# Battery capacity advice needed



## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Hello Michael and welcome to the forum.

I'd say:
- 36 ThunderSky cells = $8000
- Motor+controller: $4500
- Charger: $1100
- Misc: $1000

Not bad for a converted car that will essentially last forever. Renault, in fact, is now saying that their electric version of your car will be offered with a lifetime guarantee. They can do that because the cells will be leased, so what else can go wrong with the car? But with proper care, these cells will last 100K miles and if one goes bad you can easily (and inexpensively) replace it.

JR


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## michaelis (Apr 9, 2011)

JRoque said:


> Hello Michael and welcome to the forum.
> 
> I'd say:
> - 36 ThunderSky cells = $8000
> ...


What capacity should the cells have? If you divide $8000 with 36 you get that each cell costs approx. $220. If you then search for these cells on the net then you find that the 90AH cells cost $135 which means that I need 36 cells with more than 90AH capacity. Could this really be? The cells I'm looking at are Thunder Sky LPF90AH 3.2V 90AH. Or am I missing something here?http://www.electricmotorsport.com/store/ems_ev_parts_batteries_lpf_ts_90ah.php


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## Roy Von Rogers (Mar 21, 2009)

Look here and you will get an idea of size and cost of cells....

http://www.currentevtech.com/

Btw he's also a sponsor here...advert on right

Roy


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

JRoque said:


> I'd say:
> - 36 ThunderSky cells = $8000
> - Motor+controller: $4500
> - Charger: $1100
> - Misc: $1000


for inexpensive but reasonable build I'd recommend more like:
38 x 100ah Thundersky or CALB (120v nominal system), around $5000
8"DC motor + Curtis 1221(for least expensive build) = $2400
elcon pfc-1500 charger, about $550
...and about another $3k in misc 'bits' and rack material

Basically a total conversion with all new parts is going to run you $6k or so in 'stuff' and $5k for a good performing 40-50 mile range in a small car. Add more for bigger batteries/range...


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## PTCruisin (Nov 19, 2009)

Gotta go with what Dan said. Expect to pay $1.25 or more per Ah capacity for the LiFePO4 cells.

With 38, 100Ah TS cells, a 750A controller, and a 9" Netgain Motor, I get 40 miles range in a 3100 lb PT Cruiser with low-profile tires. It's not your ideal vehicle for conversion to an EV. 

You should be able to get 40 to 50 miles range easily.


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## brainzel (Jun 15, 2009)

michaelis said:


> Hi,
> [...] Reanult Megan 1.6RN -99 [...]
> My requirements are these:
> - Range between 40-50 miles (65-80 km)
> ...


I don't know where you live, but something says to me you are located i europe?
If it's right, there are some distributors for CALB (Sky Energy) and Winston Batteries (Thunder Sky).
About 1,10 Euro per Ah including taxes and shipping.

The cars weights about my New Beetle, so I would recommend 45 cells (144 Volts) CALB 130Ah / 180Ah or WB 160Ah / 200Ah.

Netgain Warp9 or Kostov 10" would be a great Motor for your conversion.
Evnetics Soliton Junior would give you the space to update if you want to get faster or get a bigger range.

~ 8000 Euro Batteries
~ 1800 Euro Controller
~ 1800 Euro Motor
~ 800 Euro Adapter / Coupler
~ 800 Euro Charger

don't forget:
- power steering
- brake pump
- wires / switches / relays / fuses / instrumentations

If you only want to fulfill your specs above: 
- Curtis 1221C @ 120V
- 38 pcs. WB 160Ah
- Zivan NG3 Charger
- Kilovac contactor
- TBS E-xpert pro / Xantrex LinkPro (Ah counter)

Michael


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## mszhao (Oct 17, 2009)

michaelis said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm very interested in converting my old Reanult Megan 1.6RN -99 to an EV. But as I understand it, after skimming through this forum, is that the batteries are the most expensive part. So the whole thing depends on how much/many batteries is needed.
> 
> ...


