# 1972 Beetle Conversion



## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Hello all, new here and wanted to start a thread for my car. I bought a 1972 Beetle in May of 2012. My goal was to do a complete restoration with a 72v kit. The project started quickly until I lost my job in October and had to move at the beginning of this year. I currently work as a Tech for Pepboys and have finally had some extra change to get back working on her.

I did a body off restoration and tore the car all the way down to the pan and replaced the majority of essential parts. I realized quickly that I 72v would not be enough for me so I settled for 96v; 12 volt lead acid batteries.

I ordered the majority of the parts I would need from EV Wilderness and was sent the wrong clutch plate. Long story short I will never order anything else from them or recommend them to ANYONE! I have a D&D ES31B bolted up to the transmission currently and ready to get the thing in the car. 

I am thinking about the Curtis controller 1221C but was wondering if anyone had any comments on this controller and compatibility. I'm planning to get the controller ordered and build battery boxes this week.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

Welcome fellow Bugger!

I didn't even know they did clutch plates, was all clutchless when I got mine.

What kind of batteries do you have? I started with marine deep cycles which last only a year, and now have mostly golf cart batts.

1221C works well, only complaint is that it only does 120V and higher is better. If you're good with electronics you should consider an Open ReVolt, a little better (and much more customizable) than a 1231C and half the price.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

> If you're good with electronics you should consider an Open ReVolt, a little better (and much more customizable) than a 1231C and half the price.


And you can increase the voltage later if you choose. One less component to change if you change voltages.


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks for the quick replies. I plan to increase voltage and I know I will want Lithium batteries in there, but for getting the thing on the road I think i'm going to go with a Pepboy's brand Prostart marine battery for now. Hopefully I can get them warrantied and replaced before the 12month free replacement although I have not bought them yet so I am open to suggestions as well.

I think I'll try that controller out. Wiring and soldering is no problem for me and I like that price way better than what I was budgeting for.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Did you ever consider looking for good used Lithium?


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Not interested in lithium batteries right now, just need to get this thing rolling. I'm 20 years old and have too many friends doubting the build and betting against it. Seems like my father and I are the only ones excited about it.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Succumbs to Peer pressure, Ugg.


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## dladd (Jun 1, 2011)

SWR said:


> Not interested in lithium batteries right now, just need to get this thing rolling. I'm 20 years old and have too many friends doubting the build and betting against it. Seems like my father and I are the only ones excited about it.


well... if you are trying to prove a point about EV's, I'm not sure that 96 volts of lead is the way to do it. In for a penny, in for a pound, build a nice Lithium car and show them what's up!


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

SWR said:


> too many friends doubting the build and betting against it.


Maybe you could use that to fund a lithium pack soon


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

The betting would have been a great idea when I first started the build. My goal is to finish this thing up by June 8.
I ordered the Open Revolt controller today and it is expected to ship on Monday.
I think I can get 5 batteries behind the rear seat and the other 4 in the front trunk. Does anyone have any pictures of lead batteries in the front and their controller set up in the engine compartment?


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Here's Corbin Dunn's Motor Compartment.










You really need to go do a search on EV-Album. http://www.evalbum.com


You will more than likely find pretty much all you need there. 

Here is another setup using a motor like I have and like I have for sale. 










Check out the rest of this one as well as Corbin Dunn's build. 

Many more as well. 

Pete


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

SWR said:


> Does anyone have any pictures of lead batteries in the front and their controller set up in the engine compartment?


See link in sig.

Here's a few other controller layouts:


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## Wolfswagen (Jul 2, 2012)

I just wanted to jump in and say welcome and good luck! Your plan is very similar to what I originally considered - I even thought about ordering from Wilderness EV at one point - but the result is a Bug much better than I had dreamed.

I'm at 96v now, and with less than 2,000 lbs the acceleration is "good enough" to not need more. My next upgrade will probably be another batch of batteries to make it 144v (I'm using the Curtis 1231C), but I'm letting a thought soak in to just double the pack and keep it 96v. My current lithium pack is only ~170 lbs.

