# [EVDL] Battery box thickness



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using aluminum? 14, 18, or 20 ga? 

The battery box is in the vehicle and has separate support for weight. . The box is basically for containment and isolation and will have a clear polycarbonate top. 

Thanks in advance. 

Barry

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Barry,

I would suggest that you go with a non-reactive material if you are redoing your battery box and it 
has sturctural support underneath.
You could make it out of 1/4" wood for the general shape and then sandwich it between layers of 
fiberglass.

Rush
www.TucsonEV.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <[email protected]>
To: "EVDL" <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 9:03 AM
Subject: [EVDL] Battery box thickness


> In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to redo my battery box. What is the 
> recommended thickness if using aluminum? 14, 18, or 20 ga?
>
> The battery box is in the vehicle and has separate support for weight. . The box is basically for 
> containment and isolation and will have a clear polycarbonate top.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Barry
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 

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| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Why non-reactive if he won't have any acid mist to deal with any more?



> Rush <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Barry,
> >
> > I would suggest that you go with a non-reactive material if you are redoing your battery box and it
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> > redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Roger,

"Your question can't really be answered without more detail as to the size
of the box. Weight of cells that the box is to hold, and details as to how
the box is to be supported."

Box is approximately 30" x 30" x 12". Weight of cells is ~600lbs. Current
supports are 2"x1" steel supports, spanning approximately 36", spaced
approximately 8", and bolted to the vehicle frame.

Thanks again,
Barry 



-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Heuckeroth [mailto:[email protected]] 
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 8:47 PM
To: [email protected]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness




> [email protected] wrote:
> 
> > In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> > redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

So, you have steel supports every 8"? If that is the case 0.063" will be suffice. It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier between the steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion. 

Sent from my iPad



> "Barry Oppenheim" <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Roger,
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Roger,

"So, you have steel supports every 8"?"

Yes. Here's an old picture (prior to being bolted in). 
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_PB574-Suuu8/SNaap0c0CnI/AAAAAAAABYw/CeFEt8ULAOI/s1
600-h/IMG_2267.JPG

"It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier between the
steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion."
Thanks. I have some rubbing matting that should be perfect.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Roger Heuckeroth
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 4:49 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

So, you have steel supports every 8"? If that is the case 0.063" will be
suffice. It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier
between the steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion. 

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2011, at 1:56 PM, "Barry Oppenheim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Roger,
> 
> "Your question can't really be answered without more detail as to the size
> of the box. Weight of cells that the box is to hold, and details as to
how
> the box is to be supported."
> 
> Box is approximately 30" x 30" x 12". Weight of cells is ~600lbs.
Current
> supports are 2"x1" steel supports, spanning approximately 36", spaced
> approximately 8", and bolted to the vehicle frame.
> 
> Thanks again,
> Barry 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Heuckeroth [mailto:[email protected]] 
> Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 8:47 PM
> To: [email protected]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness
> 
> 
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> >> redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I am curious as to why you would not use 0.040 mild steel. No isolation
problem. Easy to weld, the rest of the car is made of it? Just wondering.
Oh, it's inexpensive.

Sincerely,
Mark Grasser


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Barry Oppenheim
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 5:15 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

Roger,

"So, you have steel supports every 8"?"

Yes. Here's an old picture (prior to being bolted in). 
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_PB574-Suuu8/SNaap0c0CnI/AAAAAAAABYw/CeFEt8ULAOI/s1
600-h/IMG_2267.JPG

"It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier between the
steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion."
Thanks. I have some rubbing matting that should be perfect.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Roger Heuckeroth
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 4:49 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

So, you have steel supports every 8"? If that is the case 0.063" will be
suffice. It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier
between the steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion. 

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2011, at 1:56 PM, "Barry Oppenheim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Roger,
> 
> "Your question can't really be answered without more detail as to the size
> of the box. Weight of cells that the box is to hold, and details as to
how
> the box is to be supported."
> 
> Box is approximately 30" x 30" x 12". Weight of cells is ~600lbs.
Current
> supports are 2"x1" steel supports, spanning approximately 36", spaced
> approximately 8", and bolted to the vehicle frame.
> 
> Thanks again,
> Barry 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Heuckeroth [mailto:[email protected]] 
> Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 8:47 PM
> To: [email protected]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness
> 
> 
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> >> redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Mark,

Shinier 

Actually good question. Two reasons.

1.Weight For 18 gauge steel vs aluminum: 2lbs/sq ft for steel vs .569
lbs/sqft for aluminum
(http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/gauge-sheet-d_915.html). 

So for a 3'x 3' x 1' box (21 sqft without a top) the weights are 42lbs vs
12lbs. Cost is approximately $33 vs $60 (1.57/sq ft vs 2.85/sq ft).

2.Cutting. I can use my table saw and a carbide blade to cut 18ga aluminum.
I think for the same thickness steel I'd have to use my grinder or jig saw.
My preference is to use a table saw for long cuts.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Mark Grasser
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 6:00 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

I am curious as to why you would not use 0.040 mild steel. No isolation
problem. Easy to weld, the rest of the car is made of it? Just wondering.
Oh, it's inexpensive.

Sincerely,
Mark Grasser


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Barry Oppenheim
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 5:15 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

Roger,

"So, you have steel supports every 8"?"

Yes. Here's an old picture (prior to being bolted in). 
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_PB574-Suuu8/SNaap0c0CnI/AAAAAAAABYw/CeFEt8ULAOI/s1
600-h/IMG_2267.JPG

"It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier between the
steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion."
Thanks. I have some rubbing matting that should be perfect.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Roger Heuckeroth
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 4:49 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

So, you have steel supports every 8"? If that is the case 0.063" will be
suffice. It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier
between the steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion. 

