# [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I read this email this morning.. It probably came through on time yesterday,
I've been behind on my inbox.



> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I got it at 11:21 yesterday morning......



> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I saw it the first time, Rush - don't know why you didn't, but I doubt very 
much that it was due to censoring!!

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rush" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 7:18 AM
Subject: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld


> Hi all,
>
> I originally posted this yesterday morning, but it hasn't shown up yet....
> Why - is there censoring going on again?
>
> Anyway here it is again for all of you interested in how Dennis did and 
> his
> times/speed. I made a minor correction about his motor timing, I had in
> backwards in the first one, corrected in this one.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rush" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 10:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Smoke Screen S10
>
>> Dennis wrote -
>>
>>
>>> The S10 Smoke Screen ran about 12.80 in the PS 240 volt class for a new
>>> nedra
>>> record at Speedworld last night. Dennis Berube
>>
>> I drove up to Speedworld to see Dennis run, it was a learning experience
>> to see how he tweaked the car, the tires, the zilla, putting ice in the
>> zilla cooler, charging time etc to slowly keep decreasing the time and
>> increasing the speed. He had already tweaked the motor timing at home
> to get a little more motor speed and less torque at the beginning.
>
>> He took 6 runs-
>> 1) 13.12 secs, 91 mph
>> 2) 13.00 secs, 92 mph
>> 3) 12.91secs, 93 mph
>> 4) didn't hook up
>> 5) 12.88 secs, 94 mph
>> 6) 12.82 secs, 95 mph
>>
>> The batteries were Lithium ions. IIRC he had 90 packs in series of 3 
>> cells
>> paralleled. The pack temp in the beginning was about 90 and between each
>> run the temp increased by about 6 or 8 deg, but what was interesting was
>> that depending on how fast they charged the temp either increased or
>> decreased. So a slower charging, 25 min instead of 15 min would cool them
>> off by about 3 deg and since the air was pretty cool, they cooled off a
>> little more just sitting. He charged them up to 238 to keep it well under
>> the 240 limit, at the end of the runs the voltage was down to about 227
>> and during the runs it would sag to between 180 and 167.
>>
>> He readjusted the zilla at the end of the 3rd run, upped the battery amps
>> to 1700 (if I remember correctly) and he thinks that is what stopped him
>> from hooking up on the 4th run. It just spun the tires right there at the
>> line. So on the next run took the amps down to 1650 and it hooked up just
>> fine. He also made shorter burnouts than he did at the Firebird
>> competition....
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rya6QaQOYfg (Thanks Ricky)
>>
>> What was great was the people who would come over to check out the "car
>> that makes no noise". They were really interested in how an EV worked and
>> asked the usual questions. Others came up and asked about the Current
>> Eliminator, they were surprised to see him in the S-10.
>>
>> It was a great night - Congratulations again Dennis!!!!
>>
>> Rush
>> Tucson, AZ
>> 2000 Insight, 62lmpg, #4965
>> www.ironandwood.org
>> www.Airphibian.com
>> www.TEVA2.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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9:21 AM

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I think theres a setting on sign up where you elect to receive your own
posts to the list or not.
Might be worth checking out.

Matt 

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of joe
Sent: Tuesday, 16 September 2008 7:30 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld

I saw it the first time, Rush - don't know why you didn't, but I doubt very
much that it was due to censoring!!

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rush" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 7:18 AM
Subject: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld


