battery. I just today upgraded the main battery wires from 0awh to 1/0 and started on cleaning up the wiring under the hood. I should be done this week.

I have all the parts to finish installing the water cooling which should be this week as well.

Edit: Would you say your shop was about 10deg C ? Looking at the Chart its 45k ohms at -10 deg C and about 25k ohms at about 10 deg C and about 12k ohms at about 40 deg C


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## sholland (Jan 16, 2012)

Any plans to sell your inverter?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

sholland said:


> Any plans to sell your inverter?


IM interested but its not Plug and Play. You will need to have a strong electrical understanding.

I am sending 4 out in the next while for Beta Testing. After that I will work to see if I can make something worth marketing.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Man I forgot I started this thread.

So far so good. I have been upping the power and working out the kinks.

I have a start on my gauges and I am at 460rms (650peak) phase amps with 400 battery amps and a 112s lipo (410v nominal) battery ready to produce 750 amps.

The other night I added 350 amps or feild weakening and set the revlimiter to 14000 rpm and at 100km/h on the dry but cold (~1 deg C) pavement it was able to lay rubber with both wheels. And hit a top speed at the rev limiter of 185km/h 

I just got my DOT drag slicks and hope to be done working out all the little bugs by spring in time to run a good 1/4 mile run. 

I also just installed some Ohlins suspension its a little stiff but very sporty.


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## skeyes (Dec 3, 2016)

That looks a lot more fun than a Leaf!

Holy cow you've done a lot of work on this thing. I poked around your other posts on endless forums and got an idea how far you've come. 

As more Leafs hit the scrap yards, I think there could be a market for aftermarket Leaf motor controllers if you ever got it to a point you felt it was close to plug and play. 

Great work. Really interested to see what peak power output you're gonna get outta this motor controller inverter combo.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

skeyes said:


> That looks a lot more fun than a Leaf!
> 
> Holy cow you've done a lot of work on this thing. I poked around your other posts on endless forums and got an idea how far you've come.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I have been working on this for a while 3+ years on this project and 7+ on controller development.


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## skeyes (Dec 3, 2016)

You done any runs with those drag slicks yet? 

Also question for you - You mentioned on the endless forums that the Leaf motor should be capable up to 410hp... Do you have to run any extra cooling mods to acheive that kind of power? 

I am considering the possibility of trying to do a similar high voltage high power build using a Leaf motor... only my car will be somewhat heavier (Mazda RX8, probably ~3500lbs with 36kWh of battery), and I am looking to stay above the 350hp mark. In your opinion would you consider the Leaf motor a good candidate from a mechanical standpoint? (setting aside the substantial controller difficulty)


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

skeyes said:


> You done any runs with those drag slicks yet?
> 
> Also question for you - You mentioned on the endless forums that the Leaf motor should be capable up to 410hp... Do you have to run any extra cooling mods to acheive that kind of power?
> 
> I am considering the possibility of trying to do a similar high voltage high power build using a Leaf motor... only my car will be somewhat heavier (Mazda RX8, probably ~3500lbs with 36kWh of battery), and I am looking to stay above the 350hp mark. In your opinion would you consider the Leaf motor a good candidate from a mechanical standpoint? (setting aside the substantial controller difficulty)


410hp is what I have available from the battery. Its winter here so no runs on the slicks.

350hp from an electric is much faster then 350hp from a ICE..... 

if you try to run to much more torque then the OEM stuff you will find your self destroying the gear reduction. The torque is what all the parts are rated for. HP can be had by increasing the RPM where the peak torque happens at. But remember right now I am peaking at 247hp into the system but that's at about 90km/h.... So its not only HP you need to look at you need to see if you will have the torque at the speeds you want to be driving at. With less then 247hp at the wheels I am able to make nitto neo-gens brake loose on cold dry pavement at 100km/h. Remember the peak torque is 1667ft-lbs at the wheels in the OEM early leafs. I don't think I am making a lot more then that (210ftlbs at the motor) but I am able to make it at a higher RPM. You will need feild weakening for speeds past 110km/h on a 112s (470v fully charged) battery.


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## skeyes (Dec 3, 2016)

So I forgot to mention I am looking at retaining the mazda 6 speed transmission and not using the Leaf gearbox...

Do you think 350 hp at the motor is doable for the Leaf motor? I know the torque will be there, I am more worried about the top end.

