# Ecp-nev 600a



## favguy (May 2, 2008)

Many of us here know only too much about this "controller".

*DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES CONSIDER IT!*

It is not a controller, it is a joke, made out of bits of junk by a notorious con man, Mr Paul Zigouras. Do some searching on here under "epc". He used to trawl around here trying to con people, but was rumbled very quickly, unfortunately one or two people did get stung, the so called "controller" (it doesn't meet the basic requirements any sane person would attribute to such a device!), if used usually blows up immediately and is a very real danger to any one unfortunate enough to use it.


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## stampy (Jan 19, 2012)

favguy said:


> Many of us here know only too much about this "controller".
> 
> *DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES CONSIDER IT!*
> 
> It is not a controller, it is a joke, made out of bits of junk by a notorious con man, Mr Paul Zigouras. Do some searching on here under "ecp". He used to trawl around here trying to con people, but was rumbled very quickly, unfortunately one or two people did get stung, the so called "controller" (it doesn't meet the basic requirements any sane person would attribute to such a device!), if used usually blows up immediately and is a very real danger to any one unfortunate enough to use it.


Yikes! Good to know thank you. Is there a controller that isn't a scam in and around the same price piont or under $1000?


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## favguy (May 2, 2008)

For under $1000 there is the open revolt kit by paul&sabrina:

http://www.paulandsabrinasevstuff.com/

$600 plus shipping, you have to build it yourself from a very good kit and be very proficient at soldering.

Or... this guy will build one for you for $700. I can't vouch for him as I built my own, but I did communicate with him before deciding to do this and he seemed genuine enough:

http://www.evtradinpost.com/item/889

Here's my build of this controller to give you an idea:

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/my-project-favelec-58958p7.html

Other than this, at your price point there are the kelly controllers, current consensus is they aren't too bad if you use them at well under the rated current (probably about 50% of what it says on the spec. sheet!)

This one is bang on your budget:

http://kellycontroller.com/kdh14600d24-156v600a-seriespm-controller-p-530.html


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

I'd suggest reading on this forum first, before buying ANYTHING Paul Zigouras (Pzigouras) is selling.

Read this:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64282&highlight=pzigouras

and this:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55160&highlight=pzigouras

and this:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64673&highlight=pzigouras


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## PZigouras (Jun 5, 2010)

favguy said:


> Many of us here know only too much about this "controller".
> 
> *DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES CONSIDER IT!*
> 
> It is not a controller, it is a joke, made out of bits of junk by a notorious con man, Mr Paul Zigouras. Do some searching on here under "epc". He used to trawl around here trying to con people, but was rumbled very quickly, unfortunately one or two people did get stung, the so called "controller" (it doesn't meet the basic requirements any sane person would attribute to such a device!), if used usually blows up immediately and is a very real danger to any one unfortunate enough to use it.



Actually, this person is very incorrect about these controllers.

All EPC controllers are built using the finest IGBT modules and components available, and are backed by some of the best programming out there. Most EPC controllers have features that even a $2000 Curtis controller doesn't have.

And as EPC's customer testimonial page shows, every customer who uses these controllers loves them, except for one person (who happens to work for the competition). We will let that speak for itself.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

PZigouras said:


> Actually, this person is very incorrect about these controllers.
> 
> All EPC controllers are built using the finest IGBT modules and components available, and are backed by some of the best programming out there. Most EPC controllers have features that even a $2000 Curtis controller doesn't have.
> 
> And as EPC's customer testimonial page shows, every customer who uses these controllers loves them, except for one person (who happens to work for the competition). We will let that speak for itself.


How can you live with yourself? There are multiple examples documented on this board of your crap and ample opportunities for you to present evidence to the contrary. But you cannot support your claims. Get your crap off the market and go away for good.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

So he returns..... 

Stampy,

Most of the hashing-out has already been done by others, on this forum, in the threads above. Let other's comments and experience (and photos of the insides) speak for themselves, not "customer testimonials" on an EPC controlled website....


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## PZigouras (Jun 5, 2010)

major said:


> How can you live with yourself? There are multiple examples documented on this board of your crap and ample opportunities for you to present evidence to the contrary. But you cannot support your claims. Get your crap off the market and go away for good.


Exactly what evidence are you looking for? A PCB layout?


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## PZigouras (Jun 5, 2010)

frodus said:


> So he returns.....
> 
> Stampy,
> 
> Most of the hashing-out has already been done by others, on this forum, in the threads above. Let other's comments and experience (and photos of the insides) speak for themselves, not "customer testimonials" on an EPC controlled website....


