# Logisystems Controller Broke



## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

What went wrong with it?


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## gasless (Jul 10, 2008)

Hi Tesseract

I don't have a clue what happened. I was pulling up the drive and it just stopped. I checked to see what could have gone wrong. The Voltage was good the pot box checked out good. Just no volts coming out of the controller to the motor. To bad, I really like this controller.. I talked to Marie at Logisystems by phone and I am encouraged that they will take care of it in a timely manner. I will keep everyone up to date.

Ed


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## ddmcse (Oct 9, 2008)

what model logisystems volts and amps ?


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## gasless (Jul 10, 2008)

550 amp 73 to 120 volt. While they are repairing my controller I'm having them up grade it to a 120 to 144 volt 550 amp model.


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## CPLTECH (Sep 14, 2007)

gasless said:


> Hi Tesseract
> 
> I don't have a clue what happened. I was pulling up the drive and it just stopped. I checked to see what could have gone wrong. The Voltage was good the pot box checked out good. Just no volts coming out of the controller to the motor. To bad, I really like this controller.. I talked to Marie at Logisystems by phone and I am encouraged that they will take care of it in a timely manner. I will keep everyone up to date.
> 
> Ed


How in the world did you get past the receptionist?
Today I asked to speak with Technical Service, and was refused.
I asked to speak with Customer Relations, and was refused.
You know there’s something wrong when a 1000A controller made in Oct smokes after 7 miles and there is no support.

Upset in Ohio


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## gasless (Jul 10, 2008)

CPLTECH said:


> How in the world did you get past the receptionist?
> Today I asked to speak with Technical Service, and was refused.
> I asked to speak with Customer Relations, and was refused.
> You know there’s something wrong when a 1000A controller made in Oct smokes after 7 miles and there is no support.
> ...


CPLTECH, Ive never had a problem talking to anyone there. I wonder what is going on??? I think they may have gotten some bad Caps. They told me they got a bad batch of them. Did yours actually smoke?? Mine just quit on me....Ed


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## TelnetManta (Jun 5, 2008)

I've called them on numerous occasions and while I did have to wait for a call back once or twice I have always been able to speak to someone. So far no problems with my 750amp model either. 

Ben



CPLTECH said:


> How in the world did you get past the receptionist?
> Today I asked to speak with Technical Service, and was refused.
> I asked to speak with Customer Relations, and was refused.
> You know there’s something wrong when a 1000A controller made in Oct smokes after 7 miles and there is no support.
> ...


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## CPLTECH (Sep 14, 2007)

gasless said:


> CPLTECH, Ive never had a problem talking to anyone there. I wonder what is going on??? I think they may have gotten some bad Caps. They told me they got a bad batch of them. Did yours actually smoke?? Mine just quit on me....Ed


Had slowed down to 15 mph for an intersection, slowly accelerated, jerked back & forth, smoke poured out from the 3 screw holes (screws were out in preperation of fine tuning pots-never had the chance tho). For the first time in my 49 yr of driving & 2 yrs of EV, will I now have to consider becomming a AAA member. Sad...

Just tried again, mentioning someone on the forum talked to Marie. They hung up on me. Poor way to conduct business after convincing me to buy their product 3 months ago. It may co$t me another competitors controller for this LogiSytem experience, but sounds just like some of those with Kelly experiences. At this point, I will never ever again put a LogiSystem under my hood!!!

Years ago there was a Chicago TV mfg that advertised: The quality goes in before the name goes on.


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## saab96 (Mar 19, 2008)

The state of the controller market is pretty pathetic. Someone really needs to take over the Zilla production line.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

saab96 said:


> The state of the controller market is pretty pathetic. Someone really needs to take over the Zilla production line.


I honestly doubt that's going to happen unless Otmar substantially reduces his asking price of ~$1M. This is because his design, so far as I can tell from the limited information about it, requires tedious hand-matching of the IGBTs and a lot of mechanical assembly (read: labor to put it together). If we assume that half the retail price of the Z1K is profit (over and above parts, labor, admin., etc.) you'd have to sell a thousand just to break even. Doesdn't seem too daunting, except that according to Otmar's production blog he was thrilled when he managed to make 15 in one whole month. That's $180k per year in profit which means it will take ~6 years for an investor just to break even. Keep in mind that the Zilla enjoys a reputation for being the most advanced DC motor controller on the market which is how it is able to command a premium price - will that still be true 6 years from now? I'd say the chances are slim-to-none, so *someone* will have to do more product development either to advance the state of the art or to get the costs down to remain competitive. So, a prospective investor with the $1M laying around will either have to be a motor controller design genius or else will have to rely on Otmar designing new products (which won't be for free, of course - Otmar has to make a living just like the rest of us).

