# 2003 Mini Cooper S Conversion



## madderscience (Jun 28, 2008)

sounds like a pretty well thought out plan. I assume you are getting the 144v kit.

with 100ah batteries your range will probably be about 80km/50 miles. If you want to get to 100+km go for the 160ah batteries, Other than that you are talking about using what I often recommend to people.

you won't get a significant weight reduction from going to manual steering, but the overall conversion will be simpler. there are 12V electric power steering pumps you could retrofit but you will need a much bigger DC/DC converter if you did that. 

I went to manual steering on my scion xB conversion and it works fine.

good luck!


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi MrZion
I gather you are converting one of those huge BMW things and not a "proper" Cooper S!

Anyway I would suggest a change of tack - How about getting a complete crashed Nissan Leaf and doing a complete transaxle swap

You will start with about twice the power that you can get from an AC-50 and you get all of the expensive bits in the "kit"

The later Leafs have the inverter mounted on top of the motor which may be a bit too high for your bonnet line - you could go for an earlier one or move the invertor


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## Caps18 (Jun 8, 2008)

I wonder how easily a Nissan Leaf (uncrashed) could be taken apart and installed onto the Mini Cooper frame? Dealing with the transmission/driveshaft or the front wheel drive/rear wheel drive issue would be the worst of it. Mounting the battery pack would be tricky as well. Integrating the gauges would take some work.

But, I would probably use this method if I were starting over with my pick-up truck.


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## akseminole (Jan 5, 2014)

I am positive of nothing, but I am reasonably certain that that year of Mini Cooper might come with an electric power steering pump. 
Like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/271911614942 

But if not, I suppose it's no great loss.


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## minispeed (Jun 30, 2013)

Yes the new BMW mini's do use electro hydraulic steering pumps so you shouldn't have to touch it. If I remember correctly the suffered from cooling issues so make sure the fan gets some good air flow.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Duncan said:


> Hi MrZion
> I gather you are converting one of those huge BMW things and not a "proper" Cooper S!
> 
> Anyway I would suggest a change of tack - How about getting a complete crashed Nissan Leaf and doing a complete transaxle swap
> ...


That would be a good idea if I had not already bought the mini and started stripping it down, but maybe as a future project that could be a sweet idea!



madderscience said:


> sounds like a pretty well thought out plan. I assume you are getting the 144v kit.
> 
> with 100ah batteries your range will probably be about 80km/50 miles. If you want to get to 100+km go for the 160ah batteries, Other than that you are talking about using what I often recommend to people.
> 
> ...


Yes I was planning on using the 144V system, and at the very lowest 120V. I say 120V because these boys down in California, EV4U custom's, seem to have used 120 volt system, If my memory serves me correctly.

And yea my model put the required Ah's for my batteries right in the neighborhood of 160 Ah, which is good to hear someone else say that number!



akseminole said:


> I am positive of nothing, but I am reasonably certain that that year of Mini Cooper might come with an electric power steering pump.
> Like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/271911614942
> 
> But if not, I suppose it's no great loss.


Sorry I am not understanding why I would need an electric power steering pump if I convert to a manual steering system?




minispeed said:


> Yes the new BMW mini's do use electro hydraulic steering pumps so you shouldn't have to touch it. If I remember correctly the suffered from cooling issues so make sure the fan gets some good air flow.


So from the response by akseminole and you, it seems that I need a power steering pump even though I plan to convert this to a manual steering pump. If this is the case thanks for the heads up!


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi Mr Zion

I think you misunderstood
I'm suggesting that you keep your "mini" and put the transaxle from a Nissan Leaf in place of your current IC engine and gearbox

You buy a complete Leaf - and transfer all of the bits
You end up with a modern electric drive system batteries and charger in your mini

About twice the power of the AC-50 and probably a lot cheaper


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## Moltenmetal (Mar 20, 2014)

A word of caution: the Curtis 1239 controller puts out less current (500 A vs 650 A) than the 1238 controller, and this generates noticeably less torque. So I'd stay with the lower voltage design if I could.

Not sure why you'd bother with CALB cells these days, when you can buy packs out of a crashed Leaf or Volt for a fraction of their cost. Unlike the CALBs, these are OEM vehicle batteries and higher energy density. But you will need a BMS with them- I recommend a BMS any time Li-ion chemistry is used, as minimally necessary safety equipment.

Transplanting a Leaf into your car is a much more challenging project. Lots of people talk about it, and several are attempting, but I'm not aware of anyone who has done it yet. Duncan is right though- a crashed Leaf is a car conversion kit on wheels, with the parts costing only a fraction of what they'd cost if you bought them as conversion parts. There's at least one annoying thing in the way though- the vehicle control system. Your 2003 BMW Cooper has one too, and it will take some screwing around to deal with its unhappiness once you yank out the engine.

There are promising options to take these OEM transaxles and their inverters and lobotomize them so they can be operated without the vehicle's original vehicle control unit. That saves a lot of screwing around trying to calm the car back down after you've removed three-quarters of its sensors etc.


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## akseminole (Jan 5, 2014)

If you absolutely must convert your Mini to a manual steering box for personal reasons, that is up to you.

I was simply pointing out that if your car in fact came with the electro hydraulic power steering pump already installed, that it would be a lot less work to simply retain power steering. 
No need to find a manual steering box that fits, possibly fabricate mounts, etc.

It's possible that your Mini came with the standard power steering pump which is engine driven, in that case I see no reason not to go manual as you wish to do.

My comment was only applicable if, in fact, your car did come with the electric pump rather than the belt driven pump.

My point, if there is one, is that your car would be already set up with an OEM electro hydraulic power steering system which would be as easy to use as making sure that your fuses were in working order and that your DC/DC was capable of keeping your auxiliary battery charged. 

As opposed to pulling it all out, and installing an entirely new steering setup in the car, possibly having to chase down gremlins in the system caused by error codes because the vehicles computer is wondering where it's power steering pump went. 

It just seems like extra work on top of the task of replacing the drivetrain..

I'm not trying to dissuade you from doing what you want to do with your project, if this is truly what you want to do. Go for it.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Duncan said:


> Hi Mr Zion
> 
> I think you misunderstood
> I'm suggesting that you keep your "mini" and put the transaxle from a Nissan Leaf in place of your current IC engine and gearbox
> ...


