# 110 vs 220 vs Avcon vs Small Paddle vs Large Paddle?



## bblocher (Jul 30, 2008)

john818 said:


> I know very little about this, so maybe someone can post some basic info or direct me somewhere that I can learn about it.
> 
> I know a little about charging from 110v or 220v outlets, but I know nothing about other options. I've seen references to public charging stations that have Avcon, small paddle, and large paddle connectors. I get the impression these connectors were primarily used on production vehicles. What are they, and are they feasible in a DIY project?
> 
> Also, are public charging stations likely to have 110v outlets available? That seems to be what the typical DIYer uses. I'm in the Los Angeles area, and I've heard that some Ralph's and Costco stores have been putting in charging stations, and many city halls, universities, and libraries around here have them. It would be nice to be able to take advantage of these opportunities.


If you have these plug types near you it sounds like you're a better position than a lot of us. You might have to drive out to some of these charging stations and see if there is a universal looking plug type on all them? Maybe take some pictures too as I'm sure many would be interested in seeing what's being used.


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Hello, I've been thinking about charging issues recently. My biggest desire is to take advantage of the free parking/charging at LAX. But there are many ev charging stations in LA. Find ones that are near where you drive, and be sure to submit "I was there" comments.

One of the parking garages near my workplace has a 110VAC outlet with a spa timer. That seems to be a simple solution. But, I don't think you can count on 110VAC outlets being at charging stations. I just got an email back from someone at LAX regarding the chargers they have there. It looks like they don't have normal 110VAC plugs. So, to charge there I'll need to either get an inductive inlet or an Avcon inlet. There might be some information on the EVDL list. From my brief searches there it seems that you can get Avcon inlets from http://www.avconev.com/ but a simple circuit might be needed to get it to work. I just sent them an email requesting more information. I haven't found anything regarding SPI or LPI although they seem very common in LA.

Keep us posted with your progress!


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

I added a page on the wiki, where we can compile information we find.

Opportunity Charging


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## john818 (Aug 1, 2008)

(EDIT: Realized I said Chatsworth Metrolink. Should've been Northridge Metrolink. I'll update the text but will leave the file name of the pic unchanged. Sorry.)

Finally got around to checking out some local charging stations. No standard plugs at any of them. I went to the Northridge Fashion Center, Northridge Metrolink Station, Costco Canoga Park, and a couple of lots at Cal State Northridge.

No one was charging on Sunday afternoon. There was an NEV parked at the Metrolink Station, but the others were either empty or had ICE cars parked there. The mall had 2 spots, but only one charger. Costco had two chargers, but one was missing its connector. The others appeared to be in working order, but I didn't look closely.

I'll upload a few pics.


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Great legwork, John. I've noticed that there are many paddle chargers around, and a few Avcon chargers. But, the paddle chargers are no longer being supported by any manufacturer, while the Avcon is. I would rather have some opportunity charging than none. So I'm going with Avcon.


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## jlsawell (Apr 4, 2008)

Yanks seem to be far ahead of us poor Aussies. We have no recharge infrastructure at all apart from a few locations that EV converters have managed to set up.

I've been checking out carparks for power points (we use 240v AC) but hadn't really made it a priority until now.

Anyways, last week I had a day off work and took the family shopping. While Di was in BigW I took the kids up for a visit to Centre Management.

I introduced myself, said I was almost finished converting my car to run on batteries and did they have a powerpoint in the carpark that I could charge it on? (Knowing that the answer would probably be no).

The girl at the counter said "No, sorry. There are no powerpoints in the carparks."

Now, I knew this wasn't quite true, as there is a janitor-area fenced off in one corner which has TWO power points in it. But I guess she didn't know that.

So my next question was "OK, is there any way of GETTING ONE available? Electric cars are great, but we need a place to charge them up, it's kind of a catch-22"

"Sure" she replied. "Just fill in this feedback form and we'll see what we can do" I didn't realise it would be that easy to start the process.

I told her a little about Project Better Place and she thought that it was a great idea for reducing pollution and growing local green jobs.

I'm going to suggest/request they allocate a car space next to the janitor area and just extend the 240v out to another plug on the wall.

So in future I'm planning to ramp it up and visit all the shopping centres in my area and basically just repeat the process...shake things up a little and see what falls out.


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Great idea! It's a lot easier to get businesses to put in amenities when they know there is a demand. And if you don't let them know, who will?! I'm going to ask around to a few places that I frequent, especially places that are far enough where I would need to charge to return from. I don't know how hard it would be to map out the chargers down under a la evchargernews.com, but I'm sure they'd let you have their software. Having the google map of locations really makes it easy to read.


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## jlsawell (Apr 4, 2008)

Bottomfeeder said:


> Having the google map of locations really makes it easy to read.


Better Place plans to take it one step further by smart software in the car knowing where you are going and plotting a course that includes the necessary charge stations...


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

Gently remind them that there are federal, state and possibly local rebates, tax exemptions and other freebies if they participate by installing stations. I even think the land down under has governmental give-aways too.


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Where can I find info on these rebates? A quick google search didn't yield many results. Can you put what you find on the wiki?


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## jlsawell (Apr 4, 2008)

piotrsko said:


> Gently remind them that there are federal, state and possibly local rebates, tax exemptions and other freebies if they participate by installing stations. I even think the land down under has governmental give-aways too.


I'll check, but I'm not hopeful. Our Federal Govt just changed the rebate structure on PV arrays for homes to make them unaffordable for most of the population. 

The minister responsible? Peter Garrett, former lead singer of Midnight Oil and long-time environmental activist, now turned politician and completely party-whipped.

They also tried to scrap the 50% rebate on LPG conversions for ICE cars...

At least my home state of Qld just elected Anna Bligh, who promised to re-sell hundreds of thousands of solar panels to us on the cheap, to kick-start our solar economy. We get about as much sunshine as Israel or Saudi Arabia, so why we aren't the world leader in solar, I guess we can blame our greatest export: dumb, dirty coal...


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Well, my Avcon inlet arrived in the mail yesterday. I haven't really looked at it yet. So far, my initial impression is that it is definitely over engineered. There is a plastic shield which moves out of the way, but only when a clip in the back is pressed. I assume that the plug will fit snugly into it. One thing that bothered me is that the inlet came with no information, such as a pin-out. Luckily the wiring diagram from Tom Stockebrand has what looks like the right pin-out. I'll take some photos and post them tomorrow.


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## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

Here are a couple of photos:
















The plug fits into the inlet and sort of swing into it's locking position. I drove to a local charging station to test it out and make sure that it will work where I'm going to mount it on the vehicle. I think I can get the inlet on its side in the front grill. It's close enough that if it fits it will be perfect, but if it doesn't, I'll have to think of another place to mount it. Behind the license plate? Who knows.


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