# Adaptor for a golf cart motors



## epyon (Mar 20, 2008)

Does any one make a face plate for those golf cart motors you see everywhere ? The back has no bearing surport or mount on some I'v seen . Any help would be nice , and I did do a search . It would be nice for a little car to go to the store in .


----------



## xrotaryguy (Jul 26, 2007)

I don't know of one. You could consider using a complete golf cart axle though. In fact, if you picked up a used golf cart, you could use that car's speed controller and charger in addition to the motor.


----------



## TX_Dj (Jul 25, 2008)

To adapt the motor to what? A car transmission? I don't think the motor would last very long if you were pushing a car with it.


----------



## swampjeep (May 16, 2008)

TX_Dj said:


> To adapt the motor to what? A car transmission? I don't think the motor would last very long if you were pushing a car with it.


what abotu a motorcycle or and go cart or... what would be needed to make teh motor work for ANYthing other then the golf cart, I have been wonderign the same thing.


----------



## TX_Dj (Jul 25, 2008)

swampjeep said:


> what abotu a motorcycle or and go cart or... what would be needed to make teh motor work for ANYthing other then the golf cart, I have been wonderign the same thing.


I'll offer an apology to epyon if I jumped to an assumption- because I was thinking adapter to a car, which that motor would likely be too small and underpowered to work. 

But on a motorcycle or such, it would probably do fairly well, depending on voltage and speeds desired.

Golf carts are limited to 12 mph, but are capable of up to 50 mph with the right modifications (higher voltage, higher amp controller, changed gearing, taller tires, etc) though I wouldn't think it to be very safe to run a golf cart at 50 mph 

A motorcycle and golf cart similarly equipped to what I mention above will weigh about the same, roughly, I'd guess. If the motor doesn't have a bearing support for the shaft (i.e. if it depended on the diff housing for that) then certainly that would have to factor in.

Maybe someone knows of pre-made items that will match that sort of application, but I'd not be surprised if it had to be custom fabricated. Take a look at the shaft length, and if there's enough length it should be possible to make the mount plate also contain a sealed bearing to hold the loads, and hopefully enough room for a pulley or sprocket once that's in place.

Things that make you go "hmm"


----------



## epyon (Mar 20, 2008)

I was looking at this sport bike frame at a auction . Or a D Mod SCCA Autocross car .


----------



## epyon (Mar 20, 2008)

Swampjeep , did you find anything in your searches ? I only found that guy with a go-cart on YOUTUBE .


----------



## swampjeep (May 16, 2008)

epyon said:


> Swampjeep , did you find anything in your searches ? I only found that guy with a go-cart on YOUTUBE .


nope, haven't found anything


----------



## My Dog Buddy (Jun 25, 2008)

Hi there everyone first post here but I found a thread on a site showing a cart motor in a car here is the link:

http://www.buggiesgonewild.com/extreme-dc/5608-xtremes-honda-civic-electric-car-conversion.html

I hope it is ok to post a link to another site, if not mods please delete the link and please accept my appologies. 

Looks like a nice site you have here I have enjoyed lurking and reading all off this great info.


----------



## TX_Dj (Jul 25, 2008)

My Dog Buddy said:


> Hi there everyone first post here but I found a thread on a site showing a cart motor in a car



Nice write-up. Too bad most of the photos are missing. 

I thought that sort of motor relied on a bearing in the gearbox to support the end of the shaft? If that's the case, I didn't see a bearing in his adaptor to replace that function, which means there's probably some "wobble" between the one end of the motor and the input bearing on the transmission, which would be "a bad thing".

And if memory serves, that's what we're on about in this thread- an adaptor (for a MC application) which has a bearing in it to support the loads placed on the shaft, which would be greater in an MC, due to chain or belt drive.

I may be off base, though... who knows... i never was good at baseball


----------



## mill (Aug 22, 2008)

I know this thread is a little old but I too was thinking of using one of these for motors for a motorcycle or go-cart application. Found this pretty infomative video on youtube about it http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=tkmkzr2k77s&feature=related


----------



## evcars (Mar 15, 2008)

Hey that's my honda on the BGW site.  The golf cart setup was a ''prototype test'' I built to see if EV's were something I wanted to get into before investing in the expensive EV parts. 
The car ended up performing way above my expectations on this setup. If I remember correctly, with a 48 volt 480 amp Logisystems controller, golf cart motor, and 2 strings of 8 volt batteries it would easily cruise 45 mph and have a decent range. 
The system has since been totally upgraded and while the golf cart motor didn't show any signs of wear after several hundred miles, I would recommend you using a motor with a face plate. 

