# 5000/8000w ac system for $480/620 (10pcs)



## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

http://www.evforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3844#post3844


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

Specs on the 8000watt motor:

8" diameter, 12.6" (housing lenght)
8kw (16kw peak)
144v
61.6a (120a peak)
7000rpm
8.04ft-lb (14.75ft-lb peak)
79.36lbs (weight)

Built in controller with regen, reverse, 1/2 speed, voltage and current outputs.

Air or water cooling option.
Neodymium magnets.
Comes with foot pedal control.

Custom voltage/speed available.
Custom shaft sizes available.


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## michael30.06 (May 22, 2008)

That looks fantastic, I would love to build my on again off again E Trike around that motor. 
ONE DAY!
Thanks for the link and the info. Mick


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## electro37 (May 18, 2008)

Mmmmmm! this motor, Tavrima, Supercacitors, on a trike woiuld be really a "world-beater". Cheap to run, super-quick to charge, unlimited lifespan on the power source(supercaps), virtually zero maintenance, and more stable than a bike, suitable for any age-group.


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

electro37 said:


> Mmmmmm! this motor, Tavrima, Supercacitors, on a trike woiuld be really a "world-beater". Cheap to run, super-quick to charge, unlimited lifespan on the power source(supercaps), virtually zero maintenance, and more stable than a bike, suitable for any age-group.


Get on that idea! For the cost, these seem very reasonable for someone to get into an AC system. I need to find out what the warranty is. If >1yr I'm in.


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

Holy #uck... That 8000w motor is just the motor. Good thing I asked. The controller is an additional $1100!!! How is 5000w $480 but 8000w is $1720? I'll tell you why. Because it becomes a practical means of producing an electric vehicle. We can't have that now can we.

Damn conspiracy I say. I honestly believe there will never be a practical EV, like the poor EV1, until it's as profitable to them as what we drive now.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

lazzer408 said:


> Holy #uck... That 8000w motor is just the motor. Good thing I asked. The controller is an additional $1100!!! How is 5000w $480 but 8000w is $1720? I'll tell you why. Because it becomes a practical means of producing an electric vehicle. We can't have that now can we .
> Damn conspiracy I say. I honestly believe there will never be a practical EV, like the poor EV1, until it's as profitable to them as what we drive now.


frustrating , and you drop 2k on a controller with no warranty and little if any qc , ain't china great . we need to take control of our lives . building controllers , batteries , motors . if we could get the motor / controller direct from china i bet it would be less then the $480.00 and at that price i can live without a warranty .


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

aeroscott said:


> frustrating , and you drop 2k on a controller with no warranty and little if any qc , ain't china great . we need to take control of our lives . building controllers , batteries , motors . if we could get the motor / controller direct from china i bet it would be less then the $480.00 and at that price i can live without a warranty .


That price IS direct from China. The motors do carry a 1yr Warranty.

Americans are to greedy for this country to change. That's the whole reason were buying from China now. Less work, more profit. If an American company was selling these motors I'm sure they would both be $3000. Some ass wants a BMW because a Honda is to low class for them.


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

lazzer408 said:


> That price IS direct from China. The motors do carry a 1yr Warranty.
> 
> Americans are to greedy for this country to change. That's the whole reason were buying from China now. Less work, more profit. If an American company was selling these motors I'm sure they would both be $3000. Some ass wants a BMW because a Honda is to low class for them.


I'm sure you don't want to hear this mate but there just isn't the market to warrant Chinese engineers to create controllers for less than hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It's both the problem you state here of the American consumer and the fact China does not have access to the EEs and other educated body of citizenry to design such systems without importing the "brains" (expensive).

I can tell you, just do what the chinese have always done with technology. Order a "controller sample" and simply backwards engineer it. It would take a matter of 8-10 hours to make a schematic from such a thing (assuming you have the correct testing equipment for the parts).

Either that, or tear it apart and send it to another company in china that designs circuit boards and tell them you want to clone it (from my experience unless it's using a lot of opamps and high discharge caps it won't be over 100USD/populated board)


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

Technologic said:


> I'm sure you don't want to hear this mate but there just isn't the market to warrant Chinese engineers to create controllers for less than hundreds of thousands of dollars.
> 
> It's both the problem you state here of the American consumer and the fact China does not have access to the EEs and other educated body of citizenry to design such systems without importing the "brains" (expensive).
> 
> ...


