# Solitron Jr



## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

rfhendrix said:


> Hi. I am thinking about buying a Solitorn Jr controller for my 144V Ranger with a warp9 motor and LA pack. Anyone have any experience with this controller or Solitron generally?


Hello, rf. Do some searching. You will find lot of info and feedback. There is a thread devoted to the Soliton development as well as some others. It is a very good controller.


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## algea07 (Oct 1, 2010)

rfhendrix said:


> a Solitorn Jr controller for my 144V Ranger with a warp9 motor


in my oppinion the soltron is a very nice controller,and when i build my EV i'll head straight out and buy a soitron1.

but the junior isn't really suited to a warp nine, the warp nine is 144v 1000amps max (if only for a little bit), and the junior is 300v 500amp(600amp max). so you wont be able to get 100% out of you motor. then again you might not want 100%, or you batteries might not be able to handle it. *600 amps is plenty*.

A big up side to the solitron jr is it's high voltage, this means that if in a month time you want a little extra range you can just add a battery or two. You could Increase the battery voltage to say 200v, while keeping the motor voltage at 144v. which means you can *get 25% more range*. it makes it easier to increase the range without doubling the pack size.

i'd say if you don't want, or cant get any more then 600amps, and you like the idea of being able to add a battery or two to give you a little more range then go with the Jr.

At $2100 its heaps better value then some of the other controllers going around.


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## rfhendrix (Jan 24, 2011)

Thanks. I searched but didn't find anything worthwhile. I'll try again with different key words.


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## rfhendrix (Jan 24, 2011)

algea07 said:


> in my oppinion the soltron is a very nice controller,and when i build my EV i'll head straight out and buy a soitron1.
> 
> but the junior isn't really suited to a warp nine, the warp nine is 144v 1000amps max (if only for a little bit), and the junior is 300v 500amp(600amp max). so you wont be able to get 100% out of you motor. then again you might not want 100%, or you batteries might not be able to handle it. *600 amps is plenty*.
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot. I didn't think of the higher voltage option. I think I can get one for under $2000. And I don't need the maximum from the motor. Besides I can't afford much more.


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

rfhendrix said:


> Thanks. I searched but didn't find anything worthwhile. I'll try again with different key words.


Try spelling it correctly... lol


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## rfhendrix (Jan 24, 2011)

DIYguy said:


> Try spelling it correctly... lol


I guess this isn't google


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## brainzel (Jun 15, 2009)

Our next conversion would be a Soliton Jr. with a Warp9 motor but LiFePo4 and ~160V. 96kW is quiet great power.
If your "Ranger" is a great pick-up, perhaps you should look at a 11" motor instead of 9".

Please waint until you can spend the extra money and *don't* get a lead acid pack.
Your other components are just great, so don't make a mistake in buying the wrong battery (my opinion)


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## rfhendrix (Jan 24, 2011)

brainzel said:


> Our next conversion would be a Soliton Jr. with a Warp9 motor but LiFePo4 and ~160V. 96kW is quiet great power.
> If your "Ranger" is a great pick-up, perhaps you should look at a 11" motor instead of 9".
> 
> Please waint until you can spend the extra money and *don't* get a lead acid pack.
> Your other components are just great, so don't make a mistake in buying the wrong battery (my opinion)


I think that would be a long wait although I am considering the batteries you suggested and upping the voltage some. I already have the warp 9 and I'm sticking with it.


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## algea07 (Oct 1, 2010)

brainzel said:


> perhaps you should look at a 11" motor instead of 9"


you could always make sure there is a little room left at the end of the warp nine, that way you can just tack on another warp nine. i think solitron Jr could handle two warp nines fine.

you can start with the lead acid and when they eventually kark it in say 5 years, you can upgrade to a nice cheep lithium pack, and maybe tack on that second motor.

there are plenty of pick ups using 9"motors and lead acid batteries, and they seam to work, but leave room for upgrades.

i was thinking of doing the same with my conversion just going with one warp nine then when i can afford the extra $3000 buy the second one. much to think about before then though.


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## rfhendrix (Jan 24, 2011)

Yeah, I'm designing the battery rack now to be easily adapted for lithium. My commute is only 5 miles one way so I am sure I will be happy for a few years at least. By the way I misspelled Soliton like you did.  So far I have seen 3 different ways to spell it on one thread thanks to me getting everyone started.