Sorry about the pics not working. If you have any questions or want to see the pics just ask.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

I'm bringing this question again up again ... 
Has anyone else come up with some suggestions on mounting a electric golf cart motor for our EV's ?

I've checked out the thread and video on the electric go cart ... and one other listing I've found here where the output shaft was welded on to the 19 spline adapter ...

Are there any other sucess stories on adapting the golf cart motor for out EV projects ?

I bough a D & D Systems 8.9 HP golf cart style motor locally that was rated for 36V or 48V that I plan to use on a small car conversion ... 

Very SMALL ... I'm adapting a 1958 Isetta ... origionally came with a 13 HP gas engine to push its 780 pounds down the road ... 

I'd love to hear any sucess stories on these golf cart motors ... as I see there are a number of them listed for sale on this website ... 
I'm sure some of you have worked out a good way to adapt them for EV use ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

This is the motor I started with for my tractor build.









My first step was to make a ply wood DE cap to test the motor.









Having proved it was working I then set about making a shaft to fit the female splines









I scored the spline dimensions using the gear wheels on the lathe as an index.









I then cut each spline using a cutting disc in a 4 1/2" angle grinder.

















I then made a second shaft in the same manner but keyed to take a small sprocket.









The DE cap was then turned in aluminium.









I then bolted the mounting ring from the motor to the new DE cap. I retapped the holes to M6 and added an extra one where there was space.
Notice the sealed bearing.









I used posidrive countersunk M6x25 machine screws as I had them in stock. Cap screws would do as well.


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

This is how the assembly looks.









And this is how it was finally mounted to the tractor. Notice that the short splined shaft allows a bearing at the outer end to support the radial loads of the chain.


And here is a test with the controller.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

Thank you for posting that series of pictures "Woodsmith" 
I'm sure it will help many of us when we had difficulty understanding the other adapter plate for the go cart ... 
It was probably equally good, but was difficult to visualize with the pictures that had been deleted ...

In my case ... the 2 chain sprockets will be closer in size ... as there is already a 2:1 reduction in the chaincase of the Isetta ...

Here's a picture of a professionally rebuilt chaincase for the Isetta's ... not mine unfortunately ... but the same ... just not as nicely finished as this one ...


----------



## vpoppv (Jul 27, 2009)

I'm not sure if my car is any help, but it is indeed powered by a 2 hp golf cart motor. It seems your question revolves around the support bearing, and my motor is unusual in that it has a shaft support bearing. It was total luck, because I had not planned on that: I just bought the cheapest golf cart I could find ($75; I got that money back recycling the batteries). I had actually planned to incorporate a part of the differential for the adapter plate to have a sort of pre-made support bearing. An Isetta would be awesome if you can find room for batteries!


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

DavidP said:


> In my case ... the 2 chain sprockets will be closer in size ... as there is already a 2:1 reduction in the chaincase of the Isetta ...


Do you know what overall reduction you need?

It may be simpler to connect the motor directly to the Isetta input flange.

What you could have, given a bearing in the motor DE and a bearing in the chain case, is a short coupling shaft with a slightly loose fit spline to the motor and a flexible rubber joint to the chain case flange. Maybe something like this but with three lobes.









For that sort of power it would be worth looking at some of the steering column flexible and U joints used on bigger cars without power steering. Some are quite robust.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

***WOW***

That would really be something ... but at only 2 to 1 for the gear reduction (13 & 26) ... it would probably be all speed with very little torque ... 

I could probably of mounted an adapter plate directly between the new motor and the origional chaincase, having them both move together on the same axis/pivot/attachment ... 

Interestingly ... the D & D electric motor and the origional gas engine seem to have very similar specs ...

Electric motor at with 8.9HP at 5800 rpm ... with the stock controller at 36V or 48V ... 

http://www.evdrives.com/dd_motors_170-502-0001.html 

The origional gas engine 12HP & 8.9kw at 5800 rpm

http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=15532

Sounds like the 10 - 100 kmh would be GREAT ...   

But the 0 - 10 kmh could be very sluggish, even with the additional torque on the electric motor ... 

