# Planning <Ford<Mustang GT 01 conversion



## dukeraider2 (Jan 29, 2010)

Hi 
First post I'm new and I got a wreaked stag I'm thinking about salvaging I'm selling the engine anyway and I was just going to junk it but I had planned on buying an new prius but I to would be a shame to junk it the rest of the body is still fine

My skill level is I guess low, I'm a quick study I'm not a "car guy" all I know is how to change oil and fix a flat but I guess every one was like that at sometime.

Range: ??? I guess shooting for 70-100 miles is sane... stags are a lot lighter without a v8 sigh..

performance: daily driver I don't race although acceleration is what I really like so I can live without a 150 top end and settle for 80-90mph

so if some one knows of a project like this that's done or in the works be sure to give me a heads up 

I'm aware that this undertaking might cost upwards of $10,000 but im not looking to speed that much. I'm going to be rather conservative in this en-devour and shot for a budget of $6,000.

time-duration lets just say there might be a few more motor and battery advancement before the completion of this project. My goals are long term so a deadline is not a priority. (I'm cheap)

any input is greatly appreciated 

In the mean time I'll become like the noble forum rat and gobble up the scraps of knowledge.


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## dragster (Sep 3, 2008)

Hi
To get the range and speed you are looking for is not going to happen for $6000.00 more like $20,000.00 Good luck


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## dukeraider2 (Jan 29, 2010)

@dragster
can you give me an ideal of the constraints that my budget would allow in regards of range and speed are there any resources like graphs or charts out there that can help to explain such limitations?

also how many motors would i need one or two i see that there are many different types of setups out there it's all a bit confusing what are the basic setups?


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## tinrobot (Aug 26, 2009)

dukeraider2 said:


> @dragster
> can you give me an ideal of the constraints that my budget would allow in regards of range and speed are there any resources like graphs or charts out there that can help to explain such limitations?
> 
> also how many motors would i need one or two i see that there are many different types of setups out there it's all a bit confusing what are the basic setups?


One motor replacing the old gas motor is the most common setup. You have to build a custom adapter plate and coupler to mount the new motor to the original transmission.

Range is mostly a function of battery power (though weight/aerodynamics also factor in.) The more batteries you have, the further you can go. For longer ranges, Lithium batteries are needed because of the lighter weight and higher power density. The rule of thumb for range is approx. 200-250wh/mile, though actual performance depends on the type of car, driving style etc. You say you like to drive fast, so you'd probably exceed those numbers.

Right now, lithium batteries from EV Components run a little more than $340/kwH. Using 250wh/mile as a guide, you're talking approx $85/mile for batteries. So, 100 miles worth of batteries is at least $8500. Add in at least 20% more batteries for reserve power (so you don't kill the pack) plus a battery management system, and you're talking over $10,000 for just the batteries. The other components (motor, charger, controller, etc) will run at least $6k-10K new.

You can reduce your range expectations and save on batteries, but a decent conversion would still be in the $10,000+ range using new components.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

the mustangs are NOT that light or aero, I'd bet you would need closer to 350wh/mile minimum for figuring range. To get decent performance you'll probably have to go with 144v and a 9" motor. With (18x) 8v floodies you could probably get a range of... MAYBE 40 miles?

costwise... The 'electric stuff' is gonna run you close to $7000-8000, maybe more if you have to pay for welding. 18x 8v floodies would cost around $2250 and last maybe 2 or 3 years. Li with 'same capacity' 100ah would cost 45x100x$1.10=$4950 plus probably another $500 in S&H, but last 10 years.


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## DavidDymaxion (Dec 1, 2008)

An important number is the % weight in batteries. Cars with similar % have similar range. The Mustang is heavier than an economy car, but you remove more weight.

