# [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I just insured the conversion I bought with State Farm, here in Idaho. They
didn't seem to fuss at all.

I don't have any suggestion on agents, but I don't think it's a fixed
policy. If it is, I may be in for a surprise down the road. I did
everything I could think of to make sure they knew ahead of time it was a
conversion. Because it has lithium cells, its value is quite a bit higher
than a similar model with an ICE.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Mike Brown
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 5:18 PM
To: EV Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him that
State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles. If true, must be
a very new rule, because I KNOW there are people on this list who have
insured conversions with State Farm. But, anyway, is there anyone in his
neighborhood who can recommend an insurance agent, State Farm or otherwise,
to insure a conversion?

Thanks for any help.

Mike Brown
Electro Automotive, POB 1113, Felton, CA 95018-1113 Phone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com email [email protected] Electric Car
Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I have my EV insured as a modified vehicle through Progressive. I had to provide receipts to show it was worth the stated value ($15K in my case).

Many agents at Progressive don't even realize they allow such policies. My agent had to do some searching on their system to find it and set it up. But my policy documents clearly show it.
Peter Flipsen Jr 
-----Original Message-----
From: "Mike Nickerson" <[email protected]>
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2010 07:20:34 
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'<[email protected]>
Reply-To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

I just insured the conversion I bought with State Farm, here in Idaho. They
didn't seem to fuss at all.

I don't have any suggestion on agents, but I don't think it's a fixed
policy. If it is, I may be in for a surprise down the road. I did
everything I could think of to make sure they knew ahead of time it was a
conversion. Because it has lithium cells, its value is quite a bit higher
than a similar model with an ICE.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Mike Brown
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 5:18 PM
To: EV Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him that
State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles. If true, must be
a very new rule, because I KNOW there are people on this list who have
insured conversions with State Farm. But, anyway, is there anyone in his
neighborhood who can recommend an insurance agent, State Farm or otherwise,
to insure a conversion?

Thanks for any help.

Mike Brown
Electro Automotive, POB 1113, Felton, CA 95018-1113 Phone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com email [email protected] Electric Car
Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

What type of insurance is the person wanting? PD&L should be no problem. In
Michigan ,no fault PD&L is mandated so a vehicle must be insured to get it
registered, that is the way it is set up, the insurers have a piece if cake,
you can only collect under PD&L from your own policy. The Secretary o State
does not care what is powering the vehicle, only that it has no fault
insurance and the registration fee is paid, then a registration plate is
issued. 
-- 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> On 16 Aug 2010 at 16:18, Mike Brown wrote:
> 
> > We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him
> > that State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I had previously responded that State Farm had insured my conversion without
any problems. I stand corrected. I just received the official letter in
the mail (from the home office) canceling my policy because it was an
electric vehicle conversion. The letter didn't say, but the agent's people
told me over the phone that their underwriters would have accepted if the
conversion was done by a "manufacturer" but not done by a private person.

This was after I had specifically called the agent and asked if they would
cover the EV conversion, before I bought it. I'm obviously more than a
little pissed.

The agent did go as far as finding another local insurance firm that will
insure the conversion. It is Farm Bureau Insurance. I'm not sure how wide
an area they cover. I also don't know their rate yet. If their rates are
reasonable, they will get a chance to bid for all my other insurance too. I
told my agent this and it sounds like he tried to change the mind of the
underwriters without success. I think he knows that he stands to lose quite
a bit of money because I've been a very good customer for many years.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of EVDL Administrator
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 1:06 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois



> On 16 Aug 2010 at 16:18, Mike Brown wrote:
> 
> > We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him
> > that State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Sure, I also went to my local Farmers agent where I already
had a renters insurance and a car (Liability only) insurance 
for my Prius to add another line for my Electric S10.
Since I did not request anything more than liability, the
agent was personally interested in my Electric Vehicle but
for the insurance the only took a look at the vehicle to see
if it was in decent running condition and arranged the extra
insurance which increased my premium by something like $20 a
month, it was insured as regular S10 under its original VIN.

If you want to insure for declared value then it may be
quite a bit different, but I was only concerned about running
my vehicle into something valueable, not the value of my EV

Regards,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of Mike Nickerson
Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 11:25 AM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

I had previously responded that State Farm had insured my conversion
without any problems. I stand corrected. I just received the official
letter in the mail (from the home office) canceling my policy because it
was an electric vehicle conversion. The letter didn't say, but the
agent's people told me over the phone that their underwriters would have
accepted if the conversion was done by a "manufacturer" but not done by
a private person.

This was after I had specifically called the agent and asked if they
would cover the EV conversion, before I bought it. I'm obviously more
than a little pissed.

