# I need some build advice from VW/Porsche experts



## DPWood (Mar 7, 2013)

Hi.

Well the first thing I should say is that the build I am planning is not actually a VW Bug or a Porsche but I am looking into using a transmission from one or the other. I'm just not very familiar with the differences between years and models so if some of the more experienced forum members could chime in with advice it would be greatly appriciated. What I am planning to build is a Fiero and I would like to orient the motor longitudinally and forward of the drive axels (mid engine) rather than rear mounted. I know that this can be done by reversing the ring gear in a Porsche G-50 but I'm looking for a functional, but considerably less expensive, alternative to that.

I have found a couple VW type 1 that are for sale at a really bargain price ....and a trans from a Vanagon (not sure which model). There is also a 914 transaxle listed. Its more expensive but not unreasonable for a trans that is already configured for mid engine. Which of these would be the better option. Can the early VW gearboxes be reverse mounted? Can they be built up to handle significant power levels or would I simply be better off getting the 914 trans. 

Thanks

David


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## palmer_md (Jul 22, 2011)

I'd go with the Porsche 901 transmission for the 914.


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## EVfun (Mar 14, 2010)

The ring gear can be flipped in the VW Type 1 transaxle. The early type 2 used the same transaxle with reduction gears and so the ring gear was flipped from the factory. There are also a number of mid engine sand rails using the type 1 box. They can handle quite a bit of power with some beefing up. There are a number of shops that build them for reasonable prices. You would be looking at 1969 or newer style with the double jointed rear suspension (not a swingaxle.) There are a number of builder who advertise on thesamba.


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## DPWood (Mar 7, 2013)

Thanks for the quick responses. That Porsche trans is tempting....
sooo tempting... because it is Porsche  

but...I could get 2 of the type 1 IRS transaxles and a performance clutch/lightened flywheel for maybe a few bucks more than the asking price of the 914. I can rebuild any of them myself if I have a set of drawings and add whatever parts are neeeded to get the performance I'm after.

That advertiser link was very good EVFun. It gave me a bunch of places not at the top of a google search. Thanks. Saved me much time searching.

David


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## mjcrow (Jan 5, 2008)

Depending on how much power you are aiming for, the Porsche 924, 944, 968 and 928 were all front engined, rear transaxle configurations. No need to reverse ring gears


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Get a tranny from a later 70,s Bus and flip the ring gear yourself. Steer clear of the old vw swing axle for this project. You must deal with a shifter for a tranny that is flipped. Should not be too much of an issue there. The 914 tranny is a VW transmission


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## DPWood (Mar 7, 2013)

I've been e-mailing both of the gentlemen regarding their transaxles. I may just go for option "D".....All of the above.

A nicely rebuilt VW unit should handle HPEVs AC-76 from what I have read. This is the motor that I will most likely be installing. If my budget alows me to step up to the siamesed AC-35X2 motor I would probably have to beef up the VW with some race quality parts or go with the Porsche 901. I have been going through several of the threads in the link that EVFun provided and there lots of examples of people running sand rails with the type 1 IRS. It appears to hold up to pretty grueling conditions when built for the application.

There is a consensus on that forum that the bus transaxle called a 6 rib is the strongest of the VW units. You just answered my next question ongreenev. If the ring gear in that box could be flipped to reverse rotation in a bus differential. The person selling the VW stuff apparently has several gearboxes. It might be possible that he has one in his barn. He also seemed quite knowlegeable on VW parts.

I have a pretty good idea of what I want the car to be when it is finished..... just don't want to get tripped up too much on the steps in between. I have the space frame up on the rotisserie now and I'm gradually removing 30 years of oxidizing cancer. This build is completely from the ground up so I have only the edge of my credit limit to constrain me.

Thanks guys.

David


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## mjcrow (Jan 5, 2008)

Hi David,

I'm sure you have probably seen John Metrics thread of his Fiero build here http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/dc-plasma-build-thread-10sec-fiero-69476.html but I thought I'd link to it in case you hadn't. He also put the motor(s) in the centre tunnel where the gas tank went like you are proposing.

Mike


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Question! If I am not mistaken the Fiero is a mid engined vehicle already so that means it has a transaxle so why not just use that instead of re-engineering the thing to take a VW transaxle and with the VW transaxle the motor sits all wrong for the Fiero. I like the mid-engine layout and side mounted motor. The AC-75 should fit. You'd need to measure. You should also start with a car with NO rust or corrosion. I am quite sure you could pick one up from out here in California with NO rust for a very good price. Most likely cheaper than what it will cost to revamp a crusty old car. Start with a good foundation. Not sure why the VW transaxle transplant. Sounds like a whole lot-a excess work.


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## DPWood (Mar 7, 2013)

mjcrow: Yes I have seen the Fiero he built. An absolutely incredible car. There are also a couple others on the forum involved in EV drags that just leave me wide eyed at what can be done.

onegreenev: Why all the extra work? I'm sure there are a few people around that would say it is evidence of mental instability You are right, of course, the AC 76 would fit quite nicely in a transverse orientation. Much of my reason comes down to how I want build something unique. I enjoy the challenge and completing it will give me a great deal of satisfaction. Overall I am looking at performance: being able to balance the car 50/50, packaging some of the batteries in a saddle setup would be very difficult with the Fiero transaxle, The VW gearbox would have equal length axles and a reasonably priced LSD is available. I also believe I can mount the VW tranny lower in the car. Like I said earlier. I have a good idea of how I want the car to handle and perform when I am done. It will be a car that I drive to work on a daily basis and I wand the grin of enjoying that drive to be on my face as soon as I get in the seat.

Sadly, I don't have the option of a rust free chassis. The only place you will find those in Canada is on the showroom floor. A couple years of our winters and the road salt does absolutely nasty things underneath. The good thing is that I have time to restore things the way I want to. It will only cost a few hundred dollars in materials. Much less than transporting a car about 3000 miles. My wife and I have a bunch of house renovations to do this year and probably the following one too. I won't have the cash for the major components like the motor and batteries. I will be spending my time on the mechanicals, performing surgery on the chassis, and putting everything together with full size mockups.

David


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