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## michaeljayclark (Apr 3, 2008)

Is the soliton Jr able to handle a kostov 11 inch motor?


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

michaeljayclark said:


> Is the soliton Jr able to handle a kostov 11 inch motor?


Sure - why wouldn't it? It's even capable of cooking that motor, just not as quickly as its bigger brother, is all.


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## michaeljayclark (Apr 3, 2008)

excellent!


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## brainzel (Jun 15, 2009)

Did anyone replaced a Curtis 1231C or an similar Controller by a Soliton Junior?
I'd like to know if there are any efficiency benefits at same voltage and motor.


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## efan (Aug 27, 2009)

hey everyone, 
since this is a Soliton thread I taught I would ask my question here.
This is a bit of a hypothetical question as I have not started a built yet,
but if I were to use 25 lead acid batteries, optima yellow top (or similar 12v battery) would I see any benefit in using Soliton 1 vs Soliton jr. 
I guess that is more of a battery question now that I think about it, but would I be able to pull more than 600 amps from such lead acid batteries to make it worth buying a Soliton 1. 

thanks for any help!


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

efan said:


> hey everyone,
> since this is a Soliton thread I taught I would ask my question here.
> This is a bit of a hypothetical question as I have not started a built yet,
> but if I were to use 25 lead acid batteries, optima yellow top (or similar 12v battery) would I see any benefit in using Soliton 1 vs Soliton jr.
> ...


The motor is also a key piece in the decision. But since you would have a high voltage setup you would get 1000 motor amps while only pulling 600 battery amps if you used a 170v Warp motor. If you used a high voltage motor, (250-288v) you would have 1000 motor amps until (motor voltage x motor current) = (battery voltage x battery current) which would happen somewhere in the mid to upper rpm range. So in short the Soliton1 would give you more torque and power than the Jr. even though you would have limited battery current.


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## efan (Aug 27, 2009)

rwaudio said:


> The motor is also a key piece in the decision. But since you would have a high voltage setup you would get 1000 motor amps while only pulling 600 battery amps if you used a 170v Warp motor. If you used a high voltage motor, (250-288v) you would have 1000 motor amps until (motor voltage x motor current) = (battery voltage x battery current) which would happen somewhere in the mid to upper rpm range. So in short the Soliton1 would give you more torque and power than the Jr. even though you would have limited battery current.


thanks for the help! 
Ok, so lets say I am going to use an 11" Kostov motor (250 v)
I want to mention that I do not understand much of electric vehicles and electricity in general, but wouldn't I be able to pull the same 600amps from the battery pack and get 1000 motor amps just like you described above using the Soliton jr?


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

efan said:


> thanks for the help!
> Ok, so lets say I am going to use an 11" Kostov motor (250 v)
> I want to mention that I do not understand much of electric vehicles and electricity in general, but wouldn't I be able to pull the same 600amps from the battery pack and get 1000 motor amps just like you described above using the Soliton jr?


With the Soliton Jr. you will get 500 motor amps continuous and 600 peak motor amps, the Soliton1 would give you 1000 motor amps for a portion of the rpm range.


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## algea07 (Oct 1, 2010)

i fairly new to this as well but current = torque and if you are using lead acid batteries you might like the extra torque that the soliton 1 can give you, at low speeds.

for an extra $1000 you'd come close to doubling your torque.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

rwaudio said:


> ... So in short the Soliton1 would give you more torque and power than the Jr. even though you would have limited battery current.


Just a quick correction... on what seems to be a very popular topic these days. Also, the rest of your post (and subsequent ones) prove you understand this so I'm guessing the inclusion of the word power was an oversight....

Anyway, assuming the same battery current limit is used in both the Soliton1 and the Soliton Junior, then they will both deliver the same MAXIMUM power.

The difference between them will be in the amount of torque obtainable from a given motor. The Soliton1 will deliver much higher torque, but because power is limited, it will only do so up until a much lower RPM compared to the same motor driven by a Junior. 

