# New battery design by Caterpillar



## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

Coley, seeing you make statments like this one without even knowing the info your taking about or ever even trying to check it out lets us all know how truly lacking in experiance you really are. Its like telling a person who has been to europe that its not there simply because you have never seen it or been there. -we need people on this forum that will do the research-not post lies and propaganda because they got their feelings hurt. I guess it bothers you to see free energy or more efficient motors? Nobody will take you seriously if you keep posting lies about technology you haven't even checked out.
Neogeogray


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## Coley (Jul 26, 2007)

But, I have checked them out.

Even patents can be gotten for inventions that don't work.

This is the last I'll say, until better proof comes along and then, not from you.....


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## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

Well thank goodness for that Coley.
Before anyone misunderstands due to this past post-let me explain the same thing the scientest explains in the DVD, books and online. When you invent something -then file the drawings in your patant, you NEVER explain or draw the working model. The pantant may stop any mfger but anyone and everyone else will copy it and that is also why Valone and all the others needed Grays motors to take apart as well as the power system in order to piece this technology together. (note grays main motor patant has expired) which is yet another reason to never show the complete working drawings in your patant---when it expires everyone will also have it. Another reason is that it alerts the powers that be--to your free energy discovery so they can do to you what they did to the late Edwin Gray. (Note Gray had been attacked and warned a year or so before they murdered him and afterward carried a gun and kept his drawings inside a locked briefcase-didn't help him however as they have the element of suprise as well as technologys we paid for but are not allowed to have or use.)--that too is on the dvd Coley. Again you must do the research to know these things--this is why I said PLEASE get the dvd and watch it before saying anything else. This reminds me of my dentest--I wanted all my mercury fillings removed and replaced with non-mercury (amalgum) (metal) fillings. Now only about 30% of the dental industry has seen the newest dvd documentaries on the truth about how mercury filling will keep outgassing mercury vapors for over 50 years. So approx 60% of these hard-headed dentests refuse to replace your amalgum fillings when you tell them why you want them replaced ---EVEN though it will make them money! I'm in a rural area with very few dentests in the area. I found one who has such little business that he has to go between two small towns at two different offices just to make it. Hes in my town on tuesdays and thursdays. I told him about how I would never speak before getting (researching) both sides of any topic. He agreed that he was the same way. Then I gave him the dvd on mercury fillings and told him I wanted all of mine replaced with new non-amalgums. He refused saying they did not outgas mercury vapors. I told him the CDC doc's as well as congressional hearings and fillings under a special microscope all were on this dvd and proved this behond any shadow of a doubt. He refused to agree and remove them! So I asked him--what about how you just said that you also get both sides of any topic before making a stand? He ignored me and kept refusing. He also refused to view the dvds. Now I hope everyone can better understand the many people who simply refuse to even look at free energy or more efficient energy! Its like a desease-their minds simply cannot accept things they have been programed to disbelieve.
Neogeogray


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## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

Note to all concerning new battery design-look in the EV News section on this forum and you will find this article- Inventer of new battery that charges itself --found murdered at airport in his car. I also have the article concerning the Japanese groups that have developed overunity magnet motors. (Overunity means free energy motor-Coley) Rather then try scaning it to email -if anyone wants it as well as a bunch of other info simply email me and I'll mail it to your address. I can also draw out the designs for ambient energy or water-to hydro if you like. I can also draw out the plans for the pulse motor. And if your looking for a better way to -more efficiently make electricty I can explain how to alter a generator for 99% efficiency. I remember always asking when I was younger--can't we just hook an electric motor to a generator and make more power then is required to run the motor that turns the generator? With this generator and a more efficient neo-motor the answer is now yes. To see these plans and read the theory see Mullers web site online. He has past away but his wife is keeping the site going so others can still discover free energy. And since they live in Canada there are fewer problems with letting this info out of the bag. I checked my dvd documentaries and all but one are copyrighted-the E V Gray motor dvd I have is not a copyrighted dvd so I can make a copy if anyone is intrested just email me directly. Gray made approx 4-6 of these electromagnitic motors and power supplys and they found two of them. They take one motor apart and go step by step on this dvd showing how it worked and explaining how it was Teslas circuit -"figured out" by Gray, and then later by these fellow inventors. When you view this you will understand how it is the real thing.
Neogeogray


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## Coley (Jul 26, 2007)

There are 3 of us, locally, that have electric vehicles. We are only 80 miles from Peoria, so one of us sent an inquiry, as to whether any small test vehicles would be utilized and if so, could we be included on the list.

