# I-PACE battery assembly



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

I can only guess that the pouch cell tabs are welded together, because that's how modules of pouch cells are always done.

I'm sure that the parallel connections (of groups of four cells) are at the lowest level, with the resulting groups being connected in series (3 groups in a module), because that's the only rational way to do it. That is usually written as 3S4P... the lowest level on the right - but there's no firm rule about the notation. Breaking the cells up into 2P groups will likely mean breaking half the connections in the module. 

I did look at my notes and saved links, and while there appear to be 36 identical modules in the pack - made by LG Chem in Poland - I can't find any detail about the internal design of the modules beyond that the modules have 12 cells and a 3S configuration.

Perhaps they're the same as the LG Chem modules sold by Zero EV? The drawing posted by Zero EV calls it an "X590 module", and "X590" is the internal Jaguar project code for the I-Pace. The cell count, approximate dimensions, and overall configuration match. Someone at Zero EV may be able to help.


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

brian_ said:


> I can only guess that the pouch cell tabs are welded together, because that's how modules of pouch cells are always done.
> 
> I'm sure that the parallel connections (of groups of four cells) are at the lowest level, with the resulting groups being connected in series (3 groups in a module), because that's the only rational way to do it. That is usually written as 3S4P... the lowest level on the right - but there's no firm rule about the notation. Breaking the cells up into 2P groups will likely mean breaking half the connections in the module.


I agree. My intention is to make 2 packs of 2P100S or so cells. This means i would need to break the 4P connection in halfh. I see with E-Tron cells it could be possible, but i would have to then reconnect them somehow and reverse contacts. Maybe 1mm aluminum plate with 3 screws on each side.


----------



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

arber333 said:


> Maybe 1mm aluminum plate with 3 screws on each side.


The Chevrolet Bolt also uses LG Chem modules, so the work tiger82 did to reconfigure Bolt modules should be relevant:
Modified Bolt Pack for Tesla Cobra EV Race Car

... and one note from another thread:


tiger82 said:


> We had copper connectors and backup plates CNC cut and bent. Everything was assembled with M5 nuts/bolts. Nuts were oval locking type. Holes were drilled on a drill press using a jig.


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

Well thank you for that link. This is exactly how i have assembled my Kokam cells. Also i am looking for any info on how those LG cells are assembled inside Ipace modules. There seem to be copper bus plates across each module side. Bus plate is cut/indented so it can accept cell tab. Those tabs are then collected together and (friction) welded to bus plates. 
My second plan will require cutting the bus plates where cells are welded as to make (2P + 2P)+(2P + 2P)+(2P + 2P). Then i intend to split 2P connections and connect them into 2x 2P3S so that i can make 2x 45Ah packs. 

Also now it seems even alu module skin is welded together. So i will have to cut carefully on the sides and remove the sides to get cells out!


----------



## jmeuk (Nov 25, 2018)

arber333 said:


> Hi
> 
> Does anyone have any pics available of I-PACE 4P3S battery module assembly?
> I may get a Jag battery here... 90kWh! But i will need to rewire those cell modules. Does anyone have any pic on how those modules look on the inside? I need to know if cells can be disassembled from 4P3S configuration to say 2P3S. If they are assembled by bolts or welded... I need to prepare on what is possible.
> ...






 disassemble video


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

tnx for the video...

in the meantime i took apart the actual battery and made some photos.
I also managed to split 4P modules and join them in 96S2P configuration.
It works now in my Pug.
Enjoy!








Jaguar IPACE battery porn


Yes i have promised you exciting times with my new battery from Jaguar IPACE.Battery itself is some 90kWh and 388Vdc nominal. Configuration is 4P108S!Dimensions are 225 cm x 145 cm x 15 cm, weight …




leafdriveblog.wordpress.com












Jaguar IPACE battery full monty


Last time i posted my first attempt at taking off alu box off Jaguar battery modules. That was a scary adventure, since the battery is glued to the bottom by some thermal compound. We couldnt make …




leafdriveblog.wordpress.com


----------



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

arber333 said:


> in the meantime i took apart the actual battery and made some photos.
> I also managed to split 4P modules and join them in 96S2P configuration.


Great work, and thanks for sharing it. 

Was there anything that you considered a surprise in the construction, or was it what you expected, as discussed months ago? From your description and photos, it all appears to be as expected, except bonded together and encased, rather than clamped in a stack.


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

brian_ said:


> Great work, and thanks for sharing it.
> 
> Was there anything that you considered a surprise in the construction, or was it what you expected, as discussed months ago? From your description and photos, it all appears to be as expected, except bonded together and encased, rather than clamped in a stack.


I was annoyed by the blue thermal glue. It was spread thinly so i had to be very carefull when taking apart individual cell stacks. 
Also i saw that copper contacts were welded by laser and alu contacts were welded by friction.

After some thought it came to me that i can just cut and split the copper contacts, drill some holes and torque them by M5 bolts. I had to arrange cell tabs so there would not be too much tension because of the misplaced holes. But 3000km and everything seems solid.

I am also thinking of making a liquid cooled plate to sit between both cells...


----------



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

arber333 said:


> I was annoyed by the blue thermal glue. It was spread thinly so i had to be very carefull when taking apart individual cell stacks.


It's not surprising that the assembly without clamping bolts would be glued, but I can certainly believe it would be annoying. Recycling these is going to be a pain.



arber333 said:


> Also i saw that copper contacts were welded by laser and alu contacts were welded by friction.


Although I might not have guessed that, it makes physical sense for those materials.



arber333 said:


> After some thought it came to me that i can just cut and split the copper contacts, drill some holes and torque them by M5 bolts. I had to arrange cell tabs so there would not be too much tension because of the misplaced holes. But 3000km and everything seems solid.