In other words, a Soliton1 will pull harder but you'll have to shift sooner. On 4 and 5 speed manuals 1st gear is rendered all but superfluous with a Soliton1. A Junior might still get some benefit from 1st if the car is of average weight or heavier (i.e. - 3000 lbs).

I just posted a thread about the voltage vs. RPM at 1000A in the WarP-9. Don't have similar data on Kostov, etc., but it would clearly be valuable to obtain it. The two problems with this are that it takes a lot of time to swap motors out on the dyno, and this sort of test is really abusive on higher voltage/lower amperage motors. Also, Evnetics isn't really in the business of testing motors, but, well... sometimes you have to take one for the team, eh?


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

Tesseract said:


> Just a quick correction... on what seems to be a very popular topic these days. Also, the rest of your post (and subsequent ones) prove you understand this so I'm guessing the inclusion of the word power was an oversight....
> 
> Anyway, assuming the same battery current limit is used in both the Soliton1 and the Soliton Junior, then they will both deliver the same MAXIMUM power.
> 
> ...


"Power" was included under the assumption that it would be possible to exceed the Jr's 600A peak (in duration, and thus be derated below 600A) while driving under certain conditions. This would allow the Soliton1 to produce slightly higher power while staying within the 600A battery limit. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

rwaudio said:


> "Power" was included under the assumption that it would be possible to exceed the Jr's 600A peak (in duration, and thus be derated below 600A) while driving under certain conditions. This would allow the Soliton1 to produce slightly higher power while staying within the 600A battery limit.
> 
> Please correct me if I'm wrong.


No, you're right, but that's getting more into the thermal end of things. I suppose I should have more clearly stated that if the battery current limit in both controllers is set to 500A or less then the maximum power output will be the same.

Practically speaking, however, the Soliton1 can get rid of twice as much heat as a Junior so it would, of course, be able to maintain peak output for longer than a Junior.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

so here's the twist in comparison that I am wanting to know about.

First, in my case I will have a small (2200#) car w/ Warp9. Not looking for extended high-speed on highway, but WOULD like the occasional 10 second pull off the line at stoplights for fun. Planning 144v with 100ah CALB cells. I don't need any more range than that, and would mostly pull less than 100amps around town.

Comparing Soliton1 and Jr. If I limit both battery amps to 500, but allow 1000 motor amps on the 1, and max 600 on the Jr... would this have much effect on on the occasional acceleration from a stoplight?


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> so here's the twist in comparison that I am wanting to know about.
> 
> First, in my case I will have a small (2200#) car w/ Warp9. Not looking for extended high-speed on highway, but WOULD like the occasional 10 second pull off the line at stoplights for fun. Planning 144v with 100ah CALB cells. I don't need any more range than that, and would mostly pull less than 100amps around town.
> 
> Comparing Soliton1 and Jr. If I limit both battery amps to 500, but allow 1000 motor amps on the 1, and max 600 on the Jr... would this have much effect on on the occasional acceleration from a stoplight?


Ignoring voltage sag, you would have 1000A to the motor up to 72 motor volts (See Tesseract's thread regarding RPM/current/Voltage to see what this really means) 
This would let you launch hard, but you would quickly run out of voltage to maintain that level of torque past 1000-1500rpm. If your gear ratio worked in your favour (IE 2nd or 3rd gear start) it might be pretty quick up to a reasonable speed.

The other question would be could your car handle that much torque? Jack R, got his Soliton1 issue sorted out and cooked a stage 2 clutch in the speedster with that same combination (and a bit more voltage) however the low RPM torque would be exactly the same.

I have a Soliton1, Warp11HV and will have a 300V pack capable of 1000A, I ditched the clutch because I wasn't sure if a Porsche clutch could handle the torque. (other than perhaps a very expensive racing clutch)
I'm still worried about destroying the drive train, and I have a car that people often swap in LT1/LS1 V8's.

I bet your car would be fun though


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

rwaudio said:


> ... could your car handle that much torque?


the car I am planning is a '62 sunbeam alpine. I would plan to replace the transmission with either toyota t-50, or a ford product like from a mustang since the original tranny is pretty tired and probably not suited for more than 150ft# of torque. I would hope to avoid having to replace the rear diff, so I don't want to OVER build it.