> Hi all,
>
> I originally posted this yesterday morning, but it hasn't shown up yet....
> Why - is there censoring going on again?
>
> Anyway here it is again for all of you interested in how Dennis did and 
> his
> times/speed. I made a minor correction about his motor timing, I had in
> backwards in the first one, corrected in this one.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rush" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 10:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Smoke Screen S10
>
>> Dennis wrote -
>>
>>
>>> The S10 Smoke Screen ran about 12.80 in the PS 240 volt class for a new
>>> nedra
>>> record at Speedworld last night. Dennis Berube
>>
>> I drove up to Speedworld to see Dennis run, it was a learning experience
>> to see how he tweaked the car, the tires, the zilla, putting ice in the
>> zilla cooler, charging time etc to slowly keep decreasing the time and
>> increasing the speed. He had already tweaked the motor timing at home
> to get a little more motor speed and less torque at the beginning.
>
>> He took 6 runs-
>> 1) 13.12 secs, 91 mph
>> 2) 13.00 secs, 92 mph
>> 3) 12.91secs, 93 mph
>> 4) didn't hook up
>> 5) 12.88 secs, 94 mph
>> 6) 12.82 secs, 95 mph
>>
>> The batteries were Lithium ions. IIRC he had 90 packs in series of 3 
>> cells
>> paralleled. The pack temp in the beginning was about 90 and between each
>> run the temp increased by about 6 or 8 deg, but what was interesting was
>> that depending on how fast they charged the temp either increased or
>> decreased. So a slower charging, 25 min instead of 15 min would cool them
>> off by about 3 deg and since the air was pretty cool, they cooled off a
>> little more just sitting. He charged them up to 238 to keep it well under
>> the 240 limit, at the end of the runs the voltage was down to about 227
>> and during the runs it would sag to between 180 and 167.
>>
>> He readjusted the zilla at the end of the 3rd run, upped the battery amps
>> to 1700 (if I remember correctly) and he thinks that is what stopped him
>> from hooking up on the 4th run. It just spun the tires right there at the
>> line. So on the next run took the amps down to 1650 and it hooked up just
>> fine. He also made shorter burnouts than he did at the Firebird
>> competition....
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rya6QaQOYfg (Thanks Ricky)
>>
>> What was great was the people who would come over to check out the "car
>> that makes no noise". They were really interested in how an EV worked and
>> asked the usual questions. Others came up and asked about the Current
>> Eliminator, they were surprised to see him in the S-10.
>>
>> It was a great night - Congratulations again Dennis!!!!
>>
>> Rush
>> Tucson, AZ
>> 2000 Insight, 62lmpg, #4965
>> www.ironandwood.org
>> www.Airphibian.com
>> www.TEVA2.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>


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----



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Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1672 - Release Date: 9/15/2008 
9:21 AM

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9:21 AM

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----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/15/2008 8:39:31 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/15/2008 8:39:31 AM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> Thanks Rush for driving all the way from Tucson to witness my S 10 break the 
> 1/4 mile record. 
> It looks like the 
> original message did not appear right away Please just look at its content and 
> lets move on. Dennis
> 
> I read this email this morning.. It probably came through on time yesterday,
> I've been behind on my inbox.
> 
>


> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >Hi all,
> > >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Dennis,
Just out of curiosity what was the record that you broke. I say that 
half jokingly because I don't see that there was a 240V record that was 
standing. Seems like you're the first ;-) Nice to lay some fresh 
tracks, so to speak 

Mike




> [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > In a message dated 9/15/2008 8:39:31 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
> > [email protected] writes:
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/15/2008 5:47:20 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/15/2008 5:47:20 PM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> Dennis,
> Just out of curiosity what was the record that you broke. I say that 
> half jokingly because I don't see that there was a 240V record that was 
> standing. Seems like you're the first ;-) Nice to lay some fresh 
> tracks, so to speak 
> 
> Mike 
> You are correct, On Saturday night I 
> did indeed set the SP record for the 1st time, But I really feel it was John 
> Waylands record at that voltage since his Zombie was configured as a SP car. 
> Mike give me a week, I will be in yours and Johns voltage classes. Hopefully 
> I can get her out this weekend in the A voltage class. 
> Dennis Berube 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

If you got to the NEDRA page where all the records are 
http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html and scroll down to
1972 Datsun "White Zombie"240v
Driver/Owner:John Wayland
Sponsor: Exide Batteries

John Wayland and Dennis are both in the SC (Street Conversion) class

Rush
Tucson, AZ
2000 Insight, 62lmpg, #4965
www.ironandwood.org
www.Airphibian.com
www.TEVA2.com