Again, welcome, and don't forget to add photos whenever possible.

Robert


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks for the pictures, helps give me an idea of what I would like the engine compartment to look like! My goal is to take more pictures; started off great but the more I worked on it the less pictures I took.

Trying to sort out some brake issues currently and waiting for the controller to arrive today. I'm thinking the new master cylinder I just bought is defective or has a bad seal somewhere. I have all new brake hoses and calipers and can build up a pedal but every time I fully release the brake pedal I lose everything. Going to swap it out hopefully today or tomorrow and see if that really is the problem


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## marklaken (Jan 26, 2012)

new softlines and new cylinders? I wouldn't suspect a new master cylinder right of the bat. 

the samba website might help you troubleshoot:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/vi...days=0&postorder=asc&highlight=brake+bleeding


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

When I had the cab off, I re-did the calipers, hoses, and master cylinder. I bled the lines to make sure it was all working and it was fine. I put the cab back on and moved the car to my new house and tweaked the plastic plugs in the process. To be safe I decided to replace it. With the new one in, it just didn't feel right trying to bleed it from the beginning. That is why I am suggesting the mc is bad.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

SWR said:


> When I had the cab off, I re-did the calipers, hoses, and master cylinder. I bled the lines to make sure it was all working and it was fine. I put the cab back on and moved the car to my new house and tweaked the plastic plugs in the process. To be safe I decided to replace it. With the new one in, it just didn't feel right trying to bleed it from the beginning. That is why I am suggesting the mc is bad.


Suggest to bleed again. Did you bleed the master cylinder first? Then the wheel cylinders from the furthest out to the nearest the master cylinder. Might check the throw on the Brake master cylinder rod too. 

Pete


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

I could only get a slight bit of air out of RR everything else came out clean. I can get master cylinders for fifteen dollars so it's not that big a deal to try that next.

Got the controller in today and have it mostly put together. Hopefully I can finish it up tomorrow night or Monday.


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## marklaken (Jan 26, 2012)

Bleed order for front disc brakes should be fronts first, then rear right, and rear left last. I too suspect you still have air in your lines. 

I am not familiar with late model vws, but a lot of other cars have proportioning between front and rear brake circuits built into the master cylinder and need to bleed the master cylinder (often called bench bleeding) before installing the master into the car...


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

SWR said:


> I could only get a slight bit of air out of RR everything else came out clean. I can get master cylinders for fifteen dollars so it's not that big a deal to try that next.
> 
> Got the controller in today and have it mostly put together. Hopefully I can finish it up tomorrow night or Monday.


Did you bleed the mastercyinder? They can hold air and should be bled.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

marklaken said:


> Bleed order for front disc brakes should be fronts first, then rear right, and rear left last. I too suspect you still have air in your lines.
> 
> I am not familiar with late model vws, but a lot of other cars have proportioning between front and rear brake circuits built into the master cylinder and need to bleed the master cylinder (often called bench bleeding) before installing the master into the car...


If the brake system was completely replaced with new and the system is starting out dry then yes go to the first then the next closest until you finish at the end. If however you are only replacing a wheel cylinder then bleed that side if all the others are not being touched. If your replacing your MC you should go to the far rear passenger side then move forward. Disc or Drum there is no reason to do this any other way. 

Yes doing a bench bleed before installing helps. 

The VW does not use a proportioning valve like other vehicles.


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

I never bleed brakes front first, always furthest from the master cylinder. I happen to have drums all around and had a pedal when I replaced most of the components. After installing the new master cylinder it can't hold. Just bought another new one so we'll see what happens.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

SWR said:


> I never bleed brakes front first, always furthest from the master cylinder. I happen to have drums all around and had a pedal when I replaced most of the components. After installing the new master cylinder it can't hold. Just bought another new one so we'll see what happens.



