# Brian's possible new donor car/s



## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Well I will start a new thread and post some of the possibilities for my new donor cars. Here is one I am looking at. It is a 2002 Ford ZX2 (Ya Patrick is happy) 75k miles but she hit a curb and you can see both tires are pushed back a few inches,, this does not bother me at all I can fix that, the widshield is busted ya I can replace that to not too big of a deal, my bigger concern is the airbags,, will they be super expensive even at a junk yard? Will I need to replace the entire dash on passenger side? Swapping the steering wheel no biggy nor is the pass airbag but I have no clus what an auto wrecker would want for the 2???? Any one have a clue on prices for these?

The part pushing me towards this car is the price 600 bucks!!!! Can I say no to that?? 75,000 miles the interior looks pretty mint to me???

any thoughts would help

Brian

PS the owner sent me these pics


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## Qer (May 7, 2008)

A college of mine hit a boar that didn't do THAT extensive damage to the car but three air bags went off (steering wheel, curtain at side window, airbag in chair) and the cost for repairing just that would be more than $3000. Add the cost for body damage etc and it all ended with the insurance company caching in the car instead.

I would sort out what it would cost to fix the air bags before buying that car, I have a feeling it might not be worth it even if you get the car for free. And yes, you'll have to replace the dash board, the air bag literally blows it to pieces when it's engaged.


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## lottos (Jun 22, 2008)

I know you're keen, but take your time to get a car at least as good as the last one!


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## TelnetManta (Jun 5, 2008)

I would pass on this one. For just a little bit more money you should be able to find one that doesn't require the additional mechanical work. Since this is your second EV I would focus on the upgrades that you can do over the original. Get a car that's pull and go.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

TelnetManta said:


> I would pass on this one. For just a little bit more money you should be able to find one that doesn't require the additional mechanical work. Since this is your second EV I would focus on the upgrades that you can do over the original. Get a car that's pull and go.



Ya i researched air bags last night they are 84 bucks to 225 bucks each + you need the computer for the srs system replaced or re-set to reset $125 bucks. Ya I think I wil pass on it. I also found a 92 honda Prelude with no engine and the transmission is in the trunk and the radiator leaks PERFECT! But the car weighs 2700+ pounds and it is all in primer, not sure if the body was prepped for primer or just sprayed he want 500 bucks for the car,, I am not in a hurry so I will probably pass on that one as well. Thanks for all the replies and I will keep adding to this till I find the right car, I also saw a 41 Hudson 4 door suicide doors,, ya it would need work and apparently the curb weight is under 3000 pounds I am sure the motor and tranny weigh a ton. That would be cool but new interior beyond hard to find parts etc.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

here is a 91(or 92 ) prelude wants 500 bucks,, ya needs painted but??? Your thoughts?

Brian


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

rctous said:


> here is a 91(or 92 ) prelude wants 500 bucks,, ya needs painted but??? Your thoughts?
> 
> Brian


Body will need stripped and reprimered/painted...

If you can do that yourself... sounds good... assuming you talk him down to $300

there's no engine/tranny and a broken radiator... to everyone but EVers that car is useless afterall

a junkyard would give him $40


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Technologic said:


> Body will need stripped and reprimered/painted...
> 
> If you can do that yourself... sounds good... assuming you talk him down to $300
> 
> ...



the tranny is in the trunk so it is there, inyerior looks like it could be cleaned up
I can do all the paint / body work also I am sure I could get it for 300 bucks he also says there is really no rust that is a plus


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

the prelude seems to be pretty light

The Honda Prelude was a sports coupe produced by Japanese automaker Honda .... 49.2 in (1250 mm) (1990-91). Curb weight, 2337 lb (1060 kg) - 2954 lb (1340 ...

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Going to go look at the Prelude at 2:00 I will take the camera and post a few more pics
I do like the body style looks fairly aerodynamic.

Brian


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## engineer_Bill (Jun 24, 2008)

rctous said:


> here is a 91(or 92 ) prelude wants 500 bucks,, ya needs painted but??? Your thoughts?
> 
> Brian


The donor I bought needed painted, I found a local garage that would do it for $300.00, after the paint job it looked great.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

not only NO on the Prelude but HECK NO way to much work for what I want ,, but I did come across this GEM!!! The descision maker was not there so I left my # hope he calls and doesn't want much,, this would be an awesome e-car!!!!! Not sure the year but it is a Cougar,, leather and loaded!

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

engineer_Bill said:


> The donor I bought needed painted, I found a local garage that would do it for $300.00, after the paint job it looked great.


I can paint it here or worst case do all the body work and take it to MAACO for their 200 dollar special,,,

I just called Maaco and if the car is 100% ready to paint they will tape it off and paint it for 250 bucks,,,, thats pretty darn cheap!