I completely did misunderstand! that is a really interesting idea Duncan, I will for sure look into this!

Have you done this?



Moltenmetal said:


> A word of caution: the Curtis 1239 controller puts out less current (500 A vs 650 A) than the 1238 controller, and this generates noticeably less torque. So I'd stay with the lower voltage design if I could.
> 
> Not sure why you'd bother with CALB cells these days, when you can buy packs out of a crashed Leaf or Volt for a fraction of their cost. Unlike the CALBs, these are OEM vehicle batteries and higher energy density. But you will need a BMS with them- I recommend a BMS any time Li-ion chemistry is used, as minimally necessary safety equipment.
> 
> ...


About your first paragraph, just to make sure I'm on the same page as you. Your saying since the controller produces less current, and a motors torque is proportional to the current, the 120V system would generate higher current than the 144V system? (Sorry if i'm way out)

I'll definetly look into buying packs out of those crashed leafs, not sure exactly where to start but that's the beauty of google!

Yea, I am really interested in what Duncan said about the transaxle swap. Just one craigslist search, and 30 seconds later I found a pretty new leaf for around 5k. Seem's most of them are automatics which I kind of find interesting, so I gotta search for a manual one if I end up heading down this road. Have you had experience toubleshooting the vehicle control system being unhappy once you swap out a motor?




akseminole said:


> If you absolutely must convert your Mini to a manual steering box for personal reasons, that is up to you.
> 
> I was simply pointing out that if your car in fact came with the electro hydraulic power steering pump already installed, that it would be a lot less work to simply retain power steering.
> No need to find a manual steering box that fits, possibly fabricate mounts, etc.
> ...


Sorry didn't mean to come across as intense, but rather curious. 

You make a good point, the one thing that I would be curious about is how much power savings do you get when you compare power to manual steering? The only reason I originally thought of manual steering is because I have read quite a bit of conversions doing this, so I just assumed the power savings must be worth it. But whether it is or isn't I am unsure. But as you pointed out if its already there, why make things difficult.


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## akseminole (Jan 5, 2014)

I think that the majority of conversions which were changed over to a manual steering box came with a belt driven power steering pump when it had the ICE. 

Rather than running a belt off of their motor and needing to idle the motor for the power steering pump to work, they chose to run with manual steering instead. 

I am not qualified to answer whether the power savings would net you any significant range increases. 

From the little that I have read about electro hydraulic power steering pumps, the major current draw comes when you are going slow. Like parking, parking lot etc. places where having power steering is actually desirable. They tend to have reduced power steering assist when you are at cruising speed, because the OEM knows that it is less necessary when you are at speed. 


As for the Nissan leaf, it is not that the Nissan Leaf has an automatic transmission. They, for all intents and purposes, do not have a transmission in the traditional sense. Their transaxle has only one gear ratio and there is no need to shift. 
There is no such thing as a manual Nissan Leaf.
Their motor spins up to 10,000+ rpm and the one gear ratio is adequate to drive the car to its maximum speed.
If this is not adequate for your purposes, you could dismount the motor from its transaxle, but then you would need to figure out a way to mount it to your transaxle and that sounds like a hassle.


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## akseminole (Jan 5, 2014)

MrZion said:


> About your first paragraph, just to make sure I'm on the same page as you. Your saying since the controller produces less current, and a motors torque is proportional to the current, the 120V system would generate higher current than the 144V system?


The 96v 650a controller would produce more torque from the AC-50 motor than the 144v 500a controller. (The 96v 650a controller has a maximum voltage of 130v, and so this is the controller which is being referred to as the "120v" controller.) 
I believe that the peak kilowatts for both the 96v and the 144v controllers are nearly the same, it is mostly a matter of trading torque for rpm. 
The 96v controller has a lower rpm at which the back emf catches up with the torque curve than the 144v controller.
The 144v controller has about 35ft lbs or so lower torque than the 96v controller, but the peak torque doesn't start falling off until around 5,500 rpm vs 3,500 rpm for the 96v.

144v http://www.hpevs.com/Site/images/to...raphs/ac50 144 volt 500 amp imperial peak.pdf

96v http://www.hpevs.com/Site/power_gra...lt/650-amp/ac50 108 650 amp imperial peak.pdf


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

akseminole said:


> The 96v 650a controller would produce more torque from the AC-50 motor than the 144v 500a controller. (The 96v 650a controller has a maximum voltage of 130v, and so this is the controller which is being referred to as the "120v" controller.)
> I believe that the peak kilowatts for both the 96v and the 144v controllers are nearly the same, it is mostly a matter of trading torque for rpm.
> The 96v controller has a lower rpm at which the back emf catches up with the torque curve than the 144v controller.
> The 144v controller has about 35ft lbs or so lower torque than the 96v controller, but the peak torque doesn't start falling off until around 5,500 rpm vs 3,500 rpm for the 96v.
> ...


OH! that makes total sense, a light bulb moment occurred. If you could send a cracked open beer via this forum I would!


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

New Problem:

I have hit a weird roadblock, I have disassembled the exhaust system, intercooler, wheels, and other bits and pieces within the engine bay; but, when I took my impact wrenched to the left tie rod end it came off easy, and the the arm separated fine. The right side though, the nut came off fine, but it seems that the drive axle on this side is under tremendous pressure, and I can not disassembly the tie rod end. I asked someone, and they think it could be just rust, but I don't think it is because when I try and push the boot from side to side it doesn't budge at all. 

Any thoughts?


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

If you have the room, put the nut back on with a gap between the nut and rod then whack the nut with either a 4lb sledge or air chisel after you warm it up with a torch a wee bit. Might need to replace the end afterwards. Support the tie rod before whacking so it has a fair amount of weight hanging on it.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

piotrsko said:


> If you have the room, put the nut back on with a gap between the nut and rod then whack the nut with either a 4lb sledge or air chisel after you warm it up with a torch a wee bit. Might need to replace the end afterwards. Support the tie rod before whacking so it has a fair amount of weight hanging on it.


I didn't end up heating anything up, i'm in quite a small garage so it would be a little nerve racking, but I did end up giving a good wack! I ended up for a couple of days spraying a mix of ATF and automatic trans oil where the outer tie rod was, then getting a wheel puller as in the picture and putting in between the nut and housing of the hub, just tightened until it just popped right out! thanks for the suggestion though!


