# Quest for a new charger



## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

I find it amusing that in this day and age of EV industry we are still struggling for a decent EV battery charger. Why is it so difficult?

I was somewhat content with my Elcon PFC2500 for last couple of years until one day it just decided to commit suicide. I refuse to give more money to the same people who peddle this garbage and insult their customers by not allowing them to fully control the charge profile.

I also want more than 2.5kW power for opportunity charging during the day, is it too much to ask for 6kW to take full advantage of Level 2 stations?

I want it to be sealed or at least designed for some level of environmental protection, so it can sit under the hood without collecting dirt and moisture inside the case.

I want voltage range at least up to 200V, and ability to adjust it anyway I want, not just 10 steps. I don't care if its canbus or serial or trimpot, as long as its reliable.

And best wish, I want it to work for at least 5 years in automotive environment without any suicidal tendencies.

Did you notice I did not ask for cheap? Good things cost money, I get it. I want to pay, as long as I am not paying for some corporate dude to fly on his corporate jet to his private island. I want to support engineering efforts, not marketing bullshit.

Am I dreaming?


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

In my quest for a new charger I stumbled on this little guy, CH4100
http://www.igreatway.com/msg.php?id=132

I am apprehensive of Chinese sites claiming to be manufacturer, as most of them are just resellers claiming to be a factory. The case looks nice, but that is about all you can say, it could have same garbage inside as Elcon for all I know.

Then I find Thunderstruck EV has these paired to their own charge controller
http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/pfc-ii-2500-and-charge-controller.html

Sure, its still puny 2.5kW , but at least fits many of my other criteria. However, does anyone know if they are reliable? Anyone peeked inside to see if design stands up to engineering scrutiny, etc?


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## z_power (Dec 17, 2011)

Eltek chargers seem to fulfill your checklist, they're CAN controlled and available in IP65 version however they'd need to be paralleled to take advantage of 32A charging station.

If I could add something to wishlist it would be 3 phase input for euro charging points (16/32A, 400V)


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

I ended up with a pair of Brusa's 6.6kw total, didn't break the bank on the used market and short term experience has been extremely good.

Finding the lower voltage ones could be tricky, most are the NLG513 (won't make max power till around 260v but will charge almost anything at reduced power)


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

dimitri said:


> I find it amusing that in this day and age of EV industry we are still struggling for a decent EV battery charger. Why is it so difficult?
> 
> I was somewhat content with my Elcon PFC2500 for last couple of years until one day it just decided to commit suicide. I refuse to give more money to the same people who peddle this garbage and insult their customers by not allowing them to fully control the charge profile.
> 
> ...


+1 on that Dimitri.

I've mentioned this many times before on this forum but I find it an absolute mystery that there are any number of good controller/inverter options available to the DIY EV industry but no one makes a decent charger...

Doesn't it make sense that for every controller sold a charger would also have to be sold?

Here's hoping you find one.


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

z_power said:


> Eltek chargers seem to fulfill your checklist, they're CAN controlled and available in IP65 version however they'd need to be paralleled to take advantage of 32A charging station.


IP67, actually. We use Eltek at EVDrive and never have any problems with them.


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

quick search for Eltek dealer in US did not find any sites where this charger is offered, only a contact info for a dealer in Texas. Anyone knows how to buy it? I prefer not to import from Europe due to shipping costs.

Meanwhile I spoke to guys at Thunderstruck about CH4100 and I am starting to like it, along with their EVCC controller it seems like a nice option. They will soon have a model which can be paralleled for higher power, so I could get 2 units and control them with one EVCC unit. It goes to 180V, perfect for up to 50 cell pack. EVCC integrates with J1772 signals, so I don't have to add any extra circuits. They claim the charger is good quality and had no failures yet, but admittedly they only had it for a year, so quality remains to be proven.