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## TheSGC (Nov 15, 2007)

rctous said:


> not only NO on the Prelude but HECK NO way to much work for what I want ,, but I did come across this GEM!!! The descision maker was not there so I left my # hope he calls and doesn't want much,, this would be an awesome e-car!!!!! Not sure the year but it is a Cougar,, leather and loaded!
> 
> Brian


That damage looks superficial, and about a weekends worth of fixing. That would make a sweet EV depending on the price.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

TheSGC said:


> That damage looks superficial, and about a weekends worth of fixing. That would make a sweet EV depending on the price.


ya totally easy fix but I am sure they will want a small fortune for it,, it was a crashed repo so who knows.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

wow curb weight on the cougar V6 is just over 3000 pounds,, I am sure the bigger motor makes up a lot of that.

Brian


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

rctous said:


> ya totally easy fix but I am sure they will want a small fortune for it,, it was a crashed repo so who knows.


I can't imagine they'd want over 2k for it... freaking mercury cougar's are what... 7 years old now? the entire brand is dead.

But a lot of those people selling crashed cars like that want waaaaaaaaaaay too much for it.

I say... give him an estimate of the damage to get fixed (high) and give him the retail value of the car (about $6000 in 100% working condition)... that'll give you a good price to offer


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Brian, I'm gonna just come out and say it. *Get a saturn!*

They are light, aerodymanic, and worthless in the used car market so they can be found in good shape for good prices. They are also prone to burning oil later in life so that can make for a really good cheap buy if you can find one that doesn't run well.

My saturn is actually a 4 door and the specs call for curb weight around 2300 lbs (2 door is less). Mine is probably less than 2300 because it has no power steering or AC. I got mine for $750 in running certified condition, but it was cheap because the engine had oil in the coolant and had been run that way for a while.

The car is also very tough despite its light weight and they are well protected against corrosion from the factory. Don't bother with a used honda, they make nice cars, but in general hondas are heavy, and prone to rust. The only place a saturn is likely to rust is at the rear door sills on the 4 door version under the plastic snap in step so its really easy to check for.

I have some info on the saturn S series compiled here if you are interested:

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21254

I say again, GET A SATURN!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> Brian, I'm gonna just come out and say it. *Get a saturn!*
> 
> They are light, aerodymanic, and worthless in the used car market so they can be found in good shape for good prices. They are also prone to burning oil later in life so that can make for a really good cheap buy if you can find one that doesn't run well.
> 
> ...


I have and am keeping an eye out on them we actually owned a Saturn a few years ago,, I have to fix the truck first so I have a couple weeks,,, What you don't like the Cougar???


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Technologic said:


> I can't imagine they'd want over 2k for it... freaking mercury cougar's are what... 7 years old now? the entire brand is dead.
> 
> But a lot of those people selling crashed cars like that want waaaaaaaaaaay too much for it.
> 
> I say... give him an estimate of the damage to get fixed (high) and give him the retail value of the car (about $6000 in 100% working condition)... that'll give you a good price to offer


hood 187,, fenders 160 each ,, front bumper cover 180 haven't checked on windshield yet, heck I can tell them I will bring the engine back to them it may fetch a few hundred bucks for them,,, I will not pay more than about 800 bucks for it but you are right they were never very popular and parts are not to bad I can still do the junk yard thing but right now it is way to cold,, its about 8 degrees here and dropping. Sure is nice and toasty in the garage though!!! (yeeeee hawwwww)

brian


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> What you don't like the Cougar???


NO! LOL!

I don't know how cheap you can get it for, but considering I found saturns that were in clean/strait, but poor running condition for anywhere from $150 to MAYBE as high as $1000, I don't see the point. Parts are also cheap.

The car is light but strong from factory, ages slowly, and you can already get one really cheap that doens't need cosmetic repairs. They are plastic all around so lower door edges and fenders will never rust and the steel that is exposed is galvanized or undercoated, or both.

Just look at the rad support on a saturn. Its completely rigid and boxed, practically as strong as my old fullsize pickup. I don't know how they were able to make the car so light and yet still so strong, but somehow they did. All that strength makes it capable of coping with the added weight of a conversion very well.


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

david85 said:


> Just look at the rad support on a saturn. Its completely rigid and boxed, practically as strong as my old fullsize pickup. I don't know how they were able to make the car so light and yet still so strong, but somehow they did. All that strength makes it capable of coping with the added weight of a conversion very well.


because fiberglass reinforced polyproplyene is like 8-10 times stiffer per lb than steel  Also cheaper.