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Last night I had a good run at getting some stuff separated. Funny enough which took me the longest to get out last night was the ECU, there are two multi-pin male plug-in clips that insert into the ECU, and to get those off there were these well hidden tabs that you have to fully pull out, before you can unplug the the male plug in's. 

As you can see from the different engine pictures, I took off the compressor and the alternator, by first removing the belt and then swinging the compressor off to the side so I can get further at the engine.

I've nearly got everything off the top of the engine, still some whose's and wiring to label to make sure I have a clue on whats what. Where I am at is taking the axles out, but where the outer ball joint meets the hub there is some serious contact rust happening, so I'm using my awesome concoction and spraying right in that joint, then hopefully a pickle fork will be able to vibrate this joint loose so I can finally remove the axle. These axles are quite the task!


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## itchyback (May 28, 2014)

Nice work, keep the updates coming!

I enjoyed this part of the process a lot. 

Regarding the tie-rod, they are normally a press fit/ very firm fit so you normally need to whack them with a hammer or use some sort of puller or wedge to get them out. 

Soaking stuff does wonders, heat and whacking things with a hammer/ using an impact driver are a good next step. good luck.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

itchyback said:


> Nice work, keep the updates coming!
> 
> I enjoyed this part of the process a lot.
> 
> ...


Totally! I am doing this project with my father, and he got a pretty good photo that I thought summed up one of the things you said!


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## EVTechsFL (Jan 10, 2017)

madderscience said:


> with 100ah batteries your range will probably be about 80km/50 miles. If you want to get to 100+km go for the 160ah batteries, Other than that you are talking about using what I often recommend to people.
> 
> I'm just a field Tech not an engineer. WHY would someone go to all of the expense and trouble to buy cells/batteries that only achieve 60 miles or less, with limited speed? I have been using Voltronix Prismatic 260 a/h cells (36 total) and can achieve 65 mph with 100 mile range. AND what's the deal with CALB cells? Just askin?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

EVTechsFL said:


> madderscience said:
> 
> 
> > with 100ah batteries your range will probably be about 80km/50 miles. If you want to get to 100+km go for the 160ah batteries, Other than that you are talking about using what I often recommend to people.
> ...


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

The latest news:

Got the engine out last night!! the hardest part was battling the outter ball joints on both sides of the car, the way we got around the issue is zip cutting through the boot/bolt. Was it ever a relief to get those off! After that it was all gravy from there, just figuring out what to unplug and out she came some time later.

Before starting this project, I really researched the living day lights out of every possible aspect of this project, but at the end of the day it was just research and it was easy to say that I was going to do this project. Now that I am actually close'ish to needing parts and such, it is a crazy and exciting feeling!

Like I said in my original post, if people could look at my circuit diagram I have posted and give me feedback that would be fantastic. I was supposed to digitize/update it, but I have not had the time in the past while. Soon to come.

Here are some more photo's:


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## PAK65 (Mar 3, 2017)

The leaf batteries can be found in a salvage yard, just search on car-part.com . I got a pack for about $3,500 from a yard in Virginia delivered to my door in Florida for $150. I am going to wire them in 3p16s for 180 AH and 120V. I think the equivalent in CALB batteries would be about 3 times as much money. So instead of trying to use the entire Leaf I think the batteries are the most useful part.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

PAK65 said:


> The leaf batteries can be found in a salvage yard, just search on car-part.com . I got a pack for about $3,500 from a yard in Virginia delivered to my door in Florida for $150. I am going to wire them in 3p16s for 180 AH and 120V. I think the equivalent in CALB batteries would be about 3 times as much money. So instead of trying to use the entire Leaf I think the batteries are the most useful part.


You are totally right about cost, and that's why I am so enticed about using as many components about the leaf, the bang for you buck is not achievable by buying components individually. Unless you go for used components, and do some serious digging around.

That is a good pack configuration though, thanks for the heads up!


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## duaneo (Mar 9, 2017)

Speaking as someone who drives a 2004 mini cooper daily, and has had the power steering fail while driving in a parking lot, you're definitely going to want power steering. It's not too bad when you're moving, but at low speeds, you have to be Hercules to turn that wheel even a little. 

I'm considering an EV conversion on a classic car, and buying an EV mini when they eventually make them available, so I'm watching your thread with interest!  

Cheers,
Duane


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

duaneo said:


> Speaking as someone who drives a 2004 mini cooper daily, and has had the power steering fail while driving in a parking lot, you're definitely going to want power steering. It's not too bad when you're moving, but at low speeds, you have to be Hercules to turn that wheel even a little.
> 
> I'm considering an EV conversion on a classic car, and buying an EV mini when they eventually make them available, so I'm watching your thread with interest!
> 
> ...


Have you driven other types of manual steering before??

I'm glad your keeping an eye on my thread, feel free to give input at any time!


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hello All,

Sorry it's been awhile since I posted last, I caught a nasty flu for a little bit there. 

I was able to get this minty mini cooper for quite cheap because the owner didn't want to deal with the clutch, and since I pulled the engine out recently the next part of this project was to take out the clutch. I've never actually done a clutch before. But my god was there metal shards everywhere. ball bearings all over the place, the throw-out bearing was shredded, the outer clutch plate cover was absolutely mauled over. The flywheel itself was actually barely even scratched which was a good surprise. I mean, here the pictures speak more than a thousand words....

I'm at the point in this project where I need to choose a fork in the road. The fork being either I chose to go down the one road, which is buy a used leaf and strip it for parts, or buy the parts individually. The advantages of the leaf is you pay essentially half what you would pay, compared to individually buying the parts, and you get double the horsepower and battery capacity and other such things. The negative, from what I can tell is getting the system to interface with my mini, which sounds like it will be a tone of CAN interface issues and potentially ECU codes to deal with. The advantage of buying the components individually is that I get to actually implement my circuit design, and get a true design and implementation experience. the disadvantage is it costs way more, and I don't get nearly the battery capacity and horsepower a leaf gets at that price point.

I am really interested in what you guys have to say, so I would really appreciate your opinions. Keep in mind, I am trying to learn as much as I possibly can from this experience.

