# ElectriCar build thread - 91 S10



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Yesterday we didn't get very much done. Began removing stuff to take the bed and exhaust off. Hopefully today we'll get the ball rolling again.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Ok, just got time to upload some photo's. Nothing done today. Had to work in the Sun all day! The last photo is one showing how we're tagging wiring that may be beneficial later. This one was connected on the alternator terminal on back with a jumper to the battery + terminal. Any idea what it may be for? It's about a size 10 so that's 30 amp capacity. ???


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

I've gotten a blog started now so all future photo's and notes will be found there and at evalbum.

Today we replaced the drum brake rear with a disc brake unit from a 2001 Blazer. Had it out and new one in in about 3 hours, excluding the e-brake cable which is going to take a little more work to complete. $400 from a salvage yard. More detailes and photo's on the blog here. http://electricar.myblogsite.com/


----------



## ww321q (Mar 28, 2008)

Need to make sure the rest of the brake parts are the same . Although with all that weight in the back if you had to much rear brake , it wouldn't be a problem . J.W.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Guy told me on some or all? of the 91-94 S10's, they didn't have a proportioning valve and I wouldn't notice any difference. One of my guys said I could pick one up locally if needed. 

I've got two shade tree mechanics but they're pretty good so hopefully we'll get the e-brake cable remedied this week. I really don't see any problem with it other than securing the longer cables.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Got the motor in now and tested it with a battery charger this week. Yee Haw! 

I was beginning to wonder if that day was coming this year after 3 months of so little time to work on it!

Got the e-brake problem taken care of. There are two teeny drum pads in there behind the rotor that needed adjusting. It's good to know a real mechanic!

An added bonus to the new rear end is an additional GAWR of 2900 lbs vs. 2300 stock, giving me 600 more pounds to work with. Being so I managed to rack a total of 22 batteries worth 1500 lbs including steel under the bed for 132V. Two more under the hood and I've got 144V with room to spare for the air conditioning contraption, however that works out...

New photo's posted at evalbum including ones of the bed battery racks. Most racks I've seen include 4 on each side of the drive shaft. I miraculously managed to *cram* 7 US2200's on each side and put 8 in the back!!!


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Help! Anyone know what the larger size 12 or so orange wire coming from the harness under the hood from the area of the brake booster is? I numbered it but neglected to mark the electrical drawing so I don't recall where it went to! Out of 22 wires, this is the only one not marked on the drawing!


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

*We now have the electric heater element installed.* Lots of details on the blog but I didn't think to take any photos...

Also installed a PakTrakr system to monitor the batteries. This is a very cool system if you're not aware of it. It monitors each battery and alerts you of several issues that may develop. The cost for my 24 battery pack was about $400 including a current sensor to monitor pack or motor amp draw, your choice but only one sensor.


----------



## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

Good write up.. I'm working on my ceramic heater right now..


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

More goodies installed since October update:

*LED turn signal/tail lamps* for power savings...requires different flashers with my truck.

*Upgraded the cassette stereo system *which was nearly 20 years old... Pops likes his music sometimes. 
*
Replaced the old carpet* ...we lined the floor pan with double sided radiant barrier. This stuff works great at keeping heat in or out. 

*Installed 12V fuse block* A no brainer if you want to prevent fires

I don't know how many of you are reading this but photos and the beef of the articles are on the blog site.

We are about ready to start the fun part. Getting it ready to _DRIIIIVE! 

_The plan it to start on the controls portion and front battery pack tomorrow and be driving by Thanksgiving! YEA Baby!


----------



## braddd (Nov 12, 2008)

I'm watching and learning.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

More stuff done with photos on the blog site. 

*Tilt bed* finished and works great.

*Zivan NG5 installed* behind the seat. I wasn't sure it would fit without moving the seat forward but it's all the way back! Fired it up and charged the pack for the first time Monday afternoon and then celebrated with a little help from Adolf Coors.

In retrospect I should have installed the DC-DC converter behind the seat as well to make a neater install under the hood and to also shelter it from the weather. 

*The control board* is in and the wiring about 50% finished. I have used parallel conductors of 1/0 over the entire battery pack instead of a single 2/0. That has taken a ton of labor to crimp, solder and heat shrink the connections. I didn't do all of them but most are that way. I decided to run 4/0 monster looking cable on the controller and contactors to save some labor.

The reasoning for the parallel 1/0 cables was to reduce voltage drop thus leaving more power to run the motor and hopefully a bit more mileage. Not sure it will help much but is will allow the motor to develop more torque as more voltage will reach the motor and not be converted into heat in the wiring.

Happy Thanksgiving to all!


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

Your control board frame looks good!! 

I have a couple recommendations concerning the hinges...

If you get the ones that allow you to remove the hinge pins, they will come in real handy removing and reinstalling your control board which will get heavy with all your components later.

I used hinges off of old interior doors for mine.

