# Red's Electric Motorcycle



## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Hello everyone,
I am in the planning/design stages of an electric motorcycle build and about a month till the donor is mine so I decided it was a good time to get some guru input. 

Intent: Performance Street/Race Build. As much performance as I can get @ 30–50mi per charge.

Donor: 2003 Kawasaki ZX-6R This is my donor because it’s free! But it has upgraded to ohlins forks and suspension so it works out except I have to plan a brake upgrade.

Motor: DLC-28 PMAC, [email protected] with a 6500rpm cap. I can run it safely at 120vdc-132vdc, it’s got one of the best pwr/wht ratios for the price range, and its liquid cooled PMAC for when I start doing dumb things.

Controller: Sevcon Gen 4 Size 6 or Soliton Jr maybe? All the bigger stuff seems like overkill. Comments? Suggestions?

Cooling: Admittedly, I haven’t done as much research on this as I probably should have. For now I’m going to keep the radiator in its original place, but I’d like to find a thinner/lighter one and utilize more of the body “mouth” (and maybe some type heatsink/intercooler for an electronics chilling plate). After that it comes down to plumbing, connectors, and a few 30 GPH+ pumps. Thanks Amazon.com!

Gears/Chain: I assume some online place that can make custom 1000cc+ strength sprocket/chain kits. But truthfully I don’t know much about torque vs chain strength or what sprocket sizes I’ll need. But it looks like I’ll need at least a 13 or 14 tooth to clear the swingarm. And my crappy google calc says a 1:3 ratio gets me around 185kph at 80% motor rpm so that’s my starting point..

Batteries: A123 Prismatic pouches (google “AMP20M1HD-A”) for the density/volume. I’m thinking either 38s (121.6vdc) or 41s (131.2vdc). I think I can squeeze about 150 cells (or more) in but I have to figure out the rest of the components first.

BMS: No clue! I probably should with the size of the investment.. Please help!

Suspension/Wheels/Tires: Stock for the foreseeable future.

Charger: Um, later..

Miscellaneous: Not really sure about contactors, converters, and fuses. Seems to be only a few everyone uses and less that will work for this type build..

So um yeah.. Plus I still have to name it!


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

The Soliton is a DC controller for a series wound or PM motor, so unfortunately you're pretty much stuck with Sevcon. I wouldn't bother with any other controller, as these controllers must be (sometimes painstakenly) tuned to the motor they drive. 

The DLC-28 is a good motor/controller combo. Usually the controller seller should include a contactor that works with it. I like the LEV200 contactors for Sevcon and Curtis applications. A little more than normal, but sealed and a good fit for motorcycles.

1:3 ratio is a bit too low IMHO. Something 1:4 t0 1:5 or so is a better choice for this motor. If its too low, you'll suck amps for low RPM/road speed and it will kill acceleration and range.

Good size chassis, you'll need 5-6kwh of energy onboard to get a good performing bike with ~30-50mi range.

Where are you getting Genuin A123 pouch cells? Be very careful, some are knockoffs, some haf cut tabs. Pouch cells take a lot of work to get them all hooked up, so just be aware. Alternatives that will work well are CALB cells, something like 100Ah or so.

Two names that I've worked with for BMS are Elithion and Orion. The first is distributed (one board on each cell-group) and the latter is a central BMS (one wire to each cell from a centrail unit). Both are nice setups and have similar parameters and programmability and options.

Check out elmoto.net too, all motorcycle guys.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Thanks for the info!



> 1:3 ratio is a bit too low IMHO. Something 1:4 to 1:5 or so is a better choice for this motor. If its too low, you'll suck amps for low RPM/road speed and it will kill acceleration and range.


If I put the motor motor directly in-fornt of the the swing arm, and need almost a 3" gear to clear it, the rear sprocket is huge! How are you guys overcoming this? I assume most move the motor and use a gear between the two (like a belt belt type torque converter)?



