# budget EV with no more budget.



## ngrimm (Oct 19, 2007)

It looks great. Did you paint it your self and is that "electric" blue?


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## Amberwolf (May 29, 2009)

That does look nice. Gonna put any EV-specific markings on it? Or just go down the road letting everyone think you stalled the engine and are coasting? 
EDIT: nm--I missed the logo on the back!

Maybe I can get you to paint up my CrazyBike2 once it's all finished (if that ever happens). Although at least right now if you saw it when driving around Phoenix (usually Metrocenter area) you'd definitely know it was me; it's kinda...uh, unique-looking.


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## fishguts (Dec 19, 2008)

Great job! Sometimes it's worth running over budget. It looks like you still did a great job putting together an affordable EV ... and the words "affordable" and "EV" rarely can be used in the same sentence!


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

thanks guys, i will have some electric markings air brushed on it later, it was professionaly painted, I traded one of my Micro Solar Energy Systems for the paint job. the guy did a great job. I dont get around metrocenter much, But if I seen your bike i would know it.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

the build was fun, and i realy like driving it, the look on peoples faces is the best. I will be at 5808 n 7th street at 8 today to play with it, and show it off to some friends.


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## Amberwolf (May 29, 2009)

I don't know that I can, but if it does turn out to be possible, is it ok if I show up there with a friend to see it? Assuming that's 8pm, and not 8am.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

I should have been a little clearer, it was 8am, but its cool to know that there is someone here in phoenix doing a conversion too. the car was a hit, every body asked a thousand questions, i just hope that i answered them all right, But it was fun to show it off a bit. but Im sure that we can set something up to see the car, just PM me, I get around a 35 mile range so any where in that area is doable. and anyway, I just love driving it.


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## Amberwolf (May 29, 2009)

I assumed you'd meant 8am, but figured I'd ask.  

I don't know anyone that's doing a conversion at the moment; I build ebikes out of junk though.  Well, I've built one and pondered a few others, started two more but not very far along. the last ebike is partly junk but mostly normal bike with a hubmotor kit on it. Not nearly as much fun to do as the other stuff. 

I do have a friend that is interested in this kind of stuff, though, and he's the one I'd've gone with to see the car. If it were practical and he had any money to spend on it, I'd help him convert his old van that has engine issues. 

One thing I like most about the electric stuff is it's quiet enough to hear the world around you without sound-deadening insulation or earplugs.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

well i was refering to the ebikes, or any thing electric for that matter.I agree 100% about hearing the world around you. my car is very quiet compared to its ICE version, which allows me to hear the radio,things from the road, have conversations with passangers, all kinds of things alot better. I saw a couple of guys at autozone a couple of days ago, with the gasoline powered bikes, so i thought I would ask them if they thought of doing them electric instead of gas, but they just laughed and said yea right, like changing their bikes from the little gas engines to an electric motor, was the worst idea ever. go figure.
i guess some people just refuse to stop using gasoline, or just cant.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

today i started installing 4 more batteries in the nEon, but my problem was, where? I have 12 in the trunk, and 4 in the motor compartment (formerly the engine compartment), which gives me a total amphour capacity of 410 amphours. now the car gets good range but here in phoenix i may have to drive 25 30 miles one way to get to work.(sometimes) so I looked at how other people did it and then i did it different. I saw that alot of people take out the back seat to add batteries, well that was not an option for me because I need to put 2 kids in the back some times, Or was it? here is what i came up with to add 4 more batteries for a total of 20 floodies and 515 amp hours. i only had enough angle for one battery box today but I wi;ll build the other one for the drivers side on monday. with a little modification the seat went back in place and you cant tell there are batteries under there. I just used the old batteries for a template, and will get new batteries on monday.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

since the build, I have been wanting to get more range out of the car, here in phoenix to get to work a person could drive 20 miles one way very easy. now i know that the range in the car is 40 miles at 80% DOD, so i can and have driven it that far down, but I was thinking about how to get more range. now i run my car on 60v volts, which works for the number of batteries that i have in the car, and at 60v i get a top speed of 65mph, so that is good. but i still need more range, I have 12 batteries in the trunk, and 4 batteries in the motor compartment, which gives me 310amp hours plus 1 12v for accessories. Now I could take out the back seatand put a ton of batteries in there but I need to be able to seat 2 people in the back, so here is what i did to add 4 more batteries to give me 415amp hours and stay at 60v. hopefully i can get another 5 or 10 miles from it. now i have a total of 20 12v 105 ah batteries in the car. Now the batteries in the pictures are used but i will replace them with new ones, one at a time.


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## ngrimm (Oct 19, 2007)

I see you found a way to use the metal you removed as a cover. Great idea. Do the batteries hang much lower than the floor pan?


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

no they are even with the floor pan, I did not want to go over a bump and drag them, I also used a piece of pan liner to go over the batteries so that no metal from the lid, or the seat would touch them, I think it works well.