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## arklan (Dec 10, 2012)

http://www.thebackshed.com/basiclynatural/ViewItem.asp?CL1=17&CL2=53&CL3=NA&id=52


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

Someone recently mentioned this charger to me:

http://www.currentways.com/ev-battery-chargers/liquid-cooled-chargers/3kw-bc-series-liquid-cooled-ev-battery-charger-225-450vdc/

Does anyone have experience with this? Is it any good?


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## kennybobby (Aug 10, 2012)

dimitri said:


> ... I was somewhat content with my Elcon PFC2500 for last couple of years until one day it just decided to commit suicide....


Hey dimitri did you get that charger from Elcon or TCCH? The reason i ask is that i have replaced some of the components in your charger for paul so he can reprogram it. What i noticed is that the circuit board and components only indicate that it is a 2kW charger that started out life as the 120V-15A model. The output transformer is marked 14:7 ratio and 164 volts, but the PWM and output inductors are tagged 146V and 2kW. 
Seems that trying to push a 120 charger to run at 160 is pushing the margins.

There is a voltage detector chip on the digital board to control the reset line to the microprocessor during startup and power dropouts, etc.--yours was blown somehow, first time i've seen that fail.

The TCCH chargers have a good design with PFC on the input, a PWM boost stage, and voltage and current feedback control on the output to the battery--the biggest weak point is the lack of a user interface.


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

kennybobby said:


> Hey dimitri did you get that charger from Elcon or TCCH?


I got it from Elcon. I was planning to get 3kW model, but they talked me into 2500 model since it was "newer and better" product at that time. I think I have one of their first 2500 units, so its not surprising that its just a 2kW unit pushed to its limits. I hope that later units have been improved and I was an unlucky guinea pig, but I am not going to find out as I am done with Elcon. Its time to try something else.

Its really great that you and Paul and Coulomb are trying to make these chargers more open and provide repair service, etc. Maybe others will have better luck, especially with your help.


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## pdove (Jan 9, 2012)

dimitri said:


> I got it from Elcon. I was planning to get 3kW model, but they talked me into 2500 model since it was "newer and better" product at that time. I think I have one of their first 2500 units, so its not surprising that its just a 2kW unit pushed to its limits. I hope that later units have been improved and I was an unlucky guinea pig, but I am not going to find out as I am done with Elcon. Its time to try something else.
> 
> Its really great that you and Paul and Coulomb are trying to make these chargers more open and provide repair service, etc. Maybe others will have better luck, especially with your help.


Yours is close to fixed. I got the control board working again but it looks like one of the big caps on the output is swollen a little so I haven't tried to power it. Ken replaced the processor and the voltage detector and I reprogrammed it yesterday and checked out it the code ran and it does. The red LED was blinking once a second. 

These are great chargers. The only thing I would change is the cooling and the user interface. Very efficient design.


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

An update to my quest for a new charger. I ended up choosing 2 units CH4100 from Thunderstruck-EV along with their EVCC controller.

http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/pfc-ii-2500-and-charge-controller.html

I just installed one charger and EVCC to replace my burned Elcon, works great so far. Aluminum enclosure is beautiful, looks on par next to Solion1.

Of course being an EE myself, I immediately opened up the charger to see how well the magic smoke is contained inside. Its a much much cleaner design compared to Elcon. Mostly SMT components, very nice PCB layouts, overall very professional design and high quality assembly, looks like it was made for OEM EVs.

Its controlled by isolated Canbus interface, for which guys at Thunderstruck designed a beautiful EVCC controller. EVCC comes with detailed documentation, pre-wired connections and even includes a USB dongle for programming.
You can use your computer to connect to EVCC and set desired charge voltage, current, timeout, etc. You have complete control of charge settings, no more shipping of chargers to the dealer, woohoo 

In a few weeks I will shuffle some stuff around under the hood and will install 2nd charger in parallel, which will give me 5kW of charging power. EVCC supports up to 4 chargers in parallel on the same Canbus.

At $750 for a kit this is a really good deal too.