Cheers


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hello Everyone,

I have been a ghost on the forum for awhile, really it was just school for the last while has gotten me completely taken up. Now though over the next couple of months I plan on putting up a huge push and hopefully finishing this. I've been developing my circuit, my energy consumption model, as well as figuring out vendors for which components I'm going to buy from for the last while.

Something that I was quite shocked about was how much batteries are. This nearly put a stop to my project, but instead I have found multiple vendors (which all of them I have talked to) and I have decided that I will be going to get tesla modules, 24V at 120ah. I've done my research and talked to a whole bunch of peoples and experts and the consensus is I'll just have to be more conscious of my temperature and over/under voltage. But please do share advice, and what your thoughts are on monitoring and such.

Also, this is my most updated circuit image so please comment on it. You'll notice the colour coding is not really a thing yet, nor are some of the end connections coming out of the controller.

What fuse/wiring sizing do you guys recommend for the curtis 1239 controller and why?

Cheers


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## itchyback (May 28, 2014)

Hey,
Nice build, i cant comment on your circuit diagram, it looks like dutch to me. 
Thinking over the question in your last post about buying OEM leaf/ volt or buying individual parts. 
I understand your conundrum having asked that question myself. I think the extra range and value pays for the difficulty of interfacing issues. thats my vote. plenty of cheapish aftermarket guages and bits or you could massage the leaf bits to fit in your car 

Glenn


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

itchyback said:


> I understand your conundrum having asked that question myself. I think the extra range and value pays for the difficulty of interfacing issues. thats my vote. plenty of cheapish aftermarket guages and bits or you could massage the leaf bits to fit in your car
> 
> Glenn


Funnily enough I actually decided against doing the Leaf, the reasons are the following:

1) I talked to a leaf mechanic at a shop, and we got going about the CAN signals in which I didn't have any of the hardware/software to monitor/program the signals with, as well as he said if the signals are out of phase at all the system will throw more errors than you can imagine. 

2) I looked and looked and couldn't find anyone who has actually made a functioning vehicle using the leaf drive system, I'm not saying that because I haven't found it so therefore it doesn't exist, but rather I just found that nerve racking.

3) You will have to learn how the CAN system works, and you will most likely have to reverse engineer their CAN signals.

With all this in mind I am going to buy individual parts, hopefully it works out!


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hey guys,

I'll make this a long post to summarise what's been going on the past couple of months.

I have been MIA from posting anything, but not necessarily from the project. I have been spec'ing out the components I am going to use in my conversion for the last while, and bugging/asking as many people as possible to get the info I needed to make these decisions. (Sorry to those people)

Also, I moved back to where I have garage access! This has given me much more space, many more tools, and a industrial size pneumatic tank!

What I have decided use:

1) I am using Tesla Model S batteries out of a P85 pack. Very excited about this, I am stringing 5 modules in series to give nominally 120V @ ~243Ah

2) Using an AC-50/Curtis 1238 Controller set up at 108 Volts

3) Using *CanEV *to supply my parts, which *Randy *has been a huge help! I would recommend them to anyone.

4) At this moment I believe I'll be using *ZEVA BMS* system paired with an Elcon PFC 2500 charger. *Ian *at ZEVA has been an incredible help. For anyone looking into what BMS to use give ZEVA a look, Ian gets two thumbs up!

As I said before for the last while I have been spec'ing parts out, but also setting up my works space as well as continuing to strip parts off of the mini. 

Recently I took out the fuel tank, which was more work than I thought it was going to be as the e-brake cables straddled the under carriage of the fuel tank. So I had to go and disassemble the e-brake cables starting from the centre console, and then making my way back to the rear brakes.

I have started to to think about my battery box design/layout, and with the space given I am going to have to split my pack up into two separate packs. One in the trunk and the other where the fuel tank used to be. I'm still working on the cooling system, but talking to Wayne Bickley has given me a very good idea on how to implement this system.

For creating the vacuum for the power assist brakes, in the name of being budget friendly I am going to create the reservoir out of PVC, and install it in cavity underneath the vehicle that runs from front to the back. Then using a diaphragm (louder) pump, vacuum switch, and a relay I'll hook this all up back to the brake booster to give the vacuum it needs.

Edit:
Just received my first Tesla Model S Battery Module, and wow is it ever amazing the first time you see one!


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## MrCake (Sep 27, 2017)

Following VERY closely - I`m about to do the same on my 2002 Cooper and I feel this thread my end up being gold in the future. Would you mind PMming me your email?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hello Guys,

In my previous post I uploaded a picture of my tesla model s battery, and a picture of the pcb. I noticed on the pcb, when comparing it to other pictures I have found online of tesla model s pcb's, that the voltage tap through holes on the right are scattered for me (not in a straight line like most other peoples), and mine does not say model s with a car drawn. 

Does anyone know why?


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## DreamMachine (Sep 28, 2015)

Just ordered my Tesla batteries as well! Looking forward to seeing how you wire up the ZEVA BMS system as that's primarily what I'm looking at.


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## swoozle (Nov 13, 2011)

I'm interested in this as well. I did a Honda Del Sol a few years ago and am getting the itch to do another. A mini seems like a good candidate. Thanks for the updates!


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## swoozle (Nov 13, 2011)

Where do you guys get the tesla batteries and how much are they? I paid ~$7k for a CALB 20kwh pack about 5 years and was hoping to pay a lot less now. But from what have been able to find, a Tesla pack of equivalent size would be roughly the same cost.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

swoozle said:


> Where do you guys get the tesla batteries and how much are they? I paid ~$7k for a CALB 20kwh pack about 5 years and was hoping to pay a lot less now. But from what have been able to find, a Tesla pack of equivalent size would be roughly the same cost.


About your previous comment, there two things to consider with a mini, the weight and amount of area you have to play with. The weight for a car this size is quite high, and the area you have is limited. So just keep that in mind, other than that if you've thought about that than its been tons of fun!

Where did you pay for 7k a 20 kwh pack? What makes the tesla batteries far superior is the engineering that goes into the modules themselves, and the energy density. Each chemistry has there pro's and cons, but these are a couple of big pro's for the tesla modules. Also the amount of space that my 29 kwh pack, 5 modules, will take up will be a lot less than what the calbs would take up.


