# 1990 Chevrolet Sprint



## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Hello,

Started a thread a while back about a conversion for my 1990 Sentra. I have since decided to use a Chev. Sprint due to lack of adapter options and failure to locate a manual steering rack for the Sentra. It also had several other issues that I no longer need to worry about. I now have my Sprint!










Today I bought a used 6.7" ADC motor, Curtis 1231C controller, and PB6 pot box. I have a few questions.

1. The motor has 2 wires sticking out of the center that have been cut off. 









I was advised by the previous owner that they were not in use in his car. Any ideas what they're for? My only guess is temperature sensor.

2. Does anybody have a basic wiring diagram for common DC components?

3. The controller has a jumper wire running from the positive high-voltage in to a spade connection on the same side of the controller. It is fused in the middle of the wire.









Why would this be?

4. How do I remove a taper-lock hub from a motor?

5. As the controller and motor came with no mounting hardware...I don't know what size screws to use for them...anybody know this?


Thanks so much for any help!


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Sorry for the multiple posts...I don't quite know what I did wrong. Is there a way to delete the duplicates?

Also I seem to be having some trouble getting my photos in the post and not underneath it as well.


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## madderscience (Jun 28, 2008)

Hello-

The 2 small wires are indeed for a temperature switch. they can be wired straight into a temperature 'idiot light' if you desire so. I forget if the temperature switch is off or on at high temperature but that is easy to determine with an ohmmeter. 

The Curtis 1231C is generally a reliable controller if not abused. However curtis controllers do sometimes failed "ON" full blast so be somewhat wary of a used one if you don't know for sure it functions. In any case, you should have a main contactor, circuit breaker AND fuse in series with the battery pack. The circuit breaker should be set up so it can be opened and closed by the driver. This makes it easy to disconnect for safety when parked, and makes it possible to kill power to the car in an emergency.

The Red wire with fuse is providing traction battery voltage to the logic circuits of the controller. The other three blade terminals are for the potbox. Don't mix up which is which or you will fry the controller. I imagine you can download the user's manual with wiring diagrams from Curtis. Also, The traction battery voltage to the logic circuit of the controller SHOULD be switched on the ignition via the key switch relay I think they call it, such that power is cut off when you turn off ignition. This is another safety thing, that apparently the prior owner didn't bother with. The idea is if the main contactor jams shut, the key switch relay can still turn off the controller. Having a separate path to power the controller logic circuits also allows for a precharge circuit which is a good idea to have.

As for wiring diagrams, get a copy of "convert it" by mike brown, or "Build your own electric vehicle" 2nd edition by Bob Brandt (2nd one is my favorite) Both provide step-by-step on a DC conversion including wiring diagrams. The Brandt book is more current and also has some history and theory which is why I prefer it. Amazon has both, very worthwhile the small cost. The wiring diagrams for my own car are at http://www.amphibike.org/index.cgi?page=pages/3_wheels/mr2/ev_electronics/schematics but I have electronic reversing which you won't need unless you mess with your transmission (like I did) or use direct drive.

They make pullers especially for removing taper lock hubs, but I imagine removing the bolts , soaking it in WD-40 if rusty and then and gently tapping it with a hammer might loosen it up. Don't hit it too hard or you will damage the bearings. I imagine a trip to Sears or your local industrial hardware store will be fruitful for finding a puller.

Welcome to the forum.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Thanks for all of the great information. I have tried pulling the hub off with no success. The pullers I have found all have fingers that are too fat to fit into the tiny space between the hub and the face of the motor. I have tried tapping it and wd-40 with no luck. I guess I will take it to a machine shop.


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## poprock (Apr 29, 2010)

Hi; Your car is the same as Ben Nelsons Forkenswift ( Suzuki Swift in Aust ). Check the Garage section or Youtube.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Hoping to recruit some help here. 

The motor I bought is a used 6.7" Advanced DC L91-4003 seen here http://www.cloudelectric.com/product_p/mo-l91-4003.htm. The hub currently mounted on the motor has a hole directly in the middle which goes more than 2" deep...deeper than the hub extends from the motor face, so I don't get how there could be a shaft in there . This motor came from a 1980 Renault hence the strange hub, which I also can't seem to remove. The brass ring in the center appears to have been machined with the aluminum hub.

Is there a version of this motor that was built with a female shaft? Or is it possible that this one was modified, am I missing something? It is meant to be a double shaft motor and the one on the opposite end has been removed so I know it has had some work done....HELP!