Thanks


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## skeyes (Dec 3, 2016)

I'll also have a battery of 36kWh (Chevy volt cells) with up to 880 vdc at full charge if wired all in series. Mostly curious what you think the Leaf motor can put out.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Transmissions = Fail
High Voltage = Fail
My car with leaf motor and a 112s (470V charged) battery will do 210km/h and that's just where i set the rev limiter. It can go faster.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

First test against an ICE

The other car is a Turbo I4 Caliber Srt4 they are about the fastest production FWD car out. He said he had his boos turned up and was bragging about some intake.... lol

I had the power turned down WAY down to make sure I work other bugs out of the system before cranking it up.

In fact I don't even have the cooling system hooked up yet...


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Here is a couple more videos.


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

Arlo, it's awesome what you have done with this ''cheap'' Leaf motor.
Good job!


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## foxr (Apr 16, 2015)

I would love to replicate what you have done into a different car. While I've owned 3 different CRX in the last 3 years I currently have a spark ev and want to buy a gasser(cheap) smart fortwo cabrio and put this motor in it's low powered place. What would you recommend as a first step? I can purchase the drivetrain off of car-part.com but sounds like I need more.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

You need to make it all work. The motor is easy I developed my own controller that was the hard part.

You can see if you can get enough stuff to make a leaf motor and controller work.... I did my own because the oem controller was full of salt water and I wanted more power!


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## foxr (Apr 16, 2015)

I want enough power to get the 2100lb(with battery) to 60 in under 5 seconds. if the stock controller can do this(my math says it can't.) great. So I'll need to use a custom controller, I found Mpaulholmes instructions for the 200kw controller. Just trying to put together a plan right now as once I get going I won't stop until it's done just like the house I live in, bought with $25k and have made it a $100k house, all work done by me. I'm an ev noob though, so lots to learn!


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

foxr said:


> I want enough power to get the 2100lb(with battery) to 60 in under 5 seconds. if the stock controller can do this(my math says it can't.) great. So I'll need to use a custom controller, I found Mpaulholmes instructions for the 200kw controller. Just trying to put together a plan right now as once I get going I won't stop until it's done just like the house I live in, bought with $25k and have made it a $100k house, all work done by me. I'm an ev noob though, so lots to learn!



My controller is RATED FOR WAY MORE then Mpaulholmes

He uses parts rated for both less voltage and less current.

I can offer kits. I have a couple out there working on kits now.

I also did all the powerstage work open source over on ES forums.

So you are looking at using a Smart car to do this?

Where will you fit all the battery? And what battery will you use?


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## foxr (Apr 16, 2015)

My hope was to use the smart car and do what Yabert did and put them in the floor pan. My battery has not been selected yet but either reconfigure the leaf battery or possibly from a volt or spark ev or even a smart ev. I only need to go about 60 miles(keeping my foot out of it) on days I wish to get there instead of just smiling quickly.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

foxr said:


> My hope was to use the smart car and do what Yabert did and put them in the floor pan. My battery has not been selected yet but either reconfigure the leaf battery or possibly from a volt or spark ev or even a smart ev. I only need to go about 60 miles(keeping my foot out of it) on days I wish to get there instead of just smiling quickly.


The trick is to make the power you want with so little capacity. 

The new leaf packs are 10c (peak) rated it can do it but its a big pack for that car.

The battery from the smart EV won't do the amperage you need for a 0-60 time like you wan't

My CRX weighs 2400 lbs and with the settings at 216kw peak the 0-60 is just under 5 Seconds. I will be running ~ 310kw peak when finished tuning and once up graded to the higher amperage IGBTSs with my current pack


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## foxr (Apr 16, 2015)

I will need roughly 160kw to obtain the wanted acceleration. What is your opinion off the top of your head to what battery you would think about using to obtain this in such a small space. The maximum height is 210mm, trying to find the full specs on the pan in the smart. I mean would it be possible to re-configure the leaf battery even if smaller clear down to 17kwh worth or would I need to custom build something out of 2 volt packs, all just theory I know but your knowledge is by far better than 99% of those I've seen. Thank you for your time, seriously!


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

foxr said:


> I will need roughly 160kw to obtain the wanted acceleration. What is your opinion off the top of your head to what battery you would think about using to obtain this in such a small space. The maximum height is 210mm, trying to find the full specs on the pan in the smart. I mean would it be possible to re-configure the leaf battery even if smaller clear down to 17kwh worth or would I need to custom build something out of 2 volt packs, all just theory I know but your knowledge is by far better than 99% of those I've seen. Thank you for your time, seriously!


