# The Electric Land Cruiser EVJ80 - Nissan LEAF + Resolve-EV



## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Before cutting things I'm getting my ducks in a row. Learned that it's so much easier and enjoyable to start a vehicle project when you have enough parts to keep you busy. If you are always waiting on orders then things drag out forever.

First I acquired my Land Cruiser. I got it for $1000. It had no Colorado title when I bought it which is why it was so cheap. Luckily the Cruiser is now registered in my name!

I also purchased my donor LEAF from Copart. It's a great place to buy salvaged vehicles and cars like LEAFs are still very cheap on there but you gotta account for about $1000 in fees on top of the winning bid. Still can get a good deal. I got this LEAF for $3400 out the door.










The car was advertised as an S, but I could tell from the wheels and headlights it was an SV.

6.6kw and Chademo chargers, score!










Both chargers still work! The car even runs and drives!










I checked out the battery: 17kwh. Not great but it'll work for now.











Thank you to the great state of Vermont for allowing 25 year old cars to be registered with no title!










I thought it would be interesting to weigh the vehicle now before I start any work and I can weigh it as I go and see what the final result will be. When I tell people about my project it seems like the #1 question is "how much heavier will it be?" My bet is that it will be lighter apples-to-apples with a single LEAF pack. The cast iron engine weighs almost 600lbs and the transmission an additional 250lbs. Not to mention the exhaust and gas tank and all other assorted ICE stuff.

The weight of the vehicle is 5080lbs. Note this scale is certified accurate to every 10 lbs. It was weighed at 5080lbs which means my truck is between 5080 and 5089.9lbs.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

These are the types of areas I hope this vehicle will take me to explore:


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

EV Hummers testing out in Moab alongside an H2 and Chevy Colorado:


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## Swing (Apr 25, 2021)

Awesome base car.

And awesome to see the new Hummer EVs being tested. Would love to offroad with electric torque.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks Swing!

Happy day today! Super fast shipping from Resolve-EV can't wait to plug this thing in. Resolve-EV controller + Nissan LEAF do you actually need anything else to build an EV conversion?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Shake down run today. It goes through mud just fine! I wanted to get a baseline before switching to EV.




























After that a few buddies and I went back to the shop and dissected the LEAF. It came apart way easier than anticipated. Just get in there and start pulling it apart!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Big day today! The old iron beast has been removed! Holy hell it put up a fight too. I had to drop the t-case and will have to fab some new mounts to hold it. There is so much old oil and junk stuck on the motor and the chassis it is ridiculous. Will be saving the planet just getting this leaking motor off the road!























































I managed to save the AC without it leaking out or smashing up the condenser too badly. I will try to build an accessory plate to run a serpentine belt for the AC and PS off an auxiliary motor. I'm going to need hydraulic PS so either I'll do it this way or I'll get a dedicated electric PS pump.




























I will repurpose some of the radiators for the reduction gearbox and motor/inverter, though the full size rad is probably overkill.



















Now starts the hard part!


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## Swing (Apr 25, 2021)

Nice. You could also run a dedicated motor for the AC (and PS). Either directly coupled to the compressor or on a belt driving both AC and PS. Nice for when the car is not driving.


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## x78163 (Jun 13, 2021)

Amazing project. I have a '91 Land Cruiser which is destined for the same conversion when time and finances permit. I'll be following your project quite closely! 

Out of curiosity, where do you intend to mount the leaf battery pack? Are you going to maintain it in one pack, or distribute the modules to maximize space utilization? While my plans are only napkin based at this point, I was looking at splitting the batteries within the engine bay to better utilize space. 

Additionally I'm looking at the feasibility of using the underslung spare tire space to mount a 'detachable' auxiliary battery. The aux pack will be mounted in a mobile enclosure than can be dragged like a suitcase into buildings for charging (think like a larger pelican case). I figure that I can drive to work on the aux pack, plug it in at the office, and then drive home on aux pack. I'm not 100% on the electrical bus interface, mounting or attach/detach procedures, but the volume of space would have sufficient energy density to do short distance travel.

Where did you find an interface adaptor for the leaf motor to the LC drive train? I'm assuming you're keeping the leaf transmission and not doing the standard EV motor direct to LC transmission conversion. 

Finally, are you looking at any range extender modifications? Again napkin designs, I want to see if I can finagle enough space in the engine bay for a small generator for those SHTF moments. 

Anyhow, I'm in love with your project and I look forward to watching it unfold!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Swing said:


> Nice. You could also run a dedicated motor for the AC (and PS). Either directly coupled to the compressor or on a belt driving both AC and PS. Nice for when the car is not driving.


Yeah that is my plan. Unfortunately the stock PS pump on this truck is built into the oil pump and not really feasible to run independently. I'll either adapt a belt run PS pump from another vehicle or get an electric pump. I like the idea of having it on a separate auxiliary motor that I can control with a simple knob and turn off when not needed. Also should be able to run the AC full blast while charging.

@x78163 I am going to use one of these EM57 motor couplers and my EM57 adapter plate I had machined. Then I will have a custom driveshaft built and tap and thread it onto the coupler on one end and use a Chevy 27-spline shaft on the output. The driveshaft will input into a Blackbox-C "doubler" that I will run in Low range 100% of the time (2.7:1 reduction, ~75mph top speed). I will add an electric pump and cooling radiator to manage heat in the planetary gearbox. I already purchased the Blackbox and it should be here by the end of the month. I will then have to build custom mounts for the transfer case and motor. Then I can also shift the stock transfer case into Low range for offroad driving and have an additional 2.4:1 reduction for ultimate offroad rockcrawling 

Next thing I will do is get the truck up on the lift and remove the fuel tank exhaust etc.

I will package the LEAF battery under the hood. I will build a battery box to hold it. There is ample room for all 24kwh and then some. I think a welded steel frame with aluminum panels riveted and sealant to keep it watertight. I will then focus on refining the rest of the vehicle. After awhile I want to add more and more LEAF batteries in the places you mentioned and other places too but that will be pretty complicated and hard to do.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

I didn't realize until seeing this transfer case that the J80 rear axle has an offset pinion. That means that the propeller shaft is well off-centre between the frame rails, so if an expansion battery pack were placed under the floor, there would be room on side of the shaft for a wider pack than would fit with a centred shaft. It appears that extended-capacity fuel tanks take advantage of this in the J80.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

x78163 said:


> Additionally I'm looking at the feasibility of using the underslung spare tire space to mount a 'detachable' auxiliary battery. The aux pack will be mounted in a mobile enclosure than can be dragged like a suitcase into buildings for charging (think like a larger pelican case). I figure that I can drive to work on the aux pack, plug it in at the office, and then drive home on aux pack. I'm not 100% on the electrical bus interface, mounting or attach/detach procedures, but the volume of space would have sufficient energy density to do short distance travel.


That's an interesting scheme, but it would be a heavy thing to drag inside, and you would need to either build a battery charger into the auxiliary pack, or leave one in the office.

For this to make sense, you would ideally want to discharge the auxiliary pack first while driving, so you were not dragging a partially-charged battery in to be topped off. This brings up the potentially complex issue of managing two batteries of different capacities in parallel in the vehicle.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

I was skimming too fast and missed the part about the BlackBox gearbox, so I posted (and have now removed) a question about transmission plans.


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## x78163 (Jun 13, 2021)

brian_ said:


> That's an interesting scheme, but it would be a heavy thing to drag inside, and you would need to either build a battery charger into the auxiliary pack, or leave one in the office.
> 
> For this to make sense, you would ideally want to discharge the auxiliary pack first while driving, so you were not dragging a partially-charged battery in to be topped off. This brings up the potentially complex issue of managing two batteries of different capacities in parallel in the vehicle.


100% agree. Definitely heavy, but the modularity and ability to drag would help my range anxiety fears. 

Theoretically, yes, the module needs to be self contained. As far as the bus integration in the vehicle, I'd look at something similar to an aviation fuel selector switch-> main tank or aux tank. But clearly battery packs instead. So that would be the workaround to prevent back charging one pack from the other in parallel. 

Regarding the total discharge prior to charging, I'm not sure. I know the chemistry is largely dependent on ideal DoD for battery longevity. I do remember the ye olde NiCad batteries where memory was an issue. I think one of the larger safety issues is selecting a chemistry and design that doesn't make me an arsonist.


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## x78163 (Jun 13, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> @x78163 I am going to use one of these EM57 motor couplers and my EM57 adapter plate I had machined. Then I will have a custom driveshaft built and tap and thread it onto the coupler on one end and use a Chevy 27-spline shaft on the output. The driveshaft will input into a Blackbox-C "doubler" that I will run in Low range 100% of the time (2.7:1 reduction, ~75mph top speed). I will add an electric pump and cooling radiator to manage heat in the planetary gearbox. I already purchased the Blackbox and it should be here by the end of the month. I will then have to build custom mounts for the transfer case and motor. Then I can also shift the stock transfer case into Low range for offroad driving and have an additional 2.4:1 reduction for ultimate offroad rockcrawling


That's crazy! This forum rocks. I can see the cooling definitely being an issue with the gearbox, that is a lot of energy transmission with a small surface area. 



Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I will package the LEAF battery under the hood. I will build a battery box to hold it. There is ample room for all 24kwh and then some. I think a welded steel frame with aluminum panels riveted and sealant to keep it watertight. I will then focus on refining the rest of the vehicle. After awhile I want to add more and more LEAF batteries in the places you mentioned and other places too but that will be pretty complicated and hard to do.


I didn't know if you'd have crack the leaf battery module case or if it could be dropped in as is with custom bracketing. 

The big limitations I've seen with distributed batteries is charging cable looms and discharge cable resistance. You'd have to have some beefy copper to keep those remote batteries from turning the discharge cables into cabin heaters lol.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

x78163 said:


> Regarding the total discharge prior to charging, I'm not sure. I know the chemistry is largely dependent on ideal DoD for battery longevity. I do remember the ye olde NiCad batteries where memory was an issue. I think one of the larger safety issues is selecting a chemistry and design that doesn't make me an arsonist.


Yes, that's all valid (and hilarious ) I meant to discharge the auxiliary pack to the normal service limit (which might be as high as 20% of nominal capacity), to make hauling it in for charging worthwhile. Of course, this is a small pack so when running on it in a one-pack-at-a-time scheme allowable discharge power would lower than with the larger main pack.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> The driveshaft will input into a Blackbox-C "doubler" that I will run in Low range 100% of the time (2.7:1 reduction, ~75mph top speed).


What is the input shaft speed limit for the BlackBox gearbox? It is designed to take the output of a transmission, which will never be more than the speed of the engine... which is typically much lower than the maximum speed of the Leaf motor. Is the ~75 mph top speed based on the J80's tire size (275/70R16, 665 rev/mile) and axle gearing (4.10:1), multiplication by the 2.7:1 reduction ratio, and the allowed input speed?
75 mph * 665 rev/mile / 60 min/hr * 4.10 * 2.7 = 9200 RPM​That's workable for the Leaf motor, but sounds high for the gearbox.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

@x78163 yes I have opened the leaf battery. There's no real way to install it as-is, but luckily the stock wiring has a lot of slack and I can probably maintain most of it. Also the low current wires can be extended with no penalty. I am thinking about trying to run a water cooling loop through the cells, not only for cooling the pack but to use the coolant for cabin heat.










@brian_ it has no rating for input rpm. I asked the manufacturer and gave them my idea and they strongly recommended against it and gave no guarantees. So what. I didn't expect them to either. Nothing ventured nothing gained. Like I have said many times the top speed is theoretical only and I plan to drive most of the time 40mph or less. If it fails I know what needs upgraded. If it fails that means I drove a homebuilt EV of my own creation. Progress either way. I will monitor gearbox temperature and hey it may even be another good source of cabin heat. It may not be a long-term solution but it will give me a starting point and LC parts are easy to re-sell. 

I got the engine bay all cleaned up time to start de-ICEing the rest.





































Huge amount of space for all the hardware:


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## Curtis_RVA (Jun 3, 2021)

One of my favorite parts of these conversion threads is the bay cleanup. Are you going to do an undercoating or anything while you're in there?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

No, rust isn't a huge concern in my area on top of that it has plenty of oil and grease left to protect it


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


>


That's a nice view of the offset axles and resulting wide fuel tank that I mentioned as a possible battery pack location... although the taper in the width between the frame rails would make module packaging more difficult.

The whole set of images are a nice tour of the Land Cruiser J80 chassis.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I am thinking about trying to run a water cooling loop through the cells, not only for cooling the pack but to use the coolant for cabin heat.


That would be a challenge, because Nissan did not design the modules for heat transfer. 

The OEM battery heaters (optional in some markets) are plates which sit against the sides of the module (corresponding to one cell edge); that's normal for pouch cell stacks, but there is little provision in the Leaf modules for heat transfer to that surface.

The alternative method for pouch cells is to place cooling plates between every pair of cells, as in the LG Chem modules of the Chevrolet Volt; however, there is no reasonable access between the cells of Leaf modules.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

De-ICEing complete:



















Old vs. new. The difference is staggering:






























brian_ said:


> That would be a challenge, because Nissan did not design the modules for heat transfer.


Well crap! I guess I'll just pack it up and give up 

Seriously, no kidding it's going to be a challenge. Thanks for stating the obvious again


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## x78163 (Jun 13, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> @x78163 yes I have opened the leaf battery. There's no real way to install it as-is, but luckily the stock wiring has a lot of slack and I can probably maintain most of it. Also the low current wires can be extended with no penalty. I am thinking about trying to run a water cooling loop through the cells, not only for cooling the pack but to use the coolant for cabin heat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Fantastic idea about using waste heat to augment cabin heat. I see what you mean with the 'flexibility' of moving the modules into different configurations with the wiring harnesses already in place. I can't believe how much space there is once you de-ice. I'm really interested to see the leaf motor's performance in your setup, especially since you get so much space back from removing the stock transmission from the vehicle.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Some updates to my project. While I was waiting on some parts I rebuilt the front axle which was in dire need of it. Was a huge disgusting mess but now it has all new seals and one new Birfield joint and new brakes.




