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## madderscience (Jun 28, 2008)

what does the EDGE of the hub adapter look like? is it clearly two pieces, or just one? It is hard to tell from your pictures. A taperlock hub is two pieces, one that fits over the motor shaft, and a locking collar that clamps it down. Here is what mine looked like disassembled:

http://www.amphibike.org/images/640_mr2_hub_parts.jpg 
(Note the stub shaft at the top was used in correcting the hub's alignment but is not part of the hub itself)

If it is a taperlock and the outer ring is a separate piece that compresses the inner one, then pulling on the outer ring might actually be making it tighter, you might need to drive it the opposite direction (toward the motor face) depending on how it is made. (that is how mine works) Looking at it edge on might make it obvious which way the outer ring has to go. Also if it is a taperlock, the inner part should have a slot or two cut lengthwise (parallel to the motor shaft) to allow it to be compressed onto the shaft by the outer ring.

The motor bearings are recessed about 1/4 of an inch or so behind the motor face plate. The hub probably is touching the edge of the bearing so you can't see it.

Another thought: If that hub is on there as well as it is, is there any way you can just use the existing hub instead of taking it off? It is a fairly common EV conversion problem for an adapter hub to come loose and the hubs really do need to be on there tighter than heck to prevent that problem.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

madderscience said:


> what does the EDGE of the hub adapter look like?


It is definitely one piece. But it is on there bloody tight. I have tried heating the hub, tapping it with a hammer, prying it from both sides, and several pullers. None of the pullers had a pattern that was of any use on this hub...I'm lost!


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## dladd (Jun 1, 2011)

Was this motor from a factory electric car? Maybe the OEM had a custom setup, not just a bolt on adapter. It could easily have a OEM specific output shaft, who knows!

I'd take it to a machine shop and see if they can tell what's going on, or better yet see if there is any way you can adapt to it as is, without removing the adapter.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

I sure hope that's not the case, but the car was a 1980 and the motor has a date stamp on it (production date?) from the mid 90s so its likely just a stuck hub.Off to the machinist I guess


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Machinist near my house says he can't do it without building a custom tool with a huge price tag....any more ideas?


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi Mig

You have got a wonderful adapter already there on your motor - all you need is to adapt it to your gearbox

There are 2 ways - with a clutch and without a clutch

If you want to retain the clutch look at the flywheel off your old engine - get all of the metal further out from the center than the clutch mounts removed and look at machining the center to match your adapter

If you want to go clutchless look at your clutch friction plate, then work out how to attach the the female splines in the friction plate to the adapter 

Once you have figured out how to mate the motor drive shaft to the gearbox then you can have a look at adapting the bell-housing to match up with the motor


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

I don't quite understand what you are suggesting. How can the hub be modified without removing it? If there is any way I can just use the hub that is on there now that would save me any more hassle trying to get it off...


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Ok I think I understand. I do want to keep the clutch so i would need to have theflywheel from my Sprint machined to match the hub that is on the motor. How can i know that the clearance will be correct for the hub to meet the flywheel when the motor is mounted to the bell housing?


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi Mig

What you need to do is measure where the flywheel on your IC engine is relative to the bellhousing

you then need to have your adapters so that the flywheel is in the same position

you do this by machining the flywheel to match your adapter - (or by machining an in-between adapter)
bolt the flywheel on measure the amount it sticks out

you can then calculate how thick the plate that adapts from the motor to the bellhousing has to be

Some people use two plates - one for the bellhousing and one for the motor
Then centralise the whole thing by spinning the motor and moving one plate against the other until it is sweet then bolting the two plates together


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Hey Duncan, thanks for all of the info but I think I want to stick to my original plan which was to avoid doing any fabricating on the hub/adapter and just buy a kit to be safe. If i can't find a puller that is suitable I will just cut the thing off with my grinder.

Another question:

I am currently trying to decide between floodies or lithium, and cost comparing. If I were to go with 12V Leads for a 120V system at about 130ah...could I not get away with similar or even better performance from 70ahr lithiums since the leads can only be discharged to 50%? My logic says that 70ahr of lithium should actually perform better because they can be discharged to 80%....any thoughts? This would cost more obviously but it would save me having to upgrade my suspension and maintain/replace batteries.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Specifically I am looking at the T1275 Which has an 20 hour ahr rating of 150. What would I have to use for lithiums to get comparable performance given that they're lighter and capable of greater dod?


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Got the hub off today. Made a crude puller with 1" flat stock and a drill press!


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Hello all, 

Been a while since I have updated. Motor was coupled flawlessly to the transmission 2 weeks ago. The hub that was on the motor was removed using a puller that I built from flat stock, some bolts, nuts and a drill press. I used a coupler and adapter plate from Randy at Canev and was completely happy with both. The adapter and coupler had to be modified as the shaft was 3/8 shorter than stock but there was a 3/8 spacer in the setup so it was no big deal.

I had some friends over this morning to help me lift the whole unit into the car for lack of an engine hoist. Glad we had as many guys as we did! It was bloody heavy! I'm sure it would be much harder with a 9" motor!










