# Warp11 HV Limits



## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

danmansuttmeier said:


> Would it be better to lower the voltage to get more amps in there?


No. In fact, you should higher the voltage to get more amp.

Others member here can have better explanation, but I can said than the back emf of the motor play an important fonction about the capacity of the motor to maintain is peak torque at high rpm.

Cro driver, with his Warp HV in his BMW, was able to maintain the peak torque of the motor to 4500 rpm at 1600A and 260v after voltage sag (330v nominal). The result was 500 hp, but his motor was slightly modified.

In your case, with 288v nominal and if your battery pack is very strong, you can expect a sag to 2.5 to 2.7v per cell at 1400A.
So, 2.5v x 90 cells = 225v x 1400A = 315 Kw /746 x 0.8 = around 335 hp.

If you increase nominal voltage in this equation, the peak power will be higher and if you decrease the voltage, the power will be lower.

If you think used a transmission, a 1000A controller can be a good choise to leave more chance at the motor and the cells (be more gentle with both).


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## danmansuttmeier (Mar 7, 2011)

But I read on here a good guideline on how much the motor can handle is by looking at it's weight. 1lb for every 1kw. So a 235lb warp 11hv should only be given 235kw. And that BMW is 315kw.

Also lets say if a controller had a max voltage rating of 156v. Could you hook up a 170v battery pack to compensate for voltage sag? Or is that only doable with the motor.


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

danmansuttmeier said:


> But I read on here a good guideline on how much the motor can handle is by looking at it's weight. 1lb for every 1kw.


That can be a good rule for most forklift motor . But the Warp 11 HV isn't an ordinairy forklift motor with some improvement.

His interpoles allow it to run at higher voltage. Higher voltage + same amp = more power.
Well, It's why I think the rule can be more than 1kw / lbs for this motor. Especially for 10-15 sec. drag race.





> Also lets say if a controller had a max voltage rating of 156v. Could you hook up a 170v battery pack to compensate for voltage sag? Or is that only doable with the motor


Generally no! 
As exemple a 156v controller can have a maximum input voltage of 180v. So if 170 nominal = 53 cells in series, those cells at full charge will be 191v and can stay at around 181-182v of floating voltage. That can cause problem to the controller.


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

danmansuttmeier said:


> Hey guys I have been reading some info on the limits of the warp11 HV for my chevy s-10 1/4 mile dragster project. So far it seems like the limits of this motor are 7000rpms, 288V and 200kw. We plan on drag racing so we will be running at 288V for all the speed we can get. We plan on using a muncie 4 speed transmission as well with this motor.
> 
> Anyways if the suggested limit I have read on here is 200kw and we are running at 288V then looks like 695A is all this thing can take? Seems a little low to me. I was hoping for 1400A to get my moneys worth of the soliton1 I planned on using. Would it be better to lower the voltage to get more amps in there? Any advice is appreciated.


The 11HV will take peaks higher than 695A, so for drag racing a Zilla 2k would probably be just fine (as Crodriver was using). I'm using an 11HV with a Soliton1 and peaks of 1000A shouldn't do it any harm and I'm looking at a peak power in the range of 260-270kw once I get all the batteries in. There is a time limit on all that extra current though, and the higher you go the shorter the safe time is.

The other point is there is no 1400A from a Soliton1, it was an idea they threw around for racing applications, but axed it. Eventics does have a 2500A continuous 3000A peak racing controller in the early stages though, get in now and the price is quite low. That would probably be near or above the limits on an 11HV even for 10-12 seconds.

Good luck.


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## danmansuttmeier (Mar 7, 2011)

Thanks for the help fellas. That evnetics controller sounds awesome.


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## Bowser330 (Jun 15, 2008)

all great answers.

Im not really sure what modifications were done to crodrivers motor. Because it has interpoles can it even be advanced? If it can be, maybe thats all that was done? I do recall when the Warp11HV was first sold it was advertised as being neutral @ 288V and when advanced could be used @ 336V...

In another thread its been discussed that netgain is working on an even better motor, the warp11HV dual comm, expected to have an even higher voltage rating and thus higher rpm rating.


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## gor (Nov 25, 2009)

Yabert said:


> No. In fact, you should higher the voltage to get more amp.
> 
> Others member here can have better explanation, but I can said than the back emf of the motor play an important fonction about the capacity of the motor to maintain is peak torque at high rpm.
> 
> ...


