# Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

Alltrax has a pretty good track record. They make good stuff and seem to 
support it well. I have one of their controllers in my Elec-Trak tractor, 
and have been satisfied with it.

FWIW, I understand that Alltrax are committed to manufacturing here in the 
US and sourcing as many components as possible in the US. AFAIK, the Kelly 
controllers are made in China. Of course views vary on this issue and it 
may or may not affect your decision.

David Roden
EVDL Administrator
http://www.evdl.org/


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

I see he's running a KD84600, maybe they don't have the DC/DC requirement? I
don't even see that controller listed on their website. Is he running the
full 72 volts to the controller then? I don't understand why they need the
reduced voltage for the controller.




> M. Barkley wrote:
> >
> > A fellow member in the www.nteaa.org club is running a
> > 72volt(84volt max)600amp Kelly Controller without a
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

I'll be glad when AllTrax builds a higher than 72vdc
controller for ONROAD use. I've heard rumors of such,
but so far, just rumors. Anyone with an inside scoop
on this rumor?

Granted, I'll have to get my EV Certification in
Oklahoma, before going above 80vdc. Maybe someday,
I'll get to take the EV course.






> --- EVDL Administrator <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Alltrax has a pretty good track record. They make
> > good stuff and seem to
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

I'm going to assume they run the logic of the
controller from 12volts, and since every car has to
have some sort of 12 volts for auxillary systems, IE:
Lights, Radio, etc. that it shouldn't be a hard thing
to achieve. But you know what assuming can be, so I'd
email David and ask him, or Kelly Controllers for the
horses mouth perspective. 




> --- JRP3 <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >
> > I see he's running a KD84600, maybe they don't have
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

The really confusing part, (for me at least), is they say the controller
requires an 18-40 volt supply, so I guess you couldn't even use your 12 DC
accessory converter? I'm building an off road 6 wheel ATV and I don't plan
on using a DC/DC so it would be an unneeded expense in my situation.




> M. Barkley wrote:
> >
> > I'm going to assume they run the logic of the
> > controller from 12volts, and since every car has to
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

> Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2008 06:08:37 -0800
> From: [email protected]
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly
>
>
> I see Kelly requires a DC/DC converter for their controller but see no
> mention of that requirement for Alltrax. Is that correct? The DC/DC listed
> would add $100.00 to the cost of the Kelly, unless there is a cheaper one
> available. I was considering the Kelly KD48400, ($289)or maybe the KD7240=
0,
> ($389), for possible future upgrade to 72 volts. However I can get an
> Alltrax NPX 4844 for $290 new, even less used. I realize it's non
> programmable but I don't know if I really need that feature. Thoughts?

The only programmable feature I have found necessary is the throttle respon=
se curve. Everything else is usually just set to max anyway. It's fun to =
be able to able to see the realtime data, but a few good meters make this r=
edundant.

damon
_________________________________________________________________
Climb to the top of the charts!Play the word scramble challenge with sta=
r power.
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

They likely require only a small amount of current at 18-40 volts. For
example, my controllers require 18-30 volt supply for logic section and up
to 72V for the power section. For the logic section they require less than
100mA at 24V. You can have a simple 24V zener followed by a transistor
(with heat sink) and capacitor for a low current 24V supply - only costs a
few bucks to build. For 72V from the batteries and assuming 100mA current
you would have (72-24) * 0.1 = 5W on the transistor. You can easily heat
sink 5W.

Fran




> JRP3 wrote:
> >
> > The really confusing part, (for me at least), is they say the controller
> > requires an 18-40 volt supply, so I guess you couldn't even use your 12 DC
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

I don't see where you would need to ever use a DC to dc.. I don't see it on
my owners manual for my 72400.. I would be happy to send a copy of that
manually to any body that's would like to see it. Just get me your email
address
Mitchell 

-------Original Message------- 

From: JRP3 
Date: 02/10/08 11:24:40 
To: [email protected] 
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly 

The really confusing part, (for me at least), is they say the controller 
Requires an 18-40 volt supply, so I guess you couldn't even use your 12 DC 
Accessory converter? I'm building an off road 6 wheel ATV and I don't plan 
On using a DC/DC so it would be an unneeded expense in my situation. 




> M. Barkley wrote:
> >
> > I'm going to assume they run the logic of the
> > controller from 12volts, and since every car has to
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

Damon added:
> The only programmable feature I have found necessary is the throttle
response curve. Everything else is usually just set to max anyway. It's
fun to be able to able to see the realtime data, but a few good meters make
this redundant.

Another key programmable feature with the Alltrax is the Throttle Sensor
Type.
Since I'm using an EZ-GO Inductive Throttle Sensor on my boat, it was
essential to program the Alltrax.
By default, the controller is configured for a typical Throttle Pot, which
when connected to the Alltrax results in Full Throttle at zero command.
This was easily changed and the ITS worked fine with the Alltrax.

-Myles

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*

The issue of DC/DC is where a controller does not have
internal isolation and attaching the 12V from the aux battery
to a controller would mean that the battery pack gets 
connected to chassis of the car via the aux battery connection.
This creates a hazard - touching the pack should normally not
be fatal because it is fully isolated and contact from anywhere
in the pack to chassis should not cause a fireball.

That is why you need a DC/DC for an E-meter, for example.
The E-meter is directly connected to the pack, so it must
be isolated from the 12V aux battery and chassis.

Another method some people use is to run the controller
from a tap in their pack.
That causes unbalance in their pack, in the case of 100mA
into the controller, you are un-balancing your pack with
2.4 Ah each day. It will take only a few weeks to get a
dangerously out-of-balance pack, where the choice is to
always over-charge and end its life too soon or to have
it die from unbalance and reversed batteries....
There are ways to reduce the unbalance, but the only way
to avoid it is to use the full pack voltage.
One way to do this is a DC/DC, now not for isolation
but to get the right voltage (since there should be
no connection to the aux battery)
Just be VERY careful in wiring key switch and contactors,
because part of the low-voltage system is "HOT" connected
to the pack and part is not.....

Hope this clarifies,

Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mitch or Terri
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 11:19 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly

I don't see where you would need to ever use a DC to dc.. I don't see it on my owners manual for my 72400.. I would be happy to send a copy of that manually to any body that's would like to see it. Just get me your email address Mitchell 

-------Original Message------- 

From: JRP3
Date: 02/10/08 11:24:40
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly 

The really confusing part, (for me at least), is they say the controller Requires an 18-40 volt supply, so I guess you couldn't even use your 12 DC Accessory converter? I'm building an off road 6 wheel ATV and I don't plan On using a DC/DC so it would be an unneeded expense in my situation. 




> M. Barkley wrote:
> >
> > I'm going to assume they run the logic of the controller from 12volts,
> > and since every car has to have some sort of 12 volts for auxillary
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] Alltrax vs. Kelly*



> On 10 Feb 2008 at 8:22, JRP3 wrote:
> 
> > The really confusing part, (for me at least), is they say the controller
> > requires an 18-40 volt supply, so I guess you couldn't even use your 12 DC
> ...


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