Hmmm thats not easy. Remember you need room for wires and contractors and fusing and busbars then the enclosure etc.

Also the leaf battery is an advertised capacity. The 24kw leaf battery is about 18-20 kw usable. So you will need more or less ALL of a 2015 or newer leaf battery. What you want is not easy and cheep....
You can try to find something very power dense like the KERS cells lol
Or you can talk to John metric and buy the racing cells he sells...

Also I would be willing to bet you find 160kw in the real world gives you 5.5-6 sec 0-60. You are not making 160 kw the whole time You are making what should be a flat torque curve to say 60-70km/h (depending on voltage) then the HP will peak where the torque starts to fall off but with field weakening you will try to flatten the HP curve above the peak. I bet you need 200kw (into the system) remember also the wheels will not see 200kw its whats going into the controller and motor - losses. 

Seriously aim for 200kw So I think you can make the 2015 leaf battery make 200kw for a burst on a warm day with a full charge.....


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi Foxr
I'm using most of a Volt battery - 14Kwhrs worth
And I currently take up to about 300Kw out of it - seems to be holding up pretty well

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forum...dubious-device-44370p15.html?highlight=duncan


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Duncan said:


> Hi Foxr
> I'm using most of a Volt battery - 14Kwhrs worth
> And I currently take up to about 300Kw out of it - seems to be holding up pretty well
> 
> http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forum...dubious-device-44370p15.html?highlight=duncan


Very cool. Yes I forgot I was recently pointed at Hybrid packs like the volt uses as they are more power dense. 

I should look for cells from them my self


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## Smilly_mike (Mar 27, 2017)

Just wow !
Impressive work, bravo.
I am building electronics since 30 years and you do nice work !


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Just about to take it apart and put the 800a igbts back in it....


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## Smilly_mike (Mar 27, 2017)

Hello, 

Someone know what is the specs of the Leaf IGBT ?
I own a 2011 and I want to cheat the current sensor by making a voltage divider, to get 10% more current.

Let me know if someone have specs.

Thanks


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Smilly_mike said:


> Hello,
> 
> Someone know what is the specs of the Leaf IGBT ?
> I own a 2011 and I want to cheat the current sensor by making a voltage divider, to get 10% more current.
> ...


I have read they are 900a but thats a peak at 25 degC so be careful.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Another fun night.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

I put a little description of how to assemble what I have together.


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## Jayls5 (Apr 1, 2012)

I watched your video a few days ago, so forgive me if you answered this question directly already.

What is the arduino responsible for?

In general, I'm terrified of using arduinos for anything essential involved in running an EV because they're not very robust microcontrollers. I think this applied to both the Raspberry Pi and Arduino's that I've owned, but they were very sensitive to EMI. I clicked a peizo lighter nearby, and it was enough to reset one. I'd make 100% sure you've got it well shielded, even if you haven't already had problems with it.

You're doing awesome work, and I enjoy seeing your progress videos. Let me know if I've got this right: The torque (through saturation) is inherently limited to a set amount on the leaf motors, so you're maxing that out and supplying a higher voltage to extend the useful power band into higher RPM's for short duty cycles (drag racing)? 

Do you have a link to info on your controller's logic board?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

The Logic board is a board I designed to accept a chip from Lebowski from ES forums. 

The arduino is just there to watch for desturation detection. If a driver shuts down from desaturation it sends a fault signal out the arduino accepts this and shuts down the brain/pwm by putting it into reset until a key cycle.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Managed to get a new record peak yesterday  





Also did a few tests I am just sorting out the settings to keep current control smooth as you can see in this video the current is up and down as it accelerates.


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## slloyd (Jun 7, 2017)

1988 CRX never looked so good.

i have almost convinced my wife to allow a garage in backyard so i can have room to actually build and catch up to you. wish my luck!


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

slloyd said:


> 1988 CRX never looked so good.
> 
> i have almost convinced my wife to allow a garage in backyard so i can have room to actually build and catch up to you. wish my luck!


Nice. The garage is the easy part.


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

I made it to the Dyno today....

Most torque I made was 295.9 ft-lbs at the motor (2349ft-lbs wheels) And the most HP today was 302.3hp at the wheels. The measurements are at the wheels but they enter the gear ratio in to get the RPM. Almost maxed out the dyno its rated for 2500 ft-lbs

My Brother failed me at getting the DYNO numbers in the video...  But I took picks of the screens I have 1 printout of 1 run. When they went to print the rest of the runs the computer crashed and my runs keep crashing the computer lmfao. I got his email and sent him mine he will send me the files later.