The problem is that the competition REFUSES to post any pictures of the insides of their controllers. That said, there are no photos of the insides of our products that I've seen on this forum (no real ones, anyways).


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Yes there are. Since you wouldn't take pics, someone else took pics of their controller.

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265644&postcount=1
and
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265776&postcount=7
and
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265919&postcount=12


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## favguy (May 2, 2008)

Good grief, don't you have the good sense to stay away Zigouras, you aren't welcome here with your crap, never mind, you keep on digging that hole.....


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## PZigouras (Jun 5, 2010)

favguy said:


> Good grief, don't you have the good sense to stay away Zigouras, you aren't welcome here with your crap, never mind, you keep on digging that hole.....


Okay, first of all that is NOT an EPC board. If you haven't noticed, factory EPC boards are RED with WHITE lettering that says "EPC Corp" on it. That's not even close to what I have here in front of me.

Secondly, the box in that picture (if it's even an EPC box) looks to be gutted and re-soldered a million times.

Thankfully, most of our customers don't care about the fake pictures that you posted, and the smear campaign is not working. They are happy with their products and will buy from us again. If you don't believe me, just ask one. 

Sorry.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

That's funny, Because I found this right below those pictures, admitting that this is in fact your controller (here's the original, in case he goes to edit it):




PZigouras said:


> *These pictures look a little more like ours*. The only difference is that this one does not have the auto voltage detect powersupply that the new ones do.
> 
> The programming is slightly different on the new ones as well.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Contacts? We have asked this before. Nope there are none. 

I wish I had the money to waste on one and then show everyone the truth. 

You never did ship me one like you said for me to BETA test for all those who don't believe you. I wonder why? 


I said I'd do it and run it in my VW but you never did. I even sent my shipping address. Nothing ever showed up. You did say you would.


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## Stiive (Nov 22, 2008)

frodus said:


> Yes there are. Since you wouldn't take pics, someone else took pics of their controller.
> 
> http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265644&postcount=1
> and
> ...



WOW!!!!!!!!! All I can say....

Hahahahaha how much was he charging for this thing... what ever it is....!??


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## Stiive (Nov 22, 2008)

Stiive said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!! All I can say....
> 
> Hahahahaha how much was he charging for this thing... what ever it is....!??


Yup just visited the website...
only $1,755 if you buy 11+ of the 1000A... group buy anyone?

What I want to know is... why would anyone (e.g. EVNETICS) allow this guy to resell their stuff?


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

Stiive said:


> What I want to know is... why would anyone (e.g. EVNETICS) allow this guy to resell their stuff?


Unless you're the **AA it's illegal to prevent someone from reselling something they've purchased...I'm sure they wouldn't let him be an authorized distributor.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

Stiive said:


> Yup just visited the website...
> only $1,755 if you buy 11+ of the 1000A... group buy anyone?
> 
> What I want to know is... why would anyone (e.g. EVNETICS) allow this guy to resell their stuff?


What gave you the impression that Evnetics has anything to do with EPC/ECP (or whatever PZ is calling himself these days)? This is a serious question, not a flippant/rhetorical one, btw.


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## Stiive (Nov 22, 2008)

Tesseract said:


> What gave you the impression that Evnetics has anything to do with EPC/ECP (or whatever PZ is calling himself these days)? This is a serious question, not a flippant/rhetorical one, btw.


When I searched the product it came up on ElectricCarParts website, the name of which I assume ECP is an acronym. 

When the product was displayed, a soliton came up as a related product just below. I assume the EVNETICS would have therefore sold a product to ECP at wholesale for them to resell... even if this is not the case, having the products side-by-side is still probably not a good look. Maybe this is beyond EVNETICS control by US law as ziggy pointed out...


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## Jan (Oct 5, 2009)

I guess because solitons and ecp's are standing side by side in the OP's mentioned webstore:

http://www.electriccarpartscompany.com/Controllers-and-Electrical-Control-Boxes-ECBs_c_36.html

I would feel dirty too.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

Stiive said:


> When I searched the product it came up on ElectricCarParts website, the name of which I assume ECP is an acronym.
> 
> When the product was displayed, a soliton came up as a related product just below. I assume the EVNETICS would have therefore sold a product to ECP at wholesale for them to resell... even if this is not the case, having the products side-by-side is still probably not a good look. Maybe this is beyond EVNETICS control by US law as ziggy pointed out...


Thanks, that proves something which until now I had only suspected was the case; namely, that having our products alongside EPC/ECP on that (soon to be ex-) dealer's website gave EPC/ECP undeserved legitimacy.

