# 160kw DC motor?



## CFreeman54 (Jan 14, 2009)

Check Netgain WarP motors.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

nvelasco said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am looking a DC motor manufacturer in the US and I don't know if anyone could give me a hint to find it. It is for a EBus project and all the system has to be designed on DC current to keep things as simple as possible.
> 
> ...


http://www.uqm.com/pdfs/PP200 Spec Sheet 3.30.11.pdf

This would do the job for you. It is actually an AC motor, but via the controller runs from a DC source like a battery or FC. The typical DC motors like the WarP series will not do what you want.

Regards to spain 

major


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

Thank you both for the links and refferences. I guess that the AC with DC controller has more power than the netgain products.

The only problem now is that specifications request a 2680 Nm to start the bus... it is done using an indirect transmission (basically substituting the old diesel engine and connecting the Electric motor to the transmission train for rear wheels...

Well, I'll check with the manufacturers and will see.

Keep well in the USA.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

nvelasco said:


> The only problem now is that specifications request a 2680 Nm to start the bus... it is done using an indirect transmission (basically substituting the old diesel engine and connecting the Electric motor to the transmission train for rear wheels...


That would be your job to design. Some electric buses use a single ratio gearbox and a high speed motor. Some retain a shifting transmission. Most that I've seen do not shift gears.


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

major said:


> That would be your job to design. Some electric buses use a single ratio gearbox and a high speed motor. Some retain a shifting transmission. Most that I've seen do not shift gears.


Yes, it is our job or at least another part of the team. As today is saturday, an eastern no chance to find much people working today. I'll wait till the manufacturer answer on prices and models next tuesday (your next working day)

I'll try to keep a post on the deveolpments. thanks for the guidelines and help

Nicolas


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## CFreeman54 (Jan 14, 2009)

I think Major's concern is that you indicated you wanted regen. regen is very difficult with a DC motor, and unless you plan on driving downhill a lot, not really worth the trouble. A WarP 11 HV with a Zilla 2K HV can put out more than 500 KW peak power. Check what the drag racers are doing. WarP makes a 13" diam. motor too but I am not too familiar with its specifications, but I am sure it puts out more torque than the WarP 11.


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

CFreeman54 said:


> I think Major's concern is that you indicated you wanted regen. regen is very difficult with a DC motor, and unless you plan on driving downhill a lot, not really worth the trouble. A WarP 11 HV with a Zilla 2K HV can put out more than 500 KW peak power. Check what the drag racers are doing. WarP makes a 13" diam. motor too but I am not too familiar with its specifications, but I am sure it puts out more torque than the WarP 11.


Then I should ask both manufacturers to see which one suits best the project. What exactly is a Zilla 2K HV???

Thank you for the coment.


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## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Que tal Nicolas?



nvelasco said:


> What exactly is a Zilla 2K HV???


It's a mystical creature of years past. Referencing the movie Avatar, it's Toruk Makto: a huge animal of great might that was utilized for a specific task and then vanished to never been seen of again. It's entirely made out of Unobtanium and very difficult to find and buy.

A powerful DC controller you can buy today, capable of about twice the power you're looking for, is the Evnetic's Soliton-1. The controller's designers, code developers and company owners frequent this forum and have been known to jump in to help a customer in need.

JR


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

CFreeman54 said:


> I think Major's concern is that you indicated you wanted regen.


That is one concern, CF. And others are thermal suitability and overall durability of motors like WarPs. Although I have seen commutator DC motors used on full size buses (in Brazil), they were huge interpole machines probably 4 times the size of a WarP13 

Needless to say, transit buses are a very different application from EVcar conversions. What works in the DIY, or even on the drag strip, may not be suitable for a bus. Buses are heavy, worked hard and expected to last. I worked on one which weighed in at 38,000 pounds and had over a million miles on it. The really big ones can hit 60,000 pounds.

With that mass and typical mission duty requiring 6 to 10 stops and starts per mile, regeneration can reduce energy requirements on the order of 25%. Here regeneration makes sense. 

Regards,

major


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

JRoque said:


> Que tal Nicolas?
> It's a mystical creature of years past. Referencing the movie Avatar, it's Toruk Makto: a huge animal of great might that was utilized for a specific task and then vanished to never been seen of again. It's entirely made out of Unobtanium and very difficult to find and buy.
> A powerful DC controller you can buy today, capable of about twice the power you're looking for, is the Evnetic's Soliton-1. The controller's designers, code developers and company owners frequent this forum and have been known to jump in to help a customer in need.
> JR


Unobtanium... We have a huge stock of that in our political system, but as you say it is dificult to extract... 

The comment from Major about regenerating makes sense as the street bus has to start and stop many times per mile/km. 

As I do not have much data from the bus itself, I guess I should ask some questions before bothering more your precious time, which I appretiate.

(may be in the bus trunk there is room to hide the Zilla...)


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

nvelasco said:


> ...


I've got more data from the BUS project guys.
Max Weight : 18.000 kgr -> 36.000 lbs
Bus weight : 12.000 kgr -> 24.000 lbs (without passengers)

Max speed: 70 km/h ->

Max inclination: 18%

Well, it is quite exciting!!!


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## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Hello Nick, how far will the bus have to travel? 

Here's some links to similar projects. There's some interesting figures there, especially on the first link:
http://www.kerstech.com/PDFs/Hybrid Electric School Bus Preliminary Technical Feasibility Report.pdf
http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels/vsa/pdfs/32858.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bus (note the work in Spain)

JR


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

Hello JR
The overall distance between recharging batteries/H2 tanks is about 250km ...
Thank you for the links and I have now lots of information to digest.

There are many issues around which are doors to open and close... but let's see where do we reach. 

Keep well and thx a lot


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

JRoque said:


> JR


I've read part of the information of the links and it is quite useful, but the one we are working is really an EVBUS, as there is no internal combustion engine. 

The information about spain is good as there are different initiatives in cities, promoted by the local councils.

I need to check with the DC motor manufacturers to see when they can provide the information and keep on going. 

There are issues with the batteries and super condensers, needed for fast energy recovery and fast energy output, combined with a PEM Cell... so, nothing done before, I guess....

thank you for your information and let's see where does this end.


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## nvelasco (Apr 23, 2011)

Hello,
I've got a quote from UQM and now is time for the customer to decide and see if the other parameters match. The batteries are 320 or 620Vcc from a swiss manufacturer... and now we have the PEM and capacitors to check...
I'll let you know more...


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

nvelasco said:


> Hello,
> I've got a quote from UQM and now is time for the customer to decide and see if the other parameters match. The batteries are 320 or 620Vcc from a swiss manufacturer... and now we have the PEM and capacitors to check...
> I'll let you know more...


Well if you didn't choke on the UQM quote, you might also check out Siemens. They make a line of motor/inverter products for this type of application. They were used on the ISE buses. Haven't heard much from ISE lately. They may have went under. Were out of California. They did some FC/ultracap buses. Anyway, good luck.


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