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## swoozle (Nov 13, 2011)

MrZion said:


> About your previous comment, there two things to consider with a mini, the weight and amount of area you have to play with. The weight for a car this size is quite high, and the area you have is limited. So just keep that in mind, other than that if you've thought about that than its been tons of fun!
> 
> Where did you pay for 7k a 20 kwh pack? What makes the tesla batteries far superior is the engineering that goes into the modules themselves, and the energy density. Each chemistry has there pro's and cons, but these are a couple of big pro's for the tesla modules. Also the amount of space that my 29 kwh pack, 5 modules, will take up will be a lot less than what the calbs would take up.


Sorry, my numbers were a little off.

I bought 48 130Ah cells (19.7Kwh) direct from CALB SoCal for just under $8k in late 2011. I misremembered the $7k (wishful thinking I guess .

I see a number of 5.3Kwh Tesla modules on ebay for $1400, so that's $5600 for a somewhat larger capacity pack (voltage is another story). That's a significant reduction, not even considering even cheaper options like Leaf packs. And as you say, the Tesla modules have significant advantages.

I put 48 CALB 130's in a Honda Del Sol. Is it more or less difficult to cram something in a mini?


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## swoozle (Nov 13, 2011)

Mr. Zion,

Where'd did you source the motor adaptor?

What where the factors that led you to the AC-50? Did you consider the Netgain Hyper 9 motor? 

Thanks!


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

Hi Mr Zion
Great start to your build. I have been planning my own for a while, based on a lightweight 2 seater of some sort, but Mrs Spunagain is leaning on me to look at a Mini convertible conversion instead. I guess you have found the on line virtual wiring diagrams for the R53 herehttp://www.bmw-planet.net/diagrams/release/en/r50/index.htm?

Please share with us how you mate the EV loom to the mini loom!

Re the Tesla batteries, would a pack fit under the bonnet on top of the motor?

How are you planning your cooling? Are you going to have a single loop with the motor controller and battery packs in parallel?

Best of luck!


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

> I put 48 CALB 130's in a Honda Del Sol. Is it more or less difficult to cram something in a mini?


Mini's are a hard car to cram batteries in, unless you are okay with doing away the back seat, then your laughing. Otherwise, the trunk space is very tiny, and the engine compartment is not huge either. I have a mock up of the trunk space right now, if you interested in the dimensions, I could quickly CAD it? another problem with using the trunk as a place to store batteries is the weight ratio of front to rear, a mini is 63/27 front to rear respectively. So adding 200 hundred pounds in the rear might cause some serious understeering 




> Just ordered my Tesla batteries as well! Looking forward to seeing how you wire up the ZEVA BMS system as that's primarily what I'm looking at.


Are your tesla modules coming with the slave bms? or are the voltage/thermistor taps already put into a connector? cause if there in the connector then I'm pretty sure its just a straight application of taking the the leads off the bms and connecting them to the voltage taps the way Ian describes.



> Where'd did you source the motor adaptor?
> 
> What where the factors that led you to the AC-50? Did you consider the Netgain Hyper 9 motor?


The motor adaptor I will be fabricating once I get the AC-50 here, lately I have been cleaning and prepping for when the motor comes.

There are an infinite amount of choices out there, and seeing how this is my first conversion I wanted this project to be AC, and and user friendly. At the time, the curtis caught my eye.



> Great start to your build. I have been planning my own for a while, based on a lightweight 2 seater of some sort, but Mrs Spunagain is leaning on me to look at a Mini convertible conversion instead. I guess you have found the on line virtual wiring diagrams for the R53 herehttp://www.bmw-planet.net/diagrams/r.../r50/index.htm?
> 
> Please share with us how you mate the EV loom to the mini loom!
> 
> ...


Yea I have seen that BMW planet but could not get it to work, I did manage to find and download a pdf someone made of the R53 from BMW planet.

What do you mean EV loom? the main wire harness coming from the curtis 1238 controller? And if that's the harness your talking about it doesn't mate with the Mini Loom, if you are talking about the harness that plugs into the ECU?

That is what I am really hoping for, the battery box to fit within the engine bay, because then I will be able to restore the front to rear weight ratio. I will know if I will be able to when I get the motor, make the motor adaptor, fabricate motor mounts so that the motor can perfectly mate with the transaxle and the clutch still functional. That will take up a lot of space, so I am hoping then I can design my battery box.



> Very nice job done so far. I'm planning to convert my rx8


Nice, that will probably be an awesome car to convert, what type of suspension does it have?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hey guys,

As you can see in the photo it looks a bit chaotic but I've set the tractive system up on the bench, I got my coupler and adapter on the way from CanEV, my ZEVA BMS is within the city, and I got my charger!

The coupler and the adapter are coming as a blank canvas (so to speak) so I will have to do minimal machining to make this work! That was exciting news because I don't have precise measurement tools at hand.

So, for the first time I put a nominal voltage of 121 on the controller b+ and b-, woohoo right? Well yes, until I realised two faults were showing, error 24 and 43 which are Overvoltage cutback and Pot2 Wiper High respectively. For error 24 it's recommend to check the the capacitor bank voltage, which mine was at 121 volts which seems correct to me? Error 43 is saying that my pot2 high wiper is above voltage threshold, not sure how cause I just followed the schematics by HPEV's for PB-8. I am curious though why it is Pot2, any thoughts?

Cheers,
Will


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

Hi Mr Zion 
Reading the blurb on the EVwest site for the ac50 it says..”The AC50 is an AC motor that operates at 72-108V” could that be your problem? To be fair that is the motor voltage and not the controller though...

I am keen to see where and how you splice in the motor controller and BMS signals to the mini. It looks like you should be able to use the existing temperate, fuel and tachometer dials using the outputs from the BMS and Curtis controller...

I was wondering if this http://www.evwest.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=36&products_id=139&osCsid=eenvrn6jtcpfvq6630kvn51un7 adapter would fit as I think the U.K. Neons used the same engine as the R53 Mini.

Good luck


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Spunagain said:


> Hi Mr Zion
> Reading the blurb on the EVwest site for the ac50 it says..”The AC50 is an AC motor that operates at 72-108V” could that be your problem? To be fair that is the motor voltage and not the controller though...
> 
> I am keen to see where and how you splice in the motor controller and BMS signals to the mini. It looks like you should be able to use the existing temperate, fuel and tachometer dials using the outputs from the BMS and Curtis controller...
> ...