Lets see now ... I would be running 145/80R10 Kuhmo radial tires on 10" rims with an overall diameter of 19.1 inch ... to move an 800 lbs. car ... 

Far beyond my mathematical talents at the moment ... its been too many years since I was in HighSchool ... and it was still the 'old' math back then ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

Could you not open up the chain case and change the sprocket sizes? That would keep all the chains in the case for safety, lubrication and cleanliness.
Then you could have a direct drive.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

Unfortunately ... that is not possible ... 
There is almost no clearance at all ... and if you could match up a sprocket at all ... the only one you could reduce would be the large one ... reducing the ratio further ... 

There isn't enough room to fit your finger around the chain when its fully adjusted ... less than 1/4" around or side to side ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

Hmmm, looks interesting inside.

Can you get a second one? You could match them up and double the reduction.

How was the original ICE connected to it?


----------



## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

What about a simple belt drive like I have planned for one of my future projects? An aluminum plate that bolts to the chain case, mounts the motor, and allows the motor to drive the front chain sprocket via a belt. You can fine-tune the ratio, and just need to drill some holes to bolt the plate to the chain case.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

I don't believe its possible ... 

Its a solid axel with the bearings set on the outer ends of the housing and centre ... 
You would actually have to tripple the sprockets and chains to double the reduction ... then either lengthen the axel and spread the wheel trac or shorten the different ends of the case that hold the bearing races ... as well as the spring & shock mounts, the brakes & speedo cable ... ... ... 

I'm pretty well stuck with the way it is now ...

It was pretty busy back there with the gas engine as shown in this restored chassis ... 

The electric motor should simplify things quite a bit ...


----------



## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

I'll try to explain better later. From what I see there, it is perfect what I attempted to describe.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

Thank you Todd ... I appreciate any information I'm getting ...

I'm leaning toward modifying a snowmobile clutch to gain the necessary gear reduction ... actually getting a CVT type of transmission in the process ... 

With the drive clutch mounted on the electric motor, and the driven clutch on the chain case ... coupled through the drive belt ... it should give me both the ratio I need and an 'automatic' CVT for the transmission of power ... 

The end plate for the electric motor could become part of the mounting plate for both the motor and chaincase ... with the flexible drive belt providing the flexible link between the 2 ... 

Having the electric motor properly 'piggybacked' above the chaincase may transfer some of the weight directly above the rear wheels and reduce some of the strain on the frame ... leaving more wiggle room for the weight of batteries ... 

I realize that many of these snowmobile clutches are used in only 1 direction, but some could be readily modified to work in both directions ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

That looks so much easier to add a motor and some extra reduction to then my tractor set up.

You now have both me and Todd thinking for you.

What is the snowmobile clutch thing you are speaking off? How does a clutch pack provide a reduction?

I shall have to Bing it (had enough of Google).

ETA: Ahhh, I see....


----------



## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

Woodsmith said:


> ...You now have both me and Todd thinking for you....


Uh oh! You'll ed up with an Isetta that can bully monster trucks around, and win beauty contests. 




Woodsmith said:


> That looks so much easier to add a motor and some extra reduction to then my tractor set up...


Looks like fun doesn't it?!




DavidP said:


> Thank you Todd ... I appreciate any information I'm getting ...
> 
> I'm leaning toward modifying a snowmobile clutch to gain the necessary gear reduction ... actually getting a CVT type of transmission in the process ...
> 
> ...


You've sort of described what I was getting at, minus the sled clutch thing. That sounds like an extra process that will result in lower efficiency.

I just meant using a gear and belt setup similar to what the snowmobile uses to drive the entire Isetta rear drive assembly. The golf cart motor mounts to a plate similar to what Woody made for his tractor. That whole plate bolts to the Isetta chain case. A pulley on the motor output shaft, and a pulley on the Isetta's input shaft, with whatever gear ratio you need, powers the stock rear assembly via a belt.

Very little modification to the original drive system (just holes for bolting the plate to it), and a very tuneable drive system.

The electric motor would be just over the chain case, probably a little behind the input shaft.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

It can be kind of hard to explain ... but the pictures here give a little bit of an idea ... 

http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.gates.com/img/techtips/clutch1.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/transformers-phase-converters-vfd/great-pony-motor-clutch-idea-artpro-100976/&h=378&w=300&sz=5&tbnid=DA0Epm2ZioPusM:&tbnh=122&tbnw=97&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsnowmobile%2Bclutch&hl=en&usg=__7oNOlZu6X35k704ay-4x2beAlZ8=&sa=X&ei=cZgiTMXpOIW8lQfmwqTGBQ&ved=0CC0Q9QEwAw

One of the nicest installations being used for an electric conversion is this one being used on an electric snowmobile ... 

