# Black Zombie takes on the Texas Mile



## John Wayland (May 26, 2008)

Hello to All,

3-27-2015 

The fully street legal, all factory-bodied 'Black Zombie' 1968 Mustang Fastback with a full interior and no lightening composite panels, ran the Texas Mile at 174.2 mph in the street legal class today. White Zombie's 
3300 lb. Texan brethren is powered by a Derek Barger 'High Tech Systems' 17.7 kWh lithium pack, twin Zilla Z2k controllers, and a pair of torque-monster NetGain 11 inch motors twisting a pair of Gear Vendors overdrives coupled to a 2:47 Ford nine inch differential. External 12v blowers for the motors and iced-water for the Zillas kept the heat at bay.

Congrats to Mitch and Libby Medford and the rest of team Bloodshed Motors!

See Ya... John Wayland


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

Congratulations, John, Mitch and the team!


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## IamIan (Mar 29, 2009)

Now I know what the distraction delaying Silver-Streak has been


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Congratulations to team Bloodshed. Thanks for the heads-up John.

Here's an article on the racer: http://musclecarjournal.blogspot.com/2015/01/1968-mustang-fastback-all-electric.html


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## RIPPERTON (Jan 26, 2010)

Nice to have you on the forum John but feel free to let loose here mate, no need to be shy. Hows about a proper good burnout smoke screen video.
heres one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHqcigvRCkk

and here too...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GECr7BDb3oM


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## John Wayland (May 26, 2008)

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for those burnout links. Those are from last summer's couple of Oregon-to-Texas trips co-designing, building and test driving/racing the beast  A lot of improvements have been made since those slower 12.1 second passes, and there are videos of much better smoke shows, too. The '68 Fastback will most likely run high 10s very soon, as its 6.8 @ 101 mph 1/8 mile ETs point towards 

As to Silver Streak - ah yes, it's been a long time coming! It's taken four years to bounce back to where my old driven self is emerging, and through most of that time the car was stored off site in limbo. It returned here about four months ago though. I am happy to report the entire month of April is dedicated to finishing the 71.5 kWh LiPol pack and getting it installed into the car. A big part of this finally happening, is my recent design and erection of a new heavy duty carport structure fitted with a small gantry crane to help with lifting heavy 1/3 portions of the pack in place. I will begin to report on its progress in the coming weeks.

See Ya... John Wayland


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## IamIan (Mar 29, 2009)

John Wayland said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> Thanks for those burnout links. Those are from last summer's couple of Oregon-to-Texas trips co-designing, building and test driving/racing the beast  A lot of improvements have been made since those slower 12.1 second passes, and there are videos of much better smoke shows, too. The '68 Fastback will most likely run high 10s very soon, as its 6.8 @ 101 mph 1/8 mile ETs point towards
> 
> ...




































I think that covers it.


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## jwiger (Oct 18, 2014)

Bravo, John, and to Mitch and the team/family. That is a beautiful Mustang. I really need to make my way down to the Bloodshed. I'm only an hour north of it.


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## GerhardRP (Nov 17, 2009)

John Wayland said:


> Hello to All,
> 
> 3-27-2015
> 
> ...


Hi John, Nice work for the team.
Did you perchance take zilla readings during that run? I could run them through my motor model and maybe give you some new insights into the system.
Gerhard


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## Brute Force (Aug 28, 2010)

Nicely produced video of Black Zombie's triumph at the Texas Mile:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjQtrysPzVI

Outstanding!


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Very impressive vehicle.
Incredible performance.
Superb video !


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## dedlast (Aug 17, 2013)

As everybody else is saying: Congrats on the record! Nice work. Nice coverage. And nice work, Verge, on the video.


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## Zombie 222 (Jul 3, 2014)

Been a while since I posted on the forum, but with all of the attention that the Zombie 222 is getting after The Verge video, I wanted to jump on and give some credit where it is due. 

First, John Wayland. Without the White Zombie to inspire, his trips to Texas to teach the team, introductions to soooo many cool people, help spec-ing and building the car and then continuing support both technical and emotional from Portland, there wouldn't be a Zombie 222 and a business vision. My bother from another Mother.

Marko, thanks for the trip to Austin and the wonder fab work you did without a single decent tool to work with while you were here. 

The whole Austin team and race crew (Jack, Allen, Joe and Andrew) None of you know them, but trust me they ROCK. Without them, I would be lost and there wouldn't be a car to drive. 

Derek at High Tech Systems, holy crap what a battery you can build. Truly amazing! Crazy power and a piece of art too.

George at NetGain - Thank you building a set of tough SOB-ing motors. John and I keep trying to break them, but no luck so far. 