> Where are you getting Genuine A123 pouch cells? Be very careful, some are knockoffs, some haf cut tabs. Pouch cells take a lot of work to get them all hooked up, so just be aware. Alternatives that will work well are CALB cells, something like 100Ah or so.


Wow, lots of knockoffs.. Any ideas on sourcing these cells?


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Redshirt said:


> Thanks for the info!
> 
> 
> 
> If I put the motor motor directly in-fornt of the the swing arm, and need almost a 3" gear to clear it, the rear sprocket is huge! How are you guys overcoming this? I assume most move the motor and use a gear between the two (like a belt belt type torque converter)?


Most I've seen use just a sprocket on the motor, long chain and a large rear sprocket. It's not actually that bad, just make sure it clears the swingarm. I used 530 chain because its easy to find a front sprocket for (ANSI #50 sprocket from surpluscenter.com). Sprocketspecialists.com has rear sprockets.

Here's mine, showing front and rear sprockets:
http://www.evfr.net/coppermine/albums/5-14-11/normal_Picture_007.jpg
http://www.evfr.net/coppermine/albums/7-18-10/normal_Picture_013.jpg
http://www.evfr.net/coppermine/albums/5-14-11/normal_Picture_006.jpg






Redshirt said:


> Wow, lots of knockoffs.. Any ideas on sourcing these cells?


Take your time and get those when you're ready to pull the trigger. Getting the motor installed and building a mount for it will take some time. Right now CALB cells are pretty easy and cheap to source. A123 can be risky because of knockoffs or unknown cell conditions. Right now there are some other cells floating around for the Volt and Leaf that might work. GBS are also good batteries (also resell those).


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

> Most I've seen use just a sprocket on the motor, long chain and a large rear sprocket. It's not actually that bad, just make sure it clears the swingarm.


I see what ya mean.. thx!

Here's a little digital eye candy for ya..


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Nice! Looks like a fun project.

Did you see my Private message?


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

Your heading straight for something like my 2011 race bike only a bit heavier. You will have over 220kg especially if you put a charger on board.
You might get 150kmh top but its going to be very sluggish off the mark with the 3:1 chain.
This type of power to weight ratio should be at least a 2 speed.
This type of bike is very difficult to get right because the rear linkage suspension is right in the prime motor real estate.
Just keep thinking for a while before you start spending money.
For a street fighter you will want better accel off the mark than this.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Thanks for all the info guys! I really like to wrap my head around a project before I start (hence building everything in 3D) so I'll be listening, researching, and evolving right till go!

I changed the ratio to 1:4.5 in that screenshot for ball-parking, gotta figure out if I need to be closer to 1:4 or 1:5. New swing arm (with a thinner support OD). And different motor locations.. awesome!

If anyone has any suggestions, I'm still open to other motor/controllers but this was one of the best configs I could find for the power to weight ratio that was around 2k. Anyone know how much voltage I can put through this motor?


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

Redshirt said:


> I changed the ratio to 1:4.5


1:4 is an overdrive.
4:1 is a reduction. Its read in the direction of power travel.

For a broad rev range you will need the highest battery voltage you can find. Sevcon wont do this, 150v max and very expensive config setup. Not even sure if the size 6 is available.
Kelly will do 52 series LiFePO4 174v 400A
http://kellycontroller.com/khb1440124-144v400aopto-bldc-controllerwith-regen-p-832.html

I have been thinking about 2 speed twin motors lately where you have 2 motors 2 controllers and 2 throttles.
One motor is geared very short for first gear like 10:1 and is chained through a one way clutch so it can throttle off without turning
the other is 3:1 for second gear, no clutch so it can do regen.

As the ZX6 swingarm is very simple you could go mad and mount both motors on the swingarm first getting rid of the single shock and linkage and replacing it with twin shocks later on.


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## Tomaj (Oct 3, 2011)

Kelly does not work with this motor. It also has very annoying current liming at low speed. So you can forget fast starts and quick acceleration from tight corners.