I got in my BlackBox "doubler" and got to work installed it on my t-case. The stock input shaft needs to be removed and replaced with the BB input shaft.










This thing is burly. Much more stout than I expected. Also after doing more reading about this product this is about the 3rd generation with a bunch of improvements over the earlier versions so I think it's going to be perfect for my project. I will be using the factory transmission cooler, a thermoswitch, and an electric pump to keep it cool.














































Now that I have the BB I can start building my t-case mounts. In the OEM configuration the transfer case was only bolted to the transmission itself so all of the torque goes through the interface the BB uses. I plan to build a circular mount that will bolt onto the BlackBox face and also the stock crossmember trans mount. I will also build a rear custom crossmember to further take the load.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

My hair-brained plan is starting to come together! I got pretty far on my t-case mount now. I used a big hunk of 90 degree steel extrusion from the scrap yard and welded a bit extra on top to make up the full circle. I tried my best to keep it from warping but it did a little bit, nothing that's going to cause issues though.































My buddy loaned me his plasma cutter to rough it in.





















Welders rule.
































Now I'm at a point where I can test fit it into the chassis and make sure everything fits right then do the final welding. I also will build a rear t-case brace after that. Then on to the motor!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Got some more done on the t-case mount. I think as long as it test-fits ok then I am happy with it. I may add some skid plates on to it later. As it is it's fricken super heavy and I cannot install it myself anymore that's for sure.

First I cut off the factory rubber damper, cleaned up the bracket, and drilled a couple holes so a OEM 1FZ motor mount can bolt on.



















I found some box section and some 1" tubing and started placing them. 










Tacked them into place for now. Will box everything in once I know it fits right. And paint of course.





























Now it will support the t-case without the mounts sagging. The t-case is rubber isolated and bolt-on.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

Great progress and I love your donor. Just a note of caution, will this additional mount be bolted to the chassis or just based on your outrigger layout you have there? It must be the former to handle the drive torque you will put through it.

Sent from my M2102J20SG using Tapatalk


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

All of the torque will be taken by the circular face of the BlackBox. That's where the T-case mounts to the transmission normally so that's how it's designed. The outrigger is just to support the weight since the motor and trans aren't on the front and it tends to tip rearwards. I may or may not attach it to the chassis. Been warned about doing that since any chassis flex from offroading will be transmitted into the t-case and that could be very bad for it.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

T-case mount works as in it fits, but it doesn't work. It's way too wobbly. I think I will change up the mounts so that they are at opposing angles so that there's no "jello table" type effect. Secondly, I will add a 3rd mount to the rear output shaft area. I will also buy new mounts as these are really, really flexible probably because they have 324k miles and were coated in oil and grease.




















The motor itself should fit under the cowl in the trans tunnel like I originally envisioned! Just need a short driveshaft to couple the motor and t-case. The battery pack will be under the hood in a removable waterproof box that I can lift out with an engine hoist for changes, upgrades, fixes, etc.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Been jamming on the LC thought I should post an update.

I cut off one of the cast mounting points that I don't need so the motor can stuff under the cowl.



















Test fit and taking measurements for the motor mounts.

I have between 6 and 10 inches of space between the t-case and motor shafts to play with depending where exactly I mount the motor. Driveshaft shop doesn't think it'll be an issue they are working on the driveshaft now.










Working on a rubber isolated mount and steel crossmember for the motor. Waiting for driveshaft to mount it in final location.










Test fitting PDM and Inverter:










They feel happiest here.



















Beefy mounts to hold the heavy PDM during offroad driving.

Smaller mounts but still sturdy for lighter Inverter:










Used engine hoist to hold PDM during fab for easy in and out over and over.





































Mounted the charge ports behind the front grill. Want to make a door or hinge action to access them.



















Beefy mounts for Chademo. Chademo plugs and cables are big and heavy.



















Made sure "up" was up 










Started on wiring now. First organized the Resolve-EV wires into bundles. It is very well thought out and should be a joy to wire in.

I have an aftermarket center console I figure it's a good spot to mount the Resolve-EV controller and keep it safe but easily removable for updates. The manual states it should be as close as possible to the D, N, and R buttons and to the OLED screen so I figure this is a good spot.




























I want to make sure everything I can get done is done before the driveshaft is ready!


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Curtis_RVA said:


> One of my favorite parts of these conversion threads is the bay cleanup. Are you going to do an undercoating or anything while you're in there?


hmmm another masochist, were we separated at birth? lol


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> De-ICEing complete:


ha ha I luv that


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

gregski said:


> hmmm another masochist, were we separated at birth? lol


Hahaha maybe

In the shop again tonight.


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


>


Is the PDM going to sit polywhompus like that or is that just a weird picture?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Yup it's going to sit all goofy like that, it's just how it felt most comfortable in there


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

The low voltage wiring is just about done! Only have brake and reverse light relays and D, N, and R switches left to wire in. I decided to move the Resolve-EV VCU to behind the glovebox where the stock ECU is mounted because it will be cleaner and shorter wiring. I was able to slightly modify the ECU brackets to hold the VCU, nice!



















Ran wiring through the factory engine harness grommet.










Left the stock diagnosis box for resetting airbags etc.










Throttle harness, OLED, harness, and OBD harness and grounds all ready to hook up.










Used a small fuse/relay box to power my EV circuits (https://amzn.to/3nRI39B)

It powers the Inverter relay/BMS, Resolve-EV 12v, and my accessory pumps; vacuum pump, power steering, and transfer-case cooler. I have two free relays for big lights or something like that.










Tested the chassis 12v system again and all is working. 12v system is now DONE! All low voltage wiring under the hood is DONE!


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## CruiserFan (Sep 21, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Love seeing this process take place on an FJ80 - doing a great job!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

loving all the detailed pics, you are doing a great job, and moving fast, and I/we know it takes time to stop what you are doing and bust out the Polaroid constantly, ha ha


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

CruiserFan said:


>


hey, mate did you solder those connections and that's just red heat shrink or did you use those hard plastic butt connectors, if the ladder prepare to have one come undone at the least opportune time, think a high speed chase whilst running moon shine


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks guys! I have a personal goal to get it running before the end of the year so I've been putting in long hours lately. Haha yes I soldered all the small gauge connections and that is adhesive lined heat shrink tubing.


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Thanks guy! I have a personal goal to get it running before the end of the year so I've been putting in long hours lately. Haha yes I soldered all the small gauge connections and that is adhesive lined heat shrink tubing.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Some updates. Firstly I have started my new YouTube series on the Electric Land Cruiser, check it out! If you have been following my thread then this will be old news but of course it will catch up. Also on my channel you can watch my 1982 Unique Mobility Electrek EV Restoration project.






@Rockcrawler posted about getting a Volvo PS pump, so I did! $50 from the U-Pull. I also got a vacuum pump from a Camaro ZL-1, nice! Lastly, a 12v hydraulic fluid pump for the t-case cooler completes the trifecta. Under $200 for all 3.










My wife pulled apart the LEAF seats and salvaged the heating elements from them. Hell yeah these are nice. Saved the switches also. 

Heating elements from both front seats plus the rear bench!


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> My wife pulled apart the LEAF seats and salvaged the heating elements from them. Hell yeah these are nice. Saved the switches also.


Why you lucky Bas..... does she have a sister? [asking for a friend]


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Some updates. Firstly I have started my new YouTube series on the Electric Land Cruiser, check it out! If you have been following my thread then this will be old news but of course it will catch up. Also on my channel you can watch my 1982 Unique Mobility Electrek EV Restoration project.


Bruh, are you kidding me, your Channel is the bomb, love the Electrek series, and love your Land Cruiser episode, keep it going !!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Haha thanks @gregski. No sisters sorry lol!

It's as easy as 1, 2, 3!

1:









2:









3:










Met the Car Wizard and got the gang to sign my shirt!











Eco-green E85 tow rig:


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Getting really close to testing the HV system and the motor!

Firstly I got my custom driveshaft and it's pretty much perfect. Really happy with it, he got it just how I imagined. Won't know until I know ie drive but another big step completed.











Now I could get the motor into position and finish up the mounts.






































Also made a rear mount on my t-case to support it better:











Rubber is just a spacer for the moment.




















I finalized the HV wiring. Used 0 gauge for the main DC and welding wire for the inveter-motor wiring. Got it all for free luckily!











I braided the inveter-motor wires to reduce EMI and improve efficiency:




















The 1/2" lugs fit really nicely into the Nissan bus bar slots.











3D printed a support for the long inveter bus bars and also to seal up the area (used silicone to seal).





























Used p-clamps to secure the wiring to the firewall.





























3D printed my switch panel for D, N, and R and also two openings for center diff-lock and brake signal disconnect from the Resolve-EV for left-foot braking.










And 3D printed a bezel for the Resolve-EV OLED display:


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

that's awesome, major progress!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Working on small things to get ready to do a EV system test and spin the motor and drivetrain. Got my diffs and t-cases full of oil.

I got my t-case levers installed with custom fab since the factory t-case lever was bolted to the automatic transmission. Luckily the Blackbox lever fits conveniently where the auto shift selector linkage went. Twin sticks!

Also installed my Lokka auto diff locker but it was messy so no photos.



















Both in Hi range











Both in Low range


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

It works!!! It really works!! Oh man what a day!

Teaser video:
















Now comes the hard part; fitting this under the hood...


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


>


Nice Job!

Talk to me Goose, is that a Nextion gauge? nope looks like Resolve-EV OLED display??


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Yep that's the Resolve-EV display. Not much to update been busy with other stuff since the last post. Hopefully will get back to it ASAP!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Battery install imminent. Got myself a 2017 30kwh battery in the form of another wrecked LEAF lol. Was holding out for the 30 as the old girl is going to need all the kwh she can get. 12/12 bars on the dash!


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Battery install imminent. Got myself a 2017 30kwh battery in the form of another wrecked LEAF lol. Was holding out for the 30 as the old girl is going to need all the kwh she can get. 12/12 bars on the dash!


Excellent score, going to learn from you how to treat that pack, I am thinking same one for my '71 GMC, just toss it in the bed and call it good, ha ha


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## EV-FAN (May 17, 2021)

Awesome Project! Super cool!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I have started on the last major challenge of my EV build; the battery. I now have myself a 12/12 bar 2017 30kwh pack which I believe is the largest one that works with the Resolve-EV controller. It is likely also the largest pack that will fit under the hood where I plan to mount it.

I took apart the battery and am methodically marking every balance tap and taking tons of photos so I can rebuild the pack in a new shape. I was really fearing this challenge but now that I am arms-deep in it I am feeling more confident.





























In the rear of the pack is a 24-module stack and along each side are 12-module stacks. I plan to make two 24-module stacks, and put one on top of the other in the engine bay. It should just fit, barely.

The stack is 34-35 inches long and I have 37ish inches to work with in the engine bay front-to-back.











I am marking every single balance tap so I can relocate them to their new positions without changing the order.


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## Bratitude (Jan 23, 2020)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> It works!!! It really works!! Oh man what a day!
> 
> Teaser video:



Awesome! very cool to see the drive line spinning up. Looks smooth! This is the first time I’ve heard/seen some one use the coupler + adapter plate assembly with a drive shaft. 

The leaf powers 4x4s are starting to come alive!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks, I spent a little more time getting the motor lined up and reducing vibrations. It's much smoother now:


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

This is coming together so nicely. Remember back to the first page of this thread I bought a 2013 LEAF. I dissembled the battery from that LEAF and am using it in my 1982 Electrek restoration, but I kept all of the other parts. The busbars and all wiring looks identical to that of my 30kwh pack. So that means I can use the busbar assembly and bracketry that I saved from my '13 pack to build two identical stacks of 24 modules from my '17 pack. After that I just need to adapt the BMS wiring. That saves me tons of labor drilling and cutting busbars and makes for a super clean, OEM setup. Thanks Nissan! I'm glad I saved all this stuff!

I took the left and right stacks and built them into a long 24 module stack. I will need to think more about how to secure these modules. There is a lot of mass here, maybe 150lbs or more, and it is really only supported by 4x M6 all-thread studs. The OEM stack has a different type of module for half which have studs built into their case which tie into more bracing within the pack. Since my new stack doesn't have these studs, and there's no way to add them, I will have to add bracing another way. I have a few ideas I'll see what makes most sense as I go. If it were a sports car I could be more relaxed, but since it is a 4x4 that will be thrown all around while rock crawling or whatever I need to really do this right.

I also want to maintain all of the original hardware from the battery pack. Well, it's not that I want to but I must. That's how the Resolve-EV controller works, with all OEM hardware in place. So I will keep the service disconnect, current sensor, both contactors, etc and somehow mount them in/on/to my battery box.

My new stack:









OEM rear stack:









If you look closely you'll notice the busbar assembly (orange plastic and copper) I installed upside-down from the original one. I flipped it so that my + and - on each end line up for shorter overall wiring. So easy!











Using my left over brackets to compress the modules. LEAF modules MUST be compressed during use or they will expand and destroy themselves! I measured the exposed thread on the OEM studs and tightened these until they matched.










The BMS wiring saved and labeled ready to transfer to the new pack. I will be extending/shortening the wires as necessary for a clean install.


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

That was a useful post.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I finished up the stack today and I'm super happy with the result. Really pleased with how it came together. I was dreading the battery reorganizing and BMS wiring the most for this project but so far it's been coming together like it was meant to.

I reinstalled all of the BMS wires slowly but surely one at a time triple checking my notes and labels and their place on the battery and at the end everything was in it's place and nothing was missing! Some wires I had to shorten some I had to lengthen. I also mounted up the temperature sensors as best as I could figure. The stock plastic covers went over with some trimming and it looks almost factory!

Next step is building a battery box.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Jeez this battery box is ridiculous. I may be over-building it by using 3/16" steel but damn it's going to be sturdy! It's a 36x20x15 inch box. The pictures basically tell the story:










































































It's going to fit!! The A/C has got to go. I could probably keep it with some slight mods but in the end it will just be easier and better for the EV side of things to ditch it. Oh well.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Jeez this battery box is ridiculous. I may be over-building it by using 3/16" steel but damn it's going to be sturdy! It's a 36x20x15 inch box. The pictures basically tell the story:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very nice placement of the battery. Can you use the Leaf electric AC rather? That gives you reverse cycle heating also! And all the leaf goodies are there already so seems a shame not to. Maybe use the smaller leaf radiator?