We could supply test data, on real day to day driving, in all sorts of weather.

So far nothing back on that.


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## BHall (Aug 1, 2007)

Well, from what I have read (and there is a bit to read, if you dig) regarding the new batteries from Caterpillar/firefly I am very interested. http://www.fireflyenergy.com/ I will definitely be watching these when they come out. I actually don't know why this new battery and its technology is not being more discussed in the EV world. I mean why reinvent the wheel, why not improve upon a solid platform (which is what they are doing). 

Brian


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## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

The article on bettery inventor doesn't say much other then the battery used special plates that caused energy to be developed within the battery for free. I have a dvd on a metal made that develops hydrogen automatically without the need for electricty. The inventor was trying to develop a type of alum -weld that would weld aluminium perfectly. He developed that and more-you can purchase this online or at county fairs as the powers that be will not allow him to use tv or mainstream news. This is why H & A industries is only allowed to run ads in the back of magazines. There is a control grid in place. Meyer was able to get his hydrogen car on local tv news but they did not allow that to go to their syndicated affiliates. (Mainstream USA) He was also murdered later. Ron Paul is running for president and wins in most straw polls -but how many people on this forum have even heard of him? Its because theres a media blackout on him by the powers that be. This is why Leno let him come on his show. Leno has my respect for doing this as Ron Paul wants to un-do everything they have done and give us back our constution and possie-comataudis as well as get the forign troops off our bases and ports. IE the Chinese military own and run the port of long beach, the Russians military own and run the procedo at the so end of the golden gate (Iv'e been there and seen it) and approx 35 other so-called closed bases inlind are not really closed-Clinton sold them to various forign powers under the guise of UN practice games. Korean vets are at these gates picketing and hoping the news will pick this up-but its controlled so we will not know whats really going on.
Regan went against the powers that be and they tried to have him killed but the shooter messed up. Remember Regans 55 mph speed limit nation wide? well that cost the oil companies and Gov billions in lost income. Remember how he tried to pass a balanced budget amendment so we would never see another depression like whats comming now? and Congress outvoted his bill something like 6 times before he gave up? Well now were about to see why the powers that be didn't want a balanced budget law. In alternate medai they claim that later the powers that be put retro-virus type things in his food and caused his early symptoms of alshimers and early death. Something else they will not tell anyone-madd cow beef causes the SAME effects as alshimers and they only way to know if you died from madd cow rather then the other is to open the head and look at the brain. The report I read said that there could be more people dying of madd cow then alshimers in the USA.
Neogeogray


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## BHall (Aug 1, 2007)

Not trying to be a wank or anything but what does all this have to do with the new battery from Caterpillar? It's all very interesting information. Heck I would even say it would make excellent undertoned political story lines for Boston Legal but lets hear some more info on the new Firefly Oasis! They make it sound like the greatest thing since sliced bread and it may be. 

I see that they posted the spec sheet on their website:
Specification Summary
BCI Group Size: Group 31
Nominal OC Voltage: 12V
Deep-Cycling Capability: Yes
Reserve Capacity: 215 min @25A
CCA: 650 amperes
CA: 800 amperes
Internal Resistance (Ohms): 0.0008
Length: 13.46 (341.88)
Width: 6.77 (171.96)
Height: 9.20 (233.68)
Weight: 70.4 (32.0)
Terminal Type:Internal Thread

How does this translate to the 20hr rating that we all have come to know and love?

Brian


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## Coley (Jul 26, 2007)

It looks good enough to me to want to try a set.

I still haven't connected with the Interstate driver to see if they really have rebuilt deep cycle batteries either.