Rich at Manzanita Micro - Without the monster Zillas to feed George's motors and the PFC 40 to juice up the pack, there wouldn't be a Zombie 222. Thanks for making truly SICK controllers!

John Metric - Thanks for all of the advice about the Texas Mile and setting a record for us to rally behind.

Bob Fagliano - thanks for trying soooo hard to find better and better battery sources and I just know you'll get me a free pack one of these days with your sponsor magic  

Shawn at Street or Track - Without his awesome 3 link rear end, suspension and brakes, the Zombie 222 would have destroyed itself long ago. 

Rich at Mustangs to Fear - Killer interior parts, really love the one piece headliner and custom dash pad. 

Lastly thanks to the whole EV community for welcoming an outsider like me and having so much passion to change the world a few electrons at a time. 

In parting, here is a link to a burnout I did at a Porsche Tech day I hosted for the Central Texas chapter of the national Porsche club of America. You'll love the reaction from die hard Porsche lovers. 

https://youtu.be/g4_7GCPbroA

Mitch


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## dougingraham (Jul 26, 2011)

That is a really great looking conversion. You guys did a remarkable job!


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

Great work, Mitch.

What did you end up using for cells?


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## Zombie 222 (Jul 3, 2014)

Hollie Maea said:


> Great work, Mitch.
> 
> What did you end up using for cells?



I got a pack built by High Tech Systems using LiPo Ultra high power cells that Derek had made just for his business. 

960 cells in a 10P 96S configuration. 3000AMP, 355 voltage pack that charges up to 400volts. 

1.1MW pack.


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## rochesterricer (Jan 5, 2011)

Congrats! Great to see you back in action John.


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## Karter2 (Nov 17, 2011)

Zombie 222 said:


> I got a pack built by High Tech Systems using LiPo Ultra high power cells that Derek had made just for his business.
> 
> 960 cells in a 10P 96S configuration. 3000AMP, 355 voltage pack that charges up to 400volts.
> 
> 1.1MW pack.


Sounds like 5 Ahr cells at 60C discharge ?
Ideal for a performance / race car but would you run that kind of pack for a customer road car ?


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## The Toecutter (May 30, 2010)

Mitch's shop is roughly 250 miles from where I am. I want to meet him and see this Mustang.

The air drag of that Mustang is what is holding it back passed the 1/8th mile mark, but it can't be helped if the body is to appear stock. A bellypan might add 5-10 mph or so to the trap speed, but won't influence the ET noticeably. It is also heavy. Both of these issues create a severe limitation on the vehicle's performance.

Something excites me more than this old iron dinosaur(Don't misunderstand my comment, as that old iron dinosaur gives me a boner). What excites me more is what might be built in the future from what was learned during the making the Zombie 111, Zombie 211, Zombie 222, and Zombie XXX.

I don't think that variations of this Mustang conversion will be the only thing we see come out of the Bloodshed. I hope not.

If Wayland's been over here in Texas gallivanting around in his fetish object of a Datsun while summoning the undead during this dark ritual(as usual, it's what he does and you should never expect different), then what will be created with which to slay them?

I want to see 1500 horsepower crammed into a car that is designed from the ground up to be light-weight(< 2,500 lbs), all-wheel-drive, small(less than the footprint of most modern subcompacts), AND streamlined(CdA < 5 sq ft). It would need tires that were as close as you can get to racing tires while remaining street legal. If off the shelf WarP motors are to be used, maybe a mid-mounted set of modified dual WarP 13s would be ideal, perhaps with the car geared for 200 mph(Consideration must be given to efficiency at varying motor operating points, and I don't know if WarP 13s would be ideal for a streetable application with such tall gearing, but they might be workable).

A street-legal electric track carver with a very broad torque curve that can accelerate from 0-60 mph about as fast as it can accelerate from 60-120, and with very little mass or drag to hold it back, would be insanity. 

1500 horsepower in a 2500 lb car is theoretically capable of 7.5 second 1/4 mile times with trap speeds approaching 180. That would be faster than any production car currently on the market.

With the same pack as the Zombie XXX has, an efficient, light-weight streamliner with thick, lossy tires and AWD may end up needing only 150 Wh/mile to cruise at the speed limit, but will have plenty of performance for driving like a jackass if desired.

What might such a car look like? Think Shelby Daytona Coupe, but with more accommodations made towards drag reduction.

I don't see why such a vehicle couldn't be built. I'd love to build such a thing, but lack the knowledge and financial resources to do it all myself.

I'm wondering if Mitch has gotten an idea similar to my brief description... and if he does, I could certainly learn a thing or two with regard to designing race cars from him if given the opportunity...