Steel is actually a very crappy material for a lot of things


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Technologic said:


> because fiberglass reinforced polyproplyene is like 8-10 times stiffer per lb than steel  Also cheaper.
> 
> Steel is actually a very crappy material for a lot of things


I would love to agree with you, but actually, the front clip structure on the saturn is in fact steel. Only the side panels and bumpers are bolted on plastic, everything else is steel with bumper backing made of thick aluminum.

But in principal you are correct. I hate steel.


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

Brian

the zx2 passenger airbag is held on by four small bolts that are accessed by dropping the glove compartment. You can get those at a junk yard (if you have a local pull-a-part type place) for cheap. Or ebay... look at prices. The bag unit can be replaced without removing the dash. The heater core requires you to remove the dash! The zx2 turned out to be a fairly easy car to convert.. plenty of room for up to 12batts in trunk if you want to do a 20batt setup.. 8 seems to be the MAX in the engine compartment. Plus, it comes with a template for the adapter plate in between tranny and motor. Weighs 2478lbs stock. Just fyi. Don't know how much they were asking for it... with that much front suspension work to be done, I'd not pay more than $600 for it.. but I'm pretty sure you can get a manual steering rack if you want. Though I've already worked out all the issues with using a mr2 pump (and just about every other issue you can think of.

If I were to do another zx2, I'd make the passenger motor mount a bit beefier. I've not had any problems with it, but just for peace of mind.. Also, I'd definately do 6v's over 8v's for range. Even a lower voltage 6v system would be better (I believe). 

You already have a stronger controller, so that's the only other issue I'd do differently. Nothing has failed or not worked properly (except my gauges which I think are just junky gauges). Good luck with whatever you chose!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> Brian
> 
> the zx2 passenger airbag is held on by four small bolts that are accessed by dropping the glove compartment. You can get those at a junk yard (if you have a local pull-a-part type place) for cheap. Or ebay... look at prices. The bag unit can be replaced without removing the dash. The heater core requires you to remove the dash! The zx2 turned out to be a fairly easy car to convert.. plenty of room for up to 12batts in trunk if you want to do a 20batt setup.. 8 seems to be the MAX in the engine compartment. Plus, it comes with a template for the adapter plate in between tranny and motor. Weighs 2478lbs stock. Just fyi. Don't know how much they were asking for it... with that much front suspension work to be done, I'd not pay more than $600 for it.. but I'm pretty sure you can get a manual steering rack if you want. Though I've already worked out all the issues with using a mr2 pump (and just about every other issue you can think of.
> 
> ...


Pat I would do 144 volts since I already have 9 mabey 10 batteries I would just buy 2 or 3 more, so I only have 12 total packs to deal with so 6 up front 6 in the back is my thinking,,,, so you are saying the dash on the passenger side would not need to be replaced? Even though the airbag blew through it? I know I need to get a new SRS computer or have the current one reset.. I am sure I can get the car for at most 600 bucks perhaps even less like 400 bucks,,, the front end damage is no concern of mine at all just mainly the air bag issues concern me. Were you able to sell the ICE engine? What did ya get for it?


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## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

Heck Kansas City Craiglist has several dozen better than that cougar including this one:

Without even looking hard came up with these two.

http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/984421852.html

http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/991681821.html

I did a search for cars and trucks up to $750-. I saw some other cars with real potential on the current list as well.


http://kansascity.craigslist.org/search/cto?query=&minAsk=0&maxAsk=750&hasPic=1


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

tj4fa said:


> Heck Kansas City Craiglist has several dozen better than that cougar including this one:
> 
> Without even looking hard came up with these two.
> 
> ...


probe is an automatic I saw the mits I am more concerned about the interior than the exterior,,, DUDE you rock for looking for me,, I have called and e-mailed so many people and they just don't return the message (fools) keep em coming and thanks again!!!

Brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> Pat I would do 144 volts since I already have 9 mabey 10 batteries I would just buy 2 or 3 more, so I only have 12 total packs to deal with so 6 up front 6 in the back is my thinking,,,, so you are saying the dash on the passenger side would not need to be replaced? Even though the airbag blew through it? I know I need to get a new SRS computer or have the current one reset.. I am sure I can get the car for at most 600 bucks perhaps even less like 400 bucks,,, the front end damage is no concern of mine at all just mainly the air bag issues concern me. Were you able to sell the ICE engine? What did ya get for it?


 
The part of the dash where the airbag sits is "bolted in" to the rest of the dash, completely removable like the steering wheel bag and cover. Very easy. I took it out on mine when I removed the dash to get to the heater core. Check this site out for info on airbags and reseting computer, I'm sure I've seen a thread on it: www.teamzx2.com Seems like I remember it can be reset for around $75... or again, junk yard.

