# Planning Toyota Rav4 (ACA20R, short wheelbase) conversion



## AussieRav4 (Jul 16, 2012)

right, well after a little digging and googling and feedback given by PStechPaul [thank you] perhaps the idea of using the kelly hub motor in a AWD system configuration might not be a fully achievable idea. 

Brisbane can be a little hilly so having a bit of torque to get up some nasty hills would be a good idea and the best way i know of having more torque is to have a gear box. so unless anyone knows of a hub motor with a planetary gear box i might need to look at adapting the conversion by gdirwin to suit my car and local conditions.

perhaps its time to get technical and work out the best electric motor to buy and find/pay someone to make a mounting plate and adaptors for my Rav4. it will let me keep a mechanical reverse gear and potentially have enough grunt to get up hills. 

my only concern would be power supply and where to put the batteries given my limited space.


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## gdirwin (Apr 7, 2009)

Hi Matt:

Looking forward to seeing your build!

I loved the concept/idea of hub motors, but there was nothing available that could match the torque/reliability/cost of DC motors. If an AC motor/controller was available at a decent cost, that would be my first choice. DC motors were cheap and reliable, so were my only choice in 2009. The motors you showed were only 7kW (*4) - these seem to be very light for a relatively heavy vehicle. My 1000A Zilla and 46x200AH cells are a very nice match for the RAV - people say it "feels like a V6" with better acceleration than stock. With some battery sag, the battery power available is about 125kW under hard acceleration (this is about 170 HP, whereas stock RAV had 148 HP).

I kept AWD (keeping the transaxle,front diff,drive shaft, rear diff) - this was a big limitation on the size of motor that would fit.

If you can, consider placing many or all batteries underneath the car - low centre of gravity etc... (especially if you remove the driveshaft). I was not comfortable doing this as it was not clear if TS cells could be laid on their side. Perhaps pouch cells or A123 cells in a custom/flat compression enclosure?

The AWD RAV is not the most efficient platform, so count on higher power usage compared to most of the vehicles around - even factory cars (Leaf, Volt, IMief) are a lot smaller vehicles than a gen 2 (2001) RAV - the gen 3 RAVs are even bigger! The AWD does not help the overall efficiency, but it is great to have in winter!

You didn't mention what year of RAV you were going to convert - I wanted a 5 spd, which is not available in North America in gen 3 RAVs... If you have the budget, make sure you pick a car that you really like and want to drive - if you can find a nearly new car (with lots of gadgets/toys, leather etc...) with a blown motor, that would be ideal. Remember you will be spending a lot of time/money and will want to drive it for a long time.

Welcome, and keep posting - I would love to see your progress!


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## AussieRav4 (Jul 16, 2012)

Hi,
sorry its taken awhile for me to reply.
Ive not lost momentum, life has taken over.

my Rav4 is a 2000 model [late 2000] and its the first of the 2nd generation Rav4s. the big part of how my car differs from yours is that i have a 3 door version and it is a short wheel base. 

as i was thinking, hub motors would have let me have another place to put battery packs. 

My Rav4 is an auto transmission and through doing some reading on the site and around the net shows that an auto transmission might be a harder thing to convert. I want the AWD, while i dont know your definition of cold, it does get wet here and i like to have a safe AWD car. 

the car is fine and has the toys in it. stereo, GPS, air-con, ect and its a great car. its just trying to convert it. 

im a little jittery to look at the AWD-auto system i have. I have no idea on if an electric/auto gear box is able to be done. 

If i can workout if the transmission can use an electric motor then i will keep going on planning and sourcing parts. I will need to workout where to put the batteries as i have less space in my car than you have.

if i cant get positive answers on the auto thing i will put this project to bed and look at sourcing a new car to play with this dream.

play safe and happy motoring


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## gdirwin (Apr 7, 2009)

There is some great info on using automatics here:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forum...s-why-automatic-gearboxes-work-evs-29101.html

If you want to stick with cost effective DC motor controllers, the Zilla and Evnetics controllers are top notch. Soliton has build in idle function, whereas although Zilla does not have it built in, it can be added if the non-hepa pedal (ie traditional pot-box) is used (see recent discussion below):
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/can-you-idle-zilla-1k-78896.html

The advantage of automatic is that your power steering and A/C can be run off a tailshaft pulley - with 5 spd manuals, you have to add an electric power steering pump (A/C can still be run of a tail-shaft when stopped - just no A/C until you move). I went for a 5 spd because it is more robus (I think) and more efficient, possibly easier to convert...

With AWD, motor size/diameter is very limited, so try to take detailed measurements of the bell-housing and distance from the transmission shaft to the front differential/transaxle - on a 2001-2005 RAV, a 9" is the biggest possible (and that required grinding some of the motor housing!). Is it a model year 2001 (same as mine) or model year 2000 (which is a gen 1 RAV)? If your's (2000?) is the same as mine (2001), a 9" Netgain motor should fit... 

Looking forward to hearing more when/if you get going!


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## AussieRav4 (Jul 16, 2012)

Cheers,
I will be doing this on a long term project. I'm currently going back to university to retrain to get an education degree. as such im working on a limited budget. I wont do a half assed job and will do it correctly and above all i will make it safe so my car can be legally used on the roads here in Australia. 

It was my intent to borrow your conversion pretty heavily. Sooner or later i was wanting to ask if i can talk with you about your mounting plate and adaptors you made for your conversion so i could look at buying an elec motor and get the mounting plate made for it so it could bolt on. i would like to ask if you your agree to forwarding me the design you used so i could get all the mounting parts made locally here.

I know there is nothing simple about what i want to do but with my limited knowledge on cars im very quickly realising that i may be in over my head. i dont understand the required electrical systems in my car and i want to try and make as much of this conversion "plug and play" as i can. 

If i can talk with you in the long term it would be great. 

regards


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