# Chevy Volt motor (2) and trans



## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Looks like Remy motors 150 and 74 hp , oil cooled with electric pump, with hacking could you get a lot more out of this ?yes!
Next comes the best part , the planetary gear which has 2 modes of operation,#1 motor locked as one to #2 motor/ generator(high eff.mode). 
Next mode , main motor running sun gear and #2 motor running the ring gear , the output going threw the planet gears to spider( connects planet gears together to output).
By altering the speed and direction of the motors you get infinite output speeds at 98% eff., gear loads are balanced so long life and very light.

This is the drive type used on the Mars landers. 

Does anyone know of any hacking of the volt drive?


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

I must say I am interested as well.


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## sunworksco (Sep 8, 2008)

Isn't the GM Spark EV the same drive train as the Volt?

*GM Spark Drivetrain*


Does anyone know how much the Sparky weighs?
This might be the perfect retrofit for the air-cooled VW boxer engine and tranny?


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Based on info I've seen in articles like the one linked below, I doubt they are the same.

http://insideevs.com/gm-general-says-spark-evs-400lb-ft-of-torque-no-misprint/


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

this is how the volt motors work▶ Chevrolet Volt Drive Simulation - YouTube


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

I would think the volt will get the spark motor tech. Volt is 175 hp and 75 hp. This could be mind blowing combined with infinite gears.


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## sunworksco (Sep 8, 2008)

GM should consider ditching the ICE and installing two of the Spark drive trains, one front and one rear for all-wheel-drive.
Now that would be something special.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

how about volt trans in a 4X4 infinite ratio, great rock crawler.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Thinking about the spark motor.Low voltage windings means motor makes less back voltage. So as speed goes up the controller makes higher voltage called volts/herts mode , the amps stay up so torque stays up longer.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

aeroscott said:


> Does anyone know of any hacking of the volt drive?


 There is a video on the Volt Forums with a guy demonstrating a 5.5 sec 0-60mph sprint in his volt just with "hacked" software. !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA4fLSuvkk8


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Is there anything on his hack?


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## !George (Jun 9, 2009)

aeroscott said:


> Is there anything on his hack?


I know the software he is using is called EFILive, and is primarily used for tuning ICE cars. I'm thinking that he's controlling the engine to bring up the power levels to allow him to spin the motor up quicker. And apparently, the VCM doesn't like _that_ at all.

Typical GM.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

I was thinking about the GM comment about reducing inersha by lowering the gear ratio on the Spark , good point. With the volt you have 2 motors running so inersha can be reduced by the speed changes being split between the motors. 
the other neat thing that the Spark does is to use planetary gear for the 
final drive gear.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

With 2 drives and Spark torque technology applied to the Volt drive , you would get 600 ft lbs. per unit times 2 or 1200 ft. lbs. , the most powerful
street car in the world class.


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## Batterypoweredtoad (Feb 5, 2008)

YOu can't compare gear multiplied electric motor torque to engine dyno ICE numbers. Different things. Apple's to orangutans.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

number for number the ice loses .


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## Batterypoweredtoad (Feb 5, 2008)

You are comparing torque through a transmission for the electric drivetrain to the ICE' s engine only torque. My 100 ft.lb. ICE Miata puts ~1200 ft.lbs. to the wheels in first gear if you count the transmission and differential in the equation. Volt and spark motors might make phenomenal torque, but I doubt they are 600 ft.lbs. each unmultiplied. I seriously doubt they are on par with the 2000amp each warp9s in the assault and battery car.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Thats motor torque not geared torque.geared would be much higher, lowest would be 1200X 7.35(final drive)=8820 ft.lbs.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Please read the links.


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## Batterypoweredtoad (Feb 5, 2008)

aeroscott said:


> Please read the links.


OK, I read the links. Spark is 402 ft.lbs. from 0-about 2000 rpm with a tall final drive of 3.18/1. So that carries the torque to around 40 mph. So basically they wound the motor for higher torque and fewer rpm. So you wouldn't be competing with supercars with two of them, you would be competing with diesel trucks. 

I would love a supercar with two volt drivetrains. I don't think it would be a Ferrari killer is all.


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## kerrymann (Feb 17, 2011)

I actually have a volt motor and gearbox sitting in my shop right now (and the inverter and battery too). I need to get the pictures and video's I have of it but I can say it's not lite. I will try to get a weight on it. 

The powering the coaxial dual motor is a challenge but I think if you can get the OEM inverter up and running it would be a nice package. I have my '13 volt that I could use to try to sniff out the control commands but it is not a easy task. I will try to get the pictures up tonight if anyone is interested.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

I'm thinking 300 lbs. Love to see your pictures.
Hacking the inverter would great, after that I would like to have higher voltage to increase the torque range (volts/hertz(speed)) closer to 6k rpm. This is what the brush motors and Tesla do . the back emf of a low voltage motor( verses high) is less at any given rpm ac or dc .All motors are generators, when they turn they make voltage the faster the higher. This back emf reduces the net voltage into the motor and amps fall with the reduced "seen" voltage , torque falls in relation to amps as the speed is increased .If you can match and exceed the back emf, torque will stay the same , but rpm increasing means more hp(torque X rpm= hp).