I did not end up selling the original ice.. it ran fine, but had 146k miles and no one seemed interested (until after I carted it off that is.. the way things go). Six twelve volts? TONS of room for that. Look at the battery placement on mine. You wouldn't even need to sink a box through the trunk like me if you didn't want to. What are the dimensions of your batts? My 8v's are 10.125w, 11h, 7d. What size motor do you have? I used the 8" ADC. 

There is a good 33" between the frame rails in the trunk and 24" of front to back space for batts (if you cut through floor) - more if you surface mount on trunk floor.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

tj4fa said:


> Heck Kansas City Craiglist has several dozen better than that cougar including this one:
> 
> Without even looking hard came up with these two.
> 
> ...


the eclipse is SOLD


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

see this pic of dash with airbag removed... cover is part of the airbag assembly...


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> The part of the dash where the airbag sits is "bolted in" to the rest of the dash, completely removable like the steering wheel bag and cover. Very easy. I took it out on mine when I removed the dash to get to the heater core. Check this site out for info on airbags and reseting computer, I'm sure I've seen a thread on it: www.teamzx2.com Seems like I remember it can be reset for around $75... or again, junk yard.
> 
> I did not end up selling the original ice.. it ran fine, but had 146k miles and no one seemed interested (until after I carted it off that is.. the way things go). Six twelve volts? TONS of room for that. Look at the battery placement on mine. You wouldn't even need to sink a box through the trunk like me if you didn't want to. What are the dimensions of your batts? My 8v's are 10.125w, 11h, 7d. What size motor do you have? I used the 8" ADC.
> 
> There is a good 33" between the frame rails in the trunk and 24" of front to back space for batts (if you cut through floor) - more if you surface mount on trunk floor.


my bats are 12.75 x 6.5 x 9.5 I would cut through the trunk of course to keep pretty much a full trunk,,, I have a Warp 9 Impulse motor

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> see this pic of dash with airbag removed... cover is part of the airbag assembly...


simple thanks man for the pic

Brian


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## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

rctous said:


> probe is an automatic I saw the mits I am more concerned about the interior than the exterior,,, DUDE you rock for looking for me,, I have called and e-mailed so many people and they just don't return the message (fools) keep em coming and thanks again!!!
> 
> Brian


No problem. 

Would a 5 speed out of a '90 Probe fit a '94? 

http://kansascity.craigslist.org/pts/984843890.html


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

tj4fa said:


> No problem.
> 
> Would a 5 speed out of a '90 Probe fit a '94?
> 
> http://kansascity.craigslist.org/pts/984843890.html


not too sure but I am avoiding the ford probe

thanks though

Brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> my bats are 12.75 x 6.5 x 9.5 I would cut through the trunk of course to keep pretty much a full trunk,,, I have a Warp 9 Impulse motor
> 
> Brian


you'd have no problem with four batts in front of motor, but at that height, I would think you'd only be able to do a line of batts against the firewall above the motor (not two rows of two like me). Plus your motor is slightly larger.. but that would still give you six batts up front and pleny of room for six in trunk (with enough room to mount chargers down in batt box to save all that space in the trunk).

lol.. not that I'm trying to sway your towards a zx2.. But it is nice to do a car that has been done if only for reference. Saturns are great, but can lack curb appeal imo... plus, I just couldnt' find one around here that was in good enough condition. They tend to be beat like an old horse. I didn't want to do ANY body work/repair.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> you'd have no problem with four batts in front of motor, but at that height, I would think you'd only be able to do a line of batts against the firewall above the motor (not two rows of two like me). Plus your motor is slightly larger.. but that would still give you six batts up front and pleny of room for six in trunk (with enough room to mount chargers down in batt box to save all that space in the trunk).
> 
> lol.. not that I'm trying to sway your towards a zx2.. But it is nice to do a car that has been done if only for reference. Saturns are great, but can lack curb appeal imo... plus, I just couldnt' find one around here that was in good enough condition. They tend to be beat like an old horse. I didn't want to do ANY body work/repair.


nothing at all personal Pat but part of the reason I am NOT leaning toward the ZX2 is because you did one,,, it just isn't as original once it has been done. Heck I would have to make sure I did a nice job to compete with yours. I haven't made up my ming but I am thinking of offering him 350 bucks for the car,,,, at that price how could I say no???? I do knda like the look of the car ,, the low mileage,, the interior is in great shape (I think) so it makes sence to do if he takes my money.. I will send him an e-mail

Brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> nothing at all personal Pat but part of the reason I am NOT leaning toward the ZX2 is because you did one,,, it just isn't as original once it has been done. Heck I would have to make sure I did a nice job to compete with yours. I haven't made up my ming but I am thinking of offering him 350 bucks for the car,,,, at that price how could I say no???? I do knda like the look of the car ,, the low mileage,, the interior is in great shape (I think) so it makes sence to do if he takes my money.. I will send him an e-mail
> 
> Brian


no offense.. I see your point. But honestly, having seen the job you did on the first one, yours would be way better than mine! Plus it'll be your second one so I'm sure they'll be improvements. With the larger controller and motor, it'll definately perform better! What kind of range were you getting with the 12v's in the Storm?


