# [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

[No message]


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

>From everything I have read I doubt you will be satisfied with a 6.7" motor
in a pickup. I have got an 8" and I still have the gas engine to assist.
And from what I hear two coupled 6.7" motors would actually be better than
an 8". That should work in a small pickup.

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Alan Brinkman
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 8:34 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor

Hello everyone,

I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,
and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini
truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less
top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that
would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see
that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe
that would be a better project?

Thanks,

Alan 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I have gotten some data form Lee Hart's Renault 5 (small car lead sled 
estimated at 1045kg)
allegedly it is able to cruise level at 100km/h at around 80V and 120A. 
that's an ADC 6.7 L91 (ADC has shorter 6.7" motors too, this is the 
longest) costing around 935$
I think it is rated at 199A (and will do even more) and the voltage can 
go higher too so presumably it should be able to move other vehicles at 
similar weight or maybe a bit more. Lee's car says top speed of 136km/h
The killacycle is based on two such motors. White zombie is two 8 inch 
motors (I forget which kind) and they can move if properly motivated.

I think it can imitate normal car performance although perhaps not a 
sprinter unless you push the motor hard.
If you plan to pile the lead on a truck then it might be too little. 
(I'll try to contain my aversion towards trucks and lead)

Dan




> Alan Brinkman wrote:
> > Hello everyone,
> >
> > I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Based on my experience with a small truck conversion (1983 Ford Ranger),
I'd say yes a 6.7 inch ADC would work if you learn and respect its
limitations. It won't provide sparkling acceleration or hill climbing 
performance. It could run at highway speeds on the level and get up
hills with a 5-speed transmission in 1st or 2nd gear. I think a 9-inch
ADC would be better.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alan Brinkman" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 5:33 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
> DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,
> and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini
> truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less
> top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that
> would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see
> that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe
> that would be a better project?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Alan 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Not even close, don't try it! Even a 8" ADC wont't power a small pickup 
effectively. It takes a 9" and at least 120V to do a good job with a truck.

I speak from experience, guys!

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alan Brinkman" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 5:33 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor


> Hello everyone,
>
> I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
> DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,
> and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini
> truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less
> top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that
> would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see
> that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe
> that would be a better project?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Alan
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.17.4/1188 - Release Date: 
> 12/17/2007 2:13 PM
>
> 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I just put a 6.7 inch in my 1970 Datsun truck. I'm still waiting for my bed to come back from the body shop, so I don't have it all back together yet. I only have 200 pounds of my 400 pound battery pack and no bed, so it is about 400 pounds lighter than what the finished truck should be. I have taken it out for a few test runs and had it up to about 45 mph since I've only been on local low speed roads. All indications say that my little 6.7 inch is up to the task, but realize this is a very light truck, and just to be sure I am forcing air through the motor. The other thing to realize is that taking out my 6.7 and upgrading it to an 8" or 9" ADC will not be a difficult task if I decide to go that route someday. So if going with a 6.7 inch gets you on the road now when you otherwise would not, go for it. Oh, and also, not all 6.7 inchers are equal. You'll want to get an 8 brush version not 4, and you want one with a longer armature which means more copper. 

damon> Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 17:33:34 -0800> From: [email protected]> To: [email protected]> Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor> > Hello everyone,> > I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced> DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,> and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini> truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less> top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that> would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see> that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe> that would be a better project?> > Thanks,> > Alan > > _______________________________________________> For subscription options, see> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Alan,
>From what I've gathered on this list two 6.7" (the good ones) would equal
about a 9" motor. And two 8" motors would equal about an 11" motor as far
as torque per amp. The difference performance wise between the two sets are
the upper RPM limit. The bigger motors have a lower RPM redline before they
fly apart. I don't know from experience but it appears a single 6.7" with
enough current could get minimally acceptable performance. If it doesn't
accelerate fast enough you either need a bigger motor or more current
(within limits of the motors thermal handling capabilities of course). 

Joe says you need a minimum of a 9" for a small truck but I would disagree.
I have a 9" motor and it'll break the tires lose in 2nd gear with 1000 motor
amps. So a 9" is way more than you need for minimum performance. If
someone says a 6.7" with 120V is too slow I'd ask how much current they were
feeding the thing and if it was getting too warm. If they say 300 amps and
No, I would say they need to give it more current. We'd have to get Motor
Teresa or Bill Dube to comment whether a single 6.7" motor would be able to
take 1000 Amps for acceleration purposes and 150A continuous the rest of the
time. If you could do that I'd say a 6.7" motor would be quite acceptable.

Don't use a motor size and voltage alone to pick a good match. The main
things you need to ask when considering the smaller motor is how much
current will you need to pull through it to get the performance you want,
and will the motor handle it. If I went on my current configuration with a
9" motor, 120V and 300 amps and attributed performance to motor size I'd say
a 9" is even too small (its slow). But say I was able to push 1000A to the
motor with 120V pack the thing would break the tires lose in 2nd gear. It
would top out at a lower speed than with the 192V pack, but initial
acceleration (say to like 30mph) would be about the same as with the 192V
pack.

Good luck.
Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Alan Brinkman
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 4:34 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor

Hello everyone,

I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,
and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini
truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less
top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that
would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see
that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe
that would be a better project?