Loving your build!

cheers
Tyler


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

tylerwatts said:


> Very nice placement of the battery. Can you use the Leaf electric AC rather? That gives you reverse cycle heating also! And all the leaf goodies are there already so seems a shame not to. Maybe use the smaller leaf radiator?
> 
> Loving your build!
> 
> ...


Yes that was my plan however the AC lines that go through the firewall interfere with the placement of the battery box. And getting rid of the condenser made it easier to fit the front end of the battery box and also the radiator. AC was a little too ambitious anyway. Thank you!

The radiator I'm going to use is from a Geo Metro haha! All the LEAFs I bought had the front end smashed in and the rads totally destroyed. I was walking through the junkyard looking for a radiator thinking "I need like a Geo or something" and then boom around the next corner a 3-cylinder Metro with a half size rad!











The battery box is a huge amount of work. It's coming together though. I made the top bolt on/off so I can remove it to build it, paint it, and install the batteries themselves. Finished up the mounts, it uses 4x engine mounts from the Land Cruiser so it should be very secure.























































Currently I am welding in the mounting brackets to actually bolt the module stacks in place. Then hopefully it can go to the sand blaster next week so I can then paint it and INSTALL IT!


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

ELC, from what I can see looking at your photos from underneath the vehicle, I think you need to check the phasing of your driveshafts going to the front and rear axles.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> ELC, from what I can see looking at your photos from underneath the vehicle, I think you need to check the phasing of your driveshafts going to the front and rear axles.


Yes, absolutely...once I reinstall them for good  they are just installed for mock-up in those photos.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Yes that was my plan however the AC lines that go through the firewall interfere with the placement of the battery box. And getting rid of the condenser made it easier to fit the front end of the battery box and also the radiator. AC was a little too ambitious anyway. Thank you!
> 
> The radiator I'm going to use is from a Geo Metro haha! All the LEAFs I bought had the front end smashed in and the rads totally destroyed. I was walking through the junkyard looking for a radiator thinking "I need like a Geo or something" and then boom around the next corner a 3-cylinder Metro with a half size rad!
> 
> ...


Are you going to panel and insulate the box? At least panel it to keep dirt.off the batteries, some insulation in the cold is good also. I'd either bond some aluminium sheet / checker plate or aluminium composite panels in there. Does that interfere with the securing of the cells? Doesn't appear that the frame actually holds them, just frames around them right?

Forgive my for commenting a lot, really love your build and the idea of an LC conversion! Actually I'd love to do the same to an FJ, some day maybe.

cheers
Tyler


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

tylerwatts said:


> Are you going to panel and insulate the box? At least panel it to keep dirt.off the batteries, some insulation in the cold is good also. I'd either bond some aluminium sheet / checker plate or aluminium composite panels in there. Does that interfere with the securing of the cells? Doesn't appear that the frame actually holds them, just frames around them right?
> 
> Forgive my for commenting a lot, really love your build and the idea of an LC conversion! Actually I'd love to do the same to an FJ, some day maybe.
> 
> ...


Oh yes, I am going to put aluminum panels on the sides of the box. It needs to be 100% waterproof to cross rivers and splash through the mud and all that Land Cruiser type stuff! Also for driving in the rain or snow. My idea right now is to rivet aluminum panels with seam sealer in between to each side. I have some nice aluminum sheet I've already picked up.

I started working on the box that will hold the contactors and main plugs. I cut out the sheet metal from the LEAF battery box and grafted it on to my new box. Still a long way to go but you can see the plan at least. This will go on the passenger side of the battery box next to and behind the 12v battery.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Back in the '60s, designers and engineers realized that the engine/transmission unit pushing into the vehicle cabin from a frontal collision was something to be avoided. What some came up with was a reinforced and sloping firewall and transmission tunnel area as well as a breakaway system that directed the e/t to drop down and go under the cabin, in such a collision. I'm concerned your very stout battery box (which is good, to protect the battery) could also be dangerous to the occupants of your front seats in such a collision. The very strong and relatively sharp corners of the box are very close to the firewall/tunnel area. In the front, there is very little of an energy absorbing crush zone. In an frontal collision, particularly where the impact was above the front frame rails, in your case it looks like there is very little structure to keep the box from pushing into the front passenger area.

As far as what you could do would be to follow the lead of the '60s designers and engineers. Sloping reinforcing plates could be added to the firewall/ tunnel near the corners of the box to keep it from penetrating into the passenger area and also direct it down. Your extensive use of rubber mounts on the various parts in the way of a potentially displaced box are a good first step to incorporating breakaway features.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

@electro wrks I will give that some thought. Honestly, crash safety has been pretty far down on my list. The slow target speeds and low range reduce the change of a high speed frontal impact but of course anything can happen. I think you are right a couple angled plates would help push the box down and back instead of straight into the firewall. I will think about it some more!

Still working on the battery box! I welded in some brackets and studs to mount the battery stacks to. Also started on the aluminum side panels. Next time I think I will do cut-send-cut or something similar and design all this in CAD. Doing it the old fashioned way is so much effort!


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

If you don't know the trick already, aluminum cuts a lot easier with an abrasive disk if you occasionally rub parafin into the disk.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Finished out the contactor box and the final touches on the battery box and got them off to the sandblaster. Should get it back around noon tomorrow then I'm going to paint the inside and start installing the packs and everything for realsies.



















I cut the top open so I can actually get the contactor assembly inside and will rivet an aluminum plate on top.



















Lastly I found a spot for the service disconnect plug to live. This part also contains the main high voltage fuse.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Battery box back from sandblasting. Seam sealer applied on all of the welds plus I got all of the aluminum side panels cut and drilled for rivets. Painting it this weekend then installing the battery for real starting on Monday.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

While the box was at sandblasting I took the opportunity to install my suspension. I picked up a used set of Old Man Emu 2" lift springs and shocks. Fit the budget and they should perform well. It sits really high I need to add some steel bumpers now


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Interior paint on.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Why didn't you powder coat it?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> Why didn't you powder coat it?


Budget and time.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Started final assembly of the battery yesterday. Hoping to finish today.


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## niklaskinn (Nov 27, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Started final assembly of the battery yesterday. Hoping to finish today.


Nice work. 
I follow you build closely, as I’m a few months behind you in my build. 
What size is your box?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

niklaskinn said:


> Nice work.
> I follow you build closely, as I’m a few months behind you in my build.
> What size is your box?


Thanks! The box is 36x20x16 inches externally.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Spent all day today and got one panel done haha. Going slow because it was the most important panel. Got all my wiring complete and 366v measured at the contactors! The BMS must be wired correctly because it is plugged in but it's not smoking! A good sign!











The contactor box bolts on to the aluminum side panel.












Panel on, riveted, bolted and sealed up:




























WE'VE GOT VOLTAGE!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

All panels on! Sealant smeared on all the joints real good! Going to let it cure and then it's time for PAINT! So close!!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

First coat of paint on. And since everyone wants to know, it weighs 600lbs. Oof. That's about 100lbs heavier than I anticipated. Still lighter than a 1FZ!


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

wow you are kicking @ss !!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

It runs!!!! It rruuunnnnsss!!! We just took it in a joy ride around the block! 45mph was easy. It is definitely not slow! IT WORKS!!!!!!


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## niklaskinn (Nov 27, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> It runs!!!! It rruuunnnnsss!!! We just took it in a joy ride around the block! 45mph was easy. It is definitely not slow! IT WORKS!!!!!!


I love that you say it is not slow 💪🏼
it get me to thinking my super little truck will be very fast


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

First drive video below. Be sure to subscribe to my channel to see the full build and everything coming next! www.youtube.com/c/UniqueMobility


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## asymptonic (Oct 14, 2021)

What's the gearing/transmission setup on this?


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

asymptonic said:


> What's the gearing/transmission setup on this?


It's all in this thread. It uses a single-speed planetary reduction box between the motor and the transfer case.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

brian_ said:


> It's all in this thread. It uses a single-speed planetary reduction box between the motor and the transfer case.


It would be good for those of us considering using this Leaf set-up to have a recap of the gearing, ratios, tire diameters, etc. used by ELC.

Also, ELC, I keep wondering about the short drive shaft set-up between the motor and the Black Box-c/transfer case. At ~10,000-12,000RPM( the max RPM of the Leaf motors), this kind of set-up may not be practical. Keeping it running smoothly, without excess vibrations, could be a problem. Think a small amount of dirt or grease in the wrong place. At ~twice the rpm of a typical ICE set-up, again, this could be a real problem. Also, is the DS fixed on one end, or full floating between the splined shafts? I could be wrong, but I believe one end of this kind of DS has to have one end in a fixed(non sliding) position to work properly, without some vibration issues.

Could you eliminate the DS entirely? The motor could be mounted directly to the BB reduction unit with an adapter plate. The splines in the new BB input shaft could be machined out to a convenient diameter to fit the outside diameter of a turned down splined motor coupling. The input shaft could be shortened to a more convenient length at the same time. A good press fit along with a small, carefully done end weld would lock the parts in place.

A motor plate would fit nicely between the parallel machined faces of the BB and motor with no extra bearing needed. The adapter plate could index off of the machined stepped end cover of the BB on one side. Lining up the motor on the other side of the plate is a little more difficult. It probably could be lined up by hand centering it. Something that is very difficult to do with the floppy input shafts of typical RWD transmissions. Once centered, without excess side loads on shafts and bearings, dowel pin holes could be drilled and reamed to fix the position. Another benefit of this type of adapter is that it could be put together with gaskets and/or sealing compound to keep oil in; and dirt and water out.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

<deleted>


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> It would be good for those of us considering using this Leaf set-up to have a recap of the gearing, ratios, tire diameters, etc. used by ELC.
> 
> Also, ELC, I keep wondering about the short drive shaft set-up between the motor and the Black Box-c/transfer case. At ~10,000-12,000RPM( the max RPM of the Leaf motors), this kind of set-up may not be practical. Keeping it running smoothly, without excess vibrations, could be a problem. Think a small amount of dirt or grease in the wrong place. At ~twice the rpm of a typical ICE set-up, again, this could be a real problem. Also, is the DS fixed on one end, or full floating between the splined shafts? I could be wrong, but I believe one end of this kind of DS has to have one end in a fixed(non sliding) position to work properly, without some vibration issues.
> 
> ...


Possibly I will need to do what you describe. The driveshaft builder thought this would work well for me. It is floating on both sides but only has 1/4" of travel back and forth and both sides are filled with grease which damps it's movement. My goals are slow speeds crawling on trails and driving around town. It would be nice to get up to highway speeds but not necessary. It's a living project that will change over time.

The driveshaft is built with V8 truck transmission parts which approach or pass 10,000rpm in overdrive in some cases. 

Right now I'm focusing on getting the rest of the auxiliary systems going like for instance a radiator and coolant lol. Really was rushing to get it done by the end of the year because I'm moving out of my shop space and it would be really nice to not have a 2 ton paper weight so mission accomplished on that front!


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## jawmes8 (Dec 22, 2021)

Thank you for this incredible thread and documentation! Joined the forum because of it. I had a few additional questions, hope I didn't miss it in the thread.

What pedal assembly did you go with for the Resolve-EV controller? 

Do you have any plans to make the fuel gauge measure the battery levels? Or is that done through the OLED?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks @jawmes8 ! I used a VW throttle pedal as described in the manual. I forget the exact model that mine came from I think it was a Tiguan. I would like to get the fuel gauge and tach, speedometer, temperature and other gauges working eventually. Mostly for the novelty factor but I think speedo and tach are definitely the priority. It would be cool to make the oil pressure gauge an ammeter or something like that too. Currently none of the gauges work except for the 12v battery voltage gauge which works perfectly.


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## niklaskinn (Nov 27, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Thanks @jawmes8 ! I used a VW throttle pedal as described in the manual. I forget the exact model that mine came from I think it was a Tiguan. I would like to get the fuel gauge and tach, speedometer, temperature and other gauges working eventually. Mostly for the novelty factor but I think speedo and tach are definitely the priority. It would be cool to make the oil pressure gauge an ammeter or something like that too. Currently none of the gauges work except for the 12v battery voltage gauge which works perfectly.


Hi have you see the speedhut GPS speedometer gauges.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

niklaskinn said:


> Hi have you see the speedhut GPS speedometer gauges.


Oh yeah definitely. I can just use my phone too. The gauge would be nice to have actual wheelspeed which is good information to have off-road or on snow and ice. I have the speed sensor so I could make it work like stock. The wiring harness ran through the engine harness so it just needs some wiring love.


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## niklaskinn (Nov 27, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Oh yeah definitely. I can just use my phone too. The gauge would be nice to have actual wheelspeed which is good information to have off-road or on snow and ice. I have the speed sensor so I could make it work like stock. The wiring harness ran through the engine harness so it just needs some wiring love.


Then you can make it works with the original speedo


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Episode 3 of The Electric Land Cruiser. Check it out!


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## jawmes8 (Dec 22, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Thanks @jawmes8 ! I used a VW throttle pedal as described in the manual. I forget the exact model that mine came from I think it was a Tiguan. I would like to get the fuel gauge and tach, speedometer, temperature and other gauges working eventually. Mostly for the novelty factor but I think speedo and tach are definitely the priority. It would be cool to make the oil pressure gauge an ammeter or something like that too. Currently none of the gauges work except for the 12v battery voltage gauge which works perfectly.


Nice, subscribed to your YouTube channel so looking forward to updates


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I won't have much to update for a little while as I'm moving out of my shop and doing Christmas and New Years etc but I don't think I posted these photos of the battery box so I thought I'd post them. I thought the stencil was cool  Will do a custom stencil with the battery capacity on top I think.






