Like tiger82 and the Chevrolet Bolt modules in their Tesla-powered Cobra.

I'm glad it's working out. That's valuable experience for others. 



arber333 said:


> I am also thinking of making a liquid cooled plate to sit between both cells...


Again like the Cobra, essentially replicating the design of the LG Chem modules in the Chevrolet Volt. Would the improved heat transfer worth the extra work, compared to the original "chill plate on one module face" design?


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

brian_ said:


> Again like the Cobra, essentially replicating the design of the LG Chem modules in the Chevrolet Volt. Would the improved heat transfer worth the extra work, compared to the original "chill plate on one module face" design?


Yes Cobra battery thread was an inspiration. But i dont see the need to fully cool the battery. My idea is to draw/bring heat from/to batteries inside insulated box during normal use or fast charging.
I need to think of a way because i have the cells packed quite tightly in packs of 2P8S and then two such packs are one over the other. I think it would be best to cool the cells in the middle between two packs https://openinverter.org/forum/download/file.php?id=7030&mode=view. That way would be most efficient i think. And i would only need one chill plate per two packs.
Lots of spagetti tubes though...


----------



## SecondLife-EVBatteries (Apr 2, 2020)

arber333 said:


> Hi
> 
> Does anyone have any pics available of I-PACE 4P3S battery module assembly?
> I may get a Jag battery here... 90kWh! But i will need to rewire those cell modules. Does anyone have any pic on how those modules look on the inside? I need to know if cells can be disassembled from 4P3S configuration to say 2P3S. If they are assembled by bolts or welded... I need to prepare on what is possible.
> ...


I have lots of pack photos if required here at Second life EV Batteries Ltd. more information can be found on www.slevb.com Individual modules are also for sale

hope this image of of some help


----------



## Richards ipace (9 mo ago)

I’ve got an ipace and an off grid house , I was thinking of re doing my solar and I was wondering if I can utilise my ipace battery to power my house ? It sounds simple in my head. Connect a huge inverter to the car and olug it in to my house electrical system , but I don’t know if it’s a simple process could any of you geniuses shed some light on it for me plz ?


----------



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Richards ipace said:


> I’ve got an ipace and an off grid house , I was thinking of re doing my solar and I was wondering if I can utilise my ipace battery to power my house ? It sounds simple in my head. Connect a huge inverter to the car and olug it in to my house electrical system , but I don’t know if it’s a simple process could any of you geniuses shed some light on it for me plz ?


What you're looking to do is Bidirectional local V2G (V2H , V2B, V2X) power transfer. It is fundamentally just what you described, but there are enough important details that it's not an easy thing to do - it makes sense to buy an EV which is already capable of supporting this, with the charging connection that goes with it. The inverter can be in either the vehicle or the charging station.

This recent article discusses the state of availability, from the point of view of a charging station manufacturer which promotes V2G:
New year, new bidirectional cars


----------



## Sukhjeevan (7 mo ago)

Hi,

I'm completely new to EV converisons! My only experience is building an Ultima Evolution and I own a Taycan Turbo and Tesla 3 Performance.

I've just purchased the iPace battery packs and was wondering what the best cooling method was. Single large water cooled plate underneath all the packs or individual smaller plates between the packs. I was planning on leaving the cells in the iPace containers. My application will be 2 battery boxes, one in the front and one in the rear of a 911.

Thanks


----------



## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

All depends how you package the battery boxes and what resources you have (if you are milling, the max x,y of the machine constrains what you do), and tye raw materials you can get (like if you have to have the plates mailed or shipped, raw or machined, on a standard pallet). There's also handling the weight of a giant plate...

Less fluid connections is better, so my first choice would be to minimize the plates - 1 per box in your case.


----------



## Sukhjeevan (7 mo ago)

remy_martian said:


> All depends how you package the battery boxes and what resources you have (if you are milling, the max x,y of the machine constrains what you do), and tye raw materials you can get (like if you have to have the plates mailed or shipped, raw or machined, on a standard pallet). There's also handling the weight of a giant plate...
> 
> Less fluid connections is better, so my first choice would be to minimize the plates - 1 per box in your case.


I can obtain whatever material is best and also find a suitable machine shop to mill. I assume individual plates are more effective in removing heat, but yes as you say the less fluid connections the better. Also, I've seen some battery boxes that look completely sealed. I assume that is for safety reasons but how does that impact heat extraction?


----------



## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

It doesn't. The battery cells are liquid cooled, so being in a closed box is irrelevant.

The boxes are "closed off" (still are vented) more for dust and weather concerns in homebrew conversions, though a steel box does provide a fire barrier to buy time to bail out in the unlikely even the pack lights off. As far as crash safety, some might consider it, but I doubt most go into that level of design.


----------



## Sukhjeevan (7 mo ago)

What's the best way to store the batteries whilst I wait to kick off the conversion? I'm planning on keeping them in a warm spare room for now but should I keep them charged whilst stored?


----------



## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

How long before you use them?


----------



## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

And actually over on the photovoltaic sites, keeping them cold delays aging effects with just above 0c or 32f being good, but impractical. Many chemistry will survive being frozen, but you cant charge or discharge at those temps.


----------



## arber333 (Dec 13, 2010)

Discharge them to 3.8V per cell and keep them somewhere cool or at least at stable temperature. This is long term storage for Liion cells.


----------



## dzup4uk (1 mo ago)

I have one module “JLR X590” of I-pace battery. Is there a way to connect BMS to this single module without disassembling it?


----------