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

ha.. then I'd have to find another zx2 to improve on your improvements! Kidding....


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> no offense.. I see your point. But honestly, having seen the job you did on the first one, yours would be way better than mine! Plus it'll be your second one so I'm sure they'll be improvements. With the larger controller and motor, it'll definately perform better! What kind of range were you getting with the 12v's in the Storm?


30 miles range but really never broke in the batteries they are 14AH batteries and only weigh 63 pounds each 30 miles is way more than I needed

probably 35 at best

Brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> 30 miles range but really never broke in the batteries
> 
> probably 35 at best
> 
> Brian


hmmm... I haven't seen more than 26.. but then it's been cold to very cold ever since I finished. I can't wait for a stretch of warm weather to see how it affects range.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> hmmm... I haven't seen more than 26.. but then it's been cold to very cold ever since I finished. I can't wait for a stretch of warm weather to see how it affects range.


how are you determining your 26 miles,,, car slows or dies? Didn't you get stranded once? how far did ya get?


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> how are you determining your 26 miles,,, car slows or dies? Didn't you get stranded once? how far did ya get?


I've never let the car die completely. I did sort of get stranded once, but it was only after a few test drives, so I just didn't let the batts break in properly. I don't recall how far I went that day, but it was under 20 miles. I was able to sit a few, drive a little, sit a few, drive a little to get it home.

I've pretty much been using the Curtis fuel gauge as my guide (since I've been having ammeter/voltmeter issues) and try to never let it get to red. I'm still not really certain what constitutes 80% DOD. I've had various answers to that question. Generally, with my 120v system, I don't let it go below 117volts. When I unplug to start the day I'm usually at 132volts.

Right now it's -1 degree outside. It'll be interesting to see if I can drive it at all today or how far I'll get.

update: Drove great in subzero temps... got 16.5miles before it started showing some weakness... all in all, not bad since my batts aren't insulated or heated at all. 16.5 miles with final voltage of 115.2


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## SirHenry (Jan 13, 2009)

What would you suggest if I needed more range? Say 100 Miles?


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

SirHenry said:


> What would you suggest if I needed more range? Say 100 Miles?


definately an AC system for a start,, LiFo batteries would surley help as well.

big money

did I mention BIG MONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

B


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

I put an ad in Craigs list saying that I needed a car for the conversion and did actually get a call today of course a guy with a SATURN,, I returned the call and left a message for him we will see.


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

rctous said:


> definately an AC system for a start,, LiFo batteries would surley help as well.
> 
> big money
> 
> did I mention BIG MONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Sure if you were converting a standard steel sedan (whether from 1910 or 2008).

But you know what they say, "necessity breeds invention". Seemingly a strictly low budget, with big ideas can breed invention even more readily.

Just think of many ways to transport 200 lbs of human being... There's always a new way, and always a new means to get from point A to point B for cheaper.

Just like there's always been a way for me to eat for $1-2 for a full day while in college for the last 7 years... Until I'm "old enough" to be "taken seriously" for my "intelligence".


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> I put an ad in Craigs list saying that I needed a car for the conversion and did actually get a call today of course a guy with a SATURN,, I returned the call and left a message for him we will see.


*bites tongue*


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## TheSGC (Nov 15, 2007)

rctous said:


> I put an ad in Craigs list saying that I needed a car for the conversion and did actually get a call today of course a guy with a SATURN,, I returned the call and left a message for him we will see.


I like to browse Craigslist for "blown engines" and there are always cars around. Most of them are sweet, like BMW 3 series for $600 with a blown engine that no one will touch. If I only had the space for another EV....


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

TheSGC said:


> I like to browse Craigslist for "blown engines" and there are always cars around. Most of them are sweet, like BMW 3 series for $600 with a blown engine that no one will touch.


I know what you mean SGC... I once saw a blown BMW Z4 (BMW's and Mercedes are piles or garbage that generally break down after about 40,000 miles) with a full engine rebuild being needed and a radiator that was almost completely shot for $1000.

If I was building an EV from an existing car, that would be very sexy.