And my buddy Josh did a great job cutting out a slot for the Blackbox shifter:


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## mons2b (Nov 17, 2015)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> The low voltage wiring is just about done! Only have brake and reverse light relays and D, N, and R switches left to wire in. I decided to move the Resolve-EV VCU to behind the glovebox where the stock ECU is mounted because it will be cleaner and shorter wiring. I was able to slightly modify the ECU brackets to hold the VCU, nice!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You need about 50 to 80amp fuse for the power steering. That box may Chernobyl when you go full lock.


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## mons2b (Nov 17, 2015)

.


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## mons2b (Nov 17, 2015)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Spent all day today and got one panel done haha. Going slow because it was the most important panel. Got all my wiring complete and 366v measured at the contactors! The BMS must be wired correctly because it is plugged in but it's not smoking! A good sign!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Where did you get your gloves? How much did they cost?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

mons2b said:


> You need about 50 to 80amp fuse for the power steering. That box may Chernobyl when you go full lock.


I got this resettable 80amp circuit breaker for the PS pump: Amazon.com

I got the gloves from an electrician supply company I forget which. They were about $200 for a pair!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

With a little trimming the hood fits!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

asymptonic said:


> What's the gearing/transmission setup on this?


Sorry meant to answer this before. It has the stock FZJ80 transfer case and a Blackbox "doubler." The transfer case has 1:1 high range and 2.4:1 low range. The Blackbox also has a 1:1 high range and 2.7:1 low range. It looks like I will have to do most onroad driving with the Blackbox in low range. The diffs are 4.10s. I plan on having 35" tires eventually, have 33s now.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I was able to drive my electric land cruiser onto my trailer which was a big goal of mine so I could move at the end of this year. Mission Accomplished!

Driving up the ramps onto the deck I found out that the electric drivetrain in it's current form is going to pose some problems off-road.

Firstly, I had to use quite a bit of pedal to get going up the ramps from a stop. Once there was some forward motion then there was plenty of power but the initial go was underwhelming.

Secondly, the Resolve-EV controller does not allow any throttle input when the brake is pressed. This is a safety feature to prevent a runaway vehicle, but on the angle of my trailer it was causing problems. I was inching up the trailer ramps slowly like normal but as the vehicle comes to a stop the regen braking disappears and there is nothing to stop the truck from just rolling backwards. The only way I could get going was to hold my parking brake (which doesn't work well) and then just get on the throttle as fast as possible after releasing the brake pedal. This is definitely no good for off-road driving, it could even be dangerous.

I was in high-low (high range t-case, low range Blackbox) so I still have additional gear reduction to use but this was a good experiment.

I'm going to ask Isak as Resolve-EV to see if there is a software update that could address this. Also I could make a simple switch that would disconnect the brake input from the Resolve-EV. It really is only needed to switch from Neutral to Drive or Reverse so I don't foresee a problem with a switch like that.

Also the Resolve-EV controller allows one-pedal driving so it does not creep forward from a stop like the LEAF. It's personal preference and for an onroad vehicle I think I would prefer it, but for off-road driving I definitely want that creep back. I also prefer automatic transmissions to manual transmissions when off-road for the same reason even though I much prefer manual onroad.

Some minor teething issues I'll figure out one way or the other.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Yeah - the Tesla was annoying AF in the same way to get it onto the trailer. It doesn't allow simultaneous brake pedal and accelerator, either and the creep doesn't have enough torque for creeping up the trailer ramp. It supposedly has a hill hold, but at the time, I was loading the trailer and not surfing the web.

In your case, you could easily defeat this with a NC pushbutton that you need to hold down for the defeat...seems like that might be the way to do it vs a toggle switch.


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## matthew.stead (Jun 8, 2020)

Great milestone @Electric Land Cruiser 

With my Resolve Controller I wired the "brake" to a push button (only for gear changes). I hence don't think I will get regen. It works well as I just press two buttons simultaneously to change gear. It is my responsibility to make sure I don't change gears when the car is moving!!


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## mons2b (Nov 17, 2015)

Very well done so far. You are a inspiration to keep working on our project’s that’s for sure


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Happy New Year! We celebrated the snow day with a drive around the neighborhood in our Electric Land Cruiser!


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

I've been doing some deep diving into the use of a planetary type gear reduction for use with the Leaf motor. This after market gear reduction supplier has a definite warning about the upper RPM limit of its planetary unit:








Teraflex LOW 231 HD Transfer Case for 88-06 Jeep Wrangler YJ, TJ & Unlimited with 4.0L and Manual Transmission


The Tera Low231 conversion kit is the solution for providing Wranglers, Cherokees, and Comanches with low crawl ratios. This kit provides rock-crawling performance without affecting high range gears for daily drivers, or the trip to and from the back country. It provides a true 4.




www.quadratec.com




Do the Blackbox people have a similar warning? I think the problem is that the small planetary gears turn at such a high RPM, relative to the other components, that problems can come up with the bearings supporting the gears. This makes the bearings the weakest link in the power train. Similar problems show up in helicopter gear boxes with planetary gear drives:








A study on helicopter main gearbox planetary bearing fault diagnosis


The condition monitoring of helicopter main gearbox (MGB) is crucial for operation safety, flight airworthiness and maintenance scheduling. Currently,…




www.sciencedirect.com




It may not be a problem in your case, with intermittent use. That may not be the case for those of us wanting to use the Leaf motor with a planetary gear reducer for long periods of highway speed, on road use.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

electro wrks said:


> I've been doing some deep diving into the use of a planetary type gear reduction for use with the Leaf motor. This after market gear reduction supplier has a definite warning about the upper RPM limit of its planetary unit:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I agree that the gears themselves are not a problem if machined and treated for the intended speed; bearings and seals are more likely issues.

Torque Trends makes the ev-TorqueBox fixed-ratio planetary reducer for EV applications and the same unit with different options for other applications. On their product page there is a video about the internal construction, in which they say starting around 2:02 that the input ball-type bearing has ceramic rolling elements for the EV version, but steel for the other versions, so that the EV version can handle higher input speed; construction is apparently otherwise the same for all applications, because the gears, seals, and other bearings can handle the speeds they see in EV use with motors up to 13,000 RPM.

(By the way, if anyone watches the video or looks at the internal parts and wonders why there's no ring gear if it is a planetary gear set, it is a compound planetary system of the type with two sets of planets meshed with each other, and the output set react against a stationary sun gear instead of a stationary ring gear. The output is taken from the planet carrier.)


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I watched the video. You need to locate that vibration's source....tying it down does not get rid of the source, merely the annoyance. Given its magnitude, something's going to fail over time, IMO...


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

electro wrks said:


> I've been doing some deep diving into the use of a planetary type gear reduction for use with the Leaf motor. This after market gear reduction supplier has a definite warning about the upper RPM limit of its planetary unit:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Jet turbines use planetaries, so it's not tye planetaries, it's the design. Bearings, seals tolerances, pumps, lubricants, etc all factor. So, yes, there's a design speed and a rock crawler reducer may not be a smart choice to drop RPM in half from 12 grand.

Most of the reducer planetaries out there that I've seen use planetary sets from the GM Powerglide transmission.


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> First drive video below. Be sure to subscribe to my channel to see the full build and everything coming next! www.youtube.com/c/UniqueMobility


call me crazy mate but this video does not come up under your videos or when we search your channel, yes we can watch it using this link, but I am afraid regular YouTubers will never find it, so just letting you know


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

remy_martian said:


> I watched the video. You need to locate that vibration's source....tying it down does not get rid of the source, merely the annoyance. Given its magnitude, something's going to fail over time, IMO...


As I wrote in a previous post, I believe one end of the short drive shaft needs to be fixed for the set-up to work properly. Maybe you could drill and tap one of the splined sleeves for a set screw to do this. You probably want to drill a small dimple in the shaft for the set screw, so the splines are not mushed down and make it difficult to remove.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I believe the Blackbox reducer that I have uses the planetary from a GM tranny, if not the Powerglide then something similar. I have been through this a couple times in the thread but it will be actively cooled and the truck will not go to the full 10,000 RPM. Starting small and working my way up.

@electro wrks I think I will take your advice and pin one side of the shaft.

I have not done any work on the truck since the first day I got it moving. The vibration is primarily because the motor and t-case are not tied together and move independently. The motor is also twisting sideways. I have some ideas on how to tie the two pieces together with steel and also stop the motor from twisting. That's the first thing I'm going to work on once I get back at it.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> The vibration is primarily because the motor and t-case are not tied together and move independently. The motor is also twisting sideways. I have some ideas on how to tie the two pieces together with steel and also stop the motor from twisting. That's the first thing I'm going to work on once I get back at it.


Just an option to consider, but you could ditch the jointed shaft and connect the motor and Blackbox with a rigid housing. If the motor can't move all the way back to the Blackbox face due to tunnel space restrictions, a shaft and extended "torque tube" (a tube or box with mounting flanges on each end) would work. The torque tube takes all of the reaction torque, as well as keeping the components aligned and not moving axially relative to each other. Some sort of compliant coupling (a giubo or jaw and spider setup) in the shaft is probably advisable to forgive slight fabrication errors and thermal changes.

For examples, a torque tube is found between a front-mounted engine and rear-mounted transaxle, in vehicles such as the Porsche 924 and 928, Alfa Romeo Alfetta (_Tipo 116)_, and C5 through C7 Corvette; there are many others, but those are probably the best-known.


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## mons2b (Nov 17, 2015)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Happy New Year! We celebrated the snow day with a drive around the neighborhood in our Electric Land Cruiser!


It was cute your partner telling you off


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

It's kinda a balance on what we guys do under their influence 😂


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## VintageVolts (Jul 7, 2020)

This is a great writeup, thanks for taking the time to show us everything. It's similar to what i want to do with my old land rover, i.e. directly couple a motor to the transfer box


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## 2drx4 (Jan 3, 2022)

electro wrks said:


> I've been doing some deep diving into the use of a planetary type gear reduction for use with the Leaf motor. This after market gear reduction supplier has a definite warning about the upper RPM limit of its planetary unit:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The Blackbox does not have those limitations. The Teralow 4:1 transfer case kit is a very bad design and is nothing but problems for everyone that uses them, they've been around for years but hopefully will go the way of the dodo with JK and JL 4:1 transfer cases being so available. JK/JL ones do not have any practical speed limitations as they are OEM parts that are actually designed correctly. The Blackbox uses NP/NV 241 style planetaries, and again as these are actual OEM parts sourced from an OEM transfer case, there is no speed limitations on them. I use one (technically it's an Ecobox because I'm cheap, but it is the same thing) in my Cherokee as the primary reduction and will run up to a 3000-4000 input RPM with it without issues.



Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I believe the Blackbox reducer that I have uses the planetary from a GM tranny, if not the Powerglide then something similar. I have been through this a couple times in the thread but it will be actively cooled and the truck will not go to the full 10,000 RPM. Starting small and working my way up.
> 
> @electro wrks I think I will take your advice and pin one side of the shaft.
> 
> I have not done any work on the truck since the first day I got it moving. The vibration is primarily because the motor and t-case are not tied together and move independently. The motor is also twisting sideways. I have some ideas on how to tie the two pieces together with steel and also stop the motor from twisting. That's the first thing I'm going to work on once I get back at it.


The other poster that suggested you attach them together with a torque tube is correct, or at least I think thats the best option. If the motor and gearbox are twisting relative to each other then the ujoint angles will never work to cancel the velocity change they cause. You may be able to get it acceptable by mounting everything so there is considerably less movement, and making sure the angles are all equal and opposite to each other. The other option is to use a double cardan joint on one or both ends, but this will likely cause its own issues due to the length of these joints, however they do not cause the velocity change issues seen in a regular single joint. A CV shaft also might work well, but again the length issues are probably going to make it impractical. The reality is it would be best to just take the angular change out of the equation by joining both ends.

Really interesting build though, so I hope you get it sorted.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

2drx4 said:


> The Blackbox uses NP/NV 241 style planetaries, and again as these are actual OEM parts sourced from an OEM transfer case, there is no speed limitations on them. I use one (technically it's an Ecobox because I'm cheap, but it is the same thing) in my Cherokee as the primary reduction and will run up to a 3000-4000 input RPM with it without issues.


The issue is that 3,000 to 4,000 RPM is below the mid-point of the speed range for the electric motor being used; being restricted to that speed in an EV with only the Blackbox and transfer case to shift (no conventional transmission) would limit performance, and that speed is too low for optimal motor efficiency other than at the lowest power level.


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## 2drx4 (Jan 3, 2022)

brian_ said:


> The issue is that 3,000 to 4,000 RPM is below the mid-point of the speed range for the electric motor being used; being restricted to that speed in an EV with only the Blackbox and transfer case to shift (no conventional transmission) would limit performance, and that speed is too low for optimal motor efficiency other than at the lowest power level.


It can definitely handle 5000-6000rpm without issues in the short term. I don't know about long term/continuous usage. Guys were using these reduction boxes in U4 and other extremely punishing racing, and they would definitely throw that type of input speed at them over and over, but in off road racing you accept your entire drivetrain is effectively on borrowed time. I would be concerned about oil foaming and heat buildup if you did it continuously, but that would be something to evaluate as needed. Foaming can be combated with different oils (those planetaries are meant to be living in ATF, NWF calls for gear oil because it's a safer option for the shock loading and lower speed environment they envision it living in). If heat management is necessary it is entirely possible to add an external oil pump and cooler to it, and I believe some of the people racing with them were/are doing it, it certainly is a common mod to transfer cases while racing.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

2drx4 said:


> It can definitely handle 5000-6000rpm without issues in the short term.


Good, but a unit which is really suitable for a Leaf motor would handle 10,000 RPM short term, and perhaps 7,000 RPM continuously. A Nissan Leaf on a highway runs over 6,000 RPM at moderate highway speed (~100 km/h, ~60 MPH) with its stock gearing. The same power is available all the way down to 3,000 RPM, but gearing for lower speed on the highway means less torque (due to less multiplication of the motor's limited torque) at low speed.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks for the info @2drx4, that is good to know. I am well outside the design of the Blackbox but I'm also hopeful that it will work for me. I had a fixed reduction gearbox quoted that would bolt onto my motor and also onto the transfer case and it was over $10k for a single unit so for now this is the solution.