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld


> Dennis,
> Just out of curiosity what was the record that you broke. I say that
> half jokingly because I don't see that there was a 240V record that was
> standing. Seems like you're the first ;-) Nice to lay some fresh
> tracks, so to speak 
>
> Mike
>
>
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> In a message dated 9/15/2008 8:39:31 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
> >> [email protected] writes:
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

But if you go to the NEDRA Class Rules page
http://www.nedra.com/class_rules.html and scroll down a bit you can see that
neither White Zombie nor Smokscreen are in the Stock Conversion (SC) class.
Zombie used to be before the rule change that said the car needed the stock
rear end. Now John is racing in the Pro-Street (PS) class. This is where
the Crazyhorse Pinto races until such time as its ET's get to the standing
SC/A record at which time the stock 8" rear end will be swapped in. I think
if one looks close enough at Dennis' build on Smokescreen it clearly falls
in the Modified Conversion (MC) class. All technicalities aside racing with
comparable setups will be fun. It just may be a while until we can get
ahold of lithiums to race with the big dogs. Unless of course in the
interest of competition they hang with in the "lead sled pack" until I can
rustle up some funding for lithium. I really want to do so close
comparisons with Crazyhorse and Smoke Screen to see how the single large
motor stacks against the dual smaller motors.

Fun Fun,
Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Rush
> Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 5:31 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld
> 
> If you got to the NEDRA page where all the records are
> http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html and scroll down to
> 1972 Datsun "White Zombie"240v
> Driver/Owner:John Wayland
> Sponsor: Exide Batteries
> 
> John Wayland and Dennis are both in the SC (Street Conversion) class
> 
> Rush
> Tucson, AZ
> 2000 Insight, 62lmpg, #4965
> www.ironandwood.org
> www.Airphibian.com
> www.TEVA2.com
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, September 15, 2008 5:45 PM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld
> 
> 
> > Dennis,
> > Just out of curiosity what was the record that you broke. I say that
> > half jokingly because I don't see that there was a 240V record that was
> > standing. Seems like you're the first ;-) Nice to lay some fresh
> > tracks, so to speak 
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >


> [email protected] wrote:
> > >
> > >> In a message dated 9/15/2008 8:39:31 AM US Mountain Standard
> > Time,
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/15/2008 9:21:26 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/15/2008 9:21:26 PM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> But if you go to the NEDRA Class Rules page
> http://www.nedra.com/class_rules.html and scroll down a bit you can see that
> neither White Zombie nor Smokscreen are in the Stock Conversion (SC) class.
> Zombie used to be before the rule change that said the car needed the stock
> rear end. Now John is racing in the Pro-Street (PS) class. This is where
> the Crazyhorse Pinto races until such time as its ET's get to the standing
> SC/A record at which time the stock 8" rear end will be swapped in. I think
> if one looks close enough at Dennis' build on Smokescreen it clearly falls
> in the Modified Conversion (MC) class. All technicalities aside racing with
> comparable setups will be fun. It just may be a while until we can get
> ahold of lithiums to race with the big dogs. Unless of course in the
> interest of competition they hang with in the "lead sled pack" until I can
> rustle up some funding for lithium. I really want to do so close
> comparisons with Crazyhorse and Smoke Screen to see how the single large
> motor stacks against the dual smaller motors.
> 
> Fun Fun,
> Mike
> 
It looks like John Wayland has a permanent record in the SC class at 240 
volts. Newbies wanting that record would just break a lot of parts. The Smoke 
Screen is in the PS class assigned by the nedra tech officer Ken Koch at this 
years early Barona event. I still feel that 
nedra should split up records made with lead and lithium. Dennis Berube 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I agree that the White Zombie's old SC records should be dealt with. As 
it stands with me right now I am taking it as a personal challange to 
beat the currently standing SC/A record "as it stands" but with the 
current rules. So instead of claiming the record is invalid I plan to 
just beat it and be done with it. It is going to take time though for 
me to get there.

