# [EVDL] logisysem throttle box



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Nice. How much was it?




> Steve Clunn<[email protected]> wrote:
> > I just got a throttle box from logisystem that takes care of the rough
> > starts . It has two gears inside so the throttle arm is not attached
> > to the rheostat. Moving the arm 1/5 of a turn, turns the rheostat
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Steve Clunn wrote:
> > I just got a throttle box from logisystem that takes care of the rough
> > starts . It has two gears inside so the throttle arm is not attached
> > to the rheostat. Moving the arm 1/5 of a turn, turns the rheostat
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

What are the reasons, why you may have a rough, jerky, jumpy starts with a 
standard throttle box? My Curtis unit is super very smooth at start up, 
where If I just push the accelerator a hair, the motor is only turning less 
than 1 rpm.

Roland


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Willie McKemie" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 9:14 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] logisysem throttle box


>


> Steve Clunn wrote:
> > > I just got a throttle box from logisystem that takes care of the rough
> > > starts . It has two gears inside so the throttle arm is not attached
> > > to the rheostat. Moving the arm 1/5 of a turn, turns the rheostat
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Roland Wiench wrote:
> > What are the reasons, why you may have a rough, jerky, jumpy starts with a
> > standard throttle box? My Curtis unit is super very smooth at start up,
> > where If I just push the accelerator a hair, the motor is only turning less
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Willie McKemie" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 10:39 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] logisysem throttle box


>


> Roland Wiench wrote:
> > > What are the reasons, why you may have a rough, jerky, jumpy starts with
> > > a
> > > standard throttle box? My Curtis unit is super very smooth at start up,
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Steve Clunn wrote:
> >>> I just got a throttle box from logisystem that takes care of the rough
> >>> starts. It has two gears inside so the throttle arm is not attached
> >>> to the rheostat. Moving the arm 1/5 of a turn, turns the rheostat
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Lee Hart wrote:
> 
> > I don't see how adding gears will make a bad pot good. I
> > think the fundamental problem is that a cheap pot will have
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Could you use a 'log' or audio taper pot? I use quotes around log, since 
most are two-slope pots that mimic a log change. I know some pot boxes 
use a limited range pot (not the full 270 or so degrees), in which case 
this may not work. Or could you add an external resistor to tweak the 
pot's response?

One added benefit if you can use an audio taper pot is they are often 
available as higher quality devices.

- SteveS




> Roger Stockton wrote:
> > Lee Hart wrote:
> >
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

For the too-much-torque-in-reverse problem, I have a relay that clicks
in with the reverse lights that shorts a 5k resistor across the pot
box. This effectively cuts the throttle range in half. I can still
squeak the tires, but I can also be more gentile.

I would like a more logarithmic response also. I generally do most of
my driving with the throttle about in the 1/4 position. If that area
were expanded out I could have more fine control.

I have a Auburn Scientific Kodiac controller 700A. There are unmarked
pots inside that I have not played with that might adjust some of the
parameters. I love this controller BTW. No low speed squeal like the
Curtis, and smooth starts without tweaking. All analog design I
believe!

-Jon Glauser
http://jonglauser.blogspot.com
http://www.evalbum.com/555

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
effect POT?

No Noise, and a smooth 0-5V output...and they make them in either 270deg or
less...

http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Cat=1967060&keywords=ha
ll%20effect

Yes, Yes...it is expensive at $32 but you are putting this in an several
thousand dollar vehicle, attached to a thousand dollar plus controller...

If I knew what the specs were on the pot needed for the Curtis pot box, I
would order a Hall_effect Pot replacement the same time I ordered my Pot-Box
and it would go in Day-Zero...

Oh yes..one more thing... no wear...

Bob Sisson
1993 Geo Metro Convertible Project
Gaithersburg MD



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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Bob Sisson<[email protected]> wrote:
> > What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
> > effect POT?
> 
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

The kelly can take either 0-5V or 0-5K, that's why I was researching it...

You also can program (as with most) the "dead" zone on both ends to get rid
of some of the noise...