@brian_ my current idea is to use four pieces of angle steel like I used to build my battery box and weld them in between the mounting plate for the motor and BB in an X pattern around my existing driveshaft. It would be like a poor-man's torque-tube.

My gearing is 2.7:1 BB into 4.1:1 diffs with 33" tires. At 6000 RPM, the wheelspeed is 53 MPH. 56 MPH with my planned 35" tires. In double-low range (2.4:1 + 2.7:1) at 6000 RPM the wheelspeed is 23 MPH so I'll probably end up using more RPM while offroading than on the highways. I'll probably also only shift to double-low range for the most challenging of obstacles and drive most of the trails in low-high.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Running a gearbox up to 6500 RPM in offroad competition is very different than running it continuously at 6500 RPM. 

As far as "no speed limit", sounds like either a hack in a basement makes them or you didn't get the spec from the person who designed the box.

Stuff always breaks at the most expensive place, or inconvenient time, to load it on a flatbed. Realize most, if not all, tow companies will not tow an electric with any axles rolling. At a competition, you laugh it off and trailer it home. On the shoulder of an Interstate highway, it can get you or the tow driver killed.

Road vehicles need reliability. Your wallet needs it done once, correctly.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> Running a gearbox up to 6500 RPM in offroad competition is very different than running it continuously at 6500 RPM.
> 
> As far as "no speed limit", sounds like either a hack in a basement makes them or you didn't get the spec from the person who designed the box.
> 
> ...


Ok @remy_martian your ignorance is on full display here. I appreciate _some_ of your input, but sometimes you are just so off...

The type racing he is talking about is Ultra4, the highest level of King of the Hammers which is a 165 mile race through the toughest terrain like vertical rock walls and huge mud pits and top speeds of over 100 MPH through the desert that takes places over the course of 14 hours.

My truck defined by its 30Kwh battery will only be able to go 30-40 minutes on the highway before the battery runs out...maybe.

Lastly, my use case is for an off-road trail truck that I will tow to the trailhead on a trailer. I certainly won't be _on the interstate highway!_  I am prepared for break-downs, in fact I expect them. I am going to build a tow bar on the front of my Land Cruiser so that it can be retrieved from the middle of nowhere and luckily my tow vehicle is also a Land Cruiser that can also get to the middle of nowhere and back.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

In reality, my goal for top speed is 50-55 MPH so that I can go through the town of Moab without getting rear-ended by semis and the like. I think that's totally reasonable and doable.


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## 2drx4 (Jan 3, 2022)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> In reality, my goal for top speed is 50-55 MPH so that I can go through the town of Moab without getting rear-ended by semis and the like. I think that's totally reasonable and doable.


I think so too. One you sort out the vibration issues you can do some testing. See if it gets too hot. Address the issues if needed. Like you said, you're not doing actual highway trips, and these things have survived some epic abuse at the hands of racers.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

An electric seems like an oxymoron during environmental destruction playtime. 

Better replace that girly bumper and guard that grille, then, because only it stands between a rock and your battery case going into 4th of July celebrations.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> An electric seems like an oxymoron during environmental destruction playtime.
> 
> Better replace that girly bumper and guard that grille, then, because only it stands between a rock and your battery case going into 4th of July celebrations.


I have enough dom tubing and other steel to build bumpers and sliders. I wrote in this thread I'm building bumpers and sliders and showed my winch. Thanks for joining at the last second.


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## Greengearhead (Apr 21, 2015)

The gear reduction part of the build does seem difficult for people looking for sustained freeway driving after conversion of a rwd car using the leaf motor. This build is an off road only vehicle so probably a non issue.
For mostly freeway rwd conversion using leaf motor mounted in the front of vehicle, has anyone tried modifying the stock leaf gearbox to be used with rwd prop shaft and diff. 
Seems like 2 options (just brainstorming here maybe neither of these would work)
1. Weld up the diff and set a dummy shaft in one cv shaft output, prop shaft to the other. I guess you would need a very special rear differential that is close to 1:1 ratio to maintain ability to go hwy speed.
2. Connect to the first reduction gear set output in the leaf gearbox leaving the diff and cv outputs unused , this would mean modifying / creating a custom gear box case and output from the first reduction gear shaft.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Greengearhead said:


> For mostly freeway rwd conversion using leaf motor mounted in the front of vehicle, has anyone tried modifying the stock leaf gearbox to be used with rwd prop shaft and diff.
> Seems like 2 options (just brainstorming here maybe neither of these would work)


I don't know if the builder really wants this in his thread, but...


Greengearhead said:


> 1. Weld up the diff and set a dummy shaft in one cv shaft output, prop shaft to the other. I guess you would need a very special rear differential that is close to 1:1 ratio to maintain ability to go hwy speed.


Yes, that would work (although preferably with a spool rather than welding the diff). Somebody actually proposed essentially the same thing in a Honda forum, and none of the responses could suggest a source. Although a final drive unit without reduction is rare, some of the rear final drives in AWD vehicles are made to work with a shaft that turns at or near from axle speed (instead of the usual transmission output shaft speed), and appear to be near 1:1; Haldex units from VW or Audi applications might be examples. Unfortunately at least the Haldex units also incorporate a computer-controlled clutch on the input which wouldn't be needed or wanted. 

I don't think that the "dummy shaft" would be needed, just a cap to keep gear oil in the transaxle.



Greengearhead said:


> 2. Connect to the first reduction gear set output in the leaf gearbox leaving the diff and cv outputs unused , this would mean modifying / creating a custom gear box case and output from the first reduction gear shaft.


I read about someone doing that, but I don't have a link to it. 

_Roadstercycle _seems to have done essentially the same thing with a Tesla LDU (large drive unit), building a custom case and using only the first-stage reduction gears (which have a 3.19:1 ratio in that case): Tesla LDU drive shaft conversion.


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## Greengear (Mar 27, 2019)

brian_ said:


> I don't know if the builder really wants this in his thread, but...
> 
> Yes, that would work (although preferably with a spool rather than welding the diff). Somebody actually proposed essentially the same thing in a Honda forum, and none of the responses could suggest a source. Although a final drive unit without reduction is rare, some of the rear final drives in AWD vehicles are made to work with a shaft that turns at or near from axle speed (instead of the usual transmission output shaft speed), and appear to be near 1:1; Haldex units from VW or Audi applications might be examples. Unfortunately at least the Haldex units also incorporate a computer-controlled clutch on the input which wouldn't be needed or wanted.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the detailed response. I will stop derailing this awesome build thread. 
The electric land cruiser build is inspiring. Looking forward to the next installment.


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## mpgMike (Nov 9, 2021)

Greengearhead said:


> 1. Weld up the diff and set a dummy shaft in one cv shaft output, prop shaft to the other. I guess you would need a very special rear differential that is close to 1:1 ratio to maintain ability to go hwy speed.


Don't forget that when you lock one of the output shafts, the other spins at 2X RPM.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Greengearhead said:


> 1. Weld up the diff and set a dummy shaft in one cv shaft output, prop shaft to the other...





mpgMike said:


> Don't forget that when you lock one of the output shafts, the other spins at 2X RPM.


Welding up the diff means making it into a spool, so both outputs turn with the ring gear. It is not the same thing as locking one of the outputs stationary.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Not much new except I charged it up (to 80%). Did it a few hours a day for a few days as I'm still using the 120v Nissan EVSE. Going to do the 240v mod on it soon. Otherwise I ordered all new steel braided brake lines and rear hardware to do a complete brake job. This truck has a LSPV (low-sensing proportioning valve) and I'm going to delete it. It is supposed to adjust the rear brake bias when weight is added to the vehicle but most people find it just makes a spongy brake pedal feel and weak rear brakes when you need them. Since this is basically an experimental vehicle I want the brakes to be as strong and reliable as possible.


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## Greengear (Mar 27, 2019)

The load sensing prop valve delete makes sense. I guess your Toyota probably has nice fixed calipers and typical better than American truck brake feel. I use a home made pressure bleeder made from a small Home Depot pump sprayer after replacing lines. I have a master cylinder pressure bleeder cap kit but it doesn’t work on some classic cars. I make a custom master cap for those vehicles by screwing a fitting into an old plastic master cylinder cap.


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Did you think about switching over to electric brake boosters like those found on Tesla and a few other cars?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

D&VsEVJeep said:


> Did you think about switching over to electric brake boosters like those found on Tesla and a few other cars?


I thought about it briefly but just decided to use the stock system and a vacuum pump. The vac pump was about $100 it doesn't get cheaper than that. I'm a big fan of KISS, I don't want to re-engineer an entire vehicle, just convert it.


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I thought about it briefly but just decided to use the stock system and a vacuum pump. The vac pump was about $100 it doesn't get cheaper than that. I'm a big fan of KISS, I don't want to re-engineer an entire vehicle, just convert it.


Our brake booster was in bad shape so I decided to scrap it and go all electric... 🤞


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## asymptonic (Oct 14, 2021)

I'm starting to lean this way as well. I want an electric version of what I love to drive. Just read an article about the lack of steering feel from electric power steering assist and that's pushing me towards electric hydraulic power steering and possibly just electric brake boost rather than direct electric. Don't feel as strongly on the braking but feeling the road as directly as possible is a big part of driving for me, right along with stick and clutch, though I realize that can't be maintained the same way.


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## Greengear (Mar 27, 2019)

I would be more interested in going through the pain and cost of switching to electric booster if and when products like resolve ev are able to enable regen through the brake pedal while holding off on hydraulic pressure during a stop (aka blended brakes). I know regen when throttle is released is adjustable for one pedal driving but blended brakes are really nice on the oem hybrid and evs I have owned. This is probably still a ways off for ev conversion due to the complexity and potential danger of dialing it all in. 
electric power steering seems like a better use of time and energy but still very involved. It’s sort of a conversion within a conversion. At least it allows you to get rid of a stupid leaky, noisy fluid system. Doesn’t every old car seem to leak power steering fluid everywhere!


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

We are planning both electric brake boost with a ibooster as well as adding on a electric steering assist to the stock jeep steering rack (disconnect the hydraulic lines) that has a speed signal input for speed sensitive steering. I was told that the AEM VCU200 has a brake pressure input that can take the brake line pressure and add in regen from the e-motor for blended braking (in addition to one-pedal driving). We will for sure be sharing our experience on all of this...


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

asymptonic said:


> ... Just read an article about the lack of steering feel from electric power steering assist and that's pushing me towards electric hydraulic power steering and possibly just electric brake boost rather than direct electric. Don't feel as strongly on the braking but feeling the road as directly as possible is a big part of driving for me, right along with stick and clutch, though I realize that can't be maintained the same way.


The effect on feedback with electric brake boost is not the same as the effect on steering... I wouldn't worry about it the brake feel.

Even in steering much of the issue is likely just over-boosting, and the issues caused by assist motor inertia and drive gearing drag should vary between designs so some will be better than others.


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## 2drx4 (Jan 3, 2022)

D&VsEVJeep said:


> We are planning both electric brake boost with a ibooster as well as adding on a electric steering assist to the stock jeep steering rack (disconnect the hydraulic lines) that has a speed signal input for speed sensitive steering. .


I'm curious how this works since your Jeep does not use a rack and pinion steering. Is it an inline unit in the steering shaft, or what?


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

2drx4 said:


> I'm curious how this works since your Jeep does not use a rack and pinion steering. Is it an inline unit in the steering shaft, or what?


Yep. Like this one... Electric Power Steering Unit for Electric Vehicles, EV West - Electric Vehicle Parts, Components, EVSE Charging Stations, Electric Car Conversion Kits


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

D&VsEVJeep said:


> Yep. Like this one... Electric Power Steering Unit for Electric Vehicles, EV West - Electric Vehicle Parts, Components, EVSE Charging Stations, Electric Car Conversion Kits


So it's a column assist unit, and the hydraulics of the steering box (not rack) will need to be disabled.



brian_ said:


> Even in steering much of the issue is likely just over-boosting, and the issues caused by assist motor inertia and drive gearing drag should vary between designs so some will be better than others.


I was forgetting which vehicle this is... a TJ Wrangler has a recirculating ball steering gear (box), not a rack. Assist with this type of steering can be with a cylinder parallel to the axle, but in the TJ it's a hydraulic box. Like a hydraulic rack it could be just bypassed, but it would be better to fully disable the hydraulics.


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

brian_ said:


> Like a hydraulic rack it could be just bypassed, but it would be better to fully disable the hydraulics.


Yes, you are correct...I misspoke when I said rack... Yes, I have removed the entire hydraulic system.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Finally got in my IP68 vent valves to let the battery box breath. I bought M6 versions of these: https://amzn.to/3KPDVjh

The OEM LEAF battery box has these built in.




















And I snapped a photo of my VW Tiguan throttle pedal I think someone asked about it awhile back:










Not the easiest to mount, used a couple bolts and a couple hose clamps.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Latest episode of my Electrek series is live:


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Not the easiest to mount, used a couple bolts and a couple hose clamps.


Now I know why the resolve-ev defaults to using that throttle pedal. Its so much simpler to install into any car and no hacking/welding required!


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Is that valved style of vent going to hold negative pressure after going down a "hill"? 

Why didn't you pick a filtered breather?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> Is that valved style of vent going to hold negative pressure after going down a "hill"?
> 
> Why didn't you pick a filtered breather?


Hi. I did. I posted the link. It is an IP68 breather vent valve. It is filtered. Thanks for your input.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Power brakes! I got the rear brakes rebuilt and adjusted. Took forever to adjust the parking brake which I guess is normal for an 80. Now the parking brake holds strong which is a requirement without any sort of parking prawl or engine compression to help.

I also got my vacuum pump wired and mounted up. It's louder than I expected but not horrible with the hood shut. Also I can hear an air leak from the booster diaphragm so maybe it will be quieter if I fix the leaks. Went for a quick test drive and we have power brakes! Ok now we just have to make it go fast enough to properly bed them in  I also have a full set of braided steel lines (as in 7 lines) so I will swap those in and bleed the brakes next and do the LSPV delete at the same time.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

No vacuum tank?