That Zombie 222 is dreadful. I hope that Patient Zero has lots of converts.


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## jwiger (Oct 18, 2014)

From the media I have seen, Mitch's dream is Super Muscle Cars. Classic looking muscle cars with super car acceleration. It's a resto-mod operation. The high end extreme that you are describing will probably come from the deep pockets of one of the existing super car makers. Maybe the likes of Konigzegg or Nissan. 


I'm curious as to what a Hoonigan EV would do.


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## samwichse (Jan 28, 2012)

The Toecutter said:


> I want to see 1500 horsepower crammed into a car that is designed from the ground up to be light-weight(< 2,500 lbs), all-wheel-drive, small(less than the footprint of most modern subcompacts), AND streamlined(CdA < 5 sq ft). It would need tires that were as close as you can get to racing tires while remaining street legal. If off the shelf WarP motors are to be used, maybe a mid-mounted set of modified dual WarP 13s would be ideal, perhaps with the car geared for 200 mph(Consideration must be given to efficiency at varying motor operating points, and I don't know if WarP 13s would be ideal for a streetable application with such tall gearing, but they might be workable).
> 
> A street-legal electric track carver with a very broad torque curve that can accelerate from 0-60 mph about as fast as it can accelerate from 60-120, and with very little mass or drag to hold it back, would be insanity.
> 
> 1500 horsepower in a 2500 lb car is theoretically capable of 7.5 second 1/4 mile times with trap speeds approaching 180. That would be faster than any production car currently on the market.


I think this is the car you are describing:
http://www.thecarconnection.com/review/1011327_2006-honda-insight

You would need to add the 4wd, but with a racing pack and the added rear end (you could do 2 motors, 1 front and 1 rear), you could probably keep it under 2200 lbs. It's a bit over 1800 stock with an aluminum chassis and a CDA of exactly 5 ft^2. The hybrid system adds a couple hundred pounds already to be stripped.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

jwiger said:


> The high end extreme that you are describing will probably come from the deep pockets of one of the existing super car makers. Maybe the likes of Konigzegg or Nissan.


Maybe from Rimac.


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

jwiger said:


> The high end extreme that you are describing will probably come from the deep pockets of one of the existing super car makers. Maybe the likes of Konigzegg or Nissan.


I'm not so sure. Eventually a big player would make such a car, but it would take way longer than it should. Big old companies tend to start with what they know, which in this case is the wrong approach.

I expect to see it come from a new company formed for that purpose. Renovo has shown that it is possible to raise a pile of development money, although their design is very unambitious. Rimac is certainly the farthest down that road, so far although I would do a number of things differently.

Honestly, I would like to take a stab at it. Step one would be a 1000hp AWD system in a Factory Five Project 818, as a tech development platform.


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## IamIan (Mar 29, 2009)

Hollie Maea said:


> Honestly, I would like to take a stab at it. Step one would be a 1000hp AWD system in a Factory Five Project 818, as a tech development platform.


When are you opening your kick-starter cloud source page?


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

IamIan said:


> When are you opening your kick-starter cloud source page?


You can't really kickstarter these things, unfortunately. Kickstarter works best when you have a product that will sell for a couple of hundred dollars each and you basically use it as an opportunity for people to preorder at a slight discount and then use that money to finalize development.

I think Mitch tried to crowd fund the Black Zombie with little success.


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## The Toecutter (May 30, 2010)

jwiger said:


> From the media I have seen, Mitch's dream is Super Muscle Cars. Classic looking muscle cars with super car acceleration. It's a resto-mod operation.



A Shelby Daytona Coupe replica seems to fit the definition of “Super Muscle Car” very well. Real Daytona Coupes are too rare to mutilate for this, but a well made kit such as Factory Five is a good start, but it would be greatly improved if it were slightly smaller and built instead to 5/6th scale. They're usually outfitted with Ford Mustang components and a nice, ballsy V8. Like all muscle cars, they are front engined. The leading supercars of the Daytona's time period such as the Jaguar E-Type, Lamborghini Miura, and Ferrari 250GTO had paid lots of attention to aerodynamics and weight distribution relative to the “muscle” cars of the period, but the Daytona Coupe did better than all of those on air drag, giving it the designation of a “Supercar” as well, and performance to match or beat the supercars of the time on the track and the musclecars of its time at the strip.


The electric powertrain opens the doors to a mid-engined setup instead, which is what you really want for cornering purposes. I suppose that would meet the “Super” part of the phrase as well.




> The high end extreme that you are describing will probably come from the deep pockets of one of the existing super car makers. Maybe the likes of Konigzegg or Nissan.



Those companies seem to make nothing but lard-asses.


