# Is EEStor for real?



## Xringer (Oct 12, 2008)

http://www.plentymag.com/blogs/edge/2008/12/secretive_startup_wins_key_pat.php


Or, is it another stock scam??


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

Xringer said:


> http://www.plentymag.com/blogs/edge/2008/12/secretive_startup_wins_key_pat.php
> 
> 
> Or, is it another stock scam??


Yes it's a stock scam.


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## Xringer (Oct 12, 2008)

Technologic said:


> Yes it's a stock scam.


Pretty soon these battery scams will be as common as solar panel scams..

I just got 960 google hits on "solar panel breakthrough"..


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## San_Carlos_Jeff (Nov 7, 2008)

AFAIK there's no stock. It may or may not be a VC scam, but since it's not my money I keep hoping for the best.


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## order99 (Sep 8, 2008)

No idea, honestly. It would be nice if the Tech was here and cheap, but until a few buyers try out the finished product and review it-well, i'm not holding my breath.


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

order99 said:


> No idea, honestly. It would be nice if the Tech was here and cheap, but until a few buyers try out the finished product and review it-well, i'm not holding my breath.


No finished product or prototype exist.

The tech and their "proof" so far is beyond highly questionable from a material science perspective.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

90% possibility of scam, 1% possibility of complete truth, 9% chance they actually have some sort of product that "needs some work"......

I'm 99% sure EEstor in general is a scam.....


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## Xringer (Oct 12, 2008)

San_Carlos_Jeff said:


> AFAIK there's no stock. It may or may not be a VC scam, but since it's not my money I keep hoping for the best.



Just did a google on *EEStor Scam* and found out there is stock,
but not publicly traded _stock_.. 

Some investors who had the claims investigated..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EEstor#cite_note-43


I wonder why well known companies have invested?? 
They must have a pretty neat demo show..


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

Xringer said:


> I wonder why well known companies have invested??
> They must have a pretty neat demo show..


Lockhead Martin spokesperson said this a year ago

"It's a once in a moon shot, but we're just hoping it really happens, so nobody else can get contracts"

I'm pretty sure... at least Lockhead, knows it's a snowballs chance in hell. Zenn I think is just using it to scam more people.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Technologic said:


> Zenn I think is just using it to scam more people.


I did hear at least one member here who said that he was thinking about investing in zenn because of lockheed martain's involvement with EEstor. I know zenn paid some $3 000 000 for the exclusive right to market the hypercaps for road going cars and for one of the first shipments.

Maybe they are getting some hype out of it, but I can't help but wonder if zenn is also being played. I wonder how long it will take before the SEC decides to have a closer look at EEstor (if ever).

Lockheed also has money to burn, at least they did when they first threw money at EEstor. Only recently did starbucks start to scale back its rediculous expansion LOL! (owned by lockheed)


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

david85 said:


> Lockheed also has money to burn, at least they did when they first threw money at EEstor. Only recently did starbucks start to scale back its rediculous expansion LOL! (owned by lockheed)


Lockhead martin also almost has exculsive contracts with every branch of the military.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Technologic said:


> Lockhead martin also almost has exculsive contracts with every branch of the military.


No wonder a hammer costs so much! LMAO


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

david85 said:


> No wonder a hammer costs so much! LMAO


I hope Eestor is real, but in reality I think it's about as likely as americans stopping buying oil. I don't think in 60 years when I'm 80 I will have seen that day yet.

I miss material science and hope in my lifetime I can do something significant in it... I simply dislike this kind of misinformation and posting of patents granted as proof of concept.

Someone DID patent the universe once... and hyberdrive, and other crap.
I want a prototype... once I see one with this two times higher energy density than LiFePO I may get a tad excited.

Nanowire batteries DO exist already in prototype form... stanford has one. I imagine it cost them a few hundred thousand dollars to make, but at least it exists.

The only thing that exists so far with Eestor is some barium titanite dust (which any joe blow can buy)

Unless Eestor is real, and they really produce these things for cheap, I don't forsee any new capacitor tech that changes things for EVs for the next 10 years. We need carbon nanotube films... and good luck on that one.