Take Sevcon Gen4 size 6 116V or Size 4 150V controller. 
Check this site http://www.evdrive.com/products/evd-motor-controller/
or perhaps contact Electric motorsport or Motenergy, you will find something for your pocket.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

The EVDrive packages are great little packages. They put 4 in a UTV with some high power batteries and it tore the trails up! They're already tuned and will not need extra programming unless you want to change current limits, RPM, or other simple parameters.

EVDrive is the only one that has a 150V Sevcon to go with that motor that I know of.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Sorry if this is a noob question but it's giving me a headache..
In a direct drive system (sprocket on motor, sprocket on wheel, chain/belt connecting the two) does the sprocket ratio effect the vehicles top speed?
If the top speed is simplified as a product of motor rpm (at voltage) vs tire diameter/perimeter then wouldn't the sprocket ratio effect the torque (how fast you can achieve a speed) not the limit of speed?


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Ratios can effect top speed.

If you have too high of a ratio, the motor max RPM is essentially your max wheel RPM.

If you have too low of a ratio, the motor won't be in the "high power" part of its power curve.... and might not have enough power at that point to overcome aerodynamic friction.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

"Someone" just said "so your building your own Zero SR?"..
Is he right? http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/zero-s/specs.php?model=sr
What motor are those guys using?


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

I would love to find something closer to the 60kw-75kw range but most are either 100+ lbs, over 200v, or over ~4k usd.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

That's a tall order.... and in single quantities, not likely going to happen for you.

The higher power you see, almost always the voltages are higher..... and so is weight.... and for that kind of power, you're looking at over $4k.

You want something cheap AND low voltage AND high power..... nothing on the market that I can think of, not under $4k.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Yeap, the goal is always just past what ya can have! Or should I just say "Stay hungry". 

Ok then, what would happen if I made the motor longer?

Let’s assume that I machine a new housing that is a perfect fit compared to the original, but is 50% longer (and I have magnets to fit and don’t mind winding the new motor).
What happens to the voltage limits, amperage limits, ect of the motor?
I assume the voltage limits would stay the same (well, change slightly) and the amperage limits would increase by 50%?


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> You want something cheap AND low voltage AND high power..... nothing on the market that I can think of, not under $4k.


Well, I don't mind going over 4k it it's worth it but not over 7k.
Problem being, at a 6k+ price point I would rethink the whole bike design..


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Well, what have you found thus far? I think the DLC28 is a pretty good match for you, and about the highest output for that voltage level (under 200volts) in a brushless package.

Just wondering, Why do you need that high power? Is it just because bigger is better? I find that a lot of new guys think they need a huge amount of HP/kW ability..... but it isn't always true.

Remember, the Torque on these motors is huge. It could be that you're thinking you want great acceleration, which is related more to torque. HP is determined by RPM and Torque, so its possible that with the right gearing, you get the acceleration you need, but are limited to a certain top speed because of the HP of the motor. 

Also, you'd need to build a 60-75kW able battery pack. At 150V, that's 400-500A. Yes, that is peak, but something to consider.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> Well, what have you found thus far? I think the DLC28 is a pretty good match for you, and about the highest output for that voltage level (under 200volts) in a brushless package.


Yeah, I kinda like the EVD35..
Reputable company, comes programmed and tested, and the price is still less than "most" places. I got a few more things to decide then I'm going to give them a call about production times.



frodus said:


> Just wondering, Why do you need that high power? Is it just because bigger is better? I find that a lot of new guys think they need a huge amount of HP/kW ability..... but it isn't always true.


Simply put? I'm looking down the barrel of a $10k+ build and want as much bang for my buck as I can get. Keep in mind, this will be used primarily for "street fighting"..



frodus said:


> Also, you'd need to build a 60-75kW able battery pack. At 150V, that's 400-500A. Yes, that is peak, but something to consider.


