# Flooding in Louisiana and electric motors



## cricha5 (Jun 21, 2008)

I haven't heard anyone talk about water. Is it not a problem? I floods a lot here in Louisiana. Often times without enough warning to get home from where you were. We have to drive through water that comes up past the floor boards sometimes. Wouldn't this completely screw up the electric motor? A lot of the motors I see are open, like the warps. Are there sealed ones? This isn't too much of a problem for an ICE since all that matters is for the air intake to be relatively dry and that is usually at the top of the engine bay. The way I've been seeing electric motors mounted, way down low, concerns me.


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## kcblkeeley (May 8, 2008)

Seems to me you're right. I used to live in New Orleans until you know who came by. I would think that no matter how sealed the motor is, once the posts are under water it's over. And as you know, once the canals fill up with a good rain the streets are next. You might want to think about having a backup vehicle for wet days. Good Luck!


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## wakinyantanka (Apr 8, 2008)

cricha5 said:


> I haven't heard anyone talk about water. Is it not a problem? I floods a lot here in Louisiana. Often times without enough warning to get home from where you were. We have to drive through water that comes up past the floor boards sometimes. Wouldn't this completely screw up the electric motor? A lot of the motors I see are open, like the warps. Are there sealed ones? This isn't too much of a problem for an ICE since all that matters is for the air intake to be relatively dry and that is usually at the top of the engine bay. The way I've been seeing electric motors mounted, way down low, concerns me.


This is not an issue for an electric motor. A great deal of electric motors can get wet and be just fine. Heck electric fuel pumps in ICE vehicles pull the fuel straight past the armature, thats how they are designed, it helps keep that little thing cool. Getting the armature wet is no big deal, electricity will take the path of least resistance, water does not conduct at all, it's the minerals in the water that are conductive and the armature is still the easiest route for the electricity to flow. The problem you may run into would be dirt and debris, if mud or anything gets in there it could do some damage that way. My suggestion would be to figure out a way to keep the dirt out.


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## cricha5 (Jun 21, 2008)

Thanks. Makes sense, but are you saying that an idealized sealed waterproof electric motor would work if completely submerged or just wet?


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## wakinyantanka (Apr 8, 2008)

cricha5 said:


> Thanks. Makes sense, but are you saying that an idealized sealed waterproof electric motor would work if completely submerged or just wet?


Completely submerged as long as its water and not mud. If its waterproof I don't think it would matter either way. 
I would suggest doing a google search on it just to be sure.


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## judebert (Apr 16, 2008)

Actually, the existing, non-ideal, open, DC brushed electric motors that most people use on their EVs will work just fine, even completely submerged. The only reason they'd stop working would be if electricity got routed away from them, and the water isn't conductive enough to do that.

There is a danger involved with dirt. If mud or other debris enters the motor, it will abrade the brushes, commutator, rotor, and other moving parts. This can cause disconnected dead areas and even short-circuits. Keep that motor clean!

Additionally, almost all the *other* components in the car will die if they even get moist. The DC/DC converter and controller in particular are generally very sensitive to moisture. Sometimes contactors will work when submerged, but it's best not to take the chance. Protect all those parts with a waterproof component box.


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## kcblkeeley (May 8, 2008)

Guys, are you actually saying that a fully submerged, not "wet" motor, will be fine? We're not talking about just submerged either, we're talking about an inner "wake" in the engine compartment sloshing on everthing. I would not want to risk 5k worth of motor, contacts and controller. And we're talking about muddy. hard water at that.


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## GearHead (Jul 4, 2008)

I'm new to EV's, but I am quite familiar with harsh environments for motors and electronics.

The motor will survive just fine while submerged unless there is a break in the insulation; which is quite likely. You will most likely lose your electronics if they become submerged while powered. In short, I would avoid driving in water with your EV.

You might also consider protecting your electronics and electrical connections from moisture for better reliability. The humidity in New Orleans will severely shorten their life.


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## robau (Jun 26, 2008)

I'v seen the results in electrical equipment after one night of being submerged in a 4WD in a river in a powered up state with only 12 volts.










There were TO220 devices like this one with legs *GONE* due to galvanic corosion*.

*144 DC volts under water hmmmmmm
A flood of distiled water........

Now at least when you get through the water the fan and high RPM may dry things out fast.


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## Telco (Jun 28, 2008)

If it makes you feel better about it, a submerged water pump is an electric motor with a pumping mechanism attached, and they will work for 20+ years if you get a high quality one. A severe duty motor designed for outside use should be able to handle an occasional dunking.


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## etischer (Jun 16, 2008)

If your drive (motor controller) is capable of tripping due to ground fault, that will shut you down. I've seen brushed motors trip a drive on Ground Fault just due to dust build up. 

When the commutator switches current to different coils, there is a much higher voltage present than battery voltage. It's no different than an ignition coil. Im not saying there is a danger, just saying it's something to consider. Bearings and internal fan blades probably wouldn't do too well underwater either.


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## Dennis (Feb 25, 2008)

The pump motors used in Louisiana are not DC motors...They are either synchronous motors or induction motors. Induction motors do not have commutators and therefore can take the abuse of water with debris better, but the synchronous motors might be the old type that uses slip rings on the rotating exciter field rotor and could be damaged by debris in the water...


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## judebert (Apr 16, 2008)

kcblkeeley said:


> Guys, are you actually saying that a fully submerged, not "wet" motor, will be fine? We're not talking about just submerged either, we're talking about an inner "wake" in the engine compartment sloshing on everthing. I would not want to risk 5k worth of motor, contacts and controller. And we're talking about muddy. hard water at that.


The "muddy" is the part that bothers me about the motor. That'll cause problems now and later, gradually eroding your commutator away.

The "sloshing on everything" is actually the worse part. The DC/DC converter (if any) and controller shouldn't even get *damp* or they'll fail. Hard. 

I wouldn't worry (much) about driving my EV through a deep puddle, like we get in Florida during a heavy rainstorm. I'd take it slow, because I don't want to splash rooster tails up inside the engine compartment and wet my other electronic components. 

I wouldn't go through actual flooded areas, though. Too much dirt grinding inside my motor, too much chance to dunk something delicate.


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