I talked with Randy from CanEV and people from HPEV's and what was said is that above 120V's the current will start to limit and a fault will show. So I am going to load my pack until the voltage is below 120 and see if the error goes away.

According to Wikipedia you are correct, in non-USA markets neon at some point did use the same tritec engine. If you research what year the neon used this engine that would be a really great solution, Randy from CanEV is really great to deal with.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

MrZion
I assume you are referring to the controller's operation. Is that correct? Can you set your charge limit slight lower to keep away from the 120V limit?

Cheers

Tyler


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

tylerwatts said:


> MrZion
> I assume you are referring to the controller's operation. Is that correct? Can you set your charge limit slight lower to keep away from the 120V limit?
> 
> Cheers
> ...


My charger is CAN controlled via my ZEVA BMS so yes I will be able to set my charge limit. When I get the BMS working (because right now my master won't even turn on...) I am going to play around and see if I can bring it up to 120 and see if the error is still around, or whether I need to drop the voltage a bit.

The fault doesn't effect my motor's performance, from what I can tell running it on the bench, because when it's under operation the status LED's on the Curtis controller flash normal operation. It's just as soon as I start decelerating or in idle the fault LED's start flashing.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

So, I have got the AC-50 spinning at what ever RPM (sounds amazing) and no flashing fault code!

On another note..
I got my ZEVA BMS and I originally had some problems with the instructions, but sorted that out with the help of Ian at ZEVA. I am now able to monitor one Tesla module with shunt balancing working. My problem is now trying to monitor two tesla modules. I believe my methodology is correct, by taking the 6+ of the one module, hooking it up to a terminal block with jumpers, and getting the 1- and making those two the same potential and attaching a lead from the slave bms board to the terminal block. Let me know what you guys think!?

(In my drawn picture the cell monitoring board was not actually connected, I just wanted to show it if it were to be connected, the leads though were connected to a type of terminal block that plugs into the slave bms.)

What happened though (and caught me off guard) was the welding of the positive terminal (the terminal that says 2 for module 1) when I took the 2/0 cable from module two (terminal 3) and touched it to module 1 positive terminal. There is no load, as you can see its just the two batteries in series. What else happened was that the 6+ lead melted the insulation and the wire got hot enough to melt through the battery modules stiff plastic.

If you notice, module one negative terminal would be the zero potential and module two positive terminal would be the high potential. Later that night, I realised I hooked up the voltage tap leads giving the complete opposite polarity. Notice where I said 0V and 48V. I don't know if this is what caused the welding, but I would really like to hear what you guys have to say, because I am not going hook up my pack until I know what happened.

Cheers,
Will


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

What you are describing sounds right and diagram looks ok, but a couple of questions, sorry if they seem obvious! (I am neither a Tesla or EV expert but used to be an electronic engineer a long time ago)

Were the packs connected to anything else? (if they were drawing current e.g. if you had them hooked up to the motor controller.)

If you were monitoring the voltage across the packs, are you sure the meter was not in current mode?

Were the main battery high current connections insulated and not shorting on anything?

Are you sure the you have the connections on the Tesla pack cell monitor correct? Have you checked each one with a volt meter?

Is one of the connections not actually b- but pack chassis ground? Does not look possible.

Is it possible the wire shorted to the chassis?

Are these the connections you are using? http://evwest.com/support/Tesla%20Model%20S%20444%20Pin%20Diagram.pdf


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Spunagain said:


> What you are describing sounds right and diagram looks ok, but a couple of questions, sorry if they seem obvious! (I am neither a Tesla or EV expert but used to be an electronic engineer a long time ago)
> 
> Were the packs connected to anything else? (if they were drawing current e.g. if you had them hooked up to the motor controller.)
> 
> ...


No, as the picture shows there was no load connected, just the two modules in series

The only external meter that I was using to measure voltage was a DMM. And I just measured the voltage of taps. Made sure each tap had a roughly 4 volt difference all the way up to 48 volts

Main battery cables are insulated and they weren't shorting 

According to the diagram that you posted, and that is the one I used, I double checked if they were wired up correctly. The only thing is like I said In my previous post, I'm pretty sure with the voltage taps I reversed the polarity. I didn't reverse the polarity of the main battery cables.

No shorting between anything metal isn't really possible, each module is stacked with a 1/4" piece of plywood in between, on a wood table.

I find it curious how when I touched the 2/0 cable to the module 1 positive terminal enough current shorted to melt the terminal, and when that was happening module 2's 6+ voltage tap got hot enough to melt through the hard rigid plastic that the modules are comprised of.


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

That is wierd.
Can you sketch what you did wrong 1st time around, not quite sure what you mean.

Also, please can you share a couple of overview pictures of the whole set up showing the packs connectors and meters. 

Even if I can’t figure it out they might help someone else diagnose the glitch!

Cheers.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Spunagain said:


> That is wierd.
> Can you sketch what you did wrong 1st time around, not quite sure what you mean.
> 
> Also, please can you share a couple of overview pictures of the whole set up showing the packs connectors and meters.
> ...


I disconnected everything because this project is happening in my garage, and I really didn't want anything happening if I left.

The picture I posted is similar but hopefully more clear. On the right, and underneath where it says cell #'s is how tesla labels each cell, and therefore each voltage tap. module 2's 6+ voltage tap connects to the left side of the terminal block. This terminal block has two terminal block jumpers, hence why I am using three parallel terminal block spaces. So the 6+ of module 2 is made to be the same potential as the 1- of module 1. Using the cable that was originally connected to module 2 negative terminal, I tapped it to module 1 positive terminal, that is when module 1 positive terminal partially melted. big spark, kinda loud, but not super loud.

Does that make sense? The positive terminal of module 2 was connected to nothing, and so was the negative terminal of module 1. These were the only connections that were taking places.


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

Ok so still wierd!

The only way this can happen is if there is a short somewhere else between the two packs which is completing the circuit. 

Let’s try and figure out where.

Can you disconnect the terminal block (I guess you have done this already) and measure the voltage across the flying leads?

It should be zero volts. If it is more then dividing the voltage by 4 should give an idea where the short is located.

Keeping one voltmeter probe on pack 1 and the other on pack 2; check the voltage at different points including the different cell connections, the main terminals and the chassis. The bigger the voltage the further you are from the short.

Was the bms still hooked up?