The Nissan GTR weighs 3,800 lbs. While the GTR is very fast in a straight line, and corners excellently on a skidpad, there really is no getting around the laws of physics. On a hilly, windy road, a smallblock V8 powered Toyota MR2 or Mazda Miata, with half the power of a GTR, would easily leave the GTR behind. That heavy weight of the GTR might lend some safety and high-speed stability, but on inclines, it adversely affects its acceleration, braking and cornering capabilities. You may as well be driving a pickup truck, on a really dangerous road, given its weight.


Koenigsegg has a very nice transmissionless hybrid called the Regera that can go from 0-60 mph in 2.8 seconds, 0-250 mph in 20 seconds, but she's 3,600 lbs. Even the “lightweight” CCR/CCX from this maker are over the 3,000 lb mark.


The halo cars produced by Nissan and Koenigsegg have too much emphasis on “luxury” and not enough on “sports.”


Bugattis, Porsches, Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Maseratis, Aston Martins, and the like, all have this same problem.


“Sports” cars, at least real ones, don't weigh as much as pickup trucks. They are nimble, narrow, maneuverable, small, and thus less risky to drive in a wreckless manner, sort of like a go-kart.


High-end makers seem to almost universally ignore weight these days. Sure, companies like Ferrari and Lamborghini brag about the weight savings of their carbon fiber shells, but in a 4,000 lb car, does it really matter? My steel-bodied GT6 is less than half the weight of many “lightweight” composite-bodied “sports cars” on the market today. John Wayland's Datsun 1200 weighed less than 1,600 lbs, stock, and you could shove dual 9” motors, plenty of chassis and drivetrain upgrades, and run 10 second ¼ miles with a heavy-assed battery pack in one, and still weigh in at less than 2,100 lbs! Steel is about the heaviest among the available materials you can choose for a car body, so I think there's something wrong with the picture of 4,000 lb “sports” cars.


I would never expect such a light car from any high-end maker these days. Even the Lotuses are getting porky these days. A 3,200 lb Evora? *puke*


Certain batteries that are suitable for EV use are powerful enough that they would only see their true potential hampered if they had to work along-side a heavy IC engine, which is where that Koenigsegg Regera goes wrong, or had to push around a lard ass of a chassis, like the Rimac and Model S. The battery pack in the Zombie XXX plus motors/controllers needed to make 1500 horsepower should weigh in at well under 1200 lbs. There aren't many ICE vehicles on the market with drive systems that can match that power for less than that weight, and the\ ones that come close are universally expensive.


Alan Cocconi built a 2600 lb TZero that was lugging around 1,280 lbs or lead acid batteries and a 120 lb drive train, so I know the weight goal of 2500 lbs, or close to it, is plausible. 




samwichse said:


> I think this is the car you are describing:
> http://www.thecarconnection.com/review/1011327_2006-honda-insight
> 
> You would need to add the 4wd, but with a racing pack and the added rear end (you could do 2 motors, 1 front and 1 rear), you could probably keep it under 2200 lbs. It's a bit over 1800 stock with an aluminum chassis and a CDA of exactly 5 ft^2. The hybrid system adds a couple hundred pounds already to be stripped.


Wayland is converting an Insight in an attempt to break 450 miles range, and if one of the goals is maintaining a vehicle's stock appearance, he could scarcely have chosen better in that attempt.

But that chassis and its components would need to be completely replaced, if it were turned into a racing machine. The car itself would have to be completely re-built to handle 1500 horsepower. Given that the Insight was designed to be a low-power, front-wheel drive, front-engined, economy-minded runabout, with little attention paid to generating downforce, it would make more sense to start from scratch or use a kit from Factory Five or GTM or similar.

Better CdA's than 5 sq ft are doable, anyhow, but I chose that as a maximum due to the fact that it's been achieved in a production car already(Honda Insight). The car's function should determine it's shape. An Ultima GTR or Ariel Atom, but with greatly improved aerodynamics and an emphasis on drag reduction, would be much closer to this idea than an Insight. Maybe it would look something like the Oldsmobile Aerotech, Opel Eco Speedster, or Panhard CD Peugeot 66C.

This heavy Zombie 222 likely has a CdA over 9 sq ft, but it looks so damned badass that it wouldn't be worth changing. A car designed to be aerodynamic could be made to look good, too, as the Shelby Daytona Coupe demonstrates(0.29 Cd). There are a lot of streamlined Bonneville Salt Flats high speed race cars built off of Chargers, Camaros and Corvettes as proof, as well.