Transmission mounts are all back on and I need to figure out how I am going to support the motor. I was given a hokey looking bracket that fits the 6.7" motor that I'm unsure if I want to use or not. I will post a picture later. I want to use the stock engine mount if I can and simplicity is the name of the game here. I went through all the swifts and metros I could find on evalbum and couldn't find a good pic of how to do this, any ideas?

Also, do I need a torque rod? I have seen some talk about this and don't totally understand the purpose it would serve as the motor would be supported and fixed the transmission face. Any and all help is appreciated.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Anybody who has done this?


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Help please!


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## Joey (Oct 12, 2007)

migreig said:


> Hello all,
> 
> Been a while since I have updated. Motor was coupled flawlessly to the transmission 2 weeks ago. The hub that was on the motor was removed using a puller that I built from flat stock, some bolts, nuts and a drill press. I used a coupler and adapter plate from Randy at Canev and was completely happy with both. The adapter and coupler had to be modified as the shaft was 3/8 shorter than stock but there was a 3/8 spacer in the setup so it was no big deal.
> 
> ...


Using the existing motor mount is a good idea. It is already designed to handle the torque of the motor and transmission as they work to rotate the wheels. Can you mount a plate to the end plate of the motor, and make an arm to connect up to the motor mount?

Another option is a cradle mount for the motor, but you would still need to figure out how to tie it back to the motor mount. I found this picture online. Does that help?


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## Mark C (Jun 25, 2010)

I looked up Metros in the garage and found this one. It had a picture of the motor support. Looks kind of cool too.

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/garage/cars/340

Hope this helps, I rootin' for you and your success!

Mark


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Thanks for the help guys! I think I may have it figured now, I will post pics of the finished product.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

It's been far too long since I have updated here. In the last few months I have built a mount for the motor.









Mounted the controller/ pot box and main contactor under the hood.









Built both front and rear battery racks to accommodate my 10-Deka Dominator 12V AGMs. I decided to try 3 under the hood and 7 in the back. The car is a little rear heavy but still has some travel in the rear suspension. I will upgrade to Ford Ranger springs soon. I built the rear racks inside the car without cutting away the wheel well or under the rear seat for a box. I can change this later I just didn't want to weaken the car as I'm adding so much weight to that area anyways.

































I still need a charger, fuse, lugs, gauges and a few other bits and pieces but I'm getting there!

Had some spare time this weekend so I decided to get some work done on the heater. You've all seen one of these before...


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Not sure what happened to my photos...


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Let's try again.
























http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/album.php?
albumid=207&pictureid=1188


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Anybody offer a hand on getting these pictures posted? I insert the url of the photo like it asks and it just keeps giving me question marks.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=207&pictureid=1190


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)




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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)




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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Obviously I suck at this.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

That was embarrassing.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

Those batts look huge! What are they, like 80 lbs?


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

The batteries are 70lbs each, so 700lbs for the pack. I'm still not sure about the weight. I may move down to 96v.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

migreig said:


> The batteries are 70lbs each, so 700lbs for the pack. I'm still not sure about the weight. I may move down to 96v.


Pfft...amateur...I'm packin over 1,000


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Quick question about wiring the contactor.

I have the wiring diagram for the curtis controller from KTA and it shows a KSI relay but is unclear about how to wire it or even what it does.

I do have this relay, it came with all of the parts that I bought second hand. Do I need to use it? Why could I not just run straight 12V ignition power to the Albright sw200 contactor?

Sorry for the newbie question but I just can't find a diagram that explains what to do with this thing anywhere!


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

The main reason for the relay would be if you're running some additional logic that does not tie the contactor directly to the ignition...say for a precharge circuit or something.

Have you downloaded the curtis manual yet? It has a number of diagrams.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Thanks for the reply. I have the Curtis manual and from what I can tell it doesn't offer any useful information about the KSI.

All of my components came from a different EV and I don't believe that there was any "additional logic". I just don't see a need for it and wanted to make sure that I won't destroy something by leaving it out and wiring my Albright SW200 directly to 12V ignition power.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

Nope, mine is. My manual precharge is wired separate, and any additional safeties you want (such as charge interlock or panic button) can be added in series.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Thanks for the help Zig, I will wire it direct for now and maybe I can figure out what the deal with the relay is sometime in the future.


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

It's been a while since I've updated this. The car is running now. I have driven it twice a total of about 20k (10.5k on a single charge) and am very happy with it. 

Came across something yesterday that's really bothering me though. I noticed that I have voltage between my traction pack and the 12v chassis ground. I don't understand why this is as I have not intentionally wired it that way. The traction pack is it's own sealed system. The only thing I can think of is maybe through the motor into the transmission? The motor itself is mounted on rubber so it's not there. It doesn't seem to be causing any trouble for now but I want to get it sorted asap. How would I go about diagnosing where the "leak" is?


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## migreig (Aug 5, 2011)

Bump. Has anybody else experienced this?


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