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## SteelDanno (Jan 17, 2009)

Holding my breath here. One day someone will come through with a legit product. 

Hello from a noob to the boards btw.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Technologic said:


> I miss material science and hope in my lifetime I can do something significant in it...


I will hold you do that. Science has become so much like a religion in recent years that its not even funny. I hope there are enough like you out there to pick up the pieces some day.


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## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Other companies are working on the same thing, ultra capacitors. I'm not a scientist and I don't have any expertise in this area but I am curious why nobody thinks they have a rats ass in hell's chance of succeeding? Why all the doubt???

I've not followed every single thing they've said but I've been reading anything I've seen since summer. During that time they've gotten two patents which I've not evaluated but still, just curious why everyone thinks they can't make this thing? Because they're behind their original schedule?


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

Because they have revealed nothing over this time and the kind of leap forward sounds too good to be true. There is no proof that even a prototype exists.

The kind of leap forward that they are claiming is akin to going from the write brothers flyer to the concord with not evolution in between. Yes, it would be nice to believe that it was pissible, but I only give this a 1% chance. EEstor was founded in a time of growing energy prices and a booming economy. 

There are so many scams and slush funds out there only in alternative "eco-green" energy that you really have to be careful what you believe.


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## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Yea, scammers are rampant nowadays compared to yesteryear. Seems like people are just out for a buck with little if any concern for others. It's really a shame too. 

OTOH, the guy was an engineer from Intel. I give him a little more credit than those in the banking and realty industry simply because of the mind of an engineer. I don't think they're quite as "predisposed" to scamming. That's not to say they won't do it, I just don't think they're as creative... 

BTW, how's your project coming along? I'm anxious to see how those lithium batteries do. I'm sort of testing my ride to figure out the range in various temperatures. Today it was 20F when I left the house. Drove 4 miles and stopped for a while. Then headed out on a little trip at 30F and soon realized I'd never make it back so had to detour. Recharging as I type. Only got 24 miles with my 2kw heater on maybe 40% of the time. This is with a 33.4Kw Lead pack! However it's only been charged maybe 10 times so it's not yet broken in. I can't wait until someone comes up with something much better!


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## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> Other companies are working on the same thing, ultra capacitors. I'm not a scientist and I don't have any expertise in this area but I am curious why nobody thinks they have a rats ass in hell's chance of succeeding? Why all the doubt???
> 
> I've not followed every single thing they've said but I've been reading anything I've seen since summer. During that time they've gotten two patents which I've not evaluated but still, just curious why everyone thinks they can't make this thing? Because they're behind their original schedule?


Because getting a patent is meaningless. You could get a patent for many many crazy and wild ideas and not have any basis or ability to produce them in reality. All patents are is checking your idea against others before it, and protecting it for 20 years if it's new.

Barium titanite has a high electron permitivity yes, but in reality their claims that they can make it into ultracaps seems suspect. The only information they provided so far in the way of independent data (in 2 years with millions invested) is they sent out barium powder to be tested for purity... well that's not even remotely a big deal at all, any joe blow has access to 99.95% barium titanite.

From what I understand this cap design they're talking about uses low temperature sintered metallic powders (that must be 1 micron or so dust).

I'm not even sure this material can be sintered at low temperatures. MOST ceramics can't (they require huge pressures and huge temps usually). I can't find any information on anyone attempting this.

Similarly since no university has successfully made an ultracap using barium titanite, Eestor would have to take a giant leap forward, which is very unlike companies now adays.


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## david85 (Nov 12, 2007)

ElectriCar said:


> BTW, how's your project coming along?


Very slowly. The battery is finally on the ship, and I am hoping to make the final arrangements for the motor to be built. While you do have 33kwh in your car, you are not getting all of it becuase of voltage sag and lost capacity in the cold weather. Lithium should perform better, but you never really know until you try it so we shall have to see.

The rust repair is done on the car and the engine will be pulled as time permits.


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## unclematt (May 11, 2008)

Xringer said:


> Pretty soon these battery scams will be as common as solar panel scams..
> 
> I just got 960 google hits on "solar panel breakthrough"..


Though I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, the high number in that search result may be due to the fact that so many online publications publish the same articles on so many different sites.


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