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## peggus (Feb 18, 2008)

You may want to add some more solid cover, metal or G-10 or something fire and projectile resistant. Batteries do explode sometimes, I sure would want something more solid than a liner between my kids bottoms and the batteries.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

yep, I m using the pieces that I cut out to make a lid for them but i had to use the liner under it for insulation, so that nothing grounds out, then the liner on top just for looks.


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## ngrimm (Oct 19, 2007)

I don't know, my parents would have loved to have the threat of exploding batteries under my behind. Settle down backthere, don't make me push this button!  Anyway your cuts look really smooth. Did you use a plasma cutter?


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

no, I just used sawsaw, and cut it real slow. It worked out better than i thought.


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## Evilsizer (Jan 25, 2010)

have you thought about fabricating/mounting a box in the gas tank area. that way you can add even more batteries for longer range. have you looked at the cost of going with some lifepro cells instead?

i found a neon on criagslist and thought it would be perfect for a EV. yours does look really nice with that paint job!


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

well if i build battery boxes (that is next) where the gas tank would be and add 8-12 more batteries, the cost still would not come close to lithium batteries+ BMS and I can replace my floodies alot easier too. thanks for the compliment on the paint.


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## Evilsizer (Jan 25, 2010)

what battery did you go with? have you thought about adding some kind of watt-hour meter or have you done that?


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

im using interstate deepcycle 105ah batteries. no dont have a whatt hour meter(I woul like one though) just soc and amp meter for now, but it works for me, I was trying to keep to a budget, but now i got ac, power steering, and vaccum brakes, so the car is loaded now. I get about 50miles range and can go 65 if i want to, but I usually stick to city streets for work.


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## mmw109 (May 28, 2010)

Looks like a good job. 

If you don't mind me asking, how did you manage to do that whole project for only $3k. 

Most motors I've seen for sale come almost up to that on their own !?


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

I bought everthing used, the motor is an aircraft starter/generator from the airplane graveyard in Tucson, it was 75 bucks, but you can do just as good with a forklift motor, I built the adapter plate in my garage, that cost 50 bucks (for the metal), I used a love joy coupling to attach the motor to the tranny, 50 bucks for the love joy from Grainger. the car was 150 bucks on craigs list, the cable I got from an electrical supply with all the crimps, the crimp tool, cable and all the crimps were 200 bucks. The controller is from Ebay, it was a curtis 1221b 48-72v 400 amps, it worked but the car was kinda slow on take off, it was 250 bucks, all the gauges were 100 bucks on Ebay, abd the dc-dc converter is a 20 amp wildmore fro ebay that was 50 bucks. The only thing that i bought new was the batteries. now that was the tricky part, because if you go with lithium, then that is 4gs easy and not with a BMS, so for my budget I went with flooded lead acid, deep cycle batteries, they are interstate 12v 100ah, and they were 65 bucks with a core charge at sams club, 65 bucks x 20 batteries is 1300 bucks. so the total was around 2200 bucks, but the curtis went out,so I up graded the controller(so I thought) to a logisystems 48-72 700 amp witch was 400 bucks, then the new paint was 300 bucks.I do modular charging( charge each battery) and the chargers were 129.00 for a 3 bank 15amp on board charger, so that was 780 bucks, and 2 15 amp single on board chargers were 60 each, so they were 120 bucks, and one 6 amp charger for the accessory batteries which are 2 12 v lawn and garden batteries that were 20 bucks each a walmart. but I sold the motor for 450 bucks and the rest went to the scrap yard which got me another 100 bucks, which put me at 3000 bucks, registration was only 18 bucks for 2 years, and i sent the curtis to be re paired and kept it for a spare.the total was $3400, but it was on the road. Now since then, iv added an electric power steering pump that i also got from ebay for 400 bucks, and an ac system that was 450 bucks and had to have the lines made, that was 100 bucks and charged the system for 50 more bucks, and vaccum power brakes,i got the vaccum from an 05 ford super duty for 50 bucks with the canister, and no heat after all i live in phoenix and have plenty of that without help from the car.


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## 9852 (Jan 17, 2010)

so you see you can build a good ev for around 3k with proper planning, and for around 4k can have it with amenities. 
but some states will require a bit more, because of regulations

now for the batteries
there will be a lot of people talking about lithium, which are great batteries, they are light weight, but they come at great cost. 
A lithium pack will last you a good 7 years with excessive use, then you need to replace it, not only will that cost you another 4k but you will have to wait for it, and for me at least that is not acceptable, if i use my car every day for work and something needs to be fixed, i want it fixed as soon as possible, and not wait for weeks to get batteries.
Now the floodies will only last about 3 years, but even if you replace them 3 times at 1300 bucksit is still less than lithium and you can go get them right now in you area, no waiting. so that is why I use deep cycle batteries.


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## mmw109 (May 28, 2010)

Cheers, well done. 

I think I agree with you on the battery front. Maybe when you come to replace them in 3 years, lithium will be a more viable solution, but for now, it really adds to the cost.


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