A lot of old premium fords had that same issue with the entire intake cracking... go figure.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> *bites tongue*


ya I am biting it ,, just got off the phone with him,, he want 600 bucks told him I would pay 400 and give him back the motor and crap ( he is a mecahnic) and he sounded interested.. it is a 97 Sl1 (or 2) is there a difference? Say drivers seat is pretty rough and the roof liner is falling down no big deal on either of those. He is going to send me some pics soon and I will post them as soon as I get them. car is light 2300+ pounds 4 door which is good for the family,, so after I see the pics i may go see the car on Sat or sun armed with a camera of course.

will keep ya all posted

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Here are some pics he sent me of the saturn thing looks OK I guess

hard to tell in the snow he did say the exterior is in pretty great shape we will see.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> ya I am biting it ,, just got off the phone with him,, he want 600 bucks told him I would pay 400 and give him back the motor and crap ( he is a mecahnic) and he sounded interested.. it is a 97 Sl1 (or 2) is there a difference? Say drivers seat is pretty rough and the roof liner is falling down no big deal on either of those. He is going to send me some pics soon and I will post them as soon as I get them. car is light 2300+ pounds 4 door which is good for the family,, so after I see the pics i may go see the car on Sat or sun armed with a camera of course.
> 
> will keep ya all posted
> 
> Brian


I think its only trim and luxury options between the SL1 and SL2 (SL2's typically have color matched bumpers standard). Structurally they should be identical. I think the base model SL1 is actually closer to 2280lbs if you have no power steering. Very light for 4 door.

Take a good hard look at the pictures like any other car and check the rocker panels LOL!

Also look under the rear of the car near the spare tire tub for rust on any of the joints.

If possible, peel the carpet back and inspect the inside of the floor.

If it all checks out, it would be one hell of a deal at $400. We'll be twins! haha


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> Here are some pics he sent me of the saturn thing looks OK I guess
> 
> hard to tell in the snow he did say the exterior is in pretty great shape we will see.


Looks great, but beauty is only skin deep. Time to take a drive and go see it!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> I think its only trim and luxury options between the SL1 and SL2 (SL2's typically have color matched bumpers standard). Structurally they should be identical. I think the base model SL1 is actually closer to 2280lbs if you have no power steering. Very light for 4 door.
> 
> Take a good hard look at the pictures like any other car and check the rocker panels LOL!
> 
> ...


I guess you have not seen the pics yet??? I will need to send it to you for the rust repair I will not have that kind of patience like you did,, do you mean some of them came with no power steering? That would be awesome as I will not hook it up any way.

Needs a hub cap or two I can get some of the cool spinners at walmart ya ya thats it! 30 bucks for a set of 4?? LOL. Twins??? Ya like Arnold and Danny LOLOLOL

B


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> I guess you have not seen the pics yet??? I will need to send it to you for the rust repair I will not have that kind of patience like you did,, do you mean some of them came with no power steering? That would be awesome as I will not hook it up any way.
> 
> Needs a hub cap or two I can get some of the cool spinners at walmart ya ya thats it! 30 bucks for a set of 4?? LOL. Twins??? Ya like Arnold and Danny LOLOLOL
> 
> B


Thats the problem with a forum used as a chat room. can sometimes talk over each other.

Not sure if you could pay the shipping on a whole car up to canada, LOL.

Yes, mine is factory *NON powersteering* and it actually handled really nice on the 250 mile trip home. If possible, you should drive it to see what its like. I was very impressed with mine on the drive home.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

By the way got the Magnum back the other day and I must say they did an awesome job,, this is clean today but the wife needs it tomorrow and it will be driven in the sloppy snow (sad) oh well the new daily driver!!

B


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

Brian, did you ever get your controller back from Logisystems... I'm wondering who has been using the Logisystems controllers and NOT having problems with them... just thinking their 750amp version would be nice for next conversion if it works.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> Brian, did you ever get your controller back from Logisystems... I'm wondering who has been using the Logisystems controllers and NOT having problems with them... just thinking their 750amp version would be nice for next conversion if it works.


Yes I got it back,, does it work??? don't know yet,, need a car to put it in,,, I assume it will work and work well (fingers crossed)

B


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

well I just got back from looking at the Saturn and here are some pics. The interior is dirty but i KNow I can clean it up well. the head liner needs replaced no biggy,, missing 2 hub caps the clear coat is pealing of the pillars that is about the worst of it, He wants to seal the deal on Tuesday for 475 bucks. For taht I think I have to do it,, what are your thoughts? Is it a go?

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

I actually just got an e-mail about another Saturn that I inquired about,, this one is a 99 and she replaced the clutch a month ago and apparently it went out on her again,, she has had enough and wants to sell it. She is asking 1000 bucks for it and I replied that that was twice what I wanted to pay,,, she replied back and said she would let me know tomorrow,, I think I would prefer this one as it is newer and it is the Sl2 model, but I have yet to see it,, we will let ya know tomorrow. Looks like a Saturn though for the next convert!!!!

Brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

Personally, I'd say take your time... When the right one comes along you'll be thrilled to give the owner xxxx dollars for it because you'll know that's the one you want to convert. Saturns are a good choice for EV's.. and some of them are nice looking. It's just like mom always told you: when you meet the right one, you'll just know.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

I agree but also its time to get started


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## lottos (Jun 22, 2008)

it's not my choice, but I liked the model you did the 1st time!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

lottos said:


> it's not my choice, but I liked the model you did the 1st time!


Ya so did I but I just can't see doing the same car twice need to change it up a bit

Brian


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Brian that car looks pretty decent. Were you able to check the spots I mentioned for rust? If those are clean, I would go for it. Considering what you would normally get for $500 or less, its a good car. The thing Even has AC if you wanted to use that later on. Do you know if its power steering?

Don't worry about hubcaps, just go to a wrecking yard and get some that you like, or wally world if you preffer the spinning variety lol

It is certainly worth looking at the second one as well before deciding anything. If its cleaner and she is willing to bend on the price, it could save you some extra time and effort.

I don't remember, did you keep the clutch with your first car?


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Forgot to mention. The parts with the peeling clear coat are plastic and fastened with screws. They come off in 10 minutes and can be painted seperate from the rest of the car.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

I do not have the clutch but I do still have the couple I made,, it is still on the motor,, do you actually think there is a chnce it will work? Same splines etc?? That would be awesome. I believe they both have power steering but I will not hook it up,, the geo was not to hard to steer

yes I pulled up the carpet and did not see really any rust issues,, does appear to have some hail damage on the hood but again not to bad,, 

aftre reading your clutch question no I did not use the clutch,, cut the pedal right out

Brian


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> Forgot to mention. The parts with the peeling clear coat are plastic and fastened with screws. They come off in 10 minutes and can be painted seperate from the rest of the car.


ya that did look like an easy fix

THANKS


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

rctous said:


> aftre reading your clutch question no I did not use the clutch,, cut the pedal right out
> 
> Brian


So a donor with a burned clutch is no problem then.

Actually there is a slim chance that the splines could match. Clutch disks are standardized wear items and if there was a different spline for every car out there, well that would be crazy! Much like wheel bearings, struts and ball joints. They may say one brand or another on them, but in reality they are intustry standard replacement parts.

Being that your storm and the saturn have similar power plants and are both technically GM brand vehicles, there is a possibility that the splines could match. I actually came across a list of cars that use the same trans axles as the saturn, and there were a few of them in that list. The sunfire and later the cobalt used the same basic transmission (I think some half a dozen on the list). I'll see if I can find that list again.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> So a donor with a burned clutch is no problem then.
> 
> Actually there is a slim chance that the splines could match. Clutch disks are standardized wear items and if there was a different spline for every car out there, well that would be crazy! Much like wheel bearings, struts and ball joints. They may say one brand or another on them, but in reality they are intustry standard replacement parts.
> 
> Being that your storm and the saturn have similar power plants and are both technically GM brand vehicles, there is a possibility that the splines could match. I actually came across a list of cars that use the same trans axles as the saturn, and there were a few of them in that list. The sunfire and later the cobalt used the same basic transmission (I think some half a dozen on the list). I'll see if I can find that list again.


no problem at all assuming it is the clutch and not the tranny. I find it a bit odd that she went through a clutch in a month??? As well why not a warranty issue? Who knows. as long as the tranny os OK I don't care. Even if the splines line up then there is the question of the length of the couple,,, heck it would be cool if the motor adaptor plate fit (ya now I am pushing it,, I hope to be able to re use the plate though. All in time we will know

B


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Could be she had only the friction disk replaced without having the pressure plate and flywheel resurfaced. There is no warranty If that was done. Depending on where you are in the country, you can get saturn transmissions from below $100 up to $500 from wrecking yards. Selection and pricing seems to be WAY better in the states. But thats nothing new.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> Could be she had only the friction disk replaced without having the pressure plate and flywheel resurfaced. There is no warranty If that was done. Depending on where you are in the country, you can get saturn transmissions from below $100 up to $500 from wrecking yards. Selection and pricing seems to be WAY better in the states. But thats nothing new.


Ya that was my exact thought only did 1/2 the job


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

then there is this one
I just offered him 400 bucks
it looks very clean with new tires
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/997645559.html

brian


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> then there is this one
> I just offered him 400 bucks
> it looks very clean with new tires
> http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/997645559.html
> ...


that one looks great.. I love the coupe! get that one even if you have to pay a bit extra for it.. less work! haha


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

PatricioIN said:


> that one looks great.. I love the coupe! get that one even if you have to pay a bit extra for it.. less work! haha


but I just looked at the moon roof pics he has it siliconed shut still I am sure I can fix it but???????????????????

