# 2017 Chevy Bolt EV arrives in late 2016 with 200-mile range



## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

PhantomPholly said:


> *
> Uglier than the Leaf, but better range.*


*
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder !
I prefer the Bolt, ..it's very similar to the Honda Jazz ?
And technically it is much better than the Nissan.*


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## Caps18 (Jun 8, 2008)

I figured that GM was going to make this vehicle back in 2009 and stop Tesla from gaining a following. 

It is pretty nice, and I really like the interior, but I will have to see one in person to really judge it.


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

60 kWh battery such small... I want one! A battery, not the Bolt


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## palmer_md (Jul 22, 2011)

It's not particularly small in my view.










See more in this article.

http://www.hybridcars.com/chevy-bolt-evs-battery-is-as-big-as-a-teslas/

The title is telling "its as big as Tesla's".


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

I have changed my mind !
It's not just a better looking car than the Leaf, ...it's the best looking EV to date ! ( though I do have a soft spot for the Focus EV )
Strange marketing argument for wanting to call it a "Crossover" , rather than a "Hatchback" 
..And I never want to hear anyone say EVs are less complicated, with less components, than a similar ICE....


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## PhantomPholly (Aug 20, 2008)

Karter2 said:


> I have changed my mind !
> It's not just a better looking car than the Leaf, ...it's the best looking EV to date ! ( though I do have a soft spot for the Focus EV )
> Strange marketing argument for wanting to call it a "Crossover" , rather than a "Hatchback"
> ..And I never want to hear anyone say EVs are less complicated, with less components, than a similar ICE....


Apart from the sheer number of battery cells making up the pack, why would you think an EV is as complicated as ICE?

Battery / Controller / Motor are far simpler; everything else is the same or simply not needed (e.g. radiator, catalytic converter, etc.).


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

palmer_md said:


> It's not particularly small in my view.


960 lbs for a 60kWh battery. That's 137Wh/kg. That's decent but not spectacular for a completed pack.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

PhantomPholly said:


> Apart from the sheer number of battery cells making up the pack, why would you think an EV is as complicated as ICE?
> 
> Battery / Controller / Motor are far simpler; everything else is the same or simply not needed (e.g. radiator, catalytic converter, etc.).


Just look at the picture !
Battery ?...not required on ICE,..or at least tiny in comparison.
Controller/inverter..not on an ICE
Motor ?, EV is smaller, less moving wear parts for sure, but technically just as complex and expensive to produce.
Most EVs seem to need complex battery/motor cooling systems
ICE may have a cat, but it doesn't have an on board charger, BMS, high voltage protection systems , etc
All up ....not much to choose in componentry/complexity, but I am pretty sure which is likely to be the simplest to repair if there is a component failure.
And again, just look at the picture. &#55357;&#56881;



Hollie Maea said:


> 960 lbs for a 60kWh battery. That's 137Wh/kg. That's decent but not spectacular for a completed pack.


That may not be spectacular, but the $147/kWhr that they cost GM is impressive and encouraging for future cell costs.


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

Karter2 said:


> Motor ?, EV is smaller, less moving wear parts for sure, but technically just as complex and expensive to produce.


I don't think I agree with that...


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

Karter2 said:


> but the $147/kWhr that they cost GM is impressive


Yeah, that part is spectacular. Only Tesla comes close to that, as far as I know.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Hollie Maea said:


> I don't think I agree with that...


Why not ?
ICE design/manufacture is a well refined industry that is done by thousands of producers world wide with incredible consistency producing millions of reliable products that have amazing reliability....at very low cost.
ICE's are not complex ( rotary ICE have only 3 moving parts !), but even piston engines outlast the cars they are installed into.
The "complexities" are the ancillaries , ECU's , FUel inj , monitoring systems, etc, but most of those are mature tech that lasts with the motors.
Electric motors for EV use, in contrast , seem to be a evolving breed, with new designs and manufacturing processes emerging with each new EV.
Operating Voltage, control tech, rpm range, etc. etc ..all seem to be different.
Few, if any , have a significant history to asess reliability or life span.
And at the production rates of current EV' s they cannot be cheap to produce ?


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## ken will (Dec 19, 2009)

Karter2 said:


> less moving wear parts for sure, but technically just as complex


Have you ever rebuilt an engine or a carburetor?
adjusted the valves? set the timing? changed the idle speed?

Any new technology can seem complicated until you start to understand it.


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## Windydrew (Dec 18, 2015)

ken will said:


> Have you ever rebuilt an engine or a carburetor?
> adjusted the valves? set the timing? changed the idle speed?
> 
> Any new technology can seem complicated until you start to understand it.


I agree, the modern ice is way more complex than an ev motor. One example is my mini sprint car. Technically, all I need to run the car is a battery pack, an ac motor controller, and an ac motor. Everything else is either to run the modern car electronics (which both ice and ev have in common), or make the vehicle simpler (dc to dc converter to maintain 12v system and battery).


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

ken will said:


> Have you ever rebuilt an engine or a carburetor?
> adjusted the valves? set the timing? changed the idle speed?


Yes ken, many times.
...but only on vehicles that were well past normal use...20+ yrs old !
I have had many ( well over 20 personal/family). cars in the past 30 years ..none with a carb incidentally !....and not one of them has had a mechanical engine issue ! 
The last engine I worked on (1990 Ford had seized after its young driver drove 100km with no coolant ! 
A new head gasket, oil, etc and scrape the rust out of the cylinders....and it's been running again for the last 2 years ! 
No carb to adjust, no tappets to set, no valve lapping !
Most of them hardly ever needed more than basic servicing ( oil & filters)
The most common issues have been electrical failures. Particularly batteries , lights, electrical controls etc .
I haven't seen an engine since a 1980's mini (1930's engine design !). That you could adjust the tappets on....or even needed to !
So , as I said, yes ICE piston engines have more components, but that does not mean they are unreliable or complex for the owner to maintain. !


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## bwjunkie (Jul 31, 2013)

That is a MASSIVE battery, I don't like it. Of course I'm stuck with a '65 diy, but if I were to buy new, I'd shy away from a battery I'll rarely use more than 40% of. Hybrid still rings true.

josh


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## dladd (Jun 1, 2011)

This will most likely be my next car. I'm currently one year into a three year lease on my Spark EV, and it flat out rocks. It's every thing I tried to build in my Saturn, but actually works right, lol. I've got a 2 mile commute right now, so range isn't really a factor. But there are times I'm heading to the edge of Sparky's range and jump in the E350 (Ford, not Mercedes) just to be safe. More range wouldn't hurt, though I assume I'd give up a little daily efficiency (I can pretty easily get 5+ mi/kWh in decent weather with no climate control on) to get the extra range I hardly ever need.

And I think the Bolt looks good. But then again, I currently drive a light blue Spark so... 

anyway, I've still got 2 years on Sparky so I don't have to decide any time soon. Lots can change in that time!


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