Those Mustangs are also finite in supply. Given this, I'm wondering what exactly “Super Muscle Car” means. I'm guessing that will determine what this company does after it makes Mustang conversions. The Bloodshed will make history in racing, regardless of what direction it chooses to go.




Hollie Maea said:


> I'm not so sure. Eventually a big player would make such a car, but it would take way longer than it should. Big old companies tend to start with what they know, which in this case is the wrong approach.



Indeed. The big companies could have done something like this 10 years ago, had they had the vision and desire. The technology has only improved since. Alan cocconi's Tzero was doing 0-60 mph in 4.1 seconds on heavy lead acid batteries during the 1990s, and he was just one man without a even a 7-figure budget to fling around. Imagine what $1 billion plus could do to the market of available exotic EVs... To the auto industry, that's chump change.



> I expect to see it come from a new company formed for that purpose. Renovo has shown that it is possible to raise a pile of development money, although their design is very unambitious. Rimac is certainly the farthest down that road, so far although I would do a number of things differently.



The Rimac is just too damned big and heavy. It's still a very fast car though, and I'd love to work on something like it some day.



> Honestly, I would like to take a stab at it. Step one would be a 1000hp AWD system in a Factory Five Project 818, as a tech development platform.



I certainly wouldn't use the 818's body, but it is a fine choice as a chassis. It's small, strong, rigid, and light. I'm sure it would need some major changes to make use of 1000 hp/2000 lb-ft of torque, but then again, anything you use that isn't designed from the ground up to handle that, would need those changes. Factory Five sells some of the most robust racing chassis in the world, that being said.


A streamlined body is needed to take full advantage of the straight-line performance and cruising range possible in such a setup. This way, the car pulls from 100-200 mph fast enough to keep you firmly glued into your seat the entire time, and you want there to be no possibility of overheating the motors and/or battery with the speed constantly kept at the highest the vehicle is capable of, but is also capable of being used as a daily driver if desired.


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## Hollie Maea (Dec 9, 2009)

^^^ I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter...


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## hostage (Aug 2, 2007)

I'd like to thank John Wayland and Mitch Medford for sharing the intimate details on the beautiful Black Zombie 222 build. Please keep us updated!


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## dedlast (Aug 17, 2013)

Well, folks, you are truly famous now, , you made it on the yahoo news feed. At least on my computer...

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/electric-68-mustang-hits-60-in-2-seconds-eats-121836908297.html

B


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## jwiger (Oct 18, 2014)

Just FYI for some folks, first gen Mustangs aren't quite "unobtainium". You can buy literally all of the parts to make a new Mustang from the Year One catalog, same thing for Camaros and 'Cudas. 

https://www.yearone.com/Catalog/1964.73.mustang/body/body-shells/fastback-body-shells

Generally it is cheaper to find a rust free candidate, but if you want one bad enough, and have the wallet to match, a New muscle car can be yours.


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## mizlplix (May 1, 2011)

"Factory Five is a good start, but it would be greatly improved if it were slightly smaller and built instead to 5/6th scale"

No, plain and simple. No. You would have to be 5'-4" to fit in it then.

I have 10 laps around the Bondurant track in an original, (1 of 3) and it is cramped inside. Bob and I are about the same size, 5'-10". Your torso points straight forwards while your feet point towards the car centerline. The passenger must lean slightly forwards or turn towards the driver so the driver can shift the transmission as our shoulders touched.

The car would have a great weight bias, as there is lots of room once the drive trane and fuel tank are removed. 

Pete Brock was designing a slightly longer/wider version for Superformance of S.A. One that would fit a 2- 6 footers in style. That would be the one to get as he was not doing any "Make-do's" in it like the original.

Miz


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## The Toecutter (May 30, 2010)

mizlplix said:


> "Factory Five is a good start, but it would be greatly improved if it were slightly smaller and built instead to 5/6th scale"
> 
> No, plain and simple. No. You would have to be 5'-4" to fit in it then.
> 
> ...


I've never sat in one. Judging that I'm 5'11" and fit in my GT6 okay, and given the GT6 is a much smaller car, I sort of figured that a Daytona Coupe could be modified to allow a smaller frontal area and less needed materials, giving a significant aerodynamic and weight bonus.

Kind of a disappointment, that a much larger car, would have even worse ergonomics.


You're very fortunate to have been allowed to drive that! I could only dream at this time...

A Daytona Coupe set up like a Tesla P85D would be the s***...


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## mizlplix (May 1, 2011)

I was just plain lucky to work for Bob. I got to drive a lot of wonderful (and not so wonderful) cars. I was his last crew chief while he still raced professionally. I also got to meet a lot of the old drivers. They were like their cars....kinda rough around the edges, but still managed to give a good performance. 

Miz


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