B


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

rctous said:


> but I just looked at the moon roof pics he has it siliconed shut still I am sure I can fix it but???????????????????
> 
> B


hmm.. probably was leaking.. I would guess it needs new rubbers.


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

hey it's like the people who use red tape over their broken tailights when they could get another one at a junkyard for $10... to some people, broke means BROKE!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

well I asked him to call so we will see I know what ya mean though usually it is just as easy to fix right as it is to "rig it " wrong!

B


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

well she just called and excepted my 400 dollar offer am going down tomorrow to take a closer look ( heck I might as well get the trailer and just get it huh? It is about 75 miles away Again it is this one 

http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/997645559.html

Are ya happy now David 85???????????????

I show a curb weight of 2309 lbs not too bad

B


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Well it looks like there isn't any weight penalty for going with the SC instead of an SL, so I would consider that as an option if the price is right. Saturn Weight specs:

http://www.differentracing.com/tech_articles/curbweight.html

The nice thing about a 4 door is that it can be comfortable for more than just 2 people. As we discovered, the rear seating in the SL1 is quite adiquate.

It all depends on what you want to do with the car.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> Well it looks like there isn't any weight penalty for going with the SC instead of an SL, so I would consider that as an option if the price is right. Saturn Weight specs:
> 
> http://www.differentracing.com/tech_articles/curbweight.html
> 
> ...


yes that is true and we will have our kids in the bacl seat,, but the fit in the storm so I am sure they will fit in The SATurn just fine 400 bucks ya the price is right+ this one looks a little more sporty ya haww donor car search OVER let the games begin!!!!!!!! I will post pics of it when I get it home tomorrow,,,

Thanks for the link looks like it will be pretty light once I pull out the AC and all the stuff

Brian


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## lottos (Jun 22, 2008)

Congratulations Brian, looking forward to EV MK2!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

lottos said:


> Congratulations Brian, looking forward to EV MK2!


what am my missing???? EV MK2//???????????????

brian


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## lottos (Jun 22, 2008)

Electric Vehicle Mark 2 (version 2)


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

lottos said:


> Electric Vehicle Mark 2 (version 2)


duh ok I get it now


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

If you go with a smaller 2 door and I go with the larger 4 door, does that mean I get to be Arnie? (twins)

Looking forward to your next thread, because you will likely be done long before me....


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## lottos (Jun 22, 2008)

david85 said:


> If you go with a smaller 2 door and I go with the larger 4 door, does that mean I get to be Arnie? (twins)
> 
> Looking forward to your next thread, because you will likely be done long before me....


Aha! Motive!


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> If you go with a smaller 2 door and I go with the larger 4 door, does that mean I get to be Arnie? (twins)
> 
> Looking forward to your next thread, because you will likely be done long before me....


don't know how tall are you? I am right at 6 foot??? Are you vertically challanged?

Heck I will probably have the motor out tomorrow


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

I'm less than 6' tall so I guess I get to be the short guy LOL.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> I'm less than 6' tall so I guess I get to be the short guy LOL.


Julius and Vincent Benedict but who was who?


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## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

rctous said:


> Heck I will probably have the motor out tomorrow


And you might be able to sell it or parts of it here:

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

tj4fa said:


> And you might be able to sell it or parts of it here:
> 
> http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/


awesome man thanks I will probably post some of the items heck mabey get enough to pay for the car

Brian


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## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

rctous said:


> awesome man thanks I will probably post some of the items heck mabey get enough to pay for the car
> 
> Brian


Saturn owners need lots of parts.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

tj4fa said:


> Saturn owners need lots of parts.


I hope your refering to the ICE owners!!!!!!!!


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Actually saturn engines are notorious oil burners. Everything else I've seen in my car suggest that the engine is the weakest link in the system. You also don't want to do extended one wheel burnouts because the differential can come apart in the transaxle, but thats not how you get good range anyway


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

david85 said:


> Actually saturn engines are notorious oil burners. Everything else I've seen in my car suggest that the engine is the weakest link in the system. You also don't want to do extended one wheel burnouts because the differential can come apart in the transaxle, but thats not how you get good range anyway


encouraging words
can't see doing too many burnouts though except in reverse upon take off from the Logisystem controller.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

reserved the trailer for 1" PM not sure if I can wait that long,,, it is amazing how building another ev is so exciting. Can't wait to start rippin it apart,,


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## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

hey, that two door might even have a third "suicide" door on the driver's side!


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Congratulations, man. I'm not the least bit jealous that you're going to complete two conversions while I'm still fiddling with my first.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

Bottomfeeder said:


> Congratulations, man. I'm not the least bit jealous that you're going to complete two conversions while I'm still fiddling with my first.


Ya but you'll get er done

I started a new thread for the build here we go again!

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/brians-ev-conversion-2-saturn-project-26520.html

brian


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