However in the meantime I have also been talking with John and the NEDRA 
Records folks about just cleaning it up as well. I (had at one point) 
recommended that the current standing SC/A 12.151 second record simply 
be moved to where it would be if the car were to go through tech today. 
Mainly, it had a Ford 9" rear end which would put it into the PS class, 
and it was running 348V which would put it in the A2 Division. So 
simple answer is to move it to a PS/A2 designation, the record would 
still stand and people could compete with it on a fair basis.

The White Zombie SC/B record of 12.991 @ 240V would actually move to a 
Pro-Street (PS) class and the B Division. So the record would 
presumably move to PS/B record of 12.991 just as you said. Now the 
record would still stand unless of course you submit in for it with your 
Smokescreen time in the PS/B class.

I agree with you about making separate Lead/Lithium categories as it 
would be impossible for a comparably equiped lead sled to compete with 
its lithium powered counterpart.

I disagree however with you and Ken Koch's interpretation of the 
Pro-Street classification of the Smokescreen. It clearly states the in 
the rules for the Pro-Street class that the vehicle must retain the 
motor in the original engine location. When I look at pictures you have 
posted of Smokescreen I see absolutely nothing in the original engine 
location. I remember you stated that for street driving its a handy 
place to put the little recharge generator. Its pretty neat to have 
that and makes a clean install for show. But according to the rules 
that I am trying to build by, it puts it in a class different from 
Pro-Street. I adhered to those rules strictly to make sure I could 
easily drop back to the SC class by putting in a stock 8" rear-end 
housing.

Now with all that said if you were to run Smokescreen in the 
Modified-Conversion (MC) class, you could post records next to the PS 
class cars and both would stand at the same time side by side for all to 
see which is fastest. I agree that in comparison to where the 
Crazyhorse motors are there is not much benefit to having the motor as 
far back as you have it in the Smokescreen (maybe there is though). But 
all else being the same (besides the slight mislocation of the motors) 
then it will be neat to see comparable PS and MC records stand on the 
books as pretty much direct comparisons. This would be better than 
Smokescreen, Zombie and Crazyhorse just overwriting each others records 
and having to go back and look at the history to see what the old times 
were.

Anyway, food for thought. Not much for me to worry about for a while. 
My racing season is pretty much over for this year. Maybe I should move 
to Arizona where I could race year round ;-)

Mike



> > Dennis wrote:
> > It looks like John Wayland has a permanent record in the SC class at
> > 240 volts. Newbies wanting that record would just break a lot of
> > parts. The Smoke Screen is in the PS class assigned by the nedra tech
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> MIKE WILLMON wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

If the rules read that way or were changed to that, I would have no 
problems whatsoever. In fact I might even support driving for that 
change (maybe). But we can't change the rules by just proclaiming our 
desires. We have to actively get involved in bringing the change 
around.

But then again there is the Modified Conversion class that does allow 
crazy stuff including motor relocation, spools, gutted interiors etc etc 
for fairly pure race machines.
(I'm not saying Smokescreen falls under any of those except the motor 
relocation).

Mike




> Tim Humphrey wrote:
> 
> > MIKE WILLMON wrote:
> >>
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/16/2008 1:21:42 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/16/2008 1:21:42 PM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> If the rules read that way or were changed to that, I would have no 
> problems whatsoever. In fact I might even support driving for that 
> change (maybe). But we can't change the rules by just proclaiming our 
> desires. We have to actively get involved in bringing the change 
> around.
> 
> But then again there is the Modified Conversion class that does allow 
> crazy stuff including motor relocation, spools, gutted interiors etc etc 
> for fairly pure race machines.
> (I'm not saying Smokescreen falls under any of those except the motor 
> relocation).
> 
> Mike
> 
So if the rule states the motor or motors should be in the stock location 
only, motors should not extend into tranny tunnels at all. Does your and Johns 
motors extend past the back of the stock engine? 