The agent did go as far as finding another local insurance firm that
will insure the conversion. It is Farm Bureau Insurance. I'm not sure
how wide an area they cover. I also don't know their rate yet. If
their rates are reasonable, they will get a chance to bid for all my
other insurance too. I told my agent this and it sounds like he tried
to change the mind of the underwriters without success. I think he
knows that he stands to lose quite a bit of money because I've been a
very good customer for many years.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of EVDL Administrator
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 1:06 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois



> On 16 Aug 2010 at 16:18, Mike Brown wrote:
> 
> > We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him
> > that State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

FWIW, I'm pretty sure that State Farm and Farmers are completely different
companies.

In my town Farmers insurance was willing to insure my EV until they found
out it was registers as a Self Assembled vehicle, and they don't insure
those.

The only company in town that would insure a Self Assembled EV was
Progressive.

> Sure, I also went to my local Farmers agent where I already
> had a renters insurance and a car (Liability only) insurance
> for my Prius to add another line for my Electric S10.
> Since I did not request anything more than liability, the
> agent was personally interested in my Electric Vehicle but
> for the insurance the only took a look at the vehicle to see
> if it was in decent running condition and arranged the extra
> insurance which increased my premium by something like $20 a
> month, it was insured as regular S10 under its original VIN.
>
> If you want to insure for declared value then it may be
> quite a bit different, but I was only concerned about running
> my vehicle into something valueable, not the value of my EV
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Mike Nickerson
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2010 11:25 AM
> To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois
>
> I had previously responded that State Farm had insured my conversion
> without any problems. I stand corrected. I just received the official
> letter in the mail (from the home office) canceling my policy because it
> was an electric vehicle conversion. The letter didn't say, but the
> agent's people told me over the phone that their underwriters would have
> accepted if the conversion was done by a "manufacturer" but not done by
> a private person.
>
> This was after I had specifically called the agent and asked if they
> would cover the EV conversion, before I bought it. I'm obviously more
> than a little pissed.
>
> The agent did go as far as finding another local insurance firm that
> will insure the conversion. It is Farm Bureau Insurance. I'm not sure
> how wide an area they cover. I also don't know their rate yet. If
> their rates are reasonable, they will get a chance to bid for all my
> other insurance too. I told my agent this and it sounds like he tried
> to change the mind of the underwriters without success. I think he
> knows that he stands to lose quite a bit of money because I've been a
> very good customer for many years.
>
> Mike
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of EVDL Administrator
> Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 1:06 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois
>


> > On 16 Aug 2010 at 16:18, Mike Brown wrote:
> >
> >> We have a customer in Naperville, IL whose insurance agent told him
> >> that State Farm has a rule against insuring modified vehicles.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

When insuring my EV, I tried Farmer's first as they were my agent for homeowners and my other car. They couldn't cover it, so sent me to State Farm. No luck with them. Allstate wouldn't cover it, or GEICO. I ended up with Progressive. I have a "stated value" policy. It is not specifically for an EV, but is most commonly used for show cars and antiques. My conversion is a 1973 VW Fastback which has a blue book value of zero (as the original ICE car). Hence the need for the stated value - I simply told them that I wanted it insured for $30,000 and they provided the policy. I did not have to provide receipts to prove the value, although I could have. The insurance is expensive - about $2,200 per year.

I think the miles you drive the car also has an effect on the cost (I drive very little). Show cars are rarely driven. If you put 10,000 miles a year on the EV you may have a problem. 

Progressive is available in Illinois.

Good luck,
Richard


Richard Hamje
822 SE 45th Avenue
Portland, OR 97215
503-805-8829
[email protected]
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Richard,
For the cost of $2200 a year I would strongly consider self insurance (take
the risk).
-- 
View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Insurance-for-Conversion-in-Illinois-tp2327620p2334152.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

That's not an option in some states unless you are a large corporation that
can put up a sufficient sized bond...

Z



> Ruspert <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Richard,
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

All you need is liability on your self. The car does not paid the 
liability, you do. I tested the insurance companies when I shop for 
insurance. I said, if you are driving a million dollar car or a 500 dollar 
shop truck with I-beam bumpers on it and it hit the same car and applied 
damage to another same car, why does the liability cost more on the higher 
value car?

In fact that latter higher cost car may applied less damage then the shop 
truck.

In 55 years of driving, I had only $27.00 of damage that I cause to my car 
while backing up in a State Farm parking lot while I just got the insurance 
and hit a light pole which scratch the lacquer paint.

Lets say you have multiple cars, that only you drive yourself, then you can 
get one liability coverage to cover all the cars. Only one car can be 
driven at a time anyway. I can take my insurance card and drive any car, 
your car or a rental car and it will be cover.