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

I was wondering about how to hook up the vacuum too. I read that Isak suggested we get a reservoir and pressure switch but I admit it looks messy as heck and I haven't even run the wiring.

On a related not I was wondering what if we just took the power brakes system from a leaf itself?

Since I have a physical donor car I noticed it has no vacuum brake booster.



Brakes, ABS – Electric Vehicle Wiki



I do worry though what if there is no power but it seems it's just like any other braking system that loses power.


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## Bratitude (Jan 23, 2020)

Or check valve?!?
tank +check valve and you won’t have to run the pump constantly.

A vacuum switch with a heuristic circuit to flip the pump on when vacuum is low.
A mosfet with a vacuum sensor would do the trick


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## gregski (Sep 6, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Latest episode of my Electrek series is live:


OK this beauty is worthy of her own thread you know?! ha ha


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Bratitude said:


> Or check valve?!?
> tank +check valve and you won’t have to run the pump constantly.
> 
> A vacuum switch with a heuristic circuit to flip the pump on when vacuum is low.
> A mosfet with a vacuum sensor would do the trick


The pump is from a Chevy Camaro ZL1 and in that application it does not have a check valve or reservoir. The 325k mile brake booster diaphragm is leaking that's all.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

windraver said:


> I was wondering about how to hook up the vacuum too. I read that Isak suggested we get a reservoir and pressure switch but I admit it looks messy as heck and I haven't even run the wiring.
> 
> On a related not I was wondering what if we just took the power brakes system from a leaf itself?
> 
> ...


The LEAF has electro-mechanical booster. You probably could get it working but I didn't want to mess with it.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

The booster does act like a reservoir, good for a couple of braking cycles with the ICE off, so good to see in practice that large ICE boosters don't need a tank. Vacuum tank now happily off the BOM, though I still would put a check valve (if needed...I think there's one in the booster, isn't there, or you'd lose power brakes at engine shutoff?) & vacuum switch in to shut it off when the booster is pumped down.

Never gave much thought to a blown ICE not having vacuum to tap off in the manifold 🤓.

My '61 Falcon had a vacuum pump as part of the fuel pump assembly and used a vacuum motor to run the windshield wipers. Along comes a wet behind the ears 14 year old swapping in a 289 V8, and I plugged the wiper vacuum line into the intake manifold port. All fun and games until you gunned it in the rain - wipers slowed or stopped dead during passing 😂


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Latest episode of the Electric Land Cruiser is up!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

First bit of carnage. The female end of the driveshaft wallowed out. @electro wrks was right and it walked out of the bearing and then started wobbling. I was testing it up to faster speeds and then heard a big THUNK followed by a bad vibration. Otherwise everything else looks fine. The motor output shaft looks totally unscathed, which is great. 

Already in process of getting this repaired then I will drill and use a set screw or pin to keep the shaft from walking out as electro wrks recommended. Then I will use more steel bracing to tie the motor and transfer case together in a torque tube type structure to keep them from moving.










I started working on the PS this week and have parts on order for that.

I also got a cooler for the coolant loop. I was running out of room so I got a very small heat exchanger about 10x5x3 inches only. From my experience owning a LEAF, the motor/inverter never got over ambient even when running on the highway at 94 MPH until the battery was dead. It only got warm when it was charging. Because of this I'm going to risk running a smaller cooler. It is so small I could run a 2nd one if needed. If it doesn't work then I'll simply get a larger one. I will be using two 120mm PC fans to cool it. @windraver just food for thought. I got this cooler: Motamec Oil Cooler 16 Row - 235mm Matrix -12 AN JIC - Black Alloy | eBay




















Lastly, I hadn't posted this yet but this is how I was able to drop the PDM and square it up in the engine bay:


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

All the systems (PDM, Inverter, Motor) will be part of the new smaller coolant loop? Or are you separating them?


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> First bit of carnage. The female end of the driveshaft wallowed out. @electro wrks was right and it walked out of the bearing and then started wobbling. I was testing it up to faster speeds and then heard a big THUNK followed by a bad vibration. Otherwise everything else looks fine. The motor output shaft looks totally unscathed, which is great.
> 
> Already in process of getting this repaired then I will drill and use a set screw or pin to keep the shaft from walking out as electro wrks recommended. Then I will use more steel bracing to tie the motor and transfer case together in a torque tube type structure to keep them from moving.


You were lucky there wasn't more damage. I've had lesser parts separate and cause much more mayhem. I think the vibration is from the combination of the slight friction of the cross bearings along with some small axial forces from the moving parts of the driveshaft. These combine to cause your floating DS to slide back and forth(every 90 degrees of rotation?) with enough amplitude to cause the vibration. Then again, it could be something totally different. I'm sure brian could figure it out.

Try fixing one end and let us know how it works out.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

windraver said:


> All the systems (PDM, Inverter, Motor) will be part of the new smaller coolant loop? Or are you separating them?


Yes, they are all on the same coolant loop. Currently I have about 12 feet of coolant hose to tie it all together


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> You were lucky there wasn't more damage. I've had lesser parts separate and cause much more mayhem. I think the vibration is from the combination of the slight friction of the cross bearings along with some small axial forces from the moving parts of the driveshaft. These combine to cause your floating DS to slide back and forth(every 90 degrees of rotation?) with enough amplitude to cause the vibration. Then again, it could be something totally different. I'm sure brian could figure it out.
> 
> Try fixing one end and let us know how it works out.


Yes, definitely. I was taking it up to about 40 MPH and it started to smooth out so I took it a bit further and then it let loose. I think I have several issues compounded and honestly I was expecting worse carnage so all in all I'm hopeful I'll get it solved in the next iteration.

Also I wired my vacuum pump in to the waterpump/inverter circuit thinking I was being clever, now the vacuum pump comes on when I plug it in to charge  In the big scheme of things these are good problems to have.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

In other news I have been working on a heater. I decided to just completely skip electric heat and waste heat at the moment and go straight to a fuel heater. Cheap chinese "diesel air heaters" are flooding the market after the German patent expired. They are basically a small combustion chamber where fuel is pushed in and a fan draws in air and it's burnt to create heat. They are very simple but very effective. They are becoming super popular in the vanlife/RV/EV community.

I have one small problem with them: they run on diesel. I hate the smell of diesel like most people and hate getting it on my hands, shoes, car, etc and having the smell linger forever. I definitely don't want that smell in or around my EV. Some of these heaters are advertised as "gasoline air heaters" but some internet detectives claim they are identical to the diesel version with just the computer settings adjusted slightly.

I took it one step further and am running mine on E85. E85 has a much more subtle smell than gasoline and doesn't linger because it's mostly alcohol. The exhaust is also much more pleasant. Also compared to gas E85 has about 40% less lifecycle greenhouse gas emissions and burns way cleaner so I think it's the most green way I can run one of these heaters.

Today I screwed around with the heater and was able to get it running reliably on E85 fuel.

The two things I did specifically to run E85:
-Added Top Lube to the fuel to provide lubrication to the pump
-Increased the minimum Hz from 1.6 to 2.4Hz and maximum from 5.6 to 6.5Hz

So far so good! The heater has been running today for hours without running a beat on the new settings keeping my garage at 60F. The heat coming out of the vents is 180-190F. If I still had my LEAF I would install one of these in it!

I got this heater which is towards the top end of the chinese quality: https://amzn.to/3JkxKCh
Top Lube: Amazon.com: Power Plus 19769-18 Fuel Additive Alcohol Top Lube Cherry Scented : Automotive

My test setup in the garage currently:











Now the next question is where in the Land Cruiser will I mount this thing?? I'm thinking maybe in the center console but it's already getting cramped in that area. I really am stumped as I want to keep all 7 seats. Maybe I will mount it in a rear quarter panel area where the subwoofer goes sometimes.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Biodiesel smells like a McDonalds when you burn it 🤡 🍟

Was cheaper than diesel, but it's been a couple of years since I've run the F350


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I had some Land Cruiser friends over and kicked ass again today on the 80. Time to get serious now. We are going to Cruise Moab which is the ultimate Land Cruiser meetup in Moab and I want to be able to run my Electric Land Cruiser so we gotta get to work.

We got a bracket welded in to mount the PS pump. I got all the adapters now so I should be able to make up some AN fittings and braided hose to complete the PS loop. Funny coincidence the LC and the Volvo PS pump I have both use the same size 16x1.5 fitting.




















We also got all 7 braided brake lines installed. Only one fitting rounded out! The small hard line on the passenger front caliper for some reason would not come loose. Will just replace it and move on.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

Love this LC build. Will you start a thread for the Hilux you picked up? That looks fun also. Light weight and poky DC power

cheers
Tyler


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks! Yes I already started a thread but haven't posted anything other than some photos: 1988 Toyota Truck Conversion-Revival

Yes I am looking forward to it too. The LC is my #1 focus right now until we get through Cruise Moab in April then I can work on some of my other stuff.

Speaking of, if anyone is out there in the Denver area who wants to learn about EVs or get your feet wet send me a PM and you can work on this pickup. I have tools and parts everything really we need to get it going just not the time.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Some updates. Firstly the brakes are basically done except the front passenger side is giving me a fight. Tried to make a new brake line but either the tube or the flaring kit or probably both I bought are too cheap and keep failing so I just ordered one. I got the power steering now completed but haven't put the wheels on the ground to test it under load yet.

I got the rest of my relay box wired up so everything works as it should (Inverter + Water Pump come on with key and charging, Vac/Steering/T-Case pumps come on with key only). I also got my radiator mounted up and fans wired.

Biggest news is I finally put the motor back in the truck! @electro wrks will be happy that I cross-drilled and pinned the driveshaft on the motor end. Hopefully that's what you were recommending. The cotter pin should be fine or should I upgrade to a hardened steel pin? I'm going to get it aligned with lasers and then weld on my torque tube next week.

Lastly, I got a replacement black door and rear fender flare so now my truck is all the same color again!



















You can see the broad steel plate face I added on which will be what the torque tube welds to.










New AN lines on my PS pump:



















Again, not sure if a radiator this small will be adequate and I'm prepared to upgrade.



















Cosmetics!



















I find it funny that the sun fade on the fender flare from a completely different truck matches my truck absolutely perfect


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## TeZla (Feb 18, 2021)

looking good!

i think that cotter pin would work fine short term, testing etc, But id be replacing that with a hardened pin pretty soon.

Cotter pins are soft metal, side cutters go through them easily. Won't take much for the adaptor to mutilate it, then shear it off once its worked some movement into itself. A hardened pin will hopefully stop any movement before it even has a chance to start.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Yeah agreed, I'll find something beefier.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Spring pin - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> Spring pin - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Got it! Thanks again.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


>


Looking at this design again, I think it will only work if the drive shaft sleeve is a relatively tight sliding fit on the motor output shaft. The single support bearing, if it is a typical single row unit, will have quite a bit of twisting play between the inner race, the balls, and the outer race. This, combined with a loose fit of the sleeve on the motor shaft, could make for excess side play(wobble) of the drive shaft- about where your hand is grabbing the yoke in the picture. You could check for the side play, after the parts are assembled, by moving the yoke side to side with your hand. Or, set up a dial indicator to measure it.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks again @electro wrks, I will see about getting a dial indicator to measure, but the adapter is very tight fitting and I can't see any side-to-side play by eye.

I'm slowly chipping away at the to-do list preparing for CM. Picked up some wheels and tires from the local classifieds which should work out perfectly for me. They are 295/70/17 (33x11.5) Ridge Grapplers on JCS 17" rims. I have Ridge Grapplers on my LX470 also and I absolutely love them. They are on the heavier side of 4x4 tires but the performance has always been excellent for me.

I also replaced a cracked headlight, the mis-matched driver's door, and the missing rear fender flare. Overall it's starting to look like a handsome truck!


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I figured you Moab people wouldn't settle for anything short of beadlock rims?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> I figured you Moab people wouldn't settle for anything short of beadlock rims?


Too expensive and not needed at this level.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I am ticking things off the list! It's coming together. Only a few things left. I'm keeping it under wraps until the reveal at Moab, some really cool stuff planned!!!

I drove it to the liquor store for the first time the other day, for some people that's job done!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I got the OBD plug wired up to the Resolve-EV controller and got Leafspy talking. Ish. For some reason I'm getting scrambled data. I have mostly 2013 Leaf hardware but my battery is a 2017. I think this is causing a mis-match in the data. It appears to be working at some level so I can probably get it working. Luckily the battery stats look pretty good 🙂


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## natec (Mar 24, 2021)

I thought if you used a different LEAF battery pack, it has to be paired to the new motor/inv or retain the original battery's control module? Sorry if you've already mentioned that in the thread and I didn't see it.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

natec said:


> I thought if you used a different LEAF battery pack, it has to be paired to the new motor/inv or retain the original battery's control module? Sorry if you've already mentioned that in the thread and I didn't see it.


I think that's true for a Leaf, but Isak at Resolve-EV said it's not required for the custom controller. Everything else functions correctly. If I change the model year around in Leafspy it gives me different data or nothing at all. The screenshot shown was using it set to 2013.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

I haven't been following too closely. Have you resolved the issue with holding the vehicle's position with the throttle on an incline? Also, what's the latest with the drive line vibration?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> I haven't been following too closely. Have you resolved the issue with holding the vehicle's position with the throttle on an incline? Also, what's the latest with the drive line vibration?


I added a simple switch inline with the brake 12v signal wire so that I can simply disconnect the brake input from the Resolve-EV controller. It is not ideal but it works!

I thought I had updated the thread but I hadn't. I built a torque tube structure between the motor mount and the t-case. Now the driveshaft is held just about perfectly straight. I installed a spring pin on the front end and a metal band on the rear to take up some slack on the t-case side. So far it is running very smooth. I am pleasantly surprised. Can now cruise down the road at 45 MPH and there is very little vibration, similar to a normal car. After parking the driveline is not hot or anything like it was before. The metal band on the rear of the axle seemed to make all the difference by taking out some of the slop in the input shaft which was causing it to rattle. Been driving it more regularly, I have probably over 100 miles on it now.