In the meantime, the longer Zilla is out of production the more difficult it will be to re-enter the (admittedly, not terribly crowded) marketplace. And then there will inevitably be a need to convince people that being "under new management" has not affected the quality of the product.

No, folks, I don't believe we will ever see the Zilla in production again *unless* Otmar himself resumes such.

(sorry for the thread hi-jack!)


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## TX_Dj (Jul 25, 2008)

CPLTECH said:


> They hung up on me.


That is piss-poor. Are you calling the same number as the other poster? Sounds like you're getting completely different people to talk to...

And to think, I was considering a Logisystems controller as an alternative to Curtis... but I should have learned by now... every time I start thinking about doing that, something comes up that convinces me yet again that I will buy Curtis instead.


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## CPLTECH (Sep 14, 2007)

TX_Dj said:


> That is piss-poor. Are you calling the same number as the other poster? Sounds like you're getting completely different people to talk to...
> 
> And to think, I was considering a Logisystems controller as an alternative to Curtis... but I should have learned by now... every time I start thinking about doing that, something comes up that convinces me yet again that I will buy Curtis instead.


The number I was calling is 432-381-6000. Same number when I talked to “Brian” back in August and convinced me that it was a superior product to Curtis and they even made modification improvements when they fixed Curtis controllers. Heard he has since departed for family reasons. Even recommended a certain dealer, who I figure is currently frustrated for lack of good product and customers calling constantly (I can’t imagine I am the only disgruntled one left holding the bag). It’s not their fault they are caught in the middle of this fiasco, too.
I googled the name for that number & address in Odessa, TX. I have since done a google satellite map of the address. Like to know where there is a “factory” at that location. Could be just the owner’s home address, tho.
As for the gatekeeper (receptionist) of the place, my “assumption” is that she is a family member trying to shield her family during this crisis, since anyone else wouldn’t put up with all this horse apple stuff. I would think that events of the day would be discussed at the dinner table and something put in place to stop all this customer good will hemorrhaging. 

FWIW, I started the following personal blog of the recent events (and those of others) of the past 3 months to calm me down from having a stroke or heart attack:
1- *Controllers.* Oh, what a can of worms! Listen intently to what is said on the forum. Unless you are adventuresome and your Triple A membership is current, go with the tried and true units. I know, for one, that I wanted something better to replace my failed 1995 Curtis 1231C. However, new tech controllers are not delivering promised reliability at this time (count me in with that crowd), and Curtis is laughing all the way to the bank. I hope in coming months that some engineering guru will solve the new tech problems to keep the EV momentum going. As a result I may end up paying twice to get a working controller that gets me farther than 7 miles. Maybe I need to carry a spare with quick disconnects if I am a “proud” owner of some of these brands. (Do you think Big Oil is sabotaging us?) 
2- *Merchants.* Buy from someone who has been around for a long, long while. Are they working on a “shoestring” budget? Buy with a credit (not debit) card so you have someone in your corner when things go sour. Otherwise you are at their mercy to make things right. Now, try to explain to your significant other why you need to spend double the original amount!
3- *Manufacturers.* Buy from someone that has a working web site with contact info. Has a department, such as Customer Relations or Tech Service. Someone that will listen to your concerns, and a front desk that can direct you to a real person. What is their product’s reputation on EV boards?
4- This global economic/recession problem is affecting the personal stress level in all of us and the balance in our 401(k). I expect this recession will filter down to the EV business, too. Try to handle it the best you can.

Just my 2¢ worth.
94 S10, 20-USB145, 9”ADC, 12K EV miles on the clock and holding


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## gasless (Jul 10, 2008)

Hi, I gave Marie the address for this forum. This way She can see what people are saying about there product. I think they will get there controller bugs worked out. Soon I hope....Ed


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## fugdabug (Jul 14, 2008)

CPLTECH said:


> Just tried again, mentioning someone on the forum talked to Marie. They hung up on me. Poor way to conduct business after convincing me to buy their product 3 months ago. It may co$t me another competitors controller for this LogiSytem experience, but sounds just like some of those with Kelly experiences. At this point, I will never ever again put a LogiSystem under my hood!!!
> 
> Years ago there was a Chicago TV mfg that advertised: The quality goes in before the name goes on.


