# traction pack short-> 12v system fry?



## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

What kind of batteries, Do you have photos and schematics of your setup? kinda hard to diagnose from such little information. When you say isolated except for the contactor I assume you mean that you have 12 volts from your Aux battery or DC DC connected to the contactor or some wire from the controller to the Aux that feeds from the 12 volt system? 

A schematic would be great and some good pictures too. 


Pete 

The answer as it stands is: Don't know.


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

thanks for the quick reply. 

answers: no DC/DC converter. just a 12v car battery with it's own charger, and a traction pack made up of 28 brand new Bestgo 160Ah cells with it's own charger. 

yes, there is one wire from the battery connected to a relay to the contactor and controller. I'll try to draw a diagram/schematic but I'm not an expert on how to draw these things. see photos below, hopefully this makes some things more clear








this is how the pack looks wired up now. 









My awful attempt at a diagram








it was in this battery box, the batteries on the right were hooked together, but not hooked to the rest of the pack when they shorted. 







the box on the right contains the contactor and two relays that flip that and activate the pot box.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Don't you have a fuse?


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

yes, there are several fuses in the 12v system, as in the OP, they're all fine. i have 1 slow-blow 650a fuse on the traction pack, it was not connected to the part of the pack that shorted


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

it has been my experience with air cooled VW's that by now you either will have a 12 v harness event ( dash fire) or there has been one {usually poorly repaired}. Other than fuel gauge and assorted lightbulbs /stereo there ain't a whole lot to destroy and replacement harnesses can be purchased. IMHO there is still more to this story that needs to be shared.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

Are your chargers isolated? Where are all those battery taps going?


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## azdeltawye (Dec 30, 2008)

mikesarge said:


> ...hopefully this makes some things more clear
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That unfused 'spaghetti' BMS wiring scares the hell out of me...


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

piotrsko said:


> it has been my experience with air cooled VW's that by now you either will have a 12 v harness event ( dash fire) or there has been one {usually poorly repaired}. Other than fuel gauge and assorted lightbulbs /stereo there ain't a whole lot to destroy and replacement harnesses can be purchased. IMHO there is still more to this story that needs to be shared.


there isn't much more to the story than what i've shared. I was installing the pack with a person from the group that sold me the batteries, he dropped a bus bar on the partially assembled pack, sparks flew. the pack wasn't connected to anything but itsself at the time.


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

Ziggythewiz said:


> Are your chargers isolated? Where are all those battery taps going?


the chargers are isolated. the small wires are for the ligoo bms system


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

azdeltawye said:


> That unfused 'spaghetti' BMS wiring scares the hell out of me...


thanks for the comment. i am installing it as per the instructions from the manufacturer alongside the person who sold it to me, so i am taking their word on the, as you put it, "unfused spaghetti" configuration.


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## TEV (Nov 25, 2011)

mikesarge said:


> there isn't much more to the story than what i've shared. I was installing the pack with a person from the group that sold me the batteries, he dropped a bus bar on the partially assembled pack, sparks flew. the pack wasn't connected to anything but itsself at the time.


If this is the case, then the only possible damage was to that pack, if it wasn't connected to anything else then your 12V system should be fine.

P.S. Also I have the feeling that you are located in Utah


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

TEV said:


> Also I have the feeling that you are located in Utah


you just might be correct! 

so it turns out sitting for nearly two years will completely dry out a FLA battery.. new battery, 12v system is working, now to get the bugs worked out of the BMS system and after years of waiting get this thing back on the road!


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## jeremyjs (Sep 22, 2010)

mikesarge said:


> thanks for the comment. i am installing it as per the instructions from the manufacturer alongside the person who sold it to me, so i am taking their word on the, as you put it, "unfused spaghetti" configuration.


It looks like an accident/fire/bad things, waiting to happen.


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## TEV (Nov 25, 2011)

Good luck, and hope to see a test drive video from you very soon .


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

jeremyjs said:


> It looks like an accident/fire/bad things, waiting to happen.


cool, thanks for the opinion. re-stating what's already been said is doing nothing but trolling. it's all extremely low voltage, installed as per factory instructions. if I wanted your opinion on that I would have asked. BYE


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

TEV said:


> Good luck, and hope to see a test drive video from you very soon .


I've driven it a little bit, but no video! it's going to be a bit because the charger is not charging my batteries.. we will see what comes of this. i may be returning it and getting a different model. more to come on my build thread...


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## Siwastaja (Aug 1, 2012)

mikesarge said:


> cool, thanks for the opinion. re-stating what's already been said is doing nothing but trolling. it's all extremely low voltage, installed as per factory instructions. if I wanted your opinion on that I would have asked. BYE


I'm sorry to say, but he's absolutely right. Of course it's low voltage - but it's extremely high current, hence the importance of the fuses, or at least REALLY careful and well considered insulation analysis. If the factory really instructed you to use unfused, thinly insulated spaghetti wiring, the factory is wrong. Your car is a fire danger, a catastrophe waiting to happen. Especially with your attitude here, I wish you best of luck. Luck indeed.


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## mikesarge (Sep 8, 2008)

Once again, I've heard it already. Criticism/advice noted. I'm now reevaluating how this whole lithium setup has been put together. The Internet is most often full of "experts" and I have bought this setup from people whom I assumed were actual experts, but as I deal with them and the issues with actually getting everything to function properly, im figuring out I probably bought a bunch of snake oil. My apologies for going off on the last poster, it just comes across as a bit of a troll when you simply repeat something that has been mentioned and acknowledged already.


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## TEV (Nov 25, 2011)

Please check your PM.


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