Now if I rent a car, my liability covers it. Just make sure you carry the 
insurance card with you. For collision coverage, this is handle by some 
credit card companies which my will cover for up to $25,000.00 if the card 
is use to purchase the rental.

Roland






----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Zeke Yewdall" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 7:09 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois


> That's not an option in some states unless you are a large corporation 
> that
> can put up a sufficient sized bond...
>
> Z
>
>


> Ruspert <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Richard,
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I wish that was the way it was in Colorado..... here you cannot register a
car till you show there is insurance on the car itself -- it doesn't matter
than I have four other cars already insured, and can only drive one at a
time.... 

Z



> Roland Wiench <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > All you need is liability on your self. The car does not paid the
> > liability, you do. I tested the insurance companies when I shop for
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

But if you have 4 other cars then adding an additional car for liability only should be pretty straight forward. I cannot add
another vehicle for free, but I get a significantly reduced rate on "liability only" for an additional car because of their multiple
vehicle discount.

Funny thing too, my insurance company just sent me an offer to cover the Pinto under a "declared value" classic car policy because
its over 25 years old. Too funny  

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall
> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 9:31 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois
> 
> I wish that was the way it was in Colorado..... here you cannot register a
> car till you show there is insurance on the car itself -- it doesn't matter
> than I have four other cars already insured, and can only drive one at a
> time.... 
> 
> Z
> 
>


> Roland Wiench <[email protected]xxx.xxx> wrote:
> >
> > > All you need is liability on your self. The car does not paid the
> > > liability, you do. I tested the insurance companies when I shop for
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Roland 

The problem with liability only is the investment you have in your conversion. I make no claim to be perfect and if the accident is my fault then I am out all the mone for the conversion. I took out a loan to do the conversion (using my other car as collateral) and I'm still paying it off. I need collision coverage or I risk being stuck making payments on a car that doesn't run. Progressive and Farmers were the only companies I found who would give me that and Progressive was cheaper.

Peter Flipsen Jr. 
-----Original Message-----
From: "Mike Willmon" <[email protected]>
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2010 09:37:48 
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'<[email protected]>
Reply-To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

But if you have 4 other cars then adding an additional car for liability only should be pretty straight forward. I cannot add
another vehicle for free, but I get a significantly reduced rate on "liability only" for an additional car because of their multiple
vehicle discount.

Funny thing too, my insurance company just sent me an offer to cover the Pinto under a "declared value" classic car policy because
its over 25 years old. Too funny  

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall
> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 9:31 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois
> 
> I wish that was the way it was in Colorado..... here you cannot register a
> car till you show there is insurance on the car itself -- it doesn't matter
> than I have four other cars already insured, and can only drive one at a
> time.... 
> 
> Z
> 
>


> Roland Wiench <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > All you need is liability on your self. The car does not paid the
> > > liability, you do. I tested the insurance companies when I shop for
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Mike Willmon wrote:
> >> I wish that was the way it was in Colorado..... here you cannot register a
> >> car till you show there is insurance on the car itself -- it doesn't matter
> >> than I have four other cars already insured, and can only drive one at a
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

This is meant for coverage pertaining to damage to the EV, not PD&L, which
should be easily obtained at reasonable cost.
-- 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In Michigan each vehicle must have a separate insurance policy for PD&L (no
fault) even if there is only one driver and only one vehicle will be driven
at a time. It is unfair, but a boon for the insurers and there is nothing
that can be done about it as the law at present requires it.
-- 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Mike;

I insured my 65 Datsun that way.
Put a $10,000 value on it and it costs me $220 a year.

Thanks;
Dennis 
Elsberry, MO 
http://www.evalbum.com/1366 




-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Willmon [mailto:[email protected]] 
Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 11:38 AM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois

But if you have 4 other cars then adding an additional car for liability
only should be pretty straight forward. I cannot add another vehicle
for free, but I get a significantly reduced rate on "liability only" for
an additional car because of their multiple vehicle discount.

Funny thing too, my insurance company just sent me an offer to cover the
Pinto under a "declared value" classic car policy because its over 25
years old. Too funny  

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On 
> Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall
> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 9:31 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Insurance for Conversion in Illinois
> 
> I wish that was the way it was in Colorado..... here you cannot 
> register a car till you show there is insurance on the car itself -- 
> it doesn't matter than I have four other cars already insured, and can

> only drive one at a time.... 
> 
> Z
> 
>


> Roland Wiench <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > All you need is liability on your self. The car does not paid the
> > > liability, you do. I tested the insurance companies when I shop for
> ...


----------