I can buy China scooter controllers for $5 and that's less then I could buy the components. China could make 3-phase controllers dirt cheap and they probably do. China is quite capable of designing it. Profit margins have no relation to cost of manufacture in any country. Why is it that a 5000w motor/controller is $480 but 8000w is $1700+? Because it becomes practical. I have the ability to design my own AC controller so that's not an issue. I was hoping to find a prebuilt solution and save me the trouble. Still a good deal for the 5000w version.


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

lazzer408 said:


> I can buy China scooter controllers for $5 and that's less then I could buy the components. China could make 3-phase controllers dirt cheap and they probably do. China is quite capable of designing it. Profit margins have no relation to cost of manufacture in any country. Why is it that a 5000w motor/controller is $480 but 8000w is $1700+? Because it becomes practical. I have the ability to design my own AC controller so that's not an issue. I was hoping to find a prebuilt solution and save me the trouble. Still a good deal for the 5000w version.


That's just it though, the chinese government tends not to have heavy influences upon their businesses. My guess is that the such controllers (8000w+) being practical may have something to do with it, or it may just be that they don't sell as many 8000w ones (or they had to buy them from an american reseller to backward engineer before they could make them).

Any number of reasons unfortunately. I highly doubt the motor/controller set (in parts and labor) is worth over $900 USD in china... in fact I'd be surprised if it's over $600USD.

Ask for a picture of the innards of the controller? they likely will give it to you... you can tell quite a bit about how much it's "worth".

Worst case you can always in the future start cloning them for $10-20 dollars from another circuit board factory


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## thedarlington (Aug 17, 2008)

so what application would the cheaper version be good for? how much is the controller?


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## EnergyOfOne (Jul 23, 2008)

This may help 

Build your own 500amp water cooled speed controller 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgoc4MwsukM

Further on in his videos he talks about offering a kit for about $200 US -this video here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hN1BAxN_Ht0&feature=related


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## booksix (Aug 26, 2008)

ok, this may be totally stupid, but you say the 5000w system is 480 (with built in controller?)... what about two of these to power a car? just wondering because I dig AC but it's too much $$


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## JohninCR (May 6, 2008)

Are we sure these motors ar AC? The only info I can find online through Unite's websites is that they are brushless, and one header lists them as DC, never any mention of AC. Where did the AC designation come from?

John


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

JohninCR said:


> Are we sure these motors ar AC? The only info I can find online through Unite's websites is that they are brushless, and one header lists them as DC, never any mention of AC. Where did the AC designation come from?
> 
> John


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brushless_DC_electric_motor

"The statement *Brushless DC electric motor* may be misleading and controversial among professionals because it's actually an 3 phase AC motor driven by a DC source. The DC direct-current electricity is converted to three phase Alternating-current by an electronic device often refered to as an ESC Electronic Speed Controller."


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## JohninCR (May 6, 2008)

lazzer408 said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brushless_DC_electric_motor
> 
> "The statement *Brushless DC electric motor* may be misleading and controversial among professionals because it's actually an 3 phase AC motor driven by a DC source. The DC direct-current electricity is converted to three phase Alternating-current by an electronic device often refered to as an ESC Electronic Speed Controller."


So those big AC motors for cars work essentially the same as the little brushless hub motor on my e-bike? Isn't the "brushless" designation for these unite motors sufficient to describe them?


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

the dc brush less motors are easier to control then induction motors .


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## lazzer408 (May 18, 2008)

aeroscott said:


> the dc brush less motors are easier to control then induction motors .


I don't know if I'll agree with that entirely. Both are a pita vs. dc.

Most of the brushless motors have permanent magnets in them. The induction motors typically used in ev's for propulsion do not.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

EnergyOfOne said:


> This may help
> 
> Build your own 500amp water cooled speed controller
> 
> ...


Both videos have been removed by the user


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## sunworksco (Sep 8, 2008)

Remember the melamine in the dog food and the lead in the toys from China.The have absolutly no conscience when it comes to manufacturing goods for the American market.Anything you have manufactured your product in China it becomes fair conterfeit game as well.


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## Ron Atkinson (Apr 17, 2008)

any builder can take advantage of the "new" teflon cable on the market nowadays, each strand in the flexible cable is "silver-coated" and able to carry previously impossible "current-loads". The cable is not cheap; but if you are short of space, and want to economise on every ounce, then this could be the answer. I rewired part of my VW with it, and it has never given me any trouble at all.


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## ecochallenger (Nov 11, 2008)

Just an idea to kick around. Remember the Cadillac 8-6-4 ? Could it be possible to set up three of 5000w drives onto a common shaft ? Then shut down the regen on two of them. Use all three for take off. Use only the one with the regen for cruise and decel. Two drives can be used for assistance on hills.It will be cheaper than the 8000w motor and controller, and switched properly could have a better range.


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