This is why I support clarification such as Hump has 
Suggested Dennis Berube 
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

The problem is specifics. It states the motor must be in the stock 
engine location. It does not state the preclusion of the motor being in 
the tranmission location. If a tech looks under my hood he or she can 
clearly see a "motor" that is mounted in the "stock engine location", as 
explicitely stated in the rule. If a tech looks under your hood he or 
she can clearly see there is no "motor" that is mounted in the "stock 
engine location". That should be clear enough to make a distinct 
determination. The question of the motors, neither mine nor yours, that 
is in the tunnel should even come up, because (in my case multiple 
motors are allowed) and in both cases there is no restriction about it 
being there.

I don't disagree with you about clarification, or at least some solid 
NEDRA board direction on intent.
Because the PS class rule says multiple motors are allowed...and must be 
in the "stock" location I don't presume they mean all of the motor(s) 
has to be in the stock location. However, for the most part, the mass 
is in the same location and the stock motor mounts are retained for use. 
At first I thought I was going to have a problem keeping the nose down, 
but its heavy enough in the front it doesn't seem to be a problem. So 
now if I thought I could get away with it I'd cut the tunnel and slide 
both motors back about 20". The front motor would be about where the 
tranny was and the rear motor would be under the back seat. That would 
help me get more weight onto the rear end. It would also let me 
implement an easy and reliable timing adjust mechanism. But how far can 
I go and stay in the Pro-Street class? As it turns out those mods would 
likely preclude the dropping back to the Street Conversion class with 
the stock rear end, so for now that stuff is off the table for me.

If NEDRA changes to rule to clarify it a bit, they should be careful to 
state in specific terms if "motors are allowed in the tunnel if they are 
also in the stock engine compartment location", OR if "all motors must 
remain in the engine compartment", OR "motors are allowed in either the 
stock engine and/or transmission location", OR the motors must utilize 
the stock motor mounts", Or maybe motors are allowed to be mounted right 
to the diff and turned up through the back of the chassis. Who knows. 
Without clarity its hard for everyone to interpret and come to the same 
conclusion.

My motors have a TH400 shorty tailshaft housing that pick up the stock 
transmission crossmember. So it does extend into the tunnel but does 
not extend past the stock transmission location. The rule does not 
preclude location of a motor in the tranny location, but it does 
explicitely require location in the stock engine location. So one of my 
motors passes, the other is not addressed in the rules other than it is 
allowed. It could be I put one in the stock location and one right on 
the diff (not that I would want to do that, but it would make for an 
interesting determination according to the current rule wording).

Mike








> Dennis wrote:
> > So if the rule states the motor or motors should be in the stock
> > location only, motors should not extend into tranny tunnels at all.
> > Does your and Johns motors extend past the back of the stock engine?
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Some how I missed your comment (copied down below this post) insinuating
John is camping on the SC/B record. But just a point of note about John's
SC Class records in general. I distinctly remember him posting up last year
about recommending to NEDRA to move his records to their proper PS class. I
have actually been waiting for this to be done and hoped it would be cleaned
up before I started making marks with Crazyhorse. I also distinctly
remember John recommending as an option that the records be retired but
annotated as the "old rules" version of that record.

My point is that John is not, nor ever intended to "camp" on that record.
In fact I have been having discussions with the NEDRA folks myself to try to
clean up the records inconsistency brought about by the new rules change
before I go in and start breaking them. It would be nice if they were
cleaned up first so there is no arguing over who really held what record and
what vehicle really should belong in which class.

This is the whole reason I brought up the point about your S10's class
designation as I feel Ken Koch is incorrect in placing SmokeScreen in the PS
class, just as White Zombie's old SC records should either be moved to their
proper class or retired. I don't think John would argue with me about the
point on his car. 

You may ask why I don't take this up with the NEDRA board? Well I say there
is not much of a NEDRA board left these days. I also say I have been taking
it up with them **in fact John up to a point in time, had been lobbying
them about the same points for a year before this** And, I also say I have
not yet seen any changes, or notices, or clarifications from NEDRA (which
isn't unexpected considering their current disarray). So not having
official channels to go through I am making the appeal to the court of
public opinion so as to state my case in public, for the record, so my
protest will be recorded.