But It was a good day and a great first trip to the dyno. I played with some settings trying to make more power but turning up the phase amps tripped desat it was hot out and the controller was getting warm. I have it liquid cooled with a fan but it needs to stay below ambiant to make good power. 

Did 4 runs all just over 300hp!!! This has been such a long hard effort but I am just getting started... This is still with the 600a IGBTs....  Once I add the 800a igbts back in and spend the time it will be able to make 400hp+ with the right battery...


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

That's awesome! Did motor have any heat problems?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

Not really.... I am pushing the IGBT's really hard and they do heat soak. But this was designed for 800a IGBTs and these are 600a IGBTs that make a little more heat..... It trips the desat when I try to hard and they are warm...  
But they are only at 35-40 deg C on the heat sink of the IGBT it self. The motor never went over 38 deg C... I have done multiple runs on the road from 0-100 mph and the motor has never been over 39 deg C measured at the windings.


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Wow, only 39°C on the motor! How much power can that thing take?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

riba2233 said:


> Wow, only 39°C on the motor! How much power can that thing take?


LOTS!  

The cool part is a 0-100 mph run takes less then 9 sec. And if I turn the power up more its even less so the heat doesn't build up in the motor....


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

That's great! Do you use some sort of liquid cooling?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

riba2233 said:


> That's great! Do you use some sort of liquid cooling?


Yes the motor is liquid cooled from factory and I used the OEM inverter housing to put my own inverter inside. It has a liquid cooled heat sink.


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Cool, thanks! What fluid does it use?


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

riba2233 said:


> Cool, thanks! What fluid does it use?


Just straight Water.


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Great, thank you!


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Arlo said:


> Yes the motor is liquid cooled from factory and I used the OEM inverter housing to put my own inverter inside. It has a liquid cooled heat sink.





riba2233 said:


> Cool, thanks! What fluid does it use?





Arlo said:


> Just straight Water.


Interesting... is it drained in the winter, or parked only in a heated garage in winter? I assume that Nissan uses a glycol-water mixture.


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## slloyd (Jun 7, 2017)

arlo, if i ever get more of these 1400A/1200V monster IGBTs i'll send some to you


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

brian_ said:


> Interesting... is it drained in the winter, or parked only in a heated garage in winter? I assume that Nissan uses a glycol-water mixture.


I added some antifreeze but have not needed it as a friend lent me his model S for like 2 months so far. lol

I love my CRX but its a model S!


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

slloyd said:


> arlo, if i ever get more of these 1400A/1200V monster IGBTs i'll send some to you


Cool I am stoked!


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## Arlo (Dec 27, 2009)

For those of you who don't follow this build on ES I managed to get on discovery channel. 

https://review.bellmedia.ca/view/468036009


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## Moltenmetal (Mar 20, 2014)

Absolutely amazing- totally inspirational work!


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## colourmecarbon (Oct 9, 2017)

Hey, it’s been fascinating following your work on tuning the Leaf motor’s performance.
I’m a habitual car-modder, looking to see what can be done with a BMW i3 BeV.

This is my first non-ICE project and am looking for advice on where to start.
I made an earlier post about adding a second motor in the i3’s spacious ‘engine’ bay.
I was advised by another forum member, to work on the motor-controller for most achievable gains. But that’s far outside my current knowledge pool, - bolting in a second motor and hooking it up to the i3’s diff is work I could do - but no point doing that if modding or replacing the control components would add more torque and 100 extra HP.
I heard twin motors are more efficient, but would it give extra torque and HP with the existing controller?
I’m presuming I’d just run piggy-backed cables from the other motor? Or am I in noob dreamworld?
The i3 has regen braking- would that need specialist programming or could the i3’s sensors adapt to the additional motor?

If anyone can direct me to a good learning resource, I can go away and read more before returning here to ask more dumb questions.


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## Kevin Sharpe (Jul 4, 2011)

colourmecarbon said:


> I was advised by another forum member, to work on the motor-controller for most achievable gains. But that’s far outside my current knowledge pool, - bolting in a second motor and hooking it up to the i3’s diff is work I could do - but no point doing that if modding or replacing the control components would add more torque and 100 extra HP.


Have you seen Damien's open source i3 controller thread (here)? That would be a relatively simple way of extracting extra performance from an i3 motor


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