# DON'T MISS Top Gear 11/05/13 @10PM EST!



## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

For anyone who has not seen the previes for this up-coming episode [on the history channel], this is the one that members of this forum probably should NOT miss out on seeing. The reason being is that it looks like it is the ELECTRIC VEHICLE episode! The preview even showed what looks to be an ELECTRIC Porsche 944, maybe even being one that someone on THIS forum has converted. I don't know that for sure, but I believe that others on this site surely must be as excited about this as I seem to be.  I wish I would have given more than 1 day's notice, but better late than never, right? I'm hoping that maybe someone could set up to record it, and then upload the .mp4 video file (minus the commercials) to this site so others who miss/missed out on catching it might have a second opportunity to see it. There is the possibility that I myself might even forget about tuning in to it at the time it is supposed to air!


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Got the DVR set


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## nedrapr (Mar 9, 2011)

Hi, 

I can shed some information on the upcoming episode. A Top Gear producer emailed NEDRA (National Electric Drag Racing Association) and proposed the idea of doing an episode with Top Gear hosts Tanner, Rutlege and Adam driving high powered EVs. The idea was to use conversions and try to get some NEDRA records. That was the original idea but plans change along the way. LOL. But the History Channel Executive Producers like the idea so I gave them the names of our active racers. Shawn Lawless offered to provide his S-10 called Lemon Juice and his Matrix Dragster and Lowell Simmons who is the automotive instructor at Mirmar High School in Florida offered the school's electric Porsche 944 called the Black Pearl. Both the Porsche and the S-10 can run solid 9's in the 1/4. They filmed the drag racing part of the episode at Mylan Dragway in Michigan but I don't know the speeds or ETs they ran. I can't wait to see how the episode turned out.


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## Coulomb (Apr 22, 2009)

I just hope it's not another EV humiliation exercise.


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## nedrapr (Mar 9, 2011)

There will be some humiliation, of course. LOL. If you watched previous episodes of the show Tanner, Adam and Rutledge compete against each other, this time using EVs. The winner gets a chance to test drive the sport version of the Tesla Model S. 

NEDRA has had some good luck in the past with TV shows. Did you catch John Wayland's appearance with the White Zombie a couple weeks ago on NOVA's "Making Things Faster?" 

We've also had some appearances in American Chopper, Monster Garage, Motorweek, Planet Green. The Daily Planet and more.

Producers come across the NEDRA website and call use with ideas. We are currently working with CBS on another project.

Chip Gribben
NEDRA PR Director


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

Coulomb said:


> I just hope it's not another EV humiliation exercise.


 Seriously?? With ET's solidly in the 9's, I can not fathom how that could possibly happen. For folks who don't have enough perspective on drag racing to know what impressive elapsed quarter-mile times might be, let me tell you that those kinds of #'s are INSANE - for any vehicle that is street legal, anyways. Have you ever heard of the drag racing show called "Pinks" (as in: the loosers must fork over their pink slips - the vehicle's title)? Although I have not seen it in quite a while, I don't recall EVER seeing an episode where ANY of the vehicles EVER made the trip in less than 10 seconds! A "fueled" vehicle with an elapsed time under 10sec should make somewhere close to maybe 160mph. But an electric vehicle's biggest advantage is at the starting line, not the finish line. I guess we'll just have to wait and see if the S-10 beats the open-wheeled DRAGSTER that it looks like it is going up against.


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Coulomb said:


> I just hope it's not another EV humiliation exercise.


Jeremy Clarkson is not on this version of Top Gear, so there is hope. He is the main reason for all the EV hate bs on the British TG.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Clarkson and the electric AMG....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCcNiF8ov78

http://www.topgear.com/uk/mercedes-benz/sls/road-test/electric-drive-driven

a much better review show..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IElqf-FCMs8


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Karter2 said:


> Clarkson and the electric AMG....
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCcNiF8ov78
> 
> http://www.topgear.com/uk/mercedes-benz/sls/road-test/electric-drive-driven


The full video for anyone who is curious:

http://www.streetfire.net/video/top-gear-20x04-20130721_part-1_2432236.htm


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## Coulomb (Apr 22, 2009)

rochesterricer said:


> The full video for anyone who is curious:
> 
> http://www.streetfire.net/video/top-gear-20x04-20130721_part-1_2432236.htm


Thanks!

So he's really impressed, but he still says you'd have to be soft in the head to buy the electric over the petrol.

Progress!


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

It turns out that the dragster, which the S-10 did NOT go up against, WAS also electric. They ALL went up against a [580hp] Z01 Camaro, and beat it. Off of the track, the boys' "challenge" vehicles consisted of an electric Focus, Leaf, and Fiat something. Rutledge won (with the leaf), securing the opportunity to put a Tesla model S through it's paces. In the end, they concluded that the tesla is the only one in which you don't look geeky driving. And with it's 265 mile range, it's the one that produces the least amount of "range anxiety". But due to electric charging stations being so few and far between on public roads at this point in time, it isn't non-existant. That model WILL set you back more than $100K though. Their overall conclusion was that electrics still have many "growing pains" (MY way of stating it) to get through before the technology is mature enough to become fully accepted by the masses.


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## ken will (Dec 19, 2009)

Electron Power said:


> And with it's 265 mile range, it's the one that produces the least amount of "range anxiety". But due to electric charging stations being so few and far between on public roads at this point in time, it isn't non-existant.


http://www.plugshare.com/

I zoomed in on Pennsylvania and there are several places where it was at least 50 miles between charge stations, so I would have anxiety in my vehicle that has a range of only 36 miles.