A neat rule of thumb I read was around 800 lbs. of batteries equals a gallon of gas. If you have a 40 mpg car, 800 lbs of lead acid batteries will give you about 40 miles of range, but maybe only around 20 miles of range for a Mustang. YMMV 

This is really rough, but multiply max current times max voltage, and divide by 2000 to get an estimate for the horsepower. You divide by 2 to take into account battery sag, losses, and conversion kW to hp. Divide by 1000 to convert Watts to kW. Here are some examples:

48 V * 400 Amps / 2000 = 20 hp (golf cart)
144 V * 500 Amps / 2000 = 40 hp
336 V * 1400 Amps / 2000 = 240 hp (NEDRA racer)

Again, this is really rough computation, but gives you some idea.


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## O'Zeeke (Mar 9, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> the mustangs are NOT that light or aero, I'd bet you would need closer to 350wh/mile minimum for figuring range. To get decent performance you'll probably have to go with 144v and a 9" motor. With (18x) 8v floodies you could probably get a range of... MAYBE 40 miles?
> 
> costwise... The 'electric stuff' is gonna run you close to $7000-8000, maybe more if you have to pay for welding. 18x 8v floodies would cost around $2250 and last maybe 2 or 3 years. Li with 'same capacity' 100ah would cost 45x100x$1.10=$4950 plus probably another $500 in S&H, but last 10 years.


dt , sounds like your right on with those figures, almost exactly what i get with my mustang but with a 11". 40 miles was achievable but not without 80%dod , just too heavy so my usb 8V's didnt even make it 2 yrs but my TS160's are due to arrive in 10 days thus losing 700 lb of lead, and that should change things a bit


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

O'Zeeke said:


> dt , sounds like your right on with those figures, almost exactly what i get with my mustang but with a 11". 40 miles was achievable but not without 80%dod , just too heavy so my usb 8V's didnt even make it 2 yrs but my TS160's are due to arrive in 10 days thus losing 700 lb of lead, and that should change things a bit


wow, how's that for a guess. 

I love the '0.0', nice touch! Maybe next is the '144v' in place of the usual 'boss 302'?

Nice tranny adaptor, who did it? and do you have any accel data with the 11" Lead, to compare with after conversion to Li ?


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## O'Zeeke (Mar 9, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> wow, how's that for a guess.
> 
> I love the '0.0', nice touch! Maybe next is the '144v' in place of the usual 'boss 302'?
> 
> Nice tranny adaptor, who did it? and do you have any accel data with the 11" Lead, to compare with after conversion to Li ?


the adaptor was made by electroauto , was a good job but took forever
Acceleration was ok for normal driving , no stats but as soon as I get the LiFePO4 in i will post some #'s


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

O'Zeeke said:


> Acceleration was ok for normal driving , no stats but as soon as I get the LiFePO4 in i will post some #'s


ooohhhh, you already have the lead out? It would have been really cool to see head-to-head comparison in same car Pb vs Li.... I am going to get some numbers soon before my Pb dies, and be switching to Li in march/april.


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## tomofreno (Mar 3, 2009)

If you like acceleration, you would likely be better to go with an 11" motor like OZeeke. Whether 9" or 11" you will need a high current controller, like the Soliton, new Net Gain or, Zilla (two of them advertised in the right sidebar) for high acceleration. High currents decrease battery lifetime so the lead acids likely won't last more than 2 - 3 years as dt said. I wouldn't use 100Ah LiFePO4 cells, since you will decrease their lifetime by pulling much more than 3C (300A) current during acceleration. You likely would draw more like 800 - 1000A for high acceleration of such a heavy car (even without the V8 in it), so say 900/3 = 300Ah LiFePO4 cells, 200Ah if you pull 600A regularly during acceleration. Performance cost more $, especially with a heavy vehicle since it cost a lot more to store a given amount of energy in batteries compared to gasoline. If you look at the adds for cost of controller, search motor costs for Netgain 9" or 11" (say at evsource or evcomponents) and search battery costs that will give you a good idea of overall costs. Still need a charger, DC/DC converter, cabin heater (if it gets cold where you are), and various wiring, relays, contactors, battery boxes...


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## dragster (Sep 3, 2008)

dukeraider2
You can have what you are looking for but you must bite the bullet.
AC 80HP motor 336 volts AC three PH. with Lithium batteries. the Batteries will be 800LB lighter then lead battery's. The bad news is your wallet will be very very small after you do this.


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