Doesn't it make you feel 'special'... you have been more than calm in your explanation... And yes, there is more than one of 'me'... and as somebody posted, the controller market is not looking too good at this point. But what is worse is the way folks treat you AFTER something goes wrong. I wish you the best, and let's hope we all can find a better controller... THAT WORKS and is well tech-supported.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

I have a logisystems in my ATV and I abuse it and it has held up fine.
I spoke with Brian originally and he suggested I go with the 750 rather than the 500 I had ordered, we did an exchange with no drama. 
At the time it was good bang for the bucks. I have even inadvertantly switched into reverse at full speed and it put up with that. I guess I got one of the good ones.
I am saddened about the support, I think they need to increase the quality control and provide proper customer support and they could do well in the market.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

elevatorguy said:


> I have a logisystems in my ATV and I abuse it and it has held up fine.


Maybe because your setup doesn't come close to the max rating of the controller? I assume you don't pull anywhere near 700 amps?


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## TelnetManta (Jun 5, 2008)

JRP3 said:


> Maybe because your setup doesn't come close to the max rating of the controller? I assume you don't pull anywhere near 700 amps?



But I do in my BMW conversion and I use a 750 amp Logisystems controller. I have around 200 EV miles so far and my controller barely gets warm. I did add two 120MM fans to the top though on Brians(rctous) recommendation.


Ben


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

That's good to know, I hope it keeps holding up.


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## CPLTECH (Sep 14, 2007)

Telnetmanta,

Was yours an earlier Mosfet version? If so, I would not doubt it was great. Not sure just when they switched production over to the IGBT version that the distributor loaned me (1000A/144V, mfg in Oct 2008). If so, that may be the reason yours has held up. Seems as if everything quickly went down hill with the production change. Wonder if they can ever rebuild their reputation after the experience of several who have spoken up on this forum. They can always reopen under another name in another state or country.
I will repeat what I said earlier: “I refuse to put a LogiSystems under my hood.”
Crap on me once, shame on you. Crap on me a second time, shame on me.


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## TelnetManta (Jun 5, 2008)

Yes, mine is the earlier version. So far so good, sorry to hear that you guys are having and have had problems.

Ben



CPLTECH said:


> Telnetmanta,
> 
> Was yours an earlier Mosfet version? If so, I would not doubt it was great. Not sure just when they switched production over to the IGBT version that the distributor loaned me (1000A/144V, mfg in Oct 2008). If so, that may be the reason yours has held up. Seems as if everything quickly went down hill with the production change. Wonder if they can ever rebuild their reputation after the experience of several who have spoken up on this forum. They can always reopen under another name in another state or country.
> I will repeat what I said earlier: “I refuse to put a LogiSystems under my hood.”
> Crap on me once, shame on you. Crap on me a second time, shame on me.


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## elevatorguy (Jul 26, 2007)

JRP3 said:


> Maybe because your setup doesn't come close to the max rating of the controller? I assume you don't pull anywhere near 700 amps?


Possibly not, my clamp on only goes to 500 and I have over ranged it so that is a unknown. 
I am still partial to Curtis, they have been doing controllers for a long time.
I used the Logicsystems due to budget, I will be using a Curtis in my truck conversion.


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## captain stone (Dec 21, 2010)

CPLTECH said:


> How in the world did you get past the receptionist?
> Today I asked to speak with Technical Service, and was refused.
> I asked to speak with Customer Relations, and was refused.
> You know there’s something wrong when a 1000A controller made in Oct smokes after 7 miles and there is no support.
> ...


 How did all that turn out ? I too have returned a new multivolt 1000 amp controller and cant get past his wife for even an update on progress


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## CPLTECH (Sep 14, 2007)

Captain,

Sorry to hear of your predicament. As for me, I did get the money back from the mom & pop distributor. Many after me did not fare so well, sad to say. You have to feel sorry for the distributor, since they had trusted in the reputation that Logisystems previously had as a repair center, then came up with a similar product (the early days). Then they ventured into an area that… well you know the rest. If you kept up with the “Tesseract Chronicles” on this forum, you see all the challenges he faced before bringing the unit to market, however it appears the folks down in Texas did not have the expertise and should have folded operations long ago. To continue operations would appear to me as something similar to a scam and the comments found here keep pointing to building a product that is poorly supported. Those who sent their units back numerous times should have been covered under some sort of “Lemon Law” and been made “whole” again with a reliable unit and/or money back. But neither has happened, and the same saga continues. What I fear for them is that some stressed out buyer will seek retribution if the law won’t step in. Then to, there was a LiPo battery scammer mentioned here. Don’t know the outcome of that yet. All this spreads doubt among the honest EV merchants.

Only suggestion is to listen closely to this forum as to purchases and build ideas from those who pioneered before.

*In another post you mentioned a Google map. Go to Bing.com for a real sharp picture of the listed address 9910 W 64th St, Odessa, TX 79764-9620. O the confidence it brings to a purchaser…*


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