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

sunbeam tigers are almost in the AC cobra class, perhaps some with the engine mods, which leads to suspension mods, which leads to drive train mods, which leads to $$$$$$

if it were me, I would start hunting for a t-56, or actually a newer automatic. I'm partial to c6's and oddly enough 727's. A slush pump would somewhat protect the existing diff, and you would not have to keep remaking motor to tranny adapters.

the 9 should ought to smoke most anything you want, once for a little bit, but you'll have to wait a while to cool down between races.

A junior ought to provide that neck snap as required, and Tess said it would probably fry the motor if need be. I make it a point to listen to Tess.

I bought a Sol-1 because JR's weren't avail, and I got the Kostov because I'm only gonna buy this stuff once, no matter what this morphs into down the road.

Just my $.02 Your mileage can and will vary


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

brainzel said:


> Did anyone replaced a Curtis 1231C or an similar Controller by a Soliton Junior?
> I'd like to know if there are any efficiency benefits at same voltage and motor.


Sorry I missed this, brainzel. I doubt there would be a noticeable difference in efficiency between a SolJr and a Curtis 1231C at the same voltage/current limits. There is, however, quite a bit of difference in feature set and, especially, in power output between those two controllers so not exactly an apples to apples comparison. The SolJr can run on more than twice the battery voltage and delivers 20% more peak current than a Curtis 1231C. Oh, and the SolJr looks a lot cooler, too, which has at least an imaginary effect on how fast a vehicle seems to get up and go...


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> the car I am planning is a '62 sunbeam alpine....


Personally, I think you don't have enough battery pack to take advantage of either controller, but this is a light car that will undoubtedly be geared for higher revs (though cars of that vintage weren't exactly known for screaming RPMs). In short, I think you'd be much happier with a Junior. Yes, the Soliton1 will deliver considerably more torque off the line, but as rwaudio pointed out you'll start feeling it drain away at an RPM just above where the original engine idled!

A much better trade-off (assuming you can do it) would be to cram more LFP cells into the car. Even 5 more cells would probably make this car a lot more fun to drive - more so than going with a Soliton1 over a Junior, anyway.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

Tesseract said:


> Personally, I think you don't have enough battery pack to take advantage of either controller,


It would be difficult not to stray over that 5C line more often than not off the line just for fun.... which was why I am thinking a 500amp limit on batteries (with 100ah cells) is a little saner. But, I might have to buck up for 160ah just so I can run a little more battery amps without killing cells.



Tesseract said:


> but this is a light car that will undoubtedly be geared for higher revs


I can't use the original Alpine tranny I don't think... too old and the adaptor guys don't have it in stock. I am thinking I have to go to either a Ford t-5 or t-9. The three-speed toploader might be ideal for electric as I can spread the gear ratios for low rpm torque.



Tesseract said:


> A much better trade-off (assuming you can do it) would be to cram more LFP cells into the car. Even 5 more cells would probably make this car a lot more fun to drive - more so than going with a Soliton1 over a Junior, anyway.


but my 9" motor won't like more than 144v, right?


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## efan (Aug 27, 2009)

hey piotrsko,
your build sounds very interesting. do you have a thread on it? I would love to read more on it.


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## brainzel (Jun 15, 2009)

Tesseract said:


> Sorry I missed this, brainzel. I doubt there would be a noticeable difference in efficiency between a SolJr and a Curtis 1231C at the same voltage/current limits. There is, however, quite a bit of difference in feature set and, especially, in power output between those two controllers so not exactly an apples to apples comparison. The SolJr can run on more than twice the battery voltage and delivers 20% more peak current than a Curtis 1231C. Oh, and the SolJr looks a lot cooler, too, which has at least an imaginary effect on how fast a vehicle seems to get up and go...


Thank you Jeffrey.
The Voltage is limited by the motor (D&D ES-31B @ 144V), I got 45 CALBs 130AH and don't want to make a BBQ, so I will take a Junior 

The average consumption is 24kWh/100km or 39kWh/100mi and I look up to get it down to 32kWh/100mi or less.

Motor and controller could be the key I think ...