1600a * 260v = 416 kw * 0.8 = 332.8kw [446.292 hp] *at wheels*
so, overall efficiency: motor and drivetrain efficiency, tire sip on dyno should be more than 80%; (overall losses <20% ...?...) 
while efficiensy of the motor alone would be below 80% (not even concedering pushing it to such extremes (effy goes from 88% at 200a and 40 ft-lbs to 80% at 400a, 130 ft-lbs and going down); drivertrain losses usualy 15% for fwd; 17% - rwd; not including tire slip (5-7%)

seems like there been misreading of dyno data and Z2k controller miscalibration... Cro sad he'll check and confirm result on different dyno - was it confirmed?
- did enyone since Cro got 500hp from warp11(11hv) or 1000 hp dual?
--------
edit: 
p.s. 1600a x 260v=416kw=558hp 
with 500 hp at wheels overall losses (motor, drivetrain, tire slip) - only about 10% ?


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## gor (Nov 25, 2009)

what can be achieved with brash advance on warp11hv? (done similar to warp9a)


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## T1 Terry (Jan 29, 2011)

Can a warp 11HV do regen?

T1 Terry


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## Bowser330 (Jun 15, 2008)

T1 Terry said:


> Can a warp 11HV do regen?
> 
> T1 Terry


technically because they have interpoles it should be feasible, not sure how difficult or if there is even a DC controller being made that can utilize that capability.


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## T1 Terry (Jan 29, 2011)

Bowser330 said:


> technically because they have interpoles it should be feasible, not sure how difficult or if there is even a DC controller being made that can utilize that capability.


 Were Evnetics working on this with the Soliton1, can't remember where I read a few posts that mentioned regen and the the Soliton1. This would suit my project if it's a reality. Was there mention of 2 Warp11HV running in series? Would this require a special motor build due to the torque being passed through the second motor?

T1 Terry


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## Coulomb (Apr 22, 2009)

gor said:


> what can be achieved with brash advance on warp11hv? (done similar to warp9a)


Since the 11HV has interpoles, I assume that there would be little to no benefit to advancing the timing/brushes. However, interpoles aren't perfect, so maybe there is a small advantage possible.

Finding this out could be an expensive exercise, however


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## gor (Nov 25, 2009)

Coulomb said:


> Since the 11HV has interpoles, I assume that there would be little to no benefit to advancing the timing/brushes. However, interpoles aren't perfect, so maybe there is a small advantage possible.
> 
> Finding this out could be an expensive exercise, however


any ways to tell how advansing could affect performance of warp11 (not hv)?
and 11''a vs 11hv?


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## Bowser330 (Jun 15, 2008)

Coulomb said:


> Since the 11HV has interpoles, I assume that there would be little to no benefit to advancing the timing/brushes. However, interpoles aren't perfect, so maybe there is a small advantage possible.
> 
> Finding this out could be an expensive exercise, however


http://rebirthauto.com/kostovmotors.aspx



> _*Should the brushed of an interpoled motor be advanced?*
> The interpoles create a magnetically neutral point whose position is independent of rotation direction, rpm, amps or voltage. The brushes are positioned exactly in this point. Advancing them will result in moving away from the neutral zone and will worsen commutation/arcing drastically. This, in turn, can have very bad consequences for the motor._


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## gor (Nov 25, 2009)

what is k11hv 288v?
http://kostov-motors.com/tractionmotors/kostovevmotors(ac-dc)/seriesdcmotorsforelectricvehicles/


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## drgrieve (Apr 14, 2011)

The lines in green are an comparison of Netgain motors. They aren't Kostov motors.


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## Genius Pooh (Dec 23, 2011)

Yabert said:


> No. In fact, you should higher the voltage to get more amp.
> 
> Others member here can have better explanation, but I can said than the back emf of the motor play an important fonction about the capacity of the motor to maintain is peak torque at high rpm.
> 
> ...


Is it ture?? warp 11 hv can bear 1000 A?

For how much time? I wonder It' basice power is about 40kw... so Peak power is 315kw about 7 times higher?

And can I use that motor at that spec for ordinally road running? for general sedan?


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