Hi Michael,my name is Mandy.you can go with this company in Utah.
http://www.evequipmentsupply.com
7427 South Main Street
Midvale, Utah 84047
801-566-7744 - office 
801-243-5300 - cell
[email protected] 

Mr Carl is a very nice and reliable person.they are very experienced in EV conversion kit.


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## 1-ev.com (Nov 4, 2010)

You could look at the Group Buy here: http://1-ev.com/ts.aspx


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## broadcastcentral (Jul 6, 2008)

How does the group buy work? Do they wait until a bunch of people have decided to order, so they can place a large order at a bulk price... or do they have a deal with the manufacturer where they can make small orders one at a time as they come in?


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## 1-ev.com (Nov 4, 2010)

Hey broadcastcentral,

Your are correct, we are waiting until we get 40K of USD worth of order, then place the order with manufacturer, where lead time is around 4 weeks.

Customer do not have to pay until last moment (till we have to pay to manufacturer) and we are NOT making profit on the batteries. 

The reason for this amount of money, that we will fill the 20' container where ship and cost (price maybe lower then listed on the website) will be cheapest and make it faster with US Customs...

-Youri


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

the Devil is in the details of what happens once the container arrives in Port. Where does it get unloaded, who physically unloads and ships crates to final destinations? Do you hire and pay a freight forwarder to handle all the import fees and re-shipping?

The other thing is that slow-boat from China, especially from Thundersky, seems to have lots of delays lately as they seem to be re-directing production to large customer orders and making the little guys wait.


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## 1-ev.com (Nov 4, 2010)

dtbaker said:


> the Devil is in the details of what happens once the container arrives in Port. Where does it get unloaded, who physically unloads and ships crates to final destinations? Do you hire and pay a freight forwarder to handle all the import fees and re-shipping?
> 
> The other thing is that slow-boat from China, especially from Thundersky, seems to have lots of delays lately as they seem to be re-directing production to large customer orders and making the little guys wait.


You are correct too. 

We are shipping though Port of Miami FL or Long Beach CA. Usually, when just the battery in the container US Customs make it quick, then we get them at out to the warehouse in Boca Raton FL (TS) or Long Beach CA (CALB) then we ship them to the Customers via _UPS Freight or others_.

It takes a bit of our time, but we are helping EV community, that what important  to make a difference and STOP FEEDING THE OIL BEAST... 

We make our money on custom conversions, where we are also ordering batteries and offering them for the same price... we are offering to others...

As far as lead time we are working with TS and CALB, and visiting them often in HK and China, while our regular business visits (other then EVs) of those areas, so we can look at the shipment before it been shipped.

Thank you.

-Y.

PS: look at Jack Rickard (http://www.evtv.me/) where he is helping EV community, not ALL MUST be about the profit... I think.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

1-ev.com said:


> We are shipping though Port of Miami FL or Long Beach CA. Usually, when just the battery in the container US Customs make it quick, then we get them at out to the warehouse in Boca Raton FL (TS) or Long Beach CA (CALB) then we ship them to the Customers via _UPS Freight or others_.


so you have handled containers from both Thundersky and CALB?
How many, when, and can you ask customers to post testamonials perhaps in the 'Vendor' section of this website?



1-ev.com said:


> It takes a bit of our time, but we are helping EV community, that what important  to make a difference and STOP FEEDING THE OIL BEAST...
> 
> We make our money on custom conversions, where we are also ordering batteries and offering them for the same price... we are offering to others...


absolutely agree and admire your motivation. I am thrilled that someone is making a living doing conversions! How many have you done, do you have orders stacked up, and do you keep a gallery of completed projects?




1-ev.com said:


> PS: look at Jack Rickard (http://www.evtv.me/) where he is helping EV community, not ALL MUST be about the profit... I think.


admirable... and all of us here spend time helping as much as asking.  I don't even mind seeing Vendors make a little for their trouble so they can make a living and stay afloat... unless you are wealthy and retired and can live without making a profit. 


I am not trying to give you a hard time, just to establish credibility. We have had a few bad experiences with unethical people like the now infamous James Morrision who took money from a bunch of people and never delivered product, so I think it is important for us to make an effort to check out Vendors before writing checks these days...