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## m38mike (Dec 27, 2008)

Last night I made some adjustments to my Jr. and that really did the trick for me. I can spin the tires on gravel, and acceleration is quick and responsive. I set all the controller limits to the top of their range except motor voltage, and lowered my min battery voltage to 108v for my 144v FLA pack. Max motor voltage for a WarP11 is 170v. I pushed it hard trying to accelerate up some hills and it did much better than the Electro-Willys ever did with an ICE. I've got liquid cooling set up for the Junior and when I checked the radiator after climbing some hills it was only warm. I didn't feel the controller housing, but the coolant was apparently keeping everything comfortably cool. I've got a 6 L/min pump pushing coolant through the Junior and into a 2-fan computer radiator, then back into the 2-quart reservior. When I checked the radiator a few days ago after hauling a trailer with Electro-Willys, and again climbing the hills, it has never been more than warm to the touch. I'm anxious to get the laptop hooked up to the controller to download the performance and temperature data to see what's going on.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

m38mike said:


> I set all the controller limits to the top of their range except motor voltage,


so, that is 800amps for both 'motor' and 'pack' for the Jr?
...and refresh my memory, what is your battery pack?


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## m38mike (Dec 27, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> so, that is 800amps for both 'motor' and 'pack' for the Jr?
> ...and refresh my memory, what is your battery pack?


 
No the motor was 1000A and the pack was 600A. Those are the limits in the Junior software. My pack is 144v made from 18 8v FLA batts.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

m38mike said:


> No the motor was 1000A and the pack was 600A. Those are the limits in the Junior software. My pack is 144v made from 18 8v FLA batts.


Huh? The limits in the junior software should be 600A for both motor and battery current. Could you please double check yours and maybe do a screen capture of the settings web page?


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## m38mike (Dec 27, 2008)

Tesseract said:


> Huh? The limits in the junior software should be 600A for both motor and battery current. Could you please double check yours and maybe do a screen capture of the settings web page?


 
Be glad to Jeffrey. But I'm sure of the motor being 1000A because it matched one of Netgain's tests where they gave the WarP11 1000A.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

m38mike said:


> Be glad to Jeffrey. But I'm sure of the motor being 1000A because it matched one of Netgain's tests where they gave the WarP11 1000A.


Eh? What matched a NetGain test?!? Now I'm totally confused!?!


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## m38mike (Dec 27, 2008)

OK my bad. It is the slew rate that's 1000A/s. My power mode is "Quiet". Min batt volts = 108V. Max batt current = 600A. Max motor voltage = 170V. Max motor current = 600A. Max motor power = 170kW. Slew rate = 1000A/s. Throttle deadband = 3%. Half throttle current = 50%. No brake or tach input at this time. 

Are you less confused now?


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

m38mike said:


> OK my bad. It is the slew rate that's 1000A/s. My power mode is "Quiet". Min batt volts = 108V. Max batt current = 600A. Max motor voltage = 170V. Max motor current = 600A. Max motor power = 170kW. Slew rate = 1000A/s. Throttle deadband = 3%. Half throttle current = 50%. No brake or tach input at this time.
> 
> Are you less confused now?


not havng a Soliton... what is 'power mode=quiet'? and 'throttle deadband'?


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

m38mike said:


> OK my bad. It is the slew rate that's 1000A/s.
> ...
> Are you less confused now?


Yep! That makes a lot more sense.. 



dtbaker said:


> not havng a Soliton... what is 'power mode=quiet'? and 'throttle deadband'?


Quiet mode increases the switching frequency to 14kHz from the default of 8kHz ("Performance" mode). Switching losses are 1.75x higher in Quiet mode, so the controller heats up a lot faster, but if your motor whines at 8kHz (and it bugs you) then Quiet mode lives up to its name.

Throttle deadband specifies what percentage of throttle movement to ignore before the controller starts ramping up motor current. This is very useful for Hall effect and inductive throttles that tend to drift a bit with temperature. Usually less than 5% is good - if you find you need more than that then you probably ought to get a different throttle - after all, it is a critical safety component in a vehicle (just ask Toyota!)...


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

Tesseract said:


> Quiet mode increases the switching frequency to 14kHz from the default of 8kHz ("Performance" mode). Switching losses are 1.75x higher in Quiet mode, so the controller heats up a lot faster, but if your motor whines at 8kHz (and it bugs you) then Quiet mode lives up to its name.