Currently the pack design is 8k-10k @ ~132vdc w/ 10c pouches. I'm leaning towards the 8k side w/ a cap of 330amps (which should land me at a 30sec/6.5c cap)


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Tomaj said:


> ... It also has very annoying current liming at low speed. So you can forget fast starts and quick acceleration from tight corners.


Hey Tomaj, are you talking about the Kelly controller or the evd35 motor?


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Redshirt said:


> Yeah, I kinda like the EVD35..
> Reputable company, comes programmed and tested, and the price is still less than "most" places. I got a few more things to decide then I'm going to give them a call about production times.


Yes they are a good company. They're right down the road and I work with them a bunch. One of the owners is a good friend of mine.. Email me.... I'm one of their resellers for this package. 






Redshirt said:


> Simply put? I'm looking down the barrel of a $10k+ build and want as much bang for my buck as I can get. Keep in mind, this will be used primarily for "street fighting"..


You should be fine. I think torque is going to be the important thing here. 






Redshirt said:


> Currently the pack design is 8k-10k @ ~132vdc w/ 10c pouches. I'm leaning towards the 8k side w/ a cap of 330amps (which should land me at a 30sec/6.5c cap)


You don't say what Ah batteries you're looking at, and how they're configured (parallel and series). I'll assume that you're looking at maybe 60Ah and 20-cells in series to get ~8kwh of battery. With 330A max battery side, and 132Vnominal, you're going to sag a little bit, especially with 60Ah. That would be right around 5.5C. Lets say 20% sag, so 105.6V @330A peak, which is right around 34.85kW or ~46.74 hp.

Now, the motor is ~0.30Nm per Amp. Battery side is 330A, max of the controller can be different, but lets say you set to the same, or ~330A. That 330A is ~100Nm is 73.75 Foot-lbs. Couple that with a 5:1 ratio, you've got 368.75ftlbs of torque at the rear axle.


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## sumfoo1 (Mar 16, 2010)

that evd70lv looks like it could be nasty!

what power would you say you need to hit 80-100?
in a single speed
50hp? less?


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

sumfoo1 said:


> that evd70lv looks like it could be nasty!


Yea, I thought about that too..
It's a min of 5 units at ~7.5kea. Nice pkg thou, custom machined housing & core\shaft, 2x power @ < 2x length and weight..


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## sumfoo1 (Mar 16, 2010)

Redshirt said:


> Yea, I thought about that too..
> It's a min of 5 units at ~7.5kea. Nice pkg thou, custom machined housing & core\shaft, 2x power @ < 2x length and weight..


Damn... I really want the re my motor but can't find a setup under 10k


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Email me, I know where a matched set of Remy and Rinehart is. They're just the core of the motor... So you'd have to build an enclosure and oil cool it.


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## Elanimal28 (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> Most I've seen use just a sprocket on the motor, long chain and a large rear sprocket. It's not actually that bad, just make sure it clears the swingarm. I used 530 chain because its easy to find a front sprocket for (ANSI #50 sprocket from surpluscenter.com). Sprocketspecialists.com has rear sprockets.
> 
> Here's mine, showing front and rear sprockets:
> http://www.evfr.net/coppermine/albums/5-14-11/normal_Picture_007.jpg
> ...


Do you know witch sprocket # correspond to a 520 chain? I ordered #50 sprocket from them but it doesn’t fit my chain because t the chain and rear sprocket are 520.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

nothing ANSI fits 520 chain. 

You'll need to go to 530 chain to match up with something ANSI, and its going to match #50 ANSI.

530 chain and an ANSI#50 sprocket is the easiest to find.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Hello all, I'm back!
Moved and took some time to get the "shop" in order.
Almost bike building time!


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## Elanimal28 (Nov 18, 2013)

Redshirt said:


> Hello all, I'm back!
> Moved and took some time to get the "shop" in order.
> Almost bike building time!