Mike



> > Dennis wrote:
> > It looks like John Wayland has a permanent record in the SC class at 240
> > volts. Newbies wanting that record would just break a lot of parts. The
> > Smoke
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Just to clarify a point I made previously regarding this. As I stated, I am
not necessarily opposed to this change. However with a NEDRA organization
in a state of flux (so to speak) It is not all that hard to accept the
rules the way they are. It is clear to me that whoever wrote the rules
intended for Stock Conversion class cars to have the motor in the stock
location, and that the newly added Pro-Street class was to be the same
except to allow non-stock heavier duty running gear to prevent breaking
things. (and to add another class with which to set NEDRA records as a
bonus) Other than that the classes have similar rules. The Modified
Conversion class clearly is meant for only the street bodied car appearance,
but with no restrictions on what parts of the car you can chop, delete,
edit, add to etc. etc. 

If you consider Dennis' argument about the SmokeScreen being a PS class
vehicle then we might as well let Rod Wilde reclassify his Maniac Mazda to
the PS class as well. I only say that jokingly because I know he is
squarely planted on those MC records. And to whoever it was who accused Rod
of being slow and out of racing too long to be interested in a currently
promoted EV event, I say his MC records have stood for 9 and 10 years. He
doesn't need to prove his capabilities again until someone challenges him.
I was kinda hoping it would be Dennis and his SmokeScreen running in the MC
class that brought Rod out of retirement and back into MC class racing. 

;-)
Mike



> > Tim Humphrey wrote:
> >
> >
> > I agree Mike. I believe the PS rules should be changed from...
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hi EVerybody;

I question the Motor Thing. Who gives a Rat's exhaust pipe WHERE the damn 
motor is, as long as the car is FAST? IF they put it in the trunk, tranny 
"Hump"........ on the roof? I guess I'm knit picking , but we are using 
conversion in -the -box thinking? Cut out the center floor , if you like?and 
have them in line in where the driveshaft usta go? Isn't that what Mike W. 
and Joule Injected did. Maybe inspired by Whit Zombie? I think this is good 
for weight distrubution? So cool to see WZ lift his front wheels off the 
trak, at launch? Isn't anybody else doing that, too?Where is the motor/ 
motors in Smoke Screen? Under the cab?I had given thought, wet dream stage, 
of a RWD Rabbit 2 door with an 11" Baker motor and rear end, motor about 
behind the front seat, floor cut out to accomodate it. Gut out the car so it 
is Zombie light, SOME kinda lite battery. Hah? Who can afford that on a 
retiree's "budget" I'll just cheer on 'dem's that are doing it!We don't EVen 
have a drag strip within hundreds of miles, anyhow. No justr buzzing over 
like JW does ,at PIR.

Anyhooo just a few thoughts.

Seeya

Bob
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Willmon" <[email protected]>
To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 1:18 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld


> Just to clarify a point I made previously regarding this. As I stated, I 
> am
> not necessarily opposed to this change. However with a NEDRA organization
> in a state of flux (so to speak) It is not all that hard to accept the
> rules the way they are. It is clear to me that whoever wrote the rules
> intended for Stock Conversion class cars to have the motor in the stock
> location, and that the newly added Pro-Street class was to be the same
> except to allow non-stock heavier duty running gear to prevent breaking
> things. (and to add another class with which to set NEDRA records as a
> bonus) Other than that the classes have similar rules. The Modified
> Conversion class clearly is meant for only the street bodied car 
> appearance,
> but with no restrictions on what parts of the car you can chop, delete,
> edit, add to etc. etc.
>
> If you consider Dennis' argument about the SmokeScreen being a PS class
> vehicle then we might as well let Rod Wilde reclassify his Maniac Mazda to
> the PS class as well. I only say that jokingly because I know he is
> squarely planted on those MC records. And to whoever it was who accused 
> Rod
> of being slow and out of racing too long to be interested in a currently
> promoted EV event, I say his MC records have stood for 9 and 10 years. He
> doesn't need to prove his capabilities again until someone challenges him.
> I was kinda hoping it would be Dennis and his SmokeScreen running in the 
> MC
> class that brought Rod out of retirement and back into MC class racing.
>
> ;-)
> Mike
>


