# It a 1985 Mercedes Benz 190E a good candidate



## dmanueld6 (Oct 27, 2008)

Hello to everybody, I'm the new boy in the hood. I will appreciate any help on my conversion. I really want to start with a hybrid conversion, but either way I don't know how to start. I got ten golf carts, 6V batteries, I have a controller from a golf cart, plus all the electrical equipment from it, even the electric motor, but I don't know if my donor car will be good for it.


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## heynow999 (Mar 2, 2008)

Is it a manual? That would be the only practical way. Those are pretty rare.


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## madderscience (Jun 28, 2008)

I'm not familair with mercedes so all I'll say there is small, light, aerodynamic is what you should be looking for. A manual tranny is the best way to go as previously stated. If your car doesn't have one, you can always fit one from something else, easy to do in a RWD car. Also, convert the RIGHT car, not necessarily the one you have.

As for parts, sounds like you are set for batteries if you can cobble together 16-20 good batteries from those golf carts. Even if the batteries are all junk, you've got one hell of a core discount coming on a new pack. Unfortunately the low voltage (36-48v) systems from the golf carts really aren't powerful enough to provide propulsion for a full sized car so there won't be much else that is usable from them as the motor, controller, contactors, fuses, etc are probably all too small. Its as if you took a lawnmower engine and put it in a car and expected good performance. 

Perhaps a hybrid/assist setup would work as you are speculating / thinking but it is difficult for a home builder to integrate the two systems (gas and electric) well enough to achieve any kind of a benefit there based on what examples I have seen on this forum and elsewhere.

Good Luck


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## jlsawell (Apr 4, 2008)

dmanueld6 said:


> Hello to everybody, I'm the new boy in the hood. I will appreciate any help on my conversion. I really want to start with a hybrid conversion, but either way I don't know how to start. I got ten golf carts, 6V batteries, I have a controller from a golf cart, plus all the electrical equipment from it, even the electric motor, but I don't know if my donor car will be good for it.


With that list of components, you'd do very well to check out "forkenswift" on google and youtube. They've got an excellent example of what is possible.


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## The Toecutter (May 30, 2010)

If your goal is to have a basic 'around town' car with speeds that do not exceed 45 mph, the car plus components in your possession are likely adequate.

If you want long range and/or highway capability, you better have a $15,000+ budget for it(especially for a LiFePO4 pack if you want long range). The 190E is not a good candidate for conversion, but you can convert it if you want to, and it will fair okay as long as your goals are realistic.

I have a 1986 300 SDL myself, but I wouldn't dare convert it to electric(waste vegetable oil OTOH is perfect for it due to its diesel engine). These cars are somewhat complicated and you will run into very expensive problems trying to convert one to electric.


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## marc02228 (Jan 15, 2011)

The Toecutter said:


> If your goal is to have a basic 'around town' car with speeds that do not exceed 45 mph, the car plus components in your possession are likely adequate.
> 
> If you want long range and/or highway capability, you better have a $15,000+ budget for it(especially for a LiFePO4 pack if you want long range). The 190E is not a good candidate for conversion, but you can convert it if you want to, and it will fair okay as long as your goals are realistic.
> 
> I have a 1986 300 SDL myself, but I wouldn't dare convert it to electric(waste vegetable oil OTOH is perfect for it due to its diesel engine). These cars are somewhat complicated and you will run into very expensive problems trying to convert one to electric.


Why do you think it's a bad car for a conversion? 
I think it is similar to a BMW e30 conversion, isn't it?

What do you think are these very expensive problems?

thanks


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

marc02228 said:


> What do you think are these very expensive problems?


The problems are expensive because the vehicle is heavy. Curb weight is 2725lbs. If you strip 650lbs of ICE, cooling, and fuel systems out, you'll you put in 200 in motor, controller, battery racks and wiring, and another 1000 for 16 of those 6V batteries. At 1400lbs over stock, you're 250lbs over the 3825lb GVWR of the car before anyone gets into it. If you dump the A/C and practically everything else that isn't absolutely essential, and drop your voltage to 72V so you can pull 250lbs more batteries out, you're still over the GVWR with just the driver- and the performance will be a joke, let alone the range.

Lead won't work in this car. Period.

If you want Lithium prismatic cells and a 9" motor to move your 1.5 tons, its going to cost $15k-$20k.

Very expensive. Not even considering that your glider might have an automatic transmission, which complicates things further...

Study the cars on the EValbum, especially the 1990 BMW 325i just listed there, #4084. Lead acid powered, it has a 30 mile range and 18 second 0-60 time. That's with a 9" motor at 156V. Your performance at 72V or 96V will be MUCH worse.

Note also that of the 3600-odd EVs on the EValbum, there is not one Mercedes S, E or C class sedan.

So, the fair conclusion is that the conversion is either very expensive (if Lithium powered, with real EV conversion components,) or a dog not worth the effort (with salvaged lead-acid batteries and golf cart stuff.)

Just sayin'...

TomA


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

OK, a quick check of the numbers shows they're off by a midnight mile. The car will likely wind up +650lbs (550 out, because that 4 cylinder isn't very heavy, probably under 400lbs, and 1200 back in) which puts the curb weight at 96V around 3400lbs, giving a useful load of around 450lbs to GVWR- almost a four seater. It will still need new rear springs and fresh rubber all around in the suspension.

The other conclusions don't change. Heavy and godawful slow on lead, or expensive for middling performance and range on lithium.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

the CD on my E (87) is 28 same as the volt . lots of stuff can be removed ( heavy seats) or lightened . great handling ,solid build , manuals trains are available ( I have 2), go manual heater control ( climate control sucks ), I would and have driven much over loaded cars . MB's do it better then any others I've tried . They race the C's lots of upgrades are available . The latest racing C's are considered among the best super cars . Live with lead acid until Lithium gets cheap , you wont need to change cars . When you get the lighter cars you give up the strength to handle weight , the rear suspension has a sub frame with 10 links (like the E , S class) A little heaver but great handling from it . I don't care how slow a car is if it can handle the weight in the bumps and turns . The springs have rubber perches that come in differing heights for heavy-er loads .


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## marc02228 (Jan 15, 2011)

I'm not sure, which car to take.
Planned components for the 190 are:
~400 A123 Cells
Soliton 1 or jr.
Kostov 11" alpha

What I need is approx 100km range.
Or I'm gonna take a miata..


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

400 19.5Ah A123 pouch cells is about a 25kWh pack. 80% of that is about 20kWh, so if you can get the car under 200Wh per mile, you can have a 100 mile range. I heavy car with a pinion drive rear axle isn't likely to get 200Wh/mile. 300Wh/mile is more likely, maybe even higher.

Fortunately 100km is only 62 miles. You'll probably be close on range with 400 pouch A123, especially if you strip your Mercedes like a track car. OTOH, it would sure be easier to start with something smaller and lighter...


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