# Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Bad and inacurate information. A home charger J1772 220v 30amp from HD is
only $799.00. Anybody who has a EV plug in should have one of these and not
a 110v that takes forever. You dont want to get stuck somewhere and have to
use 110v.

--
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

not to state the obvious, but that's just the plug. You still need a cha=
rger, which is another $1-2k for a higher power charger.

david.
http://www.evalbum.com/4021

>________________________________
> From: Cruisin <[email protected]>
>To: [email protected] =

>Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2012 3:23 PM
>Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies
> =

>Bad and inacurate information. A home charger J1772 220v 30amp from HD is
>only $799.00. Anybody who has a EV plug in should have one of these and not
>a 110v that takes forever. You dont want to get stuck somewhere and have to
>use 110v.
>
>--

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| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*



> Cruisin wrote:
> 
> > Bad and inacurate information. A home charger J1772 220v 30amp from HD is
> > only $799.00. Anybody who has a EV plug in should have one of these and
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

[ref original post
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-EV-charging-for-dummies-tp4656390.html
]


Sidebar
How much harder would it be to also have a NEMA 5-15 male inlet right
next to the other two coupler inlets on a 2010+ Production EV/pih (i.e.:
the Leaf EV). Then we would not need to carry around an Level-1 EVSE, it
would be internally built-in/on-board at all times.

We would only need to carry with us a 50' and 25' 12-3 extension cord (I
always carried both just in case, which saved my bacon many a time).
This is where a conversion EV has an advantage which usually has a 5-15
inlet so you only have to be concerned with someone vandalizing or
stealing your cheap/easily replaceable extension cord, and not an
expensive/must-have Level-1 EVSE unit.

The extra space next to the J1772 and Level-3 inlets on a Leaf EV could
be designed to have a drop in 5-15 inlet, or the type of plug used in
Europe, Australia, Asia, etc. Where ever the EV/pih is sold it is likely
to not be sent out of the country, but if it was, my aforementioned idea
would let the owner get the appropriate inlet swapped in, or be able to
adapt to it. Obviously, an easy implementation of this idea is to just
use the dual 120/240VAC EVSE that comes with the Leaf but wire it up
internally to the aforementioned inlet.

As posted, I would also carry along with me a Level-2 EVSE for when I am
at grandma's using her dryer outlet, or a RV park that is EV friendly,
etc. In those cases, the location would be rather safe, or I would be
near if it was exposed.

But at an airport's extended stay parking lot (i.e. driver won't return
for days), if a level-1 outlet is offered, I really would rather only
have a expendable extension cord exposed to harm/finding a new home than
a dangling EVSE.


{brucedp.150m.com}



-


> Roger Stockton wrote:
> > Cruisin wrote:
> >
> > > Bad and inacurate information. A home charger J1772 220v 30amp from HD is
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*



> Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> 
> > How much harder would it be to also have a NEMA 5-15 male inlet right
> > next to the other two coupler inlets on a 2010+ Production EV/pih (i.e.:
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Thanks Roger for your response.

I was not concerned with losing extension cords.

I was concerned with losing either the Level-1 EVSE that comes with the Leaf
or the Level-2 EVSE I would buy and carry with me. 

When I would use either, it would be dangling outside where anyone could
mess with it. Since I would leave for hours to kill time (restaurant, movie,
shopping, etc.), I would want to try to secure either of those with some
sort of cable lock to the vehicle. I would want there when I get back.

This is approach I used when I connected to power via an Avcon using the EAA
Avcon adapter I encouraged to be created. I would cable lock the adapter to
my bumper. Went I got back to my Blazer, sometimes I would find someone had
moved it, but gave up once they saw it was locked up.


My original thought was that that Level-1 EVSE that comes with the Leaf, the
manufacture would install internally so, it would be powered via the 5-15
inlet I suggested, and the output would be directly connected to the
built-in charger. 