I charged it from 30% to 100% and the cooling fans never kicked on either so I think my tiny radiator is going to work out ok also, only got slightly above ambient.


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## natec (Mar 24, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I think that's true for a Leaf, but Isak at Resolve-EV said it's not required for the custom controller.


Thanks for the clarification. I am using the Resolve controller as well, and wasn't aware of this.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Now the driveshaft is held just about perfectly straight.


You need to have a small amount of angle: Driveshaft Angles: Why They Matter And How Keep Them In Check


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> You need to have a small amount of angle: Driveshaft Angles: Why They Matter And How Keep Them In Check


I actually read that exact article when I was contemplating the design. I tried to run it at a slight angle but the vibration was much worse. The guy who built the driveshaft told me to just run it straight also. It's good enough to get me to Moab and shake down the truck, as soon as I get back I'm going to start redesigning the drivetrain I've already decided.

In other news I drove my EV Land Cruiser to the local Toyota 4x4 club meeting last night and showed it off. Everyone loved it except one guy who called it an abomination lol


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Everyone loved it except one guy who called it an abomination lol


Haters gunna hate. You should see my wife's Tik Tok comment section on her EV posts. Holy moly...


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I actually read that exact article when I was contemplating the design. I tried to run it at a slight angle but the vibration was much worse. The guy who built the driveshaft told me to just run it straight also. It's good enough to get me to Moab and shake down the truck, as soon as I get back I'm going to start redesigning the drivetrain I've already decided.


Your drive line is so short, it's going to be difficult to measure the angle accurately. You may already have the minimum angle. One option for the redesign is described in post 91. It has the direct mounting of the motor to the BB reduction unit, with an adapter plate.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

electro wrks said:


> Your drive line is so short, it's going to be difficult to measure the angle accurately. You may already have the minimum angle. One option for the redesign is described in post 91. It has the direct mounting of the motor to the BB reduction unit, with an adapter plate.


Yeah that's the plan. I will need to "clearance" the trans tunnel in the truck so the motor can fit up close to the t-case but directly mounting it with CNCd adapter plate is the plan.


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## tylerwatts (Feb 9, 2012)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Yeah that's the plan. I will need to "clearance" the trans tunnel in the truck so the motor can fit up close to the t-case but directly mounting it with CNCd adapter plate is the plan.


You can do well without CNC if you do it well, just saying. But a CNC bullet of aluminium always looks good when the truck is canted over on 3 wheels in the rough stuff and everyone's looking up its skirt 

cheers
Tyler


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Today I took the EV 80 back to the same scales that I weighed it on before I started. Everyone wants to know the weight, well here it is: 5180 lbs. Remember, when it was stock it weight 5080 lbs. So that means currently it is sitting 100 lbs heavier. This is with the addition of my 17" wheels and Nitto tires, steel bumpers front and rear, and a Warn 10k winch on the front. I would say apples to apples it is 100-200 lbs lighter than it was stock if the armor and mods aren't part of the equation. Really cool! I said I wasn't going to post any more photos before Moab but I lied I guess.





















Stock:


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Today I took the EV 80 back to the same scales that I weighed it on before I started. Everyone wants to know the weight, well here it is: 5180 lbs. Remember, when it was stock it weight 5080 lbs. So that means currently it is sitting 100 lbs heavier.


Ignoring all of the (significant) details of before and after equipment differences, this illustrates the importance of the specific engine. The original engine in this vehicle is vastly heavier than the engine in a typical car, so the conversion doesn't see the weight gain that would typically be expected.


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## mmciz (9 mo ago)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Today I took the EV 80 back to the same scales that I weighed it on before I started. Everyone wants to know the weight, well here it is: 5180 lbs. Remember, when it was stock it weight 5080 lbs. So that means currently it is sitting 100 lbs heavier. This is with the addition of my 17" wheels and Nitto tires, steel bumpers front and rear, and a Warn 10k winch on the front. I would say apples to apples it is 100-200 lbs lighter than it was stock if the armor and mods aren't part of the equation. Really cool! I said I wasn't going to post any more photos before Moab but I lied I guess.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I have a 93 that I've put 30,000 miles on over the last 3.5 years but my engine just died. I'm not wanting to let it go, but I also don't want to put a new gas engine in it. Following your project now! Would love to see someone start doing these conversions commercially.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

brian_ said:


> Ignoring all of the (significant) details of before and after equipment differences, this illustrates the importance of the specific engine. The original engine in this vehicle is vastly heavier than the engine in a typical car, so the conversion doesn't see the weight gain that would typically be expected.


Nonsense. Build choices always determine the final weight and how close it is to the original.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I think the lesson in choosing your project vehicle is to take a holistic approach and sketch out or visualize all of the components coming out and all the components going in. Some cars just accept conversions better than others. But yes, @brian_ is right if you are converting a car with an aluminum block that's a good sign it's going to end up heavier afterwards.


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## 94Tracker (Jan 17, 2011)

Looks like a fun build. Looking forward to see what it can do better than ICE.
You inspired me into looking into Leaf conversion for a Rav4. FWD would likely be easy but I want to keep the AWD. There is a Rav4 AWD conversion on here but DC drive. The one thing I think might stop me cold is physical motor size due to proximity of the differential. So could you get me the dimensions of the motor? See this post.
2001 "REV4" - Build Thread post 26

Added April 24 
Thanks for posting pictures on the REV4 thread. They are a big help. I can make it work if I go that way.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

One week until MOAB!


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I like the Roswell green...
👽


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

remy_martian said:


> I like the Roswell green...
> 👽


It's a color called Plutonium


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## eVolvoSaab (Sep 10, 2019)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> One week until MOAB!


Looking forward to seeing how this rig performs!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Hitting the road later today. Here's a teaser!


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Keep the Plutonium side up


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

On the road!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Made it to Moab!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Plugged in charging next to a Prius lol


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/Cc4PN0hlC5M/


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## Bratitude (Jan 23, 2020)

Awesome! can’t wait to hear about the rock crawling capability’s!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/Cc62AMQFS1Y/


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Ambassador...


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/Cc83BzRpF3j/


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

The maiden trail run went just about perfectly! The EVJ80 rocked! It really is working well on the trails. I have a few things to improve, some things to change, but overall I am impressed it honestly did better than I was expecting.

I'll have a more detailed report later after the event. Having too much fun currently


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Something I found out regarding "electric motors make all their torque at 0 RPM.

At 0 RPM you have no torque. Just a whining noise.

Roll into it at 100 RPM and you have all the torque.

This truck climbs everything so far!


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Something I found out regarding "electric motors make all their torque at 0 RPM.
> 
> At 0 RPM you have no torque. Just a whining noise.
> 
> Roll into it at 100 RPM and you have all the torque.


I don't know what's wrong with your controller, but that's not how motors work. After all, if they really had zero torque at zero speed you would never start moving, without giving it a push or rolling downhill.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Agreed w Brian. Torque or throttle mapping in the controller would have been my guess.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Ok not 0. But it's definitely not "all"

Have some climbing:

__
http://instagr.am/p/Cc_rQDKpGpY/


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

That was pretty tame in terms of incline, and it is a _road_, not unlike some farmers' lanes, so low gear seemed a bit dramatic and like an ICE move, lol. I suppose some mouse-powered ICE up ahead needs low and is holding everybody up to where they can't lug in high like you can.

You folks needed a good downpour on that road that day 😈

Am enjoying the cross section of roadcourses and the scenery. Came close to crashing my plane in the Utah canyons a few years ago....not many landing choices down there with a dead stick.

Good to see you not having any mechanical problems rearing their ugly head - not many options there for the others if you block the trail and it's no way to make friends or sell them on EV.

Are you monitoring temperatures? Would be interesting to see readouts as you start to work the machine.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/CdADaoitcNP/


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Was s/he running electric on the trail the whole time?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/CdBnrkbJwDR/


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Ok not 0. But it's definitely not "all"


Okay, so what's limiting it? Without data there can be no rational explanation, but we don't know what motor current or anything else is doing. As a result, we don't know if current (and therefore torque) is being limited to protect a component, or perhaps just to make the launch from a standstill smooth for typical consumers driving their economy EVs.



Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Have some climbing:
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/Cc_rQDKpGpY/


Thanks for taking us along.

I don't think you're hearing the motor straining. The noise is all from gearing; the frequency is dependent on speed, and while the volume and quality of the sound does vary with load there's no audible indication of where the motor is in its operating range (of torque, current, temperature, etc).


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

brian_ said:


> Okay, so what's limiting it? Without data there can be no rational explanation, but we don't know what motor current or anything else is doing. As a result, we don't know if current (and therefore torque) is being limited to protect a component, or perhaps just to make the launch from a standstill smooth for typical consumers driving their economy EVs.
> 
> 
> Thanks for taking us along.
> ...


"Cogging" or "stalling" is a common phenomena with brushless electric motors. It's well understood.

I will get more data eventually, I need to get Leafspy working for that data. For now you just have to enjoy the pictures and videos and be content with that  

Gears straining/motor straining what's the difference? It indicates high load.

@remy_martian Utah sand is something else, very fine and lots of resistance to drive in compared to sand in other places. I still haven't posted the video from the toughest climbs yet, either.

I just got back home today, I'll probably post up a full breakdown of the trip and how the truck performed tomorrow. Let's just say I'm blown away with the performance off-road and nothing broke!


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Gears straining/motor straining what's the difference? It indicates high load.


"Straining" usually means "having difficulty due to excessive load"; if you're concerned about this it certainly matters which part is under strain, but if you're not concerned and just mean "working hard", then sure... the sound roughly suggests the load, without implying any problem.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

...or he forgot to put oil in the gearcase 😂


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

__
http://instagr.am/p/CdJi_V-FO9T/


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> __
> http://instagr.am/p/CdJi_V-FO9T/


Wanna see the drone footage!!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

One pedal driving  Only touched the brakes briefly in a few spots. Otherwise just low range max regen, so awesome!


__
http://instagr.am/p/CdOH8kZliLd/


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## eVolvoSaab (Sep 10, 2019)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> One pedal driving  Only touched the brakes briefly in a few spots. Otherwise just low range max regen, so awesome!
> 
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/CdOH8kZliLd/


Awesome!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I never really posted an update after Moab. It's been over a month already. I guess I'll provide a rundown of how the EV80 performed.

I showed up to CM with my wife, Jasmin, and the 80 in tow behind my 100 and we set up camp. I did the night run and Gold Bar Rim in my 100. I only planned on doing one run in my EV80 but in hindsight I should have done more. On Friday I did Wipe Out Hill which was the Gamiviti sponsored run so of course the Gamiviti EV80 had to run it. It was the perfect maiden voyage for the truck with a good mix of challenging obstacles and also easy going trail and sandy roads. The truck really performed awesome, I was really impressed.

The Good:
-Suspension, brakes, steering were all excellent. I was not wanting for more steering power which was a pleasant surprise.
-The truck climbed everything, no shortage of torque in Lo-Lo. It can start from a stop on steep incline with no problem at all.
-Nothing broke!
-Nothing got hot. Blackbox doubler got warm but could still hold a hand on it. Motor and inverter were practically ambient.

The Bad:
-Offroad range was less than anticipated, only about 30 miles. Might be different on a hard packed CO trail vs. UT sand.
-CDL was not engaging. My last minute jerry rigged wiring didn't work. As a result I had a lot of wheelspin on the front axle but was still able to climb up most obstacles on the first try. Front weight bias probably helped.
-Battery mounts (old 1FZ motor mounts) cracked and came apart. I think this is the only damage.
The Chademo fast-charger plug didn't fit through my grill  First time I tried to test it was in Moab.

I ended up driving around the town of Moab in the EV80 at least once per day and probably put 70-80 miles on it. On Monday I did Baby Lions Back a couple times because I've never done it. Honestly, it was a good test and gave me confidence in the ability to start from a stop on a very steep incline with high stakes. It is a really good match to Moab and I was able to charge at public charge stations and go walk to lunch or the car show or whatever and the whole week in Moab I spend less than $5 on charging at the hotel! All other charging was free. If my truck had more striking range it would be such a perfect fit for Moab or other 4x4 towns like it. I definitely think this concept has tons of potential. I can't wait to expand this truck's capabilities. I've already got some big things planned.

Here are some more photos of the EV80 including some really great shots at Wipe Out Hill by Wanderin' the West – "It is only in adventure that some people succeed in knowing themselves – In finding themselves". Andre Gides. - https://www.wanderinthewest.org/


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I will be giving a presentation at State of Charge 2022 EV Conference August 12 and 13. It will be held at Red Rocks right in my backyard. Come and check it out!



https://soc22.com/


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Are those solar panels on the roof just for accessory use, or do you get enough power from them to contribute to charging? (The math breakdown I've seen does not paint a good picture of solar charging for EVs being practical.) I think I saw one of your pics where you can adjust the angle for max absorption.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

GassedOut said:


> Are those solar panels on the roof just for accessory use, or do you get enough power from them to contribute to charging? (The math breakdown I've seen does not paint a good picture of solar charging for EVs being practical.) I think I saw one of your pics where you can adjust the angle for max absorption.


I have an EcoFlow Delta Pro solar battery in the back of the truck which is charged by the solar. Then I can plug my EVSE into that and charge up. The solar battery is 3.6kwh so I can get about 10% charge for the main battery off it over the course of a couple hours. It definitely works but it's just an experiment. With 400watts of solar it would probably take 2-3 weeks to charge fully. I also bought an EcoFlow portable AC which I can run off the EcoFlow Delta Pro and have AC in my truck with no range penalty. So for accessories like that it might be pretty useful.

And yes I have a couple pre drilled holes in the brackets so I can adjust the angle if I'm going to be parked a long time.

EcoFlow Delta Pro: https://amzn.to/3tvzVO6
EcoFlow Wave AC: https://www.ecoflow.com/wave-portable-air-conditioner


----------



## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Interesting approach, thanks for the info. I'll probably be halving your battery pack, so something like that would be closer to 20% boost for me. But, at a "no joke" price point for the solar battery.