Well, please let us know if that was the issue. Yes, its quite possible to have a bad NEW Master Cylinder.


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Pro Stop is notorious for defective parts and again a defective part out of the box. I threw the new mc in today and almost instantly had a pedal building up. The brakes are almost 100% dialed in just have a few minor things to do this afternoon/evening.

Almost done building the revolt controller. Noticed I am missing a few parts so I need to contact Paul as soon as I make a list of everything that was not sent. 

Next two things to do are fit the transmission and motor, and build battery boxes.


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

I took the bug for a test roll around the block today for a brake check. The one thing I forgot to do was fix the e-brake so that is another one for the to-do list. 

I plan to finish the controller tonight and mount the transmission. 

For wiring did anyone use their old harness or did you rip it out and pull your own wire?


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Used the original harness. Just check to be sure your connections are clean and tight. Check the fuses in the fuse box and be sure your grounds are all good. VW is notorious for having bad grounds. Check and clean it up as needed and the original harness will be fine. If you have bad wiring you should change it. I have had to pull some bad wire before but never replace a whole harness. 

Pete


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Sorry I should have rephrased that. The car doesn't have any wiring so I should have asked what was better, a new harness or just pull my own. I looked into a baja harness but I need turn signals, horn, etc. so that won't work.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

I do believe they have new harnesses. Never pulled one. Have no clue how that would go. Check on thesamba.com to see if anyone on the forums can help.


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## EVfun (Mar 14, 2010)

It isn't hard to recreate a harness on your own. The schematics are available for every year over on The Samba, here is the 1972 Beetle. It isn't nearly as scary as it looks, just work from the battery positive (or DC to DC converter) and work forward. You can leave out what you don't have. I roll my own, my Buggy will be getting a new 4 fuse 12v system loosely based on the 1964 Beetle wiring diagram.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Yes you could do this. Custom fab your own but having a good color coding would be important for later. So you'd really need to build your own and keep a copy. Loose the copy and anyone else after you will have a nightmare of a time. Now with a Buggy I'd likely do my own. Id go find an old bug and strip it out and use the diagrams and build my own and make a copy. Rewiring a buggy is not the same as the Bug. But yes you could do your own if you had the hankering to do so.


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## Ampster (Oct 6, 2012)

I made my own and decided to isolate the 12v negative while I was at it. I could use a good program to draw a schematic though. Anybody know of one?


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## EVfun (Mar 14, 2010)

It won't be easy to create an isolated chassis 12 volt electrical system for a Beetle. A lot of stock parts use their attachment to the body as their ground. You will need to figure out how to isolate the parking lights, tail lights, and speedometer. I'm betting there are more things I missed (radio antenna shield...)


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## marklaken (Jan 26, 2012)

if you aren't worried about keeping it stock, you could save a little money and buy a generic harness from here:

http://www.ezwiring.com/wiring_harness.html


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

Took a little break from the car for a while. Got back going real strong on it. Mounted motor and transmission and hooked up a battery charger to do a test run just a couple feet. Battery boxes are half way built for the front and rear boxes. I still have quite a bit to do before I can get it running. I pulled my own wire from front to back for all the goodies. I need to start looking at battery chargers for the 96v. Tomorrow I'm mounting the controller, contactor, shunt, and throttle box as well as installing all the glass. If I still have time I'll finish the batt box. It seems like this list of things I need to do on the car only grows longer


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## poprock (Apr 29, 2010)

Coming in late so it may have been mentioned. I was taught to pump for wheel cylinders, hold, release bleed nipple, lock up when pressure dissipates. For discs, release bleed nipple, slowly depress pedal, signal assistant when it ceases to travel then assistant locks nipple up. But hey, my apprenticeship was in 1968


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## SWR (Dec 8, 2012)

I got a lot done this week, washed her, and snapped a couple pictures. She looks good but still has a ways to go to get completely street legal. My goal is to get it to go under its own power before I worry about lights, horn, etc.


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