The built-in charger would have to be able to lock out all other power
inputs to only use the first one plugged in\providing power. So, if I
applied power via the proposed 5-15 inlet, alos plugging in the J1772 or
Level-3 inlet would do nothing and not be used. And vice-verse, applying
power using the J1772 inlet, the 5-15 and Level-3 inlet would be disabled. I
am thinking, that method would resolve the pilot issue as only one is being
used (etc.).

While I agree the the number of Level-1 users would be less, having this
5-15 inlet would be a very easy selling point, and as it has been posted so
many-many times, there is level-1 everywhere.

I would like to know that at anytime, I could quickly plug into a regular
120VAC outlet easily using an expendable extension cord (basically, thieves
can mess with extension cord all they want, but do not mess with any EVSE I
'need' that is expensive and time-consuming to replace).


{brucedp.150m.com}

--
View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-EV-charging-for-dummies-tp4656390p4656413.html
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_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Sorry, but I disagree entirely. There seems to be some sort of conspiracy going on that is saying you have to use an 'EVSE' or risk dying a horrible death. Just use a properly installed 240V socket with earth leakage protection - $50 instead of $800 - assuming you haven't got one already. Anyway, most people wont need to charge anywhere near the full pack every day and for them 110V will be fine. Fortunately here in the EU (UK in may case) we all have ready access to 240V sockets - these are the norm.

MW




> Cruisin wrote:
> 
> > Bad and inacurate information. A home charger J1772 220v 30amp from HD is
> > only $799.00. Anybody who has a EV plug in should have one of these and not
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*



> brucedp5 wrote:
> 
> > I was not concerned with losing extension cords.
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Bruce,

Did you consider modifying the level 1 ESVE cable? You don't need a second
cable. Here's one company that will do it, for example:

http://evseupgrade.com/

Peri

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Roger Stockton
Sent: 11 July, 2012 7:56 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies



> brucedp5 wrote:
> 
> > I was not concerned with losing extension cords.
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Thanks Roger for your thoughts/views.

Perhaps you had to be there pushing the envelope like I was, or perhaps
after being stuck for lack of infrastructure and support back then, that
heightened my fears/concerns. I was vandalized several times, but was
also smart enough to have a back up plan (6 on-board chargers, a gym bag
of adapters, and a back seat of extension cords) when I was out in the
middle of nowhere.

IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just has kludgy
looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to be
cleaner-looking to only have an extension cord coming to and from the
EV, than all that 'stuff' dangling off it. 

Appearances, another point I am concerned with, potential consumer's
opinion/how does it visually affect them. While I am sure I could find a
way to secure the Leaf's L1 EVSE, it would not stop the non-EV driving
public from forming 'OGM what a nightmare' opinions of how to
fill-the-EV-tank (as it were). My other goal it to minimize their silly
notions whenever possible (yea, I know that is a near impossible task,
but still I try).


{brucedp.150m.com}




-


> Roger Stockton wrote:
> > brucedp5 wrote:
> >
> > > I was not concerned with losing extension cords.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Here is a method to prevent power cords being stolen that we use at our work 
sites. Even if we lock the power receptacles at both end, they would just 
cut off the cords. The next time they cut the power cables, we left on the 
power which give them a bad hair day.

The best way is not to show a new power cable laying around. When we make 
up new cables and connectors, we wrap it with that cloth type friction tape 
in several spots to look likes it has be splice which some bare wires 
sticking out which are not connected to anything.

Then we tie it to a back of a vehicle and drag it over dirty roads until it 
looks like it should be thrown away.

This works every time.