The second thing is you might consider mounting them on the top of the frame with the hinge point at the rear of the square stock. The reason I say that is it looks like the rear edge of the control board may not pivot over the square stock at the back real well.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

I think all I'll have on the board is the 1231 controller, DC converter, two contactors, heater fuse and a current sensor. It's not crowded at all right now. I installed a pack fuse on one of the aluminum risers so its' not on the board. Heater contactor is on the fender well, and I'm going to try and mount an Anderson disconnect on another of the risers under the board.

One idea re easy removal is the use of Molex connectors. In my industrial electronics days they make for quick change out of parts, reduced downtime etc. A local electronics dealer should have or be able to order them. Also Newark Electronics has a vast supply of them. 

And I like your idea re the hinges. That's something I'll have to think about.

2nd comment re the hinge location: The hinges are now on the back side. I did it that way originally so it would stand up and support itself with the board not actually lying on top of the bar. Now it's overhanging the bar and I have to hold it up, until I install a prop rod or such. Right now I just want to drive the dang thing!!!


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> I think all I'll have on the board is the 1231 controller, DC converter, two contactors, heater fuse and a current sensor. It's not crowded at all right now. I installed a pack fuse on one of the aluminum risers so its' not on the board. Heater contactor is on the fender well, and I'm going to try and mount an Anderson disconnect on another of the risers under the board.
> 
> One idea re easy removal is the use of Molex connectors. In my industrial electronics days they make for quick change out of parts, reduced downtime etc. A local electronics dealer should have or be able to order them. Also Newark Electronics has a vast supply of them.
> 
> ...


I like the Molex connectors you linked. My amp and voltmeter wires right now have male and female bullet connectors and the Molex connectors would clean them up.

My present board proper-upper is a 1-1/2" stick (now painted silver).  The length is fully adjustable with a hand-saw.  I used old bed frame rails for the board/battery box support framing and bolted everything up for quick break-down and removal.

I had thoughts of a locking brace off an old ladder for the control board support but when I add the ram air duct from the old ICE intake box system to the intake box under the controller, it props the board up when open so I guess I can stay with the stick for now. 

Here are some of my truck conversion photos so far at my photobucket account:

http://s117.photobucket.com/albums/o42/jaynethecat/Ranger%20EV/


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

I'm glad you posted the link. Nice job! Your board looks really good. How long have you been driving it and what is your range?


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> I'm glad you posted the link. Nice job! Your board looks really good. How long have you been driving it and what is your range?


Thanks!  I put it on the road about two weeks now!! I probably pushed the battery pack too fast one day last week by doing 40 miles with a couple one hour opportunity charges at work.

The charge time afterwords with my (not so) Quick Charge on board charger took about 16 hrs to charge after that run. I'm not too thrilled with the charger anymore.  I'll need to check my electrolyte this weekend and specific gravity on the cells just in case it's not the charger.

I think thats a smart idea you have to go with the larger cable size. Less resistance is a good thing IMO.

FYI , I can barely hear my vacuum pump by putting it in the back at a dead stop just in case you can still hear yours above your cassette player.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Re the charge time: I went with the NG5 Zivan as it would reduce the charge time in half or so. I plan to commute + do tons of short hops for my company, ie lunch runs, post office, permit office, looking at nearby jobs etc. I put close to 20K miles on my truck each year at 25-30 cents/mile so I plan on saving a ton and we're going to use it more at home as well for eating out, grocery shopping etc. 

My charger should recharge the pack in I think 6 hours or less. The first time I energized it the current started out at 35 amps on the AC line and dwindled down to about 10A at the finish. So at 35A on a 208V receptacle, that's 7.3kwh and the pack is 33.5 kw without considering the P-effect. 

I hope to be driving tomorrow. While the women go shopping I'm going wiring!  I've only got a little more to go with the control until it's driveable!


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> Re the charge time: I went with the NG5 Zivan as it would reduce the charge time in half or so. I plan to commute + do tons of short hops for my company, ie lunch runs, post office, permit office, looking at nearby jobs etc. I put close to 20K miles on my truck each year at 25-30 cents/mile so I plan on saving a ton and we're going to use it more at home as well for eating out, grocery shopping etc.
> 
> My charger should recharge the pack in I think 6 hours or less. The first time I energized it the current started out at 35 amps on the AC line and dwindled down to about 10A at the finish. So at 35A on a 208V receptacle, that's 7.3kwh and the pack is 33.5 kw without considering the P-effect.
> 
> I hope to be driving tomorrow. While the women go shopping I'm going wiring!  I've only got a little more to go with the control until it's driveable!


 
Being an electrician and all, you can install an outlet at the shop and tap the company for the power as well as hit them for 25-30 cents a mile. 

But the sounds of it, you might need add a series generator for some extended driving. 

I'm checking with an eBay seller right now to see what his generator heads will do to post it in the other thread about series hybrids.

Just make sure the women don't spend all your EV money. I'd hate to see them waste it on stuff like clothes or jewelry (unless it's sexy lingerie stuff-post pics).


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Well it's finally running! Got it going on Monday and have driven it about 120 miles so far. It's going in the paint shop Monday for a makeover. 