...does the whine just last for a little bit at the beginning like the Curtis? If so, I don't mind that at all, is the 'low-speed-audio-warning' as might be required for electrics. 



Tesseract said:


> Throttle deadband specifies what percentage of throttle movement to ignore before the controller starts ramping up motor current. This is very useful for Hall effect and inductive throttles that tend to drift a bit with temperature. Usually less than 5% is good - if you find you need more than that then you probably ought to get a different throttle - after all, it is a critical safety component in a vehicle (just ask Toyota!)...


aha. sort of like cable play adjustment with mechanical throttle. The Solitons ONLY accept hall affect, right?


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## INCONCEIVABLE (Feb 19, 2008)

The Soliton also accepts potentiometer throttle input. That's what I'm using in my car.
FYI, I cut up a Ford throttle body that I got at the local junk yard for about $12. I'm using the spring loaded throttle position sensor (potentiometer) and part of the aluminum housing including the two bearings that were part of it and built it in to a pedal assembly.
I can't comment on the Soliton whine. I don't remember hearing it. Maybe I'm In quiet mode. I haven't driven my car all winter, I'm currently building a body for it.
I will say I used to drive a car with a Curtis controller, I kind of liked the whine at slow speed, Like the sound of an engine, it let you know it was running and your gonna start moving.


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## m38mike (Dec 27, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> not havng a Soliton... what is 'power mode=quiet'? and 'throttle deadband'?


The short answer is those are two of the many settings that you can adjust in a Soliton controller. 

The longer answer is this; they have two power modes, quiet and performance. They operate at two different frequencies, each having some desireable effects, and some potential problems. You can choose one or the other depending on your type of use and the type of pack you have. I have a FLA pack, and I use my EV for commuting, not racing, so the quiet mode works better for me. Throttle deadband is simply what percent of the throttle range is not used from the O throttle position (that's where the throttle sits when you are not touching it.). 

Each time I get into the controller program settings page to adjust a setting I'm amazed at how flexible the programming really is. and now that I have the program settings page from the controller set as a bookmark in my web browser, it only takes me a minute to go in there and change a setting as I experiment with how the settings affect my EV's performance. "It's so easy a caveman can do it."


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## Qer (May 7, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> ...does the whine just last for a little bit at the beginning like the Curtis?


Nothing like it. The Curtis drop down to 1.5 kHz at low PWMs to protect the hardware, the Soliton runs at 8 or 14 kHz and in most cases you won't hear the 8 kHz. However, IF you hear the 8 kHz you can select quiet mode and trade some efficiency for silence.

The reason the Curtis drop down to 1.5 kHz at low speeds is to protect the controller. It's a simple way to do it in a controller that is purely analogue. Since the Soliton is digital and has a microcontroller that controls the PWM it protects itself in a more complicated way (it's only software, much easier to add complicated regulation algorithms then) so it never has to drop down in frequency like the Curtis.

However, that's over simplifying it (and lying a bit), actually. At reeeeally low motor voltages the frequency drops even in the Soliton, but the odds are that you'll never hear it since it's not a fixed frequency like the Curtis squeal. The Zilla seems to do something similar and someone described it as "a quiet growl" rather than a squeal.


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## glaurung (Nov 11, 2009)

Hi all, in my Range Rover conversion i first used performance settings on my Soliton1 and motor whine was very loud and annoying. I am now driving in quiet mode and it would be very quiet indeed if transmission could be turned to "quiet" too.
Maybe dual motors douple the whine effect too?
Harri


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## azdeltawye (Dec 30, 2008)

glaurung said:


> Hi all, in my Range Rover conversion i first used performance settings on my Soliton1 and motor whine was very loud and annoying...Harri


 
You must be using a Kostov motor. 

The whine from my Kostov 11" in Performance mode will turn heads 100' away...


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## slumpp (Jun 29, 2008)

rfhendrix said:


> Hi. I am thinking about buying a Soliton Jr controller for my 144V Ranger with a warp9 motor and LA pack. Anyone have any experience with this controller or Solitron generally?


EVTV.me has a ton on this controller , Well the Solitron ONE.
And now I understand it is indexed.