Roland




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2012 9:54 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies


> Thanks Roger for your thoughts/views.
>
> Perhaps you had to be there pushing the envelope like I was, or perhaps
> after being stuck for lack of infrastructure and support back then, that
> heightened my fears/concerns. I was vandalized several times, but was
> also smart enough to have a back up plan (6 on-board chargers, a gym bag
> of adapters, and a back seat of extension cords) when I was out in the
> middle of nowhere.
>
> IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just has kludgy
> looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to be
> cleaner-looking to only have an extension cord coming to and from the
> EV, than all that 'stuff' dangling off it.
>
> Appearances, another point I am concerned with, potential consumer's
> opinion/how does it visually affect them. While I am sure I could find a
> way to secure the Leaf's L1 EVSE, it would not stop the non-EV driving
> public from forming 'OGM what a nightmare' opinions of how to
> fill-the-EV-tank (as it were). My other goal it to minimize their silly
> notions whenever possible (yea, I know that is a near impossible task,
> but still I try).
>
>
> {brucedp.150m.com}
>
>
>
>
> -
>


> Roger Stockton wrote:
> > > brucedp5 wrote:
> > >
> > > > I was not concerned with losing extension cords.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*



> Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> > IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just as kludgy
> > looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to be
> > cleaner-looking to only have an extension cord coming to and from the
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

I think Roland had the solution for that problem:
take the box for a drive (you can't drive away with
the box plugged in, like what happened to numerous
people at the gas station) but certainly you can tie
it with a piece of rope to the car and run up and down a
dirt road a few times with the cord and box dragging
behind the vehicle. After that even the blinking lights
won't convince any modern day kid to steal it... 

BTW, that "strain sensor" is that simply a loose wire
internally or did the box *indicate* that strain was put
on the cord? It is totally ridiculous, I have not seen
any appliance that shuts down when you put strain on its cord.

I wonder what would happen if GM would put a strain sensor
on their cars - you would not be going anywhere fast!

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP: +31877841130
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2012 2:33 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies



> Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> > IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just as kludgy
> > looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to
> > be cleaner-looking to only have an extension cord coming to and from
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Yes! Lee has got that last point I was making. Basically it looks bad.

To some of us die-hard EVrs, 'we' could care less how it looks as long
as it functions. But to the non-EV-addicted public it looks like a
science-project after-thought, or perhaps even more graphic, a dirty
long dangling booger/bogie
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/002694391/15307974_boogers_xlarge.jpeg

Whether you like pih or not, you must admit the Ampera & Volt are good
looking GM vehicles. Whether you go for the French aerodynamic tweaks of
the Leaf, all vehicles are visually degraded with that Level-1 EVSE
'stuff' dangling out of it
http://misterhorrible.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83452f2d569e2012876d57620970c-800wi

Whereas a plain straight extension cord going to and from a vehicle is
much more visually acceptable to the general public.

Perhaps Roger is right that my vandalism concerns puts me in the
minority. But if the Level-1 EVSE were internal and connected to an
extension cord inlet, both of my concerns would be addressed, and the
public would be more accepting with the use of and how EVs/pih look
while charging.


{brucedp.150m.com}


-


> Lee Hart wrote:
> > Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> > > IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just as kludgy
> > > looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to be
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

*Re: [EVDL] EVLN: EV charging for dummies*

Yes! Lee has got that last point I was making. Basically it looks bad.

To some of us die-hard EVrs, 'we' could care less how it looks as long
as it functions. But to the non-EV-addicted public it looks like a
science-project after-thought, or perhaps even more graphic, a dirty
long dangling booger/bogie
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/002694391/15307974_boogers_xlarge.jpeg

Whether you like pih or not, you must admit the Ampera & Volt are good
looking GM vehicles. Whether you go for the French aerodynamic tweaks of
the Leaf, all vehicles are visually degraded with that Level-1 EVSE
'stuff' dangling out of it
http://misterhorrible.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83452f2d569e2012876d57620970c-800wi

Whereas a plain straight extension cord going to and from a vehicle is
much more visually acceptable to the general public.

Perhaps Roger is right that my vandalism concerns puts me in the
minority. But if the Level-1 EVSE were internal and connected to an
extension cord inlet, both of my concerns would be addressed, and the
public would be more accepting with the use of and how EVs/pih look
while charging.


{brucedp.150m.com}


-


> Lee Hart wrote:
> > Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> > > IMO The locking of the dangling Avcon adapter is also just as kludgy
> > > looking as today's Level-1 EVSE the Leaf comes with. It just seems to be
> ...


----------