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2011, at 1:56 PM, "Barry Oppenheim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Roger,
> 
> "Your question can't really be answered without more detail as to the size
> of the box. Weight of cells that the box is to hold, and details as to
how
> the box is to be supported."
> 
> Box is approximately 30" x 30" x 12". Weight of cells is ~600lbs.
Current
> supports are 2"x1" steel supports, spanning approximately 36", spaced
> approximately 8", and bolted to the vehicle frame.
> 
> Thanks again,
> Barry 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Heuckeroth [mailto:[email protected]] 
> Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 8:47 PM
> To: [email protected]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness
> 
> 
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> >> redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Barry,
I think if you use steel it could be thinner then aluminum in the same
application. I have not done the math yet though but will be there at some
time with my project. With it being thinner the weight would be less than 30
pounds, maybe 20 to 25 pounds. Given the savings in time and the better
results I think steel might be the direction I would go.

About cutting, I purchased a reverse curf (sp?) blade for my skill saw. Says
right on it "for ferrous metals" I cut 16 ga steel often with it. Work
nicely. Oh, my saw is a 90deg gear drive, outs my hands far away from the
work, I wear ear and eye protection. While it does work nicely I tend to
have the fear in me while doing it but the results are awesome!!

Sincerely,
Mark Grasser



-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Barry Oppenheim
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 6:51 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

Mark,

Shinier 

Actually good question. Two reasons.

1.Weight For 18 gauge steel vs aluminum: 2lbs/sq ft for steel vs .569
lbs/sqft for aluminum
(http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/gauge-sheet-d_915.html). 

So for a 3'x 3' x 1' box (21 sqft without a top) the weights are 42lbs vs
12lbs. Cost is approximately $33 vs $60 (1.57/sq ft vs 2.85/sq ft).

2.Cutting. I can use my table saw and a carbide blade to cut 18ga aluminum.
I think for the same thickness steel I'd have to use my grinder or jig saw.
My preference is to use a table saw for long cuts.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Mark Grasser
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 6:00 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

I am curious as to why you would not use 0.040 mild steel. No isolation
problem. Easy to weld, the rest of the car is made of it? Just wondering.
Oh, it's inexpensive.

Sincerely,
Mark Grasser


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Barry Oppenheim
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 5:15 PM
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

Roger,

"So, you have steel supports every 8"?"

Yes. Here's an old picture (prior to being bolted in). 
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_PB574-Suuu8/SNaap0c0CnI/AAAAAAAABYw/CeFEt8ULAOI/s1
600-h/IMG_2267.JPG

"It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier between the
steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion."
Thanks. I have some rubbing matting that should be perfect.

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Roger Heuckeroth
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2011 4:49 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

So, you have steel supports every 8"? If that is the case 0.063" will be
suffice. It would be a good idea to make sure there is a good barrier
between the steel and the aluminum, so there is no corrosion. 

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2011, at 1:56 PM, "Barry Oppenheim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Roger,
> 
> "Your question can't really be answered without more detail as to the size
> of the box. Weight of cells that the box is to hold, and details as to
how
> the box is to be supported."
> 
> Box is approximately 30" x 30" x 12". Weight of cells is ~600lbs.
Current
> supports are 2"x1" steel supports, spanning approximately 36", spaced
> approximately 8", and bolted to the vehicle frame.
> 
> Thanks again,
> Barry 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Heuckeroth [mailto:[email protected]] 
> Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 8:47 PM
> To: [email protected]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness
> 
> 
>


> [email protected] wrote:
> >
> >> In the process of replacing batteries (FLA to Li-Ion) and need to
> >> redo my battery box. What is the recommended thickness if using
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hi Barry,

Just a thought, but as all your cells are together in a clean and dry 
environment, have you considered not bothering with a box? You could 
assemble your cells into blocks using the plastic strapping method, 
fix some 3mm angle to your existing supports in a shape which defines 
the outer bounds of your whole pack (for lateral restraint) and then 
use ratcheting nylon tie-downs to strap them down to the steelwork 
securely (easy to remove if needed). Then just fit your see-through 
lid above the pack, supported by bits of angle attached to the boot 
(trunk) area. If it were thick enough you could get away with just 
the sides supported.

Its not ideal but it would save weight and be just as secure. The 
only drawback might be prying fingers...

Regards, Martin Winlow
Herts, UK
http://www.evalbum.com/2092
www.winlow.co.uk




> Barry Oppenheim wrote:
> 
> > Roger,
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Martin,

Thought about it. But because the box is in the passenger compartment (rear
cargo of small SUV) I'd rather have the extra safety of containment. Plus
in my case I have prying claws, not fingers to worry about 

Barry

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Martin WINLOW
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 4:16 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery box thickness

Hi Barry,

Just a thought, but as all your cells are together in a clean and dry 
environment, have you considered not bothering with a box? You could 
assemble your cells into blocks using the plastic strapping method, 
fix some 3mm angle to your existing supports in a shape which defines 
the outer bounds of your whole pack (for lateral restraint) and then 
use ratcheting nylon tie-downs to strap them down to the steelwork 
securely (easy to remove if needed). Then just fit your see-through 
lid above the pack, supported by bits of angle attached to the boot 
(trunk) area. If it were thick enough you could get away with just 
the sides supported.

Its not ideal but it would save weight and be just as secure. The 
only drawback might be prying fingers...

Regards, Martin Winlow
Herts, UK
http://www.evalbum.com/2092
www.winlow.co.uk




> Barry Oppenheim wrote:
> 
> > Roger,
> >
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hi Barry,

Yes - It can be difficult confining those pesky hamsters to their 
wheel in an EV! MW




> Barry Oppenheim wrote:
> 
> > Martin,
> >
> ...


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