Bob Sisson
1993 Geo Metro Convertible Project
Gaithersburg MD



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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> SteveS wrote:
> > Could you use a 'log' or audio taper pot? I use quotes around log, since
> > most are two-slope pots that mimic a log change. I know some pot boxes
> > use a limited range pot (not the full 270 or so degrees), in which case
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Bob Sisson wrote:
> > What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
> > effect POT?
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Somebody asked me the same question the other day - he used to work for HP 
on just such a control. Can someone tell us why the EV industry doesn't go 
that route?


Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Sisson" <[email protected]>
To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] logisysem throttle box


> What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
> effect POT?
>
> No Noise, and a smooth 0-5V output...and they make them in either 270deg 
> or
> less...
>
> http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Cat=1967060&keywords=ha
> ll%20effect
>
> Yes, Yes...it is expensive at $32 but you are putting this in an several
> thousand dollar vehicle, attached to a thousand dollar plus controller...
>
> If I knew what the specs were on the pot needed for the Curtis pot box, I
> would order a Hall_effect Pot replacement the same time I ordered my 
> Pot-Box
> and it would go in Day-Zero...
>
> Oh yes..one more thing... no wear...
>
> Bob Sisson
> 1993 Geo Metro Convertible Project
> Gaithersburg MD
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
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>


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

You can get some logi controllers with 0-5V...



> Jon Glauser <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Bob Sisson<[email protected]>
> > wrote:
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

>


> Bob Sisson<[email protected]> wrote:
> > > What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
> > > effect POT?
> > -Jon Glauser wrote:
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Michael Elliott wrote:
> > I have a design I'm working on right now for my ebike that translates
> > any hall output device and converts it to a resistive throttle output,
> > specifically for controllers that only take a resistive input.
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Since we're discussing obsolete solutions ... ;-)

Many years ago, there was a broadcast audio console -- I think it was made 
by Sparta -- which used LDRs (cadmium sulphide solar cells) to control the 
audio. The LDRs were illuminated by incadescent lamps which were controlled 
by the user-operated potentiometers. 

This was supposed to eliminate fader noise while allowing the manufacturer 
to use dirt-cheap pots. The lamps' response time was fast enough for any 
normal use in fading audio up and down, but so slow that it didn't follow 
the jumps in resistance caused by the dirty contacts in their cheap, crummy 
pots.

In practice the consoles didn't work too well, partly because it was almost 
impossible to keep the stereo channels in balance across the full range of 
the faders' movements. But I can imagine something similar for an EV 
potbox, where absolute precision of resistance isn't so critical.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I built an audio 'volume' foot petal with a CdS Cell back in '70 wanted it
impervious to dust.
It worked 'fine' and lasted for years just a light dependent resistor and an
illuminator, with a moving 'vane' or flap operated by the petal movement in
a light tight box (petal base is a box)
I think that could make a fine EV throttle box system. You could use digital
encoding at 16 serial steps (4 bit) up / down like a mouse encoder then D to
A decoder to drive LED in optoislator (LED to CdS) gives isolated varying
resistance to Motor Controller. And all cheap 'stock' parts plus a small
circuit board and a box HEY, WHO WANTS A GARAGE BUSINESS? Isn't this the
way Apple started? Dennis Miles



> EVDL Administrator <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Since we're discussing obsolete solutions ... ;-)
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Actually the curtis is quite happy to take voltage input. Internally
it has just a pullup resistor to 9V, a filter cap and some protection
diodes, the signal then feeds into an opamp. The voltage source needs
to be able to sink as well as source current due to the internal
pullup. A unidirectional voltage regulator won't work.

My own EV uses a plain old opamp to drive the curtis throttle input,
my circuit adapts a VW pedal assemly for use with the curtis. And yes,
it has all kinds of fault checking.






> Jon Glauser<[email protected]> wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Bob Sisson<[email protected]> wrote:
> >> What about replacing the resistive POT with a physically identical Hall
> >> effect POT?
> ...


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