Good. Remember a pic is worth 1K words, so take a lot of them.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> Most I've seen use just a sprocket on the motor, long chain and a large rear sprocket. It's not actually that bad, just make sure it clears the swingarm. I used 530 chain because its easy to find a front sprocket for (ANSI #50 sprocket from surpluscenter.com). Sprocketspecialists.com has rear sprockets.
> 
> Here's mine, showing front and rear sprockets:
> http://www.evfr.net/coppermine/albums/5-14-11/normal_Picture_006.jpg
> ...


Hey, Frodus

What size sprockets are you using in those photos (006 & 007)? Or sprocketspecialists.com part numbers/drawings..

Are you planning to connect those two motor plates in photo (013) or use frame & motor rigidity?


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

It's a 60-tooth, aluminum sprocket from Sprocketspecialists. Look up your motorcycle, as the bolt-hole and alignment depend on model of bike. I looked up my 1986 Honda VFR700F and chose a 60-tooth with Titan tough anodizing. 

http://sprocketspecialists.com/prod...cycle-sprocket-yrs-1987-sku-446-large-56-74t/

I gave up the project and bought a Brammo Empulse R, outlined in my blog: http://www.evfr.net/blog/

The plan was to incorporate the rear part of the frame, under the motor and above it to the front frame arms by using the battery enclosure. I didn't plan on supporting the motor plates, as they were solidly mounted to the rear part of the frame.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> It's a 60-tooth, aluminum sprocket from Sprocketspecialists. Look up your motorcycle, as the bolt-hole and alignment depend on model of bike. I looked up my 1986 Honda VFR700F and chose a 60-tooth with Titan tough anodizing.
> 
> http://sprocketspecialists.com/prod...cycle-sprocket-yrs-1987-sku-446-large-56-74t/


Nice. Yeah, it's dependent on wheel bolt pattern, was just wondering what you choose.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Sprocket specialists have a HUGE library of sprockets, so if you don't see it on the site, maybe give them a call. They're super helpful and I was really impressed with the quality of the sprocket.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

And next for the battery pack and BMS, pack first.

Still looking for higher densities (by pack volume) so pouches seem to be the answer.
Enerdel? Bestgo? Pure Power? YGS? Any suggestions and/or experiences?

The plan is 8K-10K, 132V-144V @ 55A-80A (pack configuration depends on the cells).


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Look into the Leaf modules... they're priced right and available. I think you could cram at least 8kwh of batteries in a bike, probably more depending on the bike.

Enerdel is another great choice. I've used them on a race car and they were pretty solid.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

frodus said:


> Look into the Leaf modules... they're priced right and available. I think you could cram at least 8kwh of batteries in a bike, probably more depending on the bike.


Leaf modules, not a bad idea.
Pre balanced in modules of 4 and the sealed cases would make pack'ing pretty easy. They are priced pretty good at ~half the cost of the enerdel, but they are also ~half the density. So compared to the enerdel cells, the leaf pack would be ~half the cost but ~twice the physical size.



frodus said:


> Enerdel is another great choice. I've used them on a race car and they were pretty solid.


Nice. Was probably a "bit" more than my pack.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Redshirt said:


> And next for the battery pack and BMS, pack first.
> 
> Still looking for higher densities (by pack volume) so pouches seem to be the answer.
> Enerdel? Bestgo? Pure Power? YGS? Any suggestions and/or experiences?
> ...


Anyone else? I would like as much info on this as possible.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Look at finished module weight for LEAF modules and compare to the Enerdel Module weight.

Enerdel cells look good on density, but when installed in those modules, they're more like CALB cells.


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## ccreddell (May 9, 2008)

frodus said:


> Remember, the Torque on these motors is huge. It could be that you're thinking you want great acceleration, which is related more to torque. HP is determined by RPM and Torque, so its possible that with the right gearing, you get the acceleration you need, but are limited to a certain top speed because of the HP of the motor.