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## efan (Aug 27, 2009)

I was wondering if someone from Evnetics, or anyone else can confirm this supplier:

http://www.revoltevc.com/controllers/soliton1.html


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

efan said:


> I was wondering if someone from Evnetics, or anyone else can confirm this supplier:
> 
> http://www.revoltevc.com/controllers/soliton1.html


Yes, they are an authorized dealer.


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## caglassmith (Apr 18, 2011)

How far aong are you on the Ranger project? I have literally just posted a listing for a donor vehicle 2 hours ago. Been kicking the project around for a month or so and just decided to move forward last night. Also looking at the Solitron Jr.


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

Does anyone know if you can us a 12 volt battery in place of the battery pack with the soliton jr to test spin the motor? 

I tried it yesterday but kept getting a low voltage error. I set the battery pack voltage limit at 10v and both the test battery and the auxiliary battery were well above 12v so I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

Any thoughts?

Shane


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## Qer (May 7, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> Does anyone know if you can us a 12 volt battery in place of the battery pack with the soliton jr to test spin the motor?
> 
> I tried it yesterday but kept getting a low voltage error. I set the battery pack voltage limit at 10v and both the test battery and the auxiliary battery were well above 12v so I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.


Was the battery properly charged? Did you use thin wires or had problems with a proper connection to the battery terminals or so?

You can set the Soliton to 9 Volt pack voltage minimum but if the battery voltage sags too much the Soliton will complain about pack voltage or shut down entirely, so the fact that it complains does indicate you have a bit of a voltage drop for some reason.


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> Does anyone know if you can us a 12 volt battery in place of the battery pack with the soliton jr to test spin the motor?


You can, but you are pushing your luck given that the absolute minimum pack voltage allowed is 9V (ie - not much room for sag with a 12V battery). Keep in mind that a motor like a WarP-9 requires 75A just to free spin with a 12V battery, and that might be enough to pull it down to 9V or less. Assuming the battery is fully charged and at least 100Ah in capacity you can try setting the motor current ramp rate to, e.g., 100A/s (the slower the ramp rate the easier a time the minimum pack voltage protection function will have). Also try keeping a charger connected to the battery the entire time. Finally, try using two motors, preferably in series.

It probably goes without saying, but, you shouldn't try to allow more than 100A of either battery or motor current doing this test.


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

The battery was fully charged, I used jumper cables for the the test so wire size shouldn't have been a problem. I kind of knew i was pushing the lower voltage limit and thought the battery sage might have been the problem as well so I kept my multi-meter on the battery but the voltage didn't drop at all.

Based on the error message it looks like the the controller didn't see enough voltage to even close the main contacted. I'll try it again with two batteries in series and see how it goes.

I'll let you know how it goes.

Shane


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> Does anyone know if you can us a 12 volt battery in place of the battery pack with the soliton jr to test spin the motor?
> 
> I tried it yesterday but kept getting a low voltage error. I set the battery pack voltage limit at 10v and both the test battery and the auxiliary battery were well above 12v so I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.
> 
> ...


You already got the answer from the man but. . . Why not just connect the 12v battery to the motor directly?? As long as you stay at 12volts there is no problem doing this. Of course u need a battery with some energy it.


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

DIYguy said:


> You already got the answer from the man but. . . Why not just connect the 12v battery to the motor directly?? As long as you stay at 12volts there is no problem doing this. Of course u need a battery with some energy it.


I've tested the motor back to the wheels already, this was more of a quick check to ensure that I'd installed the controller correctly and to gain some familiarity with the interface before moving on to the full battery pack install.

It's an unnecessary step but this is my first build so I'm being pretty cautious.


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> I've tested the motor back to the wheels already, this was more of a quick check to ensure that I'd installed the controller correctly and to gain some familiarity with the interface before moving on to the full battery pack install.
> 
> It's an unnecessary step but this is my first build so I'm being pretty cautious.


Oh, ok. Well that makes sense. Little steps is a good idea. Did you try 48 volts?


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

DIYguy said:


> Oh, ok. Well that makes sense. Little steps is a good idea. Did you try 48 volts?


Not yet but I think that's a good next step. I'll put a small test pack in series and see if that works.