Thanks,

Alan 

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Yeah, I should have mentioned that it depends on what you need; if you've 
got hills of any size, or drive on a major highway, then a 6.7" is not big 
enough. But if you are driving on flat ground, or gently rolling, or in 
town, then a the larger 6.7" is probably OK.

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Willmon" <[email protected]>
To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor


> Alan,
>>From what I've gathered on this list two 6.7" (the good ones) would equal
> about a 9" motor. And two 8" motors would equal about an 11" motor as far
> as torque per amp. The difference performance wise between the two sets 
> are
> the upper RPM limit. The bigger motors have a lower RPM redline before 
> they
> fly apart. I don't know from experience but it appears a single 6.7" with
> enough current could get minimally acceptable performance. If it doesn't
> accelerate fast enough you either need a bigger motor or more current
> (within limits of the motors thermal handling capabilities of course).
>
> Joe says you need a minimum of a 9" for a small truck but I would 
> disagree.
> I have a 9" motor and it'll break the tires lose in 2nd gear with 1000 
> motor
> amps. So a 9" is way more than you need for minimum performance. If
> someone says a 6.7" with 120V is too slow I'd ask how much current they 
> were
> feeding the thing and if it was getting too warm. If they say 300 amps 
> and
> No, I would say they need to give it more current. We'd have to get 
> Motor
> Teresa or Bill Dube to comment whether a single 6.7" motor would be able 
> to
> take 1000 Amps for acceleration purposes and 150A continuous the rest of 
> the
> time. If you could do that I'd say a 6.7" motor would be quite 
> acceptable.
>
> Don't use a motor size and voltage alone to pick a good match. The main
> things you need to ask when considering the smaller motor is how much
> current will you need to pull through it to get the performance you want,
> and will the motor handle it. If I went on my current configuration with 
> a
> 9" motor, 120V and 300 amps and attributed performance to motor size I'd 
> say
> a 9" is even too small (its slow). But say I was able to push 1000A to 
> the
> motor with 120V pack the thing would break the tires lose in 2nd gear. It
> would top out at a lower speed than with the 192V pack, but initial
> acceleration (say to like 30mph) would be about the same as with the 192V
> pack.
>
> Good luck.
> Mike
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On 
> Behalf
> Of Alan Brinkman
> Sent: Monday, December 17, 2007 4:34 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> I was looking at the EV Album to see how much of a vehicle an Advanced
> DC 6.7 inch motor could handle. My son is looking for a small truck,
> and the 6.7 inch motors are cheaper than 8 inch. Can you power a mini
> truck like a Toyota or Nissan with one 6.7 inch motor, maybe with less
> top speed and acceleration? If you put in two 6.7 inch motors, that
> would be similar to an 8 inch, would that be more acceptable? I see
> that some have put a 6.7 inch motor in an older air cooled VW bug, maybe
> that would be a better project?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Alan
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.17.4/1188 - Release Date: 
> 12/17/2007 2:13 PM
>
> 

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

As a 6.7" Bug driver, I'll relate my experiences:

First, I have the L91 model. This version is wound to give higher RPM's and accepts a higher voltage than the X91 model. So, it's less torquey but will give you higher motor speeds.

I commute 30 miles RTP daily on hilly highway. I drive 55 mph minimum, 65 mph after I crest the worst hill in the run. I will admit, acceleration is underwhelming but maybe it just seems that way because I'm in the DC/Baltimore ghetto-plex which was recently rated as one of the worst driver areas in the nation.

I'm running 128 volts of 8v floodies that weigh 69 lbs each so the car is heavy. Cruising at 55-60 mph in 2nd gear on level ground I only draw 80-90 battery amps. Once you get the car to cruising speed, it's quite efficient. Even on the hills, I only draw 180-200 battery amps to maintain 50-55 mph speeds.

The bottom line is, a 6.7" motor will work of you in your truck but you have to decide: Keep it light so acceleration can be snappy or load it up with batteries and accelerate gently. Forced air cooling is a great idea, plus do what Roland does and put an ammeter on the motor side so you can make sure you don't overload it. I've pulled maybe 600 motor amps through mine briefly without any noticable damage. (I don't do it now that I've been better educated)

Also, something I learned from Lee (I think?) is that motor ratings are just points on a thermal curve. You can exceed the listed values for shorter periods of time, the time being limited to when you begin to exceed the thermal limits of the motor. Of course, there's a limit to THAT as well, because I -think- too much current can destroy the armature regardless of the temperature.

I'll close with the admission that I am NOT the motor guru and that hopefully Jim Husted will speak to this matter.

Rich A.Marylandhttp://www.austinev.org/evalbum/371.html

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 18:45:20 -0800
From: "Tom Shay" [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" [email protected]
Message-ID: [email protected]
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Based on my experience with a small truck conversion (1983 Ford Ranger),
I'd say yes a 6.7 inch ADC would work if you learn and respect its
limitations. It won't provide sparkling acceleration or hill climbing 
performance. It could run at highway speeds on the level and get up
hills with a 5-speed transmission in 1st or 2nd gear. I think a 9-inch
ADC would be better.
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> --- Richard Acuti <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >
> > As a 6.7" Bug driver, I'll relate my experiences:
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

The RPM limit is why I have a tach on my 9", and an audible warning as 
well - but it's never gone off, 'cause I don't peg the tach in 2nd gear!

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Husted" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Advanced DC 6.7 inch motor


>


> > --- Richard Acuti <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> As a 6.7" Bug driver, I'll relate my experiences:
> ...


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