# Liquid Batteries headed for production



## PhantomPholly (Aug 20, 2008)

Last year I posted an article on _*Liquid Batteries*_, a technology which promises immortal batteries useful for grid storage and other stationary applications.

In just one year they are _*on the move towards commercialization of the idea*_. With appropriate electronics supporting them, these batteries could react in microseconds to grid load changes, and act as short-term backups to neighborhoods in the event of a main line shutdown. More importantly, practical grid storage will end the inefficiencies of renewable energy sources caused by the need for generation plants to have to "throttle up and down" to adjust to the non-constant sources.

Between this "install once and forget" approach and Aquion's "minimum initial cost outlay" approach, the market will have at least two real options for grid storage to create competition - and we all win from that.


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## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Great post Phantom. I believe one of the reasons - if not THE reason - is precisely because they remained small, with a small budget and lived within their means in a Cambridge basement. Had they invested all of their resources in press releases and "big" contracts like A123 did, it would be a different story.

So "molten metal"? What temps are we talking about here? That would have a significant impact on the container that can be used.

JR


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

I wonder if they are using sodium (2X more power then lithium)


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## jeremyjs (Sep 22, 2010)

cool, but the efficiency kind of sucks. I read some literature on this a while back and they were saying that it's only 65% efficient.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

That's poor efficiency for a battery, but a little better than the next cheapest grid storage option, pumped hydro, which obviously can't work everywhere. If the cost is low enough this could be useful.


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## jeremyjs (Sep 22, 2010)

JRP3 said:


> That's poor efficiency for a battery, but a little better than the next cheapest grid storage option, pumped hydro, which obviously can't work everywhere. If the cost is low enough this could be useful.


True. Hopefully it's not an intrinsic property of this kind of battery. Maybe they can bost the efficiency through refinements in design/chemistry.


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## PhantomPholly (Aug 20, 2008)

JRoque said:


> Great post Phantom. I believe one of the reasons - if not THE reason - is precisely because they remained small, with a small budget and lived within their means in a Cambridge basement. Had they invested all of their resources in press releases and "big" contracts like A123 did, it would be a different story.
> 
> So "molten metal"? What temps are we talking about here? That would have a significant impact on the container that can be used.
> 
> JR


Don't know about efficiencies - I'd hold back judgement, as the numbers posted above may have been from initial trials. The article says they've been using different combinations along the same line to improve density - that may also include improvements in efficiency, since that affects density.

Materials: "The researchers add molten raw materials: antimony on the bottom, an electrolyte such as sodium sulfide in the middle, and magnesium at the top." They later said they've switched to something else.

The temps were in the 800C range; high, but not high enough to threaten to melt stainless (although conductive metal naturally could not be used for the shell). My guess would be that ceramic space shuttle tile material would be best (ever see their demonstration, heating it with a blowtorch and then handing it to people?). Again, a fixed installation could easily accommodate a large insulated vat.


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