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## 1-ev.com (Nov 4, 2010)

dtbaker said:


> so you have handled containers from both Thundersky and CALB?
> How many, when, and can you ask customers to post testamonials perhaps in the 'Vendor' section of this website?


Yes, both Thundersky and CALB.

I have to ask Customers if they want to do it (we have signed contracts, where customers do not allow to post conversion on the website, they wan to stay private and do not get phone calls or be exposed to the Internet...), 



dtbaker said:


> absolutely agree and admire your motivation. I am thrilled that someone is making a living doing conversions! How many have you done, do you have orders stacked up, and do you keep a gallery of completed projects?


This Porsche 912 would be 6th conversion. Orders - we build 1 at a time, also see the website under "BUY". Gallery - please see 1st answer.



dtbaker said:


> admirable... and all of us here spend time helping as much as asking.  I don't even mind seeing Vendors make a little for their trouble so they can make a living and stay afloat... unless you are wealthy and retired and can live without making a profit.


EV conversion is one of my ventures... as part of it, helping TS open factory in Russia for EU market... http://www.nanotech-now.com/news.cgi?story_id=36028 



dtbaker said:


> I am not trying to give you a hard time, just to establish credibility. We have had a few bad experiences with unethical people like the now infamous James Morrision who took money from a bunch of people and never delivered product, so I think it is important for us to make an effort to check out Vendors before writing checks these days...


I know about James Morrision, that why I've get involved in the EV business to help people to get off the OIL BEAST DRUG...

Credibility - we are looking into offering Escrow account, where Battery money will reside till delivered, checking pricing on this... For now using Google Checkout.

Thank you.
Hope this helps
-Y


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

1-ev.com said:


> Yes, both Thundersky and CALB.
> 
> I have to ask Customers if they want to do it (we have signed contracts, where customers do not allow to post conversion on the website, they wan to stay private and do not get phone calls or be exposed to the Internet...),
> 
> ...



hhmmm, I see some 'contracts pending', but no completed cars. I think you may want to REQUIRE that customers allow posting of the cars you do... Maybe not their names, but at least pictures of cars and 'build lists' of components and specifications showing results to build a portfolio for prospects to look at and see your workmanship. It would go a long way proving you are for real to show craftsmanship along the way, the components you are used to working with, and how fast you get things done.


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## 1-ev.com (Nov 4, 2010)

dtbaker said:


> hhmmm, I see some 'contracts pending', but no completed cars. I think you may want to REQUIRE that customers allow posting of the cars you do... Maybe not their names, but at least pictures of cars and 'build lists' of components and specifications showing results to build a portfolio for prospects to look at and see your workmanship. It would go a long way proving you are for real to show craftsmanship along the way, the components you are used to working with, and how fast you get things done.


Dan,
I am sorry, but I cannot "REQUIRE" Customer to do anything... They tell me what to do...

One of the provision in our contract said that we can show the pictures without giving them, just if NEW customer requesting it during the signing the contract.

We do NOT NEED a large line of the customers that we cannot handle, I think Nissan, GM, Mitsubishi can do that. 

We are building UNIQUE EVs, so our slogan say : "Build *1 EV* at a time, innovate through uniqueness!"

Our Customers have 10-50 and more cars in the garages and they WANT very UNIQUE something...

Speaking of uniqueness, one of the requirement of the Customer was that one of the EVs would not be different from original by look and sound, with vibrating tail pipe "fake", but when you look under hood... ELECTRIC, plus more and more uniqueness... 

Speaking of craftsmanship, all work is scientifically calculated (I have BSE in Physics and Math + ASE myself + Team) and verified, then it documented with all calculations and tests included, all parts drawing, suppliers, as of the part of the service... Such as, load calculations on the components, Material Used, etc. Then we are testing all our cars on the Racetracks (please see website) with Professional Drivers... All documents then handled to the Customer. We may have to put set of new tires ... 


Hope this helps.
-Y...


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