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## PStechPaul (May 1, 2012)

That is a good looking design, on the outside at least. Do you have any pictures of the inside?

Although I do plan to build a charger of similar size (1500-2500W), I don't intend to compete with such units. My concept is for a more DIY kit that can be easily modified and built inexpensively by anyone with basic skills and knowledge or desire to learn.


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## spades (Jan 22, 2015)

I have a EDN group charger. 7kW. It is brand new


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## spades (Jan 22, 2015)

Oops....... I forgot to check the last page


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## rmay635703 (Oct 23, 2008)

All I am looking for is a cheap 2 stage variable voltage charger that charges at a set rate and then holds a max voltage I set.

You would think the Chinese could make an adjustable unit that does this properly without overshooting or undershooting the set voltage but

sadly I am wrong.


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## Elad (Mar 11, 2015)

dimitri said:


> I find it amusing that in this day and age of EV industry we are still struggling for a decent EV battery charger. Why is it so difficult?
> 
> I was somewhat content with my Elcon PFC2500 for last couple of years until one day it just decided to commit suicide. I refuse to give more money to the same people who peddle this garbage and insult their customers by not allowing them to fully control the charge profile.
> 
> ...


Try These guys: http://www.amicell.co.il/chargers-analyzers/chargers/


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## Baratong (Nov 29, 2012)

dimitri said:


> An update to my quest for a new charger. I ended up choosing 2 units CH4100 from Thunderstruck-EV along with their EVCC controller.
> 
> http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/pfc-ii-2500-and-charge-controller.html


I bought this one too a couple weeks ago. EVWest carries it too. I liked that it came with a full EVCC as well as the basic charger.


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

dimitri said:


> An update to my quest for a new charger. I ended up choosing 2 units CH4100 from Thunderstruck-EV along with their EVCC controller.
> 
> http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/pfc-ii-2500-and-charge-controller.html
> 
> ...


This definitely looks like a good option but what about the low max voltage? the specs suggest 180V max output so I'm guess a 140-160V pack is about as high as you could go. Am I correct?

I'm looking for a new charger myself but my new battery pack configuration is 192V so I guess I need to keep looking


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> This definitely looks like a good option but what about the low max voltage? the specs suggest 180V max output so I'm guess a 140-160V pack is about as high as you could go. Am I correct?
> 
> I'm looking for a new charger myself but my new battery pack configuration is 192V so I guess I need to keep looking


Yes, CH4100 only goes to 180V max voltage. I did not find anything close to this price range with higher voltage. CurrentWays mentioned above in this thread has a model which fits your voltage range, but they quoted $2000 for a 3kW charger, which in my opinion is too high for such low power level.


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

Wanted to post a happy ending to my quest for a new charger.
I got both chargers installed in parallel for a 5kW charging, also added JuiceBox Pro on the wall and J1772 plug in the car.
At first there were software issues with 2 chargers in parallel, but ThunderStruck guys handled it perfectly, reproduced the issue at their end, updated EVCC firmware and sent me updated EVCC box.

Here are some pics showing 30A charge ( at 170V ) and how I fit 2 chargers under the hood.
Chargers are mounted on aluminum cold plate with liquid cooling passing under the plate, in addition to their builtin fans. I extended liquid cooling loop from Soliton1 to also pass thru charger's cold plate and wired the pump to run when charging.


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## pdove (Jan 9, 2012)

Nice job! Very professional. Do you need 30 amps most days? I have found 16 amps plenty for daily driving.


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## dimitri (May 16, 2008)

pdove said:


> Nice job! Very professional. Do you need 30 amps most days? I have found 16 amps plenty for daily driving.


I don't need it most of the time, but I wanted ability to charger faster at Level2 stations if I ever need to take longer drives, plus its nice to have if I make 2-3 drives in one day sometimes.


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## skooler (Mar 26, 2011)

Looks good.

I'm late to this thread but have found brusa to be top quality. No mention of them in this thread.


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