As for the law, I Am Not A Lawyer (IANAL), so I am not entirely sure what we can and can't do legally here, but I do know that we can revoke the dealership agreement from a dealer at any time and command them to remove all references to our products from their website/literature.


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## Siwastaja (Aug 1, 2012)

The interesting part here is that the forum administration allows that fraud company to advertise on this site, and does not ban mr Zigouras. Maybe they are not just up to date; but that said, there's nothing new going on...

Another thing I find interesting is that mr Zigouras seems like a hobbyist at the field of con. A real professional wouldn't waste any time in arguing with people who have completely found out about the fraud. He should be using his valuable time to search for new victims.

Was there any criminal investigation going on with this ECP case? I remember some victims talking about that, but did it realize?


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

I haven't heard of any links between electriccarpartscompany and P Zigouras, except that they appear to stock his crap. Several have questioned their legitimacy due to this fact.

I believe electriccarpartscompany is owned and operated by Carl Clark in Midvale Utah, and I've heard him vouched for here. He may be ignorant to the whole P Zigouras issue.


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## mk4gti (May 6, 2011)

PZigouras said:


> They are happy with their products and will buy from us again. If you don't believe me, just ask one.


Hi, I would like to see the list of your happy customers. 

After reading the various threads, if you are half the sales person you claim to be, you need to get your fan base to step up. You have a lot of work to do; because after reading these threads, you obviously come out as a bad joke.



PZigouras said:


> Sorry.


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## stampy (Jan 19, 2012)

sorry I opened that wound. I like the sound of the prebuilt revolt kit when ever i fall into some $$ thats the one ill more than likely get.


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

PZigouras said:


> All EPC controllers are built using the finest IGBT modules and components available


They probably are - until you get your hands on it. 

I know what I`m talking about. 

Would you tell us the background that would make us aware of your expertise in the field of power electronics, or the one that actually designs those "circuits"? Vocational education, some college ? Why don`t you let the engineer speak up. Or ist that you - the salesman?


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

Ziggythewiz said:


> He may be ignorant to the whole P Zigouras issue.


He may be, as many others might, but http://evpartsdepot.com/ certainly is not.
They advertise and sell this junk quite eagerly, knowing it is junk. Any complaints are hanlded like this: Talk to the manufacturer- that of course is Ziguras, we are not liable. 

By seeing EPC stuff at different distributors, placed next to other name brand controllers at ebay, and on google anyway, the impression of legitimacy is being created.

Legal action to stop this could be expensive, leaving means like telephone, internet, email, to notify the public as much as possible about this fraudulent aktivity. 
Lets single out the bad ones, starting with //evpartsdepot.com e`s advertising this stuff for years now, knowing about the issues.


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## Salty9 (Jul 13, 2009)

Interesting. I'm not positive but I think this is a picture of motor and evpartsdepot uses it for battery charger and controller descriptions.


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## favguy (May 2, 2008)

The fact Zigouras's own website named above is trying to hawk this crap is, of course, no surprise. 

It is however very disturbing that electriccarpartscompany.com who seem to be a legitimate EV supplier are selling them on thier website along with real products such as the soliton controllers!  I have personally written to them expressing my concerns and will report back with any reply I get from them, may I suggest others do so also. Surely no legitimate retailer will continue to sell this junk if they have the facts?


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

PZigouras said:


> Exactly what evidence are you looking for? A PCB layout?


Prefboard layout would be more acurate.


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

PZigouras said:


> Okay, first of all that is NOT an EPC board. If you haven't noticed, factory EPC boards are RED with WHITE lettering that says "EPC Corp" on it.


http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265776&postcount=7

Mr. Ziguras: You posted those pics your self on the 10.24 at 07:08 Pm. Those are not EPC boards? Where are the RED and WHITE letters hiding?


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

Jan said:


> solitons and ecp's are standing side by side


Here we all should take action. 
We can`t prohibit a nerd to try to sell dangerous homebuilt crap. But we can single it out, where ever it showes up. And we can educate people that don`t know yet. This shop operator should be spoken to.


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Citystromer said:


> http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=265776&postcount=7
> 
> Mr. Ziguras: You posted those pics your self on the 10.24 at 07:08 Pm. Those are not EPC boards? Where are the RED and WHITE letters hiding?


That is actually Major that posted that, not PZigouras. You might be confused because Major is replying to PZigouras, but the pictures are from Major's post.


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## favguy (May 2, 2008)

Got some good news,
Carl from Electric Car Parts has written back to me confirming he's had two concerned e-mails in the last 24 hrs about ecp/epc stuff and has now removed it from the website


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