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Batterypoweredtoad said:


> OK, I read the links. Spark is 402 ft.lbs. from 0-about 2000 rpm with a tall final drive of 3.18/1. So that carries the torque to around 40 mph. So basically they wound the motor for higher torque and fewer rpm. So you wouldn't be competing with supercars with two of them, you would be competing with diesel trucks.
> 
> I would love a supercar with two volt drivetrains. I don't think it would be a Ferrari killer is all.


 Not with the stock motors .But with Spark type improvements to volt motors 600 ft. lbs. could be had. Then a higher voltage battery pack/controller = same torque at higher rpm , say 6000rpm thats 3X more hp. with variable trans and less inertia..unbeatable .


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

So a volt has 220 hp of electric motor X 3 =660 hp


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

The next problem is traction, which Dan Gurney in a group 7 car solved in 1970 . He used a 40 hp blower to create suction under the car. It was outlawed by the S.C.C.A. after 3 races.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Batterypoweredtoad said:


> OK, I read the links. Spark is 402 ft.lbs. from 0-about 2000 rpm with a tall final drive of 3.18/1. So that carries the torque to around 40 mph. So basically they wound the motor for higher torque and fewer rpm. So you wouldn't be competing with supercars with two of them, you would be competing with diesel trucks.
> 
> I would love a supercar with two volt drivetrains. I don't think it would be a Ferrari killer is all.


 Look at the link in post #5 , variable transmission , so torque is available at all speeds.


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## kerrymann (Feb 17, 2011)

aeroscott said:


> I'm thinking 300 lbs. Love to see your pictures.
> Hacking the inverter would great, after that I would like to have higher voltage to increase the torque range (volts/hertz(speed)) closer to 6k rpm.


Hi Scott, I didn't want to hijack this thread so I put them in a new post here: 

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forum...mpting-hack-chevy-volt-drivetrain-107946.html


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## Batterypoweredtoad (Feb 5, 2008)

aeroscott said:


> Look at the link in post #5 , variable transmission , so torque is available at all speeds.


Same wheel torque at 41 mph, more below, and probably more than stock above but falling rapidly with either setup.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

We are talking engine/motor torque. The trans is keeping the motor in it's highest torque range at all speeds. All trans trade torque for speed.


There are some big advantages to the bar winding on the Spark, Volt and Reme motors. Winding to winding voltages are low and can be raw copper and raped or encased with cooling channels. 



How about 4 volt trans, One for each wheel on heavy 4X4. 200 to 1 rock crawling.


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## dougingraham (Jul 26, 2011)

aeroscott said:


> Look at the link in post #5 , variable transmission , so torque is available at all speeds.


It isn't a variable transmission. There is a single final reduction ratio. They use the second motor/generator under high speed conditions to add power into the planetary gear which lowers the RPM of the primary motor. This would keep the primary motor in its torque band. It is an interesting way to widen the torque band and doesn't have any of the problems of a CVT.


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

They don't do the best job of explaining it and it's potential. A friend had one of these 2 motor drives in his boat 15 years ago . They also used these in the mars lander. It was a English co. 
The volts final drive ratio is 2.16 to 1 ,fixed, GM says this reduces losses (friction)
The sun gear is 3.24 to 1 , To the planet carrier,ring gear locked, I think
Ring gear is 1.45 to 1, to the planet carrier, sun locked, I think 
Now to what outputs are possible , motors bidirectional


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

aeroscott said:


> The next problem is traction, which Dan Gurney in a group 7 car solved in 1970 . He used a 40 hp blower to create suction under the car. It was outlawed by the S.C.C.A. after 3 races.


 I guess you are referring to the Chaparral *2J*. ?
If so , that was Jim Halls design... not Gurneys ( who drove for MClaren)
Credit where it is due !


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Sebastian Vettel driving GT5 RedbullX1 prototype at Nürburgring GP Course - YouTube thanks, thats it
saw the X1 simulated fan car youtube


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

I love wagons, MB 124 diesel or for a glider the 4matic . But MB parts $.
So the next pick would the Volvo XC70 4X4 wagon , very rugged suspension, much cheaper parts , owner tell me they have electric problems .So did the venerable 240 ,they didn't support the wiring harness , helped sell new cars .


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## aeroscott (Jan 5, 2008)

Volt gears
2.16 to 1 diff.
3.24 to 1 sun gear (main motor)
1.45 to 1 ring gear (generator)
main and diff. = 2.16x3.24=6.99 to 1 (gen locked)
main and gen (reversed but same rpm) =2.16x3.24x1.45=10.147 to 1
main 2000 rpm and gen reversed 6000 rpm= 2.16 x 3.24 x 4.35=30.44 to1

(1.45 x 6000/2000=4.35)


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