Thanks,
Shane


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> Not yet but I think that's a good next step. I'll put a small test pack in series and see if that works.
> 
> Thanks,
> Shane


Hi Shane, I'm glad to hear your build is progressing. I've been testing my Soliton1 off of a ~50v pack (11x headway 10ah cells and 1x stock 12v car battery in series) I have the battery current limited to 100A and everything works great. Even 24v should make the Soliton happy, (I've only tested down to 30v though).


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

rwaudio said:


> Hi Shane, I'm glad to hear your build is progressing. I've been testing my Soliton1 off of a ~50v pack (11x headway 10ah cells and 1x stock 12v car battery in series) I have the battery current limited to 100A and everything works great. Even 24v should make the Soliton happy, (I've only tested down to 30v though).


I finally found a second battery to test my setup at 24v and it worked like a charm. The motor spun up and the wheels turned.

Just to push my luck I also tried tesseract's suggestion of keeping the charger on a single 12v battery to see if that would work. The charger brought the battery voltage up to 15v so I set the lower limit on the controller to 10v and again it worked just fine. 

Not that it matters much but for those of you who might be attempting a similar test run you might find you need a touch more voltage then a fully charged 12v battery can offer.

Thanks rwaudio and tesseract for you suggestions.

Shane


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## Tesseract (Sep 27, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> ...
> Just to push my luck I also tried tesseract's suggestion of keeping the charger on a single 12v battery to see if that would work. The charger brought the battery voltage up to 15v so I set the lower limit on the controller to 10v and again it worked just fine.
> 
> Not that it matters much but for those of you who might be attempting a similar test run you might find you need a touch more voltage then a fully charged 12v battery can offer....


I revisited this test yesterday just for you, Shane, and I didn't have a problem operating a Jr off a much-abused AGM battery connected with a set of cheap 10ga. jumper cables. FWIW, I did set minimum pack voltage to 9V, instead of the 10V you used (and logger did show pack voltage dropping that low), and I also restricted battery current to 100A. I left ramp rate at the default of 500A/s. This was not a sufficient amount of power (~10V * 100A = 1kW) to actually get the twin WarP-9 motors on our dyno spinning, but the controller happily regulated current all the same. So, maybe your 12V battery was a bit weak or you used a starting battery with lots of sag?


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

Tesseract said:


> I revisited this test yesterday just for you, Shane, and I didn't have a problem operating a Jr off a much-abused AGM battery connected with a set of cheap 10ga. jumper cables. FWIW, I did set minimum pack voltage to 9V, instead of the 10V you used (and logger did show pack voltage dropping that low), and I also restricted battery current to 100A. I left ramp rate at the default of 500A/s. This was not a sufficient amount of power (~10V * 100A = 1kW) to actually get the twin WarP-9 motors on our dyno spinning, but the controller happily regulated current all the same. So, maybe your 12V battery was a bit weak or you used a starting battery with lots of sag?


Thanks for following up on this Tesseract. I was using a starter battery that came out of the doner and had set the voltage at 10v rather then 9v so it's very likely that it could have sagged. Still I didn't notice any sag on my multi-meter and the error message seemed to indicate that the initial voltage the controller saw was not sufficient to close the main contactor.

Regardless, the controller worked fine at 15v and I'm certainly not considering operating it at these low voltages.

Can you remind me (or point me to the post) how to access the logger function? I know I've seen it posted here somewhere but can't seem to find it.

thanks again,
Shane


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

Yukon_Shane said:


> Thanks for following up on this Tesseract. I was using a starter battery that came out of the doner and had set the voltage at 10v rather then 9v so it's very likely that it could have sagged. Still I didn't notice any sag on my multi-meter and the error message seemed to indicate that the initial voltage the controller saw was not sufficient to close the main contactor.
> 
> Regardless, the controller worked fine at 15v and I'm certainly not considering operating it at these low voltages.
> 
> ...


Hi Shane,

The logger is available for download on the evnetics website:
http://www.evnetics.com/#!downloads


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## Yukon_Shane (Jul 15, 2010)

rwaudio said:


> Hi Shane,
> 
> The logger is available for download on the evnetics website:
> http://www.evnetics.com/#!downloads


Awesome! thanks RWAudio


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