I fell in LOVE with the idea of a 'snowmobile clutch' when I first saw this picture ... 

I'm sure that it would add some degree of drag while it was moving up through the gears ... but I don't believe it would cause very much drag when it reaches the set speed ... 
The main advantage of this clutch arrangement would be that the drive (front) pulley would be very small at rest ... and the driven (rear) pulley very large ... with the 'gear ratio' gradually reversing as the motor and sled/car increase in speed ... a CVT ... or simple Constant Velocity Transmission ...

You would start out from a stopped positon at maximum torque ... and gradually reach maximum speed as the rpms increase ...
The belt will take the beating ... but is realatively easy/cheap to change ... 

I would have to do a GOOD job of beefing up the output drive for the motor and chaincase!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Hi DavidP,


DavidP said:


> I fell in LOVE with the idea of a 'snowmobile clutch


EVs don't need clutches  You just turn the motor off.



> You would start out from a stopped positon at maximum torque ... and gradually reach maximum speed as the rpms increase


That is how the electric motor behaves. What do you need a CVT for?

I've seen attempts at using these types of CVTs with electric motors (both series and sepex). It never works out for the guys who do it.

Regards,

major


----------



## maxvtol (Nov 11, 2009)

major said:


> I've seen attempts at using these types of CVTs with electric motors (both series and sepex). It never works out for the guys who do it.


What sort of problems? At least in theory, if the wheels don't spin, you'll get greater acceleration with greater torque. I've run CVT on my spreadsheet vs 5 speed and it shaved a few seconds off 0-60mph (at least on an AC50 motor).


----------



## major (Apr 4, 2008)

maxvtol said:


> if the wheels don't spin


Yeah, that's what I saw. More torque than you could use at low speed and then no help after that. It was just a terrible match to the characteristics of the DC motor. Maybe you're smarter than those guys  How many EVs do you see in the garage here or the EValbum or otherwise have heard about which use a CVT out of the thousands of documented conversions? Zero, at least which actually work worth a crap. I'm telling you I saw 2 which sucked. Take or leave it.

major


----------



## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

I see a lot of potential issues, including excessive torque (wheelspin or broken parts), inefficient power transmission (okay for cheap ICE fuel, but not battery friendly), increased complexity (more maintenance and potential for breakdowns). Sometimes compromises are necessary, but why have them when they're not?

It takes a while for a person's brain to adjust to the whole concept of electric propulsion. I came in the doors full of ideas, from my ICE experiences, to build a killer EV - only to find out the electric motor would really be a lot happier without most of them. Even the people who need or prefer a transmission seem to use them as mode selectors. Second gear for city driving and third or fourth for highway. Two to three of the gears are pretty much useless, and some even remove them and/or pin the transmission in the one they really need.

The key is to figure out how to capitalize on the advantages of a compact, torquey, electric motor and build on that.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

I'll have to respect your opinion, but I plan on using the variable speed 'clutch' if I can find one ... hopefully from a gas golf cart if I can find one at a reasonable price ... 

I wouldn't be using it as a 'clutch' though ... but to benefit from the variable drive ratio ... or CVT transmission ... 

As set up origionally for a gas engine ... it wouldn't start to transfer any power until 500 or 1000 rpm ... or whatever it would be adjusted to for a gas engine until a certain rpm was reached ... which would be totally useless for an EV !!!

I'll have to let you know how it works out ... if I can pick up a used one ... but I won't pay the price for a new clutch just to experiment with ... 

If anyone was foolish enough to just jam a snowmobile or gas golf cart clutch on his EV without some adjustments for the electric motor ... he deserves whatever he gets ... 

HINT : (You don't have to leave things so loose with clearance for slippage if the motor isn't running at 500 rpm in idle half the time)(Hopefully almost NO SLIPPAGE ... EVER)

Or he can just run around blaming the clutch ... 

Its proven technology ... on all snowmobiles and gas golf carts and other applications as well ... it works ... it just has to be properly adapted ... 

Hopefully you can see some benefit from a CVT ... if you don't think of it as a clutch ??