It has gotten cold here and I'm not very thrilled with the *1500W ceramic heater* performance. It's ok but nothing like the original. Because it's not very warm I thought I'd check into it. See below.

Someone here had posted about the element being *self regulating *somehow, ie the more flow through it the more it puts out preventing burn up with little air flow so I thought I'd check that out too.

I turned the fan on and recorded the voltage and amp draw through the element at various speeds. *I don't know how but this thing does a great job of self-regulating*. As the fan speed was increased the voltage dropped but the amperage went up!

Here's the results: 
Low speed - 8.1A, 1170 watts
Medium 1 - 11.2A, 1600 watts
Meduim 2 - 12.4A, 1770 watts
High speed - 13.9A, 1980 watts


----------



## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

WOW.. 120 miles since Monday!? I've been "driving" mine since thursday and I think I've done maybe 35 miles... It's VERY cold here and the batts are new so range is not good. I sure hope it improves! 

I agree with the heater. I thought mine wasn't working at all, and then realized it just wan't HOT. It is what I would call lukewarm. Though it does keep the snow melted off the windshield. It's only 7 degrees here today! But sunny, so dry.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

One thing you must do is block off the outside air. GM vehicles, unlike most imports do not have a button to select fresh air or recirculate. 

On my truck we removed the grill just below the windshield. This is where the fan intake is and gets all it's air from outside. We blocked that off and it's much better now. 

I just dont' know what I'm going to do with it to deal with warmer days when you want outside air. It's currently air operated via diaphram. I may use an electric solenoid to operate the flap with a switch.


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> One thing you must do is block off the outside air. GM vehicles, unlike most imports do not have a button to select fresh air or recirculate.
> 
> On my truck we removed the grill just below the windshield. This is where the fan intake is and gets all it's air from outside. We blocked that off and it's much better now.
> 
> I just dont' know what I'm going to do with it to deal with warmer days when you want outside air. It's currently air operated via diaphram. I may use an electric solenoid to operate the flap with a switch.


http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f135/hvac-system-vacuum-actuator-locations-349503/


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

It's going to be a Merry Christmas. I'm getting the truck back from the paint shop today and will try and post photos in a day or two.

Merry Christmas, Honnakah, Festivus or whatever holiday you celebrate!


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

*First 1000 miles completed today!*

Sorry for the delay on the photos but the truck went back to the paint shop. They really did a poor job with the body work so I complained and they reworked it. Still not what I would call even a good paint job. It's ok is about all I can say and that's a stretch. After that it spent time in the upholstery shop, the tint shop and finally it's back on the road. 

I also completed the first 1000 miles on it today, all trouble free to my surprise! I haven't even added water or tightened any connections. 

Next thing to do is replace the compressor for the AC and get the rear up a couple more inches. I already changed the springs out with a set from a 4X4 but still not enough. That raised it about 3 inches. 

Anyway here's a couple of photos.


----------



## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

I'm liking it Electricar...

power cable to the gas door is always awesome to see


----------



## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

nice lookin ride Electricar.... paint looks fine from here 

"black cars look better in the shade"


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

Niiiice!!


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Thanks for the complements! It's still like a new toy.


----------



## tj4fa (May 25, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> Thanks for the complements! It's still like a new toy.


Looks like you may have another good candidate for an EV in your photo (not the RV).


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Yea that's my neighbors "automatic" 2006 Camry. The wife drives a 2000 model that I may convert to manual. I've kicked that idea around but the next one I want to do is direct drive! I really don't like the clutchless trans idea as you have to wait a long time for the motor to wind down to shift. With someone on your butt it's nerve wracking, especially going up a hill and there's a ton of those around here! 

I don't know much about FWD vehicles so I have no clue how much trouble it would be to go direct drive with maybe a 2:1 reduction gear and an AC motor setup.


----------



## Technologic (Jul 20, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> I've kicked that idea around but the next one I want to do is direct drive! I really don't like the clutchless trans idea as you have to wait a long time for the motor to wind down to shift. \


If your motor can handle the RPMs I've always thought direct-drive is the way to go for cars under 2000lbs.

Sounds like a great project as well... screw the camry hybrid


----------



## Telco (Jun 28, 2008)

ElectriCar said:


> as you have to wait a long time for the motor to wind down to shift.


Can you go into this a little more? I was unaware there was a need to wait on the motor to shift gears.


----------



## ElectriCar (Jun 15, 2008)

Telco said:


> Can you go into this a little more? I was unaware there was a need to wait on the motor to shift gears.


When there is no clutch and you want to change gears you have to wait for the motor speed to match the new gear speed you're going to. 

Ie I spin up first gear to about 25-30mph. At that time the motor is turning about 5500 rpm. Second gear is turning much slower in the transmission so you have to wait until the motor slows down after you pull it out of first gear before you can shift it into second. Otherwise you'll hear grinding or popping noised you don't want to hear.

You just put light pressure on the shifter from neutral and once the speed is matched the shifter will fall into gear. Pull too hard and you'll hear bad sounds!


----------