As far as the other above reply..........YAWN


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## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

Bhall, well lets see how it pertains--Article on Inventor of a new battery, also may have been murdered by the power control grid, yes
Then theres Control grid mentioned because are real and to show the reality every seems to want to ignor-they had all of GMs EV1's crushed DAH! yes
and last part--Regan tried to fight this grid and look what happened to him-also pertains to topic, yes
No offence Bhall --but did you get low grades in school-englich-lit class?
I am wondering however why you are all playing in the same worn out topics? We already know about what batteries are out there and how their performance varies not to mention tha fact that they will be years away in most cases before production-and even if they aren't then the cost is usally so high very few can afford them and even if you could-wheres the payback-for converting from gas if the batteries cost you 6-15 thousands dollars! And don't say that outragious -as I looked at the cost of the Tesla Lith's WOW$$$
I'm looking at several other types of energy that are here NOW and cost less then a few hundred and will do far more then a set of newly design liths or other batteries already knowen of will. And for posting somethings that are new this is what I get? If thats not for you -fine but theres no need to be rude. Both you and Coley are not being true to this forum. We are here to offer info and help to each other and all members and yet all you two want to do is talk down to another member and put up posts that knock what he or she says. Was that in the member regs when we joined up? 
If you don't have something to add to the info or if you cannot be nice then you have no business posting. I have answered back to Coleys smart comments with no anger and tryed to help. I also did not swear at him like he is now doing to me. I have only been a member for approx 1 month and you two are doing everything to run me off this forum you can--is that what this forum is about?
Neogeogray


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## Coley (Jul 26, 2007)

Calm down young man, your frustration level is affecting your spelling and punctuation, as well as your sentence structure.

No one is swearing at you, just your fervent desire to change us all.

The members on this forum are better educated than you and I, so they sit back and listen to us. 

Everything seems to be a conspiracy to you.
I hope you grow out of that.

Good luck in changing the world.......

Quote:
"they had all of GMs EV1's crushed DAH! yes"

Wrong again.....one is still with us......


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## neogeogray (Jan 5, 2008)

Just a note to all visiting this site as well as all the silent members afraid to speak over the few who stand together on their rule of who they allow to do the most posting on this forum-The few you see posting stupid remarks and controlling the forum are the reason this forum will never do anything more then stop new ideas. 
I joined at the advise of a member who thought I could get both good advise for my Geo conversion and give new ideas and heres the result-whats even sadder is the person running this forum is allowing this. All I see on this forum is people using old technology from 50 years ago. Your motors are either 8 or 9 inch using simi-OLD technology as well as many still using aircraft gen. Nothing new here as none of the cars I viewed (and I looked at them all) can go over 80 miles on a charge--thats no threat to the powers that be. (And yes I know about the drag EVs but thats not something that would get you 300 mile distance or last for years would it. They are overdriving those motors as well as spending hugh amounts of money.) The controllers are all of the same design basically and do not offer true pulse or surge technology. The batteries are all the same group to chose from with nobody even trying to cross the 100 or 200 mile distance areas. Any talk of Lith batteries is the equiv to propraganda-as the powers that be control when -if ever they will be "Allowed" to be mfg. and any used such as the milw drill batters would cost you thousands to install making it cheaper to run a ICE. And when someone brings up new ideas like the idea of running batteries for longer distance using a trailer or the neo-motors like the PERM-132 or others the only responces are negitive. Basically every car on this forum is built of the same group of antiquated motor, controller and battery technologies--only each person users a different combonation of them. And if there is someone out there that did the -new tech ideas like I'm doing to attempt better EV design and specs-hes afraid to even speak up-and now all can see why.-just look at these sad posts from these few who chose to control the members and downtrodden any and all new ideas. And I wonder what this group of posting controllers real reasoning is? How many of them own shares in their local power co's? since the cars being built on this forum cannot go over 80 mph and in 50% of all cases cannot go over 35 mph and the ones that do go over 35 use up all of their energy from the old style batteries-as well as none being able to break the 100 mile distance area -let alone 200 or 300 then what threat are they to the local power companys shareholders? No offence to all of the good -but silent members but -shame on you for allowing these tools to do this to your forum. And thats not even including the fact that they are running off members as well as stopping new ones from joining when they read these posts they put up. I looked at the www.keelynet.com site today and the Government has put up 50-80 scrill sites under the web address keeleynet.com keeleynet.com keeley-net.com and every combo available and on these sites they post false info as well as items not even pretaining to energy so nobody will find the real keelynet site and get the truth--and look at more- They have also spent the last 5 years or longer doing corperate take-overs of your companies as well as forcing and taking over search engines in order to further control the free truth info on the web. In many contries they have shut down the enternet and re-started whats called enternet II -which is 100% controlled. In congress they are attempting to bring back the bill which stops all church teaching as well as any radio or internet truth sites such as Radio Liberty or infowars.com or hundreds others in the name of fair transmitting. and all of you sheeple sit back and not only do nothing-but say nothing? it makes me sad to call myself an american. The one comment made by two of these post controllers on your forum was--well I guess we'll have to just wait until they come out with this technology at the local wall-mart or K-Mart well its sitting on your duff and not doing it yourself that causes this problem. Other then slowing a little gas sales -building EVs that can only go 40 milesa on a charge and 50 mph avg top speed is not going to save anything or cause the country to turn around and buy EVs everywhere. Its technology like the EV-1 and PMG-132 and Grays ambient energy power systems and pulsed hyrdo/-run car on water systems that will however.
I would stay if this site was worthy of new ideas and the sheeple were not afraid to speak up? but as you can see they are still afraid. 
Neogeogray