> >> Tim Humphrey wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I agree Mike. I believe the PS rules should be changed from...
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Bob Rice wrote:
> 
> > I question the Motor Thing. Who gives a Rat's exhaust pipe
> > WHERE the damn motor is, as long as the car is FAST? IF they
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Mike Willmon wrote:
> 
> > If you consider Dennis' argument about the SmokeScreen being
> > a PS class vehicle then we might as well let Rod Wilde
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Roger,
This is the post I missed earlier too. It sounded like an insinuation that
John was camping on an electric vehicle racing record intentionally when in
fact it was John who first lobbied to move that record or retire it. I just
want facts to be predominant in this public forum. And no Dennis has never
said (that I know of) that he agrees with the NEDRA tech inspectors
classification, but it also sounds like he is not disagreeing with it
either. 
Mike 



> > Dennis wrote:
> > It looks like John Wayland has a permanent record in the SC class at
> > 240 volts. Newbies wanting that record would just break a lot of
> > parts. The Smoke Screen is in the PS class assigned by the nedra tech
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Thanks Roger,
Its true I can't go run the car down the track anymore this year, but I can
vote each night on www.Dragtimes.com. Now I have time to think about the
modifications for next year. It appears I have competition now that I did
not expect. But hey, bring it on 

Mike



> > Roger Stockton wrote:
> >
> >
> > BTW, congrats on Crazyhorse's improved timeslip! Your season at the
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Roger Stockton <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/16/2008 11:46:50 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/16/2008 11:46:50 PM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> Nedra can put me in whatever class they want too and its OK with me.Barona 
> was the 1st nedra race I went to and I was put in the Ps class by the head 
> nedra tech officer. So in going for tech inspections this past weekend Ps is the 
> class I told the nhra inspector I was racing in. 

Dennis Berube


> 
> 
> Roger,
> This is the post I missed earlier too. It sounded like an insinuation that
> John was camping on an electric vehicle racing record intentionally when in
> fact it was John who first lobbied to move that record or retire it. I just
> want facts to be predominant in this public forum. And no Dennis has never
> said (that I know of) that he agrees with the NEDRA tech inspectors
> classification, but it also sounds like he is not disagreeing with it
> either. 
> Mike 
> 


> > >Dennis wrote:
> > >It looks like John Wayland has a permanent record in the SC class at
> > >240 volts. Newbies wanting that record would just break a lot of
> > >parts. The Smoke Screen is in the PS class assigned by the nedra tech
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> MIKE WILLMON wrote:
> >
> > If a tech looks under my hood he or she can
> > clearly see a "motor" that is mounted in the "stock engine location", as
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/17/2008 6:11:27 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/17/2008 6:11:27 AM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


> > MIKE WILLMON wrote:
> > >
> > > If a tech looks under my hood he or she can
> > >clearly see a "motor" that is mounted in the "stock engine location", as
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Bob Rice-2 wrote:
> >
> > We don't EVen
> > have a drag strip within hundreds of miles, anyhow. No justr buzzing over
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Thanks Dave,

The NEDRA Board is reviewing the issue of motor placement.

We have discussed John's record before and I believe a board member 
was going to call John directly to discuss the status of the record 
in question. We knew a couple years ago a couple records may be 
affected by the Class Rule revisions.

Just keep building vehicles and racing. We have some house cleaning 
to do and will follow up on these outstanding issues.

In the future, I would request that any concerns be brought to my or 
Brian's attention. I'll personally make sure we follow up on them.

Chip Gribben
NEDRA PR
[email protected]








> [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > Message: 27
> > Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:32:01 -0400
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In a message dated 9/17/2008 5:34:01 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] SmokeScreen at Speedworld 
> Date:9/17/2008 5:34:01 AM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:[email protected]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:52 AM, Roger Stockton <[email protected]>


> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> ...


----------