Why not use a divorced transmission like a Harley/Buell? You could run a much smaller sprocket at the back, have good acceleration, and cruise at a low RPM to conserve battery.


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## Elanimal28 (Nov 18, 2013)

ccreddell said:


> Why not use a divorced transmission like a Harley/Buell? You could run a much smaller sprocket at the back, have good acceleration, and cruise at a low RPM to conserve battery.


That's exactly what I'm trying to do with my project. If you have the space for the trany, you can have the best of both worlds. : http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/go-up-hilli-98290p3.html


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

ccreddell said:


> Why not use a divorced transmission like a Harley/Buell? You could run a much smaller sprocket at the back, have good acceleration, and cruise at a low RPM to conserve battery.


You're bringing the gas engine thinking to electric motors and in this case it does not apply. Running the electric motor at lower RPM for the same power output does not reduce the input current from the battery. So conserving the battery is NOT a reason to use a transmission.


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## Elanimal28 (Nov 18, 2013)

major said:


> You're bringing the gas engine thinking to electric motors and in this case it does not apply. Running the electric motor at lower RPM for the same power output does not reduce the input current from the battery. So conserving the battery is NOT a reason to use a transmission.


But running at the motor's most efficient rpm won't help decrease the draw on the batteries and extend range.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Elanimal28 said:


> But running at the motor's most efficient rpm won't help decrease the draw on the batteries and extend range.


Your typical electric motor has a very good high efficiency range which can stretch from 1000 to 6000 RPM. You can hunt and seek to gain a percent or two, but likely come out a loser when considering the transmission loss and mass. If range is the goal, then much better to use the space for more battery than a box of gears


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

The reason for a transmission in a bike is because you have a motor that is not powerful enough to push a single speed.
Transmission doesn't make sense if you have a huge motor.
This is what Brammo should be using, 2 speed kart box.
Rotax DD2
http://j3competition.com/shop/engines/detail/rotax-dd2-engine-kit/

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=j0R2kSi38aEhwM&tbnid=5RKE7dqJkCMqVM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.crg-america.com%2Fkart-parts.asp%2Fkart%2FROTAX%2BFR%2B125%2Fparts%2FENGINE%2BINTERNAL&ei=igj0U5uaHcri8AX_mIKACQ&bvm=bv.73231344,d.dGc&psig=AFQjCNEm0YnirArTSCsTkQ6qyfHbwXdqng&ust=1408587945688928


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## ccreddell (May 9, 2008)

That was sorta my point. Running a transmission would allow you to run a smaller, less power hungry motor. Wouldn't that give you greater range if the motor didn't have to work as hard?


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

ccreddell said:


> That was sorta my point. Running a transmission would allow you to run a smaller, less power hungry motor. Wouldn't that give you greater range if the motor didn't have to work as hard?


No, the smaller motor would likely be less efficient than a larger motor. And at equal power outputs, the smaller motor would "work harder", as in "at a higher percentage of its rated power", wouldn't it?

There are reasons that multi-ratio gearboxes are sometimes used with electric motors, but increased range is not a valid reason.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Nice, lots of good information!

True, I think it's more about moving the optimal power range around..

I (briefly) considered going with a transmission for this bike. But for the parts/performance range of this build I decided to pass. Maybe I still will in the future but that will probably be a much "different" build.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Sorry all, I've been crazy busy with a work related project.

As far as the bike, I'm currently testing cells to decide how close to 10C I wanna build the pack for..

Also, I've decided to go with a Centralized BMS. I'm designing the pack to be bullet proof and stay within safety margins so I don't expect a lot of tear down, plus I think it looks better.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Redshirt said:


> Also, I've decided to go with a Centralized BMS. I'm designing the pack to be bullet proof and stay within safety margins so I don't expect a lot of tear down, plus I think it looks better.


Darn, the distributed systems seem cheaper and more customize-able..


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Hello everyone!

Sorry I've been away with work (and life). It was fun but I got a bike to build!
I have the last few decisions to make, so I will post my plans before I start buying parts.