I'd actually like to pick up a used or cheap EZGO 'clutch' assembly as pictured below ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

Surely there must be a fairly straight forward way to lock up the clutch on that snowmobile unit and then add a manual method of varying the ratio.


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

*YES!*

Its actually incredibly simple ... you just remove all the slack built into the drive pully (tighten it up) so that it won't freewheel while a gas engine is idling ... 
Normally it would take a certain rpm to get the weights to apply enough pressure to tighten up on the belt ... and likely increasing the weights to move up through the gear range as well ... 

To use it as a CVT on an electric vehicle ... you wouldn't want any slippage at all ... especially using a regen motor like the one I bought ...


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

I thought this YouTube video may be a good way illustrate what I was trying to describe as a CVT for EV's ... It is not used as a clutch!!!
You'll have to try to ignore all the noise and exhaust smoke from the ICE though ... 
In an EV it would be very quiet ...  
Just visualize the effect of adjusting the drive pully or adding a spacer to prevent the pulley from backing off completely ... with both pulley's always ingaged ... but infinately variable within the range of the pulleys design ... 
It appears that you would go automatically from approx. 3:1 at rest / braking & regen to 1:1 with speed when you applied power, while having a flexible coupling between the motor and driveshaft ... 

Its really just for your consideration ... I'm going to try it myself ... 
Even if I can't make it work properly, maybe someone with more knowledge than myself will be able to see the benefit and apply something similar himself ... 

1st one is from a snowmobile ... the 2nd I just found is a CTV for a Dodge Caliber ... 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zHhD-45Id0&playnext_from=TL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VYPsrOyIdw&feature=related


----------



## Anaerin (Feb 4, 2009)

DavidP said:


> I thought this YouTube video may be a good way illustrate what I was trying to describe as a CVT for EV's ... It is not used as a clutch!!!
> You'll have to try to ignore all the noise and exhaust smoke from the ICE though ...
> In an EV it would be very quiet ...
> Just visualize the effect of adjusting the drive pully or adding a spacer to prevent the pulley from backing off completely ... with both pulley's always ingaged ... but infinately variable within the range of the pulleys design ...
> ...


Ah yes, the DAF Variomatic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variomatic - Welcome to the 1950's!


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

I've just been looking into getting a professional looking adapter for the 170-502-0001 golf cart motor and notice that the ES-10E-33 for EV conversions seem to share the same bolt pattern for attachment ... 

The 170-502-0001 has the 7/8" internal 19 tooth spline for the Dana 12 electric golf cart, and the ES-10E-33 has a keyed 7/8" shaft exiting the faceplate with the included bearing ... 

The pictures and measurements seem the same ... 

So much so that I emailed D & D motors and asked if it would fit, if they were available, and how much ...

Sure would make things a lot easier if they did ...


----------



## DavidP (Jun 9, 2010)

The full size pictues look the same measurement & bolt pattern ...

http://www.evdrives.com/dd_motors_170-502-0001.html

http://www.evdrives.com/dd_motors_ES-10E-33.html


----------



## Superyellow (Dec 8, 2012)

Hello there
I admire your work on your golf car motor conversion on your tractor and I have a similar project I have a golf cart motor with 19 spline female shaft with 34mm OD I cannot find 34mm bearings... I don't think machining the shaft to 30mm is a good idea or using 1mm thick ring for the bearings... I came across these cylindirecal roller bearings which I can exchange out with another ring but those rings need oil .... Will you please suggest me what to do.
Should I use a single wide roller bearing with removable ring which can be modified to fit 34mm shaft and custom end cap with oil channels in it?
Or machine the shaft to 30mm and use standard sealed bearings?
Thank u in advance 



Woodsmith said:


> This is the motor I started with for my tractor build.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

Superyellow said:


> Hello there
> I admire your work on your golf car motor conversion on your tractor and I have a similar project I have a golf cart motor with 19 spline female shaft with 34mm OD I cannot find 34mm bearings... I don't think machining the shaft to 30mm is a good idea or using 1mm thick ring for the bearings... I came across these cylindirecal roller bearings which I can exchange out with another ring but those rings need oil .... Will you please suggest me what to do.
> Should I use a single wide roller bearing with removable ring which can be modified to fit 34mm shaft and custom end cap with oil channels in it?
> Or machine the shaft to 30mm and use standard sealed bearings?
> Thank u in advance


I've replied on your other thread.


----------