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## MitchJi (Dec 14, 2007)

Hi,

http://www.calcars.org has looked at a lot of batteries in an attempt to find better batteries for their DIY Plug-in Hybrid conversions. They had discussions with Firefly (even signed an NDA). A couple of years ago they had these figures on their web site (current specs could be different):
lbs per kWh
PbA (current) 138 lbs per kWh
NiMH worst 40 lbs per kWh 
NiMH best 40 lbs per kWh
Li-ion worst 40 lbs per kWh 
Li-ion best 24 lbs per kWh
Toshiba Li-ion 44 lbs per kWh 
Firefly worst 61 lbs per kWh
Firefly best 49 lbs per kWh

Cost usablekWh
PbA (current) $380
NiMH worst $1,200
NiMH best $800
Li-ion worst $1,200
Li-ion best $800
Firefly worst $350
Firefly best $250

Cycle life
PbA (current) 400
NiMH worst 2000
NiMH best 4000
Li-ion worst 1000
Li-ion best 4000
Firefly worst 1000
Firefly best 4000

Cents EV-mi
PbA (current) 20.0
NiMH worst 12.6
NiMH best 4.2
Li-ion worst 25.2
Li-ion best 4.2 
Firefly worst 7.4
Firefly best 1.3

Check the cost per usable kWh, the cycle life and projected cost per EV mile!

Notes: 
1. These figures (including "current" for PbA are a couple of years old).
2. I added the Toshiba Li-Ion based on published figures.
3. Firefly 3D2 (squared is supposed to weigh 35% less per kWh). The Oasis will not be 3D2.

There is also some interest here:
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/0...up-31-batteries-getting-some-ev-fans-excited/

Mitch


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## BHall (Aug 1, 2007)

neogeoconspiracytheorygray.... I mean, neogeogray, you must have floaters in your eyes because what you are reading and translating are completely misconstrued. I now realize that I accidentally got in between a little cranial battle between you and Coley. However, I have observed no evidence of anybody swearing at you. What exactly did I say that prompted your personal attack? 

As you very well know, this is a rather new forum. But I have a news flash for ya, the people on this forum are most likely not new to internet forum discussion! You obviously feel you are far superior; attempting to sound intellectual rambling about things that somehow in a very minuscule way pertain to the actual topic. I mean come on, what does your dentist really have to do with EV batteries, the topic of this thread? Heck, my mail man folds all of my magazines crisply in half and it really aggravates me. I could definitely find some way to blame that on the "powers that be" but I don't. 

You mention that most of the conversions by people on here are done by using 50 year old technology. Well, people like me have to start somewhere. However, If you could point me in the direction of the 1950 version Zilla controller it may be helpful....NOT! This is a *DIY* site. Most here don't have the funding nor the time to create some perpetual motion machine. Oh, and by the way talk to Mr. Sharkey about the ingenious battery trailer idea.

You are the one not being true to this forum. All you see is the political conspiracy theory about EV's. Once again this is a DIY site. Discussion should be about information regarding EV conversions. Your conspiracy theory mentality is one of the reasons real progress is not made in th EV world. I truly do hope you stick around. You may come to realize that the world is not always against you. 

As entertaining as your replies have been, this thread has absolutely gone nowhere and I would like to ask the moderators to close or lock it. But not after neo's reply. I need another good laugh.

Brian


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