I taken everything I'm not reusing off except the stock wheels, tires, and breaks and here she is "rolling chassis" official weighed at 35kg (I zip-tie'd the fairings on for some measurements).


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

Redshirt said:


> Hello everyone!
> 
> Sorry I've been away with work (and life). It was fun but I got a bike to build!
> I have the last few decisions to make, so I will post my plans before I start buying parts.
> ...


35kg ??
my R1 was 63kg with Dymag carbon wheels


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Yeap, 35.32 to be exact. I basically converted everything that wouldn't effect the integrity over to 6061 (including the frame). Pain in the a$$ but given the plan, and the fact that this is all a big eng challenge for me, it seemed like a good idea. I think after battery pack, wheels, tires, and breaks I can shave another 25kg or so. Should make a serious ride.

I still have to make the final decision between the EVD35LV and the EVD70LV (for a first build).


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Hey Ripperton, what's your bikes consumption (ball park) at 110kph? I'm double checking my math..


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

The only figure I have is for racing which is about a 110kmh average and we use about 4kWh in a 16km race so that's 250 Whkm


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Thank you, that helps me double check my math against my expectations.. :wink:


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## jonescg (Nov 3, 2010)

RIPPERTON said:


> 35kg ??
> my R1 was 63kg with Dymag carbon wheels


Geez Dan, you got some work to do!


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

jonescg said:


> Geez Dan, you got some work to do!


Nope
he needs to weigh the other end too.
That stock ZX roller would be at least 75-80kg
The stock rear wheel alone is 14kg.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Oops, sorry for the confusion. Ripperton is right 35.32 kg is one end not both. I just put it back on the scale, it's 71.5 kg as shown in that picture.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Do you guys know if the dlc-28 will work the Curtis 1239-8501 controller?


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

No. Curtis is an AC Induction motor controller, the DLC-28 is BLDC. Only a Sevcon or other PMAC controller will work.


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Now to find the right charger...


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## Bulbazoth (Jun 28, 2015)

Hey Redshirt! How is the bike coming along? I just found out I may be able to ship a DLC-28 to China, so I'm looking at a build very similar to yours! Probably going to use a Sevcon Gen 4 Size 6 and A123 20Ah prismatic pouches. Luckily, being in China, I can get the cells for super cheap: 75元 per  Trying to keep the cost under 35000元 ($1 = 6.21元)

I don't have much experience with this industry, so can someone explain to me why the manufacturers maximum voltage ratings mean nothing? This motor says max 120V and the controller says max 116V. Its okay to run both higher without sacrificing longevity?


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## Redshirt (Nov 18, 2013)

Bulbazoth said:


> Hey Redshirt! How is the bike coming along?


Well, it's on hold for like another month or two till i get back to the states then it's on!



Bulbazoth said:


> I just found out I may be able to ship a DLC-28 to China, so I'm looking at a build very similar to yours! Probably going to use a Sevcon Gen 4 Size 6 and A123 20Ah prismatic pouches. Luckily, being in China, I can get the cells for super cheap: 75元 per  Trying to keep the cost under 35000元 ($1 = 6.21元)
> 
> I don't have much experience with this industry, so can someone explain to me why the manufacturers maximum voltage ratings mean nothing? This motor says max 120V and the controller says max 116V. Its okay to run both higher without sacrificing longevity?


Good luck, keep your eyes on the shipping charges!
Most ratings are either what it was tested at or what it can operate safely at (or both) not what you can get away with . But this question probably deserves a technical answer from a EE or something.


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## ginnz (Jun 2, 2016)

what happened to this build? it just die out?


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## Bulbazoth (Jun 28, 2015)

hell yeah look forward to hearing all about it


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## vaporer (Sep 6, 2016)

ginnz said:


> what happened to this build? it just die out?


Life happened I guess, I was sort of excited too when I started reading on page one...sad this project went belly up.


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