Finally, are you wearing insulating gloves and goggles? If you are getting accidental welding you might get spitting gobs of metal which you don’t want in your eyes. (Sorry I have been to too many health and safety courses - some with horrific photos to put the fear of God in you!)


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## SWF (Nov 23, 2007)

MrZion said:


> My problem is now trying to monitor two tesla modules. I believe my methodology is correct, by taking the 6+ of the one module, hooking it up to a terminal block with jumpers, and getting the 1- and making those two the same potential and attaching a lead from the slave bms board to the terminal block. Let me know what you guys think!?


I am trying to understand the purpose of the terminal block between the battery modules in your picture/diagram. The BMS voltage tap wires should only be connected to the two tesla modules after the two battery modules have been connected in series to prevent damage to the BMS. Since the negative and positive of the two battery modules are connected prior to connecting the BMS, you only need one voltage tap wire from the connection between the two modules.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Good Update today,

figured out the problem when I re-drew how I connected things. Through the voltage tap leads 6+ and 1- I closed the circuit when I wired the modules in series..... stupid mistake and important lesson 

but moving on!

And for people who are wondering how to connect your zeva bms up I drew how to wire two modules up, anything more you just repeat this per slave bms

Cheers!


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## itchyback (May 28, 2014)

Thanks for sharing this, i'm just choosing how to wire a BMS to my tesla modules. EVTV has a system for $1500. 
Zeva's i like because i can plug it into a screen.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

itchyback said:


> Thanks for sharing this, i'm just choosing how to wire a BMS to my tesla modules. EVTV has a system for $1500.
> Zeva's i like because i can plug it into a screen.


Right, 1500 plus tax and what not. You can observe/program through USB serial interface i'm pretty sure though?

ZEVA just came out with a rev 3 as well that's the same system but with more functionality and hundreds cheaper I am pretty sure. Ian is also friendly and very helpful, I can't say the same thing for jack. But anyhow, either will get the job done


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## itchyback (May 28, 2014)

Nods, observable/ programmable through a computer. with ASCII (which i dont know how to use)
It might not be cheaper for me as im using a whole pack (16 modules) but I'll price it properly when i'm ready to order. The V3 looked great, released mid december, good timing for me i think


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## SWF (Nov 23, 2007)

Here is an example diagram from the ZEVA manual showing how to connect the tap wires to the ZEVA BMS in a case where you have 12 cells, which is equivalent to having two tesla modules.









Each tesla module has 7 built-in voltage tap wires, since they were designed to each have their own separate tesla slave BMS. When using the ZEVA BMS (or any BMS that monitors more than one tesla module at a time), you will not need to use all the built-in tap wires since some are redundant once the battery module terminals are connected together. The battery modules should be connected together prior to connecting the BMS, otherwise the BMS could be damaged.

So when connecting two tesla modules to the ZEVA BMS, the tap wire that is in the center in the diagram above (tap wire that is a straight line) can come from either the built-in negative tap wire of the battery module on the left or the built-in positive tap wire of the battery module on the right. So one of the built-in tesla tap wires will not be connected.

Also note the comment in the ZEVA manual about the need to bridge cell tap wires if less than 12 cells are being monitored, which would be needed if monitoring only one tesla module.


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hey guys it has been awhile since an update!

Since I got the BMS working I have been working on the motor/transaxle alignment, and it has been quite the challenge! But with the help of others and using a CanEV generic adapter plate and coupler, I know know what to do and how to do it now. For me I would say this has been the hardest part, the alignment of these two components.

I got a manifold, some 5/16" and 3/4" tubing and some whose clamps along with doorman 800-123 fuel line connectors to create my liquid cooling "circuit". I also got a pump that does about 12.5 L/min.

I got my vacuum assist brake circuit up and running creating my own reservoir of 4" diameter x 4' long. 

My battery box which is shown drawn in one of the pictures below I got welded up as well, where the top and front pieces will be 1/4" plexi so that you can see all the components inside the battery box.

Pulled out my foot pedal which is a drive by wire system so I am creating a mechanical linkage to hook up to my Curtis PB-8 that will be housed within the engine bay.

Some worries as I come closer to finishing this:
1) How crazy is the ECU going to go once everything is hooked back up?
2) Bleeding the brakes through my ABS module apparently will be tough

Cheers!


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

Nice progress!

Would it work to just unplug the old ICE ECU altogether? What outputs from the Old ecu does the car electrical system need to work properly? You might be able to create any steady state signals using relays.

For the brakes, could you use an Ezibleed which uses pressure from the tyres to help force bleed the system? Otherwise I think you will need to get a garage with a vacuum bleeding kit to help.

Quick question, are you sharing the cooling system between the battery and the motor controller, or will you have 2 pumps and 2 radiators?

I would only use the Perspex ones for show, and use metal ones for every day use to slow down any potential fire. I would also look at fitting smoke alarms to the 2 battery boxes.


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## Spunagain (Jun 15, 2017)

Hi MrZion, I hope the build is progressing well. 

A couple of weeks back I went to the Fully charged live show at Silverstone and attended the talk given by the Electric Classic Cars founder, and one of the project team that did the electric E-type Jaguar that took the happy couple from the royal wedding. 

One of key points I took away was that in the U.K. if you do a conversion, you cannot modify the chassis, safety cell or remove any existing safety features such as anti lock brakes or the dynamic stability control. To do this I would need to find a way to link the motor controller to the CAN bus so it communicated with athr DSC/ABS controllers in the Mini. This is way beyond my abilities, so I guess I am back to looking at a classic to convert instead. Which is a shame as the Mini otherwise seems to be a great candidate for conversion. 

What are you planning to do here, is it ok on your side of the pond to just disconnect the ABS and DSC?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Spunagain said:


> Hi MrZion, I hope the build is progressing well.
> 
> A couple of weeks back I went to the Fully charged live show at Silverstone and attended the talk given by the Electric Classic Cars founder, and one of the project team that did the electric E-type Jaguar that took the happy couple from the royal wedding.
> 
> ...



Hey there, sorry I didn't see your previous comment and this one till now. I'm working on 3 electric car projects right now (don't ask how I got going on the other two before finishing mine...) but I am very close to being able to just wire up the system. For me wiring the system up will be much quicker.