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

Understandably. I guess the only true "anxiety free" approach to the issue is to never travel beyond 50% of your range from home, unless you know that your destination has re-charging capabilities. For the Tesla S, that amounts to 130 miles, which I don't think would be considered too shabby, by the majority of us. The problem for the majority of us is that at this point in time, is we are still at the very top of the learning curve, and that model is not realistically available, from a financial perspective. But hopefully it won't be TOO long before the curve starts to bend downward.


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## nedrapr (Mar 9, 2011)

The last time I spoke with the Top Gear producer before filming the show started, the idea was for the guys to break some NEDRA Records. We had discussed finding some gassers to race against as well. The first idea was to use a Tesla Roadster but I was a bit apprehensive since the BBC Top Gear episode with the Roadster so I encouraged them to use conversions and the Model S since that broke the record the Roadster had. I was selfish and really wanted our NEDRA racer's conversions on the show. There was alot of discussion and ideas going back and forth. I gave them a list of our NEDRA racers and they called to arrange getting the vehicles. After that I didn't hear anything and the owners of the vehicles couldn't say anything about the outcome.

I was just excited that Top Gear contacted NEDRA. We have been working with the History Channel to do something with EVs for awhile. I think everything turned out great. It's a risk but I think it was worth it. You can tell Tanner, Adam and Rutledge were impressed. They even showed the NEDRA bumper sticker on the back of the Porsche. 

I'm sure Tanner could have got a 7 second run with the dragster since there was a slight delay after the green light. But what he did was absolutely awesome considering that was his first time in a dragster and he did an 8.5! The NEDRA Record for a dragster record is 7.5. The Matrix has alot of potential. Kudos to Lowell for the Porsche and Shawn Lawless Industries for their efforts.

Both the S-10 and the Porsche have run consistent 9s. So these guys had at there disposal some of the quickest EVs on the planet. The next TV show we hope to get John Metric's 9.1 second Miata. He's trying for 8's. We're hoping to get that on national TV!

Chip Gribben
NEDRA PR Director


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

Thanks for chiming in, Chip. It's always nice to hear from someone who is actually INSIDE of the circle, of what a thread is trying to encompass. Your organization, along with T,A, & R of TG and the H chan, is working wonders in helping to knock down the "wall" that that currently exists between the average [american, anyways] motorist and this now-happening revolution in motor vehicle technology. It makes me wonder if TG will last enough seasons to see electrically powered vehicles [inc. fuel-cell powered] become the rule. rather than the exception. And if you don't mind me stating my personal opinion: The History Channel ROCKS!


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

I don't think I agree with Adam's video game analogy. I don't think we are in the Pong stage right now. I'd say we are closer the the stage of the original Nintendo.


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

I'll go along with that. The GM EV-1 was pong, wasn't it?


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

I'd consider the EV-1 more like the generation of the Atari 2600, and the EVs of the early 20th century the Pong era.


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm not sure if I'm sure if I'm still on the bandwagon, with THAT kind of time scale in mind. It's like saying that pong didn't really pick up any fans when it first came out. But a century later, the "wise-ones" finally decided to declare that it is the way of the future, and interest finally started catching on. I don't know what I'm actually trying to say there. Maybe it's just not a very good analogy to try to equate to.


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Its an imperfect analogy of course


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

Electron Power said:


> It makes me wonder if TG will last enough seasons to see electrically powered vehicles [*inc. fuel-cell powered*] become the rule.


Not likely since they offer no advantage.


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

Having an operating cost that is 20% [or less] that of a fuel-powered vehicle IS something of significant advantage, from MY perspective!


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Electron Power said:


> Having an operating cost that is 20% [or less] that of a fuel-powered vehicle IS something of significant advantage, from MY perspective!


 ??? even if the purchace price is 10X the "fuel powered" vehicle ??


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

With no infrastructure, many challenges to create one from scratch, higher vehicle cost, and a lower "well to wheels" efficiency than EV's, HFCV's don't make sense.


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

JRP3 said:


> With no infrastructure, many challenges to create one from scratch, higher vehicle cost, and a lower "well to wheels" efficiency than EV's, HFCV's don't make sense.


Do you mean hydrocarbon-fuel-cell-vehicles?

What I see is that all vehicles will have batteries. But ones that need to go long distances will also carry gasoline, along with the ability to flamelessly convert it directly into electron flow for powering the motor/generators. Only when gasoline becomes unavailable at fueling stations will the FC option dissappear completely, I think. That might be a while yet.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

HFCV = Hydrogen Fuel Cell Vehicle. If you're talking about a battery-hybrid vehicle that still depends on gasoline for extended range then something like the Volt will be much cheaper than a fuel cell range extender.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Electron Power said:


> ... the ability to flamelessly convert it (gasoline?) .directly into electron flow for powering the motor/generators..


 Maybe you can explain what exactly you mean by this.
References ?


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## Electron Power (Jan 2, 2013)

Karter2 said:


> Maybe you can explain what exactly you mean by this.
> References ?


 Do a google search on "fuel cell". 

In summary, it is a power unit that converts the energy conatined in the gasoline directly into electical power, instead of machanical power tapped off of a shaft. It is much more efficient because it does not need to convert the energy into a thermal phase first, meaning it does not actually "burn" the gasoline. It oxidizes it through a chemical process that makes the internal electrodes want to flow electrons.

Bear in mind that this technology is NOT even close to being perfected yet. They are still trying to get it perfect using pure hydrogen as a fuel. There are additional hurdles that need to be overcome before liquid hydrocarbon fuels can be effectively used. But when the ICE finally becomes a thing of the past, it likely will be the evolution of the FC that puts it to rest.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Electron Power said:


> Bear in mind that this technology is NOT even close to being perfected yet. .


 so really its in the same category as the "high capacity, low weight, low cost, 5 minute charge, " ... EV battery ?
IE ..A dream !


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