The ~400W provided by panel is the same limitation I referenced previously, with the unfavorable math. But I see the value of how you're approaching it, being extra juice to bring along when you're away from home, and the ability to trickle charge it at the same time.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

GassedOut said:


> Interesting approach, thanks for the info. I'll probably be halving your battery pack, so something like that would be closer to 20% boost for me. But, at a "no joke" price point for the solar battery.
> 
> The ~400W provided by panel is the same limitation I referenced previously, with the unfavorable math. But I see the value of how you're approaching it, being extra juice to bring along when you're away from home, and the ability to trickle charge it at the same time.


The solar panels and roof rack were sponsored by Gamiviti so the price is right  I could probably fit 600+ watts on the roof, and more on the hood, but we were conservative and also wanted to make sure the footprint was small not to get caught on branches or rocks. Lastly they are ACO, pretty cheap panels.

If I can get more than 1300 watts of solar by either unfolding panels or assembling a ground array or some other method then that would allow me to charge pretty much all day. I use my OEM Nissan EVSE on 120v and it pulls about 1300 watts from the solar battery, but only charges the vehicle at 950-1000 watts so I am losing a lot right there.

Now I'm thinking about hooking up the panels to my 12v system, that might actually help since with all my electric pumps of various types the idle draw is probably significant (haven't measured yet).

My future goals for this truck is to use renewables to do an offroad journey of 100-200 miles or so through the US Southwest somewhere. If I can build a wind turbine and a water generator of some sort as well as expand solar then maybe I can do it. Gotta start somewhere.


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Now I'm thinking about hooking up the panels to my 12v system, that might actually help since with all my electric pumps of various types the idle draw is probably significant (haven't measured yet).


That's what I figured you were doing initially.  When I looked at solar panels, I kept coming back to the conclusion that they're only practical at this stage for reducing battery drain by other stuff. But, with manual steering and brakes, and possibly no stereo, my 12V battery won't be tasked with much more than lighting and "ignition."

Wind or water power to supplement your solar would be awesome! Assuming you can find water in the desert to run it...


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## UglyCarFan (8 mo ago)

GassedOut: on the other hand, installing higher voltage panels and using a simpe DC to DC converter would give you lots of options.


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

UglyCarFan said:


> GassedOut: on the other hand, installing higher voltage panels and using a simpe DC to DC converter would give you lots of options.


Is this a theoretical pipe dream, or do you know of such a product?

Using the solar panels for accessory power was already mentioned. I'm not sure what bringing up DC-DC adds. That's sort of a contradictory concept, in the solar context.


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## Bratitude (Jan 23, 2020)

GassedOut said:


> Is this a theoretical pipe dream, or do you know of such a product?
> 
> Using the solar panels for accessory power was already mentioned. I'm not sure what bringing up DC-DC adds. That's sort of a contradictory concept, in the solar context.


you have to boost the output of the panels to pack voltage(350v+) so a dcdc boost converter is needed. 








GitHub - realsolarcarsllc/solarcarengineering: Engineering Lessons and Code for our boards


Engineering Lessons and Code for our boards. Contribute to realsolarcarsllc/solarcarengineering development by creating an account on GitHub.




github.com


----------



## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Bratitude said:


> you have to boost the output of the panels to pack voltage(350v+) so a dcdc boost converter is needed.


Ah, that nature of DC-DC conversion. My apologies. I didn't see much info on the GitHub page to explain what I'm learning about (story of my life), but found a few of his other sources:






Home |Real Solar Cars


Solar powered cars are closer than you think, we show you why.



realsolarcars.com









$250 as a starting point seems pretty appealing, if it can be a major charging source, but I haven't had time till now to delve into it enough to figure out the nuts & bolts of the approach. Boosting the voltage that much drops the current way down, so what does that do to charging time? He says the average car can be charged by panels not much bigger than a typical parking space, so I'm somewhat confused on that point.

Other stuff I turned up:









Highly efficient DC-DC boost converter implemented with improved MPPT algorithm for utility level photovoltaic applications


The paper presents a highly efficient DC-DC Boost converter meant for utility level photovoltaic systems. Solar photovoltaic cells are highly sought-a…




www.sciencedirect.com






https://ietresearch.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1049/iet-pel.2018.5255



p.s. I recognize your name from the Leaf plug 'n play hardware project!


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

"He says the average car can be charged by panels not much bigger than a typical parking space"

If you're willing to park in that spot for two weeks, ok....

Boosting the voltage does not boost the power output of the solar collectors if that's his claim. There's never a free lunch.


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Don't shoot the messenger.  I'd have to go back and look, but it seemed like he was saying it could charge a typical battery daily with that size of panel array. Doesn't seem realistic to me, but I'm not the one who raised the possibility and don't pretend to understand it...


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

If he's saying he can boost a fixed area panel's output power to be able to charge a full 85kW pack in a day, by simply boost converting the voltage of the system, he's a nitwit.


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

From the looks of his setup, I'm guessing he's running closer to 20 kW than 85 kW, but that's purely speculative on my part. He seemed to be catering to DIY types with wires dangling everywhere and batteries shoehorned into the trunk, not production EVs with huge capacity.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

From what I've seen here, DIY types with wires dangling everywhere are a clear minority (apart from bench testing or initial commissioning).


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## WC53 (6 mo ago)

How would you rate the drive ability around town of the Leaf motor through T-case and rear diff? Rpm range, speed etc? Trying to look at the different leaf conversions and how they work with the gear reduction.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

The latest copy of TCT Magazine just dropped, check out the in-depth story of my Electric Land Cruiser! Story begins on page 8:









Spring 2022 | LC 200 Adventure, 300k Sequoia, Electric Land Cruiser, and Events are Back!


Toyota Truck, Land Cruiser, 4Runner, FJ Cruiser, and Tacoma News & Information. We cover all models including Lexus SUVs used for exploration.




www.tctmagazine.net


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## DaveEV (7 mo ago)

I'm about to grab an NP241C from behind a GMC Turbo 400 for the BlackBox internals... or maybe modify it? I'd like to mount EM57 directly to the BB and a driveshaft on the output side. Miata has a weird PowerPlant Frame that runs from trans to diff that I'd need to custom mount... 

@Electric Land Cruiser , or anyone who has done the single gear reduction, any tips, recommendations, or things you'd do differently the second time around? I appreciate all the help from these forums!


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Not to Hyjack the thread...but does the Resolve control solution still only work with Leaf batteries?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

D&VsEVJeep said:


> Not to Hyjack the thread...but does the Resolve control solution still only work with Leaf batteries?


Yes only LEAF. You can email Isak his email is on www.resolve-ev.com he is working on a new software version that will allow much more customization.

@DaveEV I'm not sure that the transfer case parts are a good fit for you, they are designed for trucks and much lower input RPM. In a Miata you will be going at much faster speeds than me. My truck is a work in progress, still very much a prototype. Sounds like you have a plan so that's great. It was a challenge for me to find a reduction unit also which is what lead me to the BB.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

For everyone in Colorado I'm going to be showing my electric cars at Red Rocks Amphitheater on Saturday August 13. Come see the EV Land Cruiser and my 1982 UM Electrek restoration project along with a ton of other awesome Electric Cars.

More info: www.soc22.com


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## DaveEV (7 mo ago)

Wish I could make it to SOC22. I've been playing around with gear ratios for a while, and am realizing two things:

I've been focused on Toyota transfer case with 2.28:1 low (not the 2.72 in the NP241)
I hadn't thought about RPMs. There's definitely a whine in low... I imagine it will toast itself at fairly modest RPMs.

I'll save the gear reduction for the next build, try direct drive into some dual transfer setup for a Toyota 4x4. It looks like the Miata is going to get a transmission swap from BMW E36 and the things that go along with that.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I think you can get 5.38:1 gear sets for the Miata diff, not sure if that's low enough? The Miata is the type of car that has a zillion companies supporting it possibly you could find someone who could manufacture a ~7:1 or 8:1 rear end??

The LEAFs FD is 8.2:1 and you would want to have a slightly higher FD than that in a Miata to get over 100 MPH I assume. Also it's much lighter and if you upgrade to the 200hp inverter the longer gearing would rock.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Check out my Behind the Build session today!






Again come TOMORROW SATURDAY come to Red Rocks Amphitheater and you will see the coolest EVs you have ever seen guaranteed:


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## UglyCarFan (8 mo ago)

I miss the awesome margaritas we used to have at that bar in Morrison......the last time was just before seeing Santana...


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Showing off the awesome custom built EVs at the event:


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I got featured on TFL EV! So cool I love those guys!!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I pulled out my drivetrain in order to start the process of machining a new, much more precise adapter and solid driveshaft.


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## electro wrks (Mar 5, 2012)

I think you'll be a lot happier with a direct coupling design as suggested in post 91, or some kind of adapter plate(s) and coupling, without the drive shaft.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I am limited in the space in the transmission tunnel, if I were to mount the motor directly to the Blackbox then I would have to cut out the trans tunnel and fab a new one. On top of that the motor would interfere with the low range shifters and, oil pump, and other stuff going on under there. The design me and my machinist friend have come up with will have the driveshaft supported by two or three bearings and an oil bath if we can pull it off. The driveshaft length will be about the same as the GM 27-spline input shaft I was using as a mockup so hopefully with bearing support it will work. If not then back to the drawing board.


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## D&VsEVJeep (Dec 9, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I am limited in the space in the transmission tunnel, if I were to mount the motor directly to the Blackbox then ...


Are you having any issues with the input speed to the Blackbox? IIRC...they were slightly concerned with the input speed?

For our next Jeep conversion we want to use a Leaf motor and also connect it to the stock transfer case but we of course need a speed reducer in-between...


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

D&VsEVJeep said:


> Are you having any issues with the input speed to the Blackbox? IIRC...they were slightly concerned with the input speed?
> 
> For our next Jeep conversion we want to use a Leaf motor and also connect it to the stock transfer case but we of course need a speed reducer in-between...


I have not reached enough road speed yet to have exceeded the BB's input RPM. I'm guessing the fastest I've had the motor spinning is 5000-6000 RPM so similar to a gas engine. I have been crawling under the truck out in Moab and here at home after driving it and the BB never gets much warmer than a few degrees above ambient. So far so good.


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## Frankmcennis (4 mo ago)

Hi, would like to know how it is compare to the original ice, as the feeling of power? Spec to spec the ice is more powerfull than the leaf motor. I'm looking to do the swap on my 1999 tj.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Frankmcennis said:


> Hi, would like to know how it is compare to the original ice, as the feeling of power? Spec to spec the ice is more powerfull than the leaf motor. I'm looking to do the swap on my 1999 tj.


Acceleration feels similar to the stock engine


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## Frankmcennis (4 mo ago)

Good, I'll follow your lead and do the same swap this winter.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I made a little Q&A video to answer questions I've gotten and give some updates on the Cruiser:


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Getting started on CNCing the new motor adapter!


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Getting started on CNCing the new motor adapter!


That puts my plasma cutting and compass measuring adapter plate to shame. It's almost a shame to sandwich something so beautiful between other objects.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I believe he's planning to do a conversion business (even though he can't seem to spell very well 😂), so needs the repeatability of CNC, unlike one-offs in which there's no shame if proper alignment, "prosision", and strength are accomplished.


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## kennybobby (Aug 10, 2012)

The right pocket looks like a programmed machine cut (CNC) whereas the left one looks to have manual moves to clean out the pocket (program development).

The top face seems to have a periodic banding on the right flat, can't tell if it was from a flycutter or rotary table.

But don't mind my picky comments, i have an old clapped out manual mill with loose worn out gibbs that can't hold a flat cut over the top of the vise, so i appreciate seeing your nice CNC work.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Prosise Metal Works is my friend's business. Not Precise lmao.

Yes this is the very first prototype plate


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## GassedOut (9 mo ago)

remy_martian said:


> I believe he's planning to do a conversion business





Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Yes this is the very first prototype plate


I hoped that might be the case, but didn't want to be presumptuous.  Glad to see others will be able to benefit from your work.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

My prototype driveline adapter is finished! Planning to stick it in the truck this coming week.


__
http://instagr.am/p/Cl0NwJeOqdp/


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## Bratitude (Jan 23, 2020)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> My prototype driveline adapter is finished! Planning to stick it in the truck this coming week.
> 
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/Cl0NwJeOqdp/


this is getting out of hand.....


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I will be releasing a long form Christmas special on my YouTube channel from my trip to Moab this year. I have been neglecting the channel but I will be putting a lot more work into it from now on. I upgraded my PC and now editing 4k is a breeze compared to before. I had been trying to keep the videos chronological but I decided to just go straight to the good stuff and do the 4x4 driving first!

Be sure to subscribe to my channel www.youtube.com/UniqueMobility!

Teaser:

__
http://instagr.am/p/CmPbrGYOWvO/


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Merry Christmas! Check out my Moab Special!


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I had some buddies over and we installed my drivetrain. It fits just about perfectly. I went to start the truck and test it out but it's not working 

It won't charge and won't go into any drive modes. Did a little troubleshooting and it seems there is no communication with the inverter or possibly PDM.

I parked this truck several months ago when I pulled it apart for upgrades and it's just been sitting. I tried a second Resolve-EV controller that I have on the shelf and it gives the same behavior. I used LeafSpy and it shows the battery is live but there are no other ECMs communicating. I guess I will start by tracing wiring. All I can think of is a mouse or something chewed on the wires because the truck has just been parked.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Could it be as simple as not having a ground strap between the body and your now-nicely-rubber-isolated drivetrain?


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## kennybobby (Aug 10, 2012)

What's the condition of the 12V battery? They need to be kept fully charged all the time.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

12v is good, I kept it on a tender the whole time. DC-DC is working and it's at 14.4v when switched on.


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## kennybobby (Aug 10, 2012)

Rules that out, good.

What are the cell voltages from leafspy--min/max/avg


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

kennybobby said:


> Rules that out, good.
> 
> What are the cell voltages from leafspy--min/max/avg