I wouldn't give up just yet, what's made this project much easier for me is that I have been talking with a mini cooper dealer service shop, and more specifically the shop forman. When he looked at the R53 diagrams he thinks that even if I took the ECU (or more formally called the DME) the ABS would still work.


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Created an account just to join this thread- I've been looking into converting a 2007 cooper S to ev since I first bought one a few weeks ago. How are things going?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

tobby540 said:


> Created an account just to join this thread- I've been looking into converting a 2007 cooper S to ev since I first bought one a few weeks ago. How are things going?


Nice! I can't believe my last post was so long ago... A lot has happened since, lot's of challenges come with a mini; mainly to do with available space. My drive train and motor is all set up, the battery boxes are nearly done, I've previously set up this inverter before so that will not be to challenging. The issue that I am trying to solve right now is how to retain ABS/traction control when removing the ECU, since now the ICE is gone. 

I have a template of the bell housing that is essentially a perfect match, there was one small part where I was a little shy when compared to the actual radius of the bell housing


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Mr Zion!! How goes things with your conversion? Did you manage to find a way to keep the ABS?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

tobby540 said:


> Mr Zion!! How goes things with your conversion? Did you manage to find a way to keep the ABS?


I'm thinking that my conversion will be done in a week, so I will update once everything is said and done (yaahoo!). But things are moving along nicely!


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Any updates?


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

tobby540 said:


> Any updates?


Hey Tobby,

Unfortunately life happened, and I wasn't able to work on the car for months, but I have re-picked it up over the last month. 

Where am I at? The system is fully hooked up, all functionality of what I installed works correctly (yaahoo). I am now just starting to tackle bringing the original car functionality back (lot's of which I find still works) but for instance I have noticed that the car breaks signal which is triggered by a magnetic switch ran power from the magnetic switch to the DME (ECU) back to the lights... well since the DME isn't really in the equation anymore I now have to bypass the DME and run power to the lights from the mag switch to trigger a relay, or just use my inverter's functionality.

So all I am doing right now is tackling one issue at a time in regards to bringing original car functionality back online.

I also found out that at least here in BC all you have to do to ensure the vehicle is change some notation on your insurance, no vehicle inspection. I talked with an inspector who over looks all of vancouver and he told me this. exciting times on the western front!


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## clsund (Jan 18, 2019)

Signed up to follow this thread too! How's the work coming along? I have an 06 Mini I'm wanting to convert.


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Mr Zion! 

How have the times been? 

all the best-


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hello Toby,

I finished the car so that it could drive, but when the car was taken out for a test drive (when I wasn’t there) the OEM throttle pedal assembly collapsed. Not sure how, but I haven’t taken a look at it. I was planning to do that in the next week or so. 

Have you started yours?


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Mr Zion, 

sorry to hear about your petal collapsing! 

I haven't started my conversion yet other than looking at which motor I wanted to put in it (AC 55 from Curtis). I'm still in college and haven't got the funds available to get this started but super eager to hear about how you went about doing this!

Cheers,


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## MrZion (May 4, 2016)

Hi All,

I haven't posted for a while but I have been driving the mini around my island perfectly fine minus the power steering and the brake lights. Funnily enough, the brake lights have been troublesome.. and the power steering pump requires the brakes input and has control wires which come from the ASC so getting that up and running might be a challenge, might have to develop a PCB for that one.

Other than that, I just was ripping around in my very hilly area perfectly fine, how cool is that!

The two recommendations I would say is that use a Curtis 1239e due to the logic level isolation, I had an isolation problem for some time and was a headache to try and figure it out. Number 2 is use a motor rated for 4000 lbs or higher, I would even go to say 4500 lbs or higher, and the reason is that the AC50 has a hard time with two guys (around 400lbs) plus the curb weight going around my hilly area. My hills rage from 15-20% grade (so they are really quite steep).

It's been a ton of fun driving. The next phase of the project is 3 things, one, to take get more movement out of the brake pistons, they're a bit stiff so you can sometimes hear the brakes engaged even though they should not be. Two, try and figure out the power steering and develop a PCB if need be, and three get the break lights working... 

Cheers guys!


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## tobby540 (Jul 20, 2018)

Mr Zion! It has been too long! How are things going? Did you get the bits to work properly?


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## Rwcampbell51 (Apr 14, 2021)

itchyback said:


> Hey,
> Nice build, i cant comment on your circuit diagram, it looks like dutch to me.
> Thinking over the question in your last post about buying OEM leaf/ volt or buying individual parts.
> I understand your conundrum having asked that question myself. I think the extra range and value pays for the difficulty of interfacing issues. thats my vote. plenty of cheapish aftermarket guages and bits or you could massage the leaf bits to fit in your car
> ...


Saw this old forum for conversation of a 2003 mini to ev. Like the leaf idea. I see he abandoned the leaf because saw problems hooking into the mini system. Why not use the leaf wiring harness and ECU instead of the mini cooper. I have 2004 I would like to convert. Transmission went bad.


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## hbthink (Dec 21, 2010)

Just picked up a nice 2009 Mini for $700 with roof rack and box. Actually put mechanic in can sealed up its leaks and it runs decently well, though I'd be afraid to take it farther than I can push it! Also got the guts of a 2012 Leaf, would like to use the complete drivetrain. Got the leaf for free but someone else wanted the battery and paid for it. I'd like to stay over 300vdc but space in a mini is at a premium for sure. I'll post pics as I progress. I believe the leaf motor and gearbox could be fit into the space with some motor mount fabrication then I'd pair both half shafts cut in half and remate the leaf end gearbox side to the mini wheel side with coupler and welding, if that makes sense. I cannot think of an easier way to do things. The leaf motor/gearbox combo is quite nice would rather use it than the six speed in the car. Going to use CAN to drive the leaf inverter probably with the Thunderstruck ev ECU. Well anyways thats the current plan open to suggestions.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

hbthink said:


> I believe the leaf motor and gearbox could be fit into the space with some motor mount fabrication then I'd pair both half shafts cut in half and remate the leaf end gearbox side to the mini wheel side with coupler and welding, if that makes sense. I cannot think of an easier way to do things.


That can work, and has been done successfully... but it's not easy and can produce a weak or unbalanced shaft. There are alternatives, the ideal being custom-made axle shafts splined on the outer ends to fit the car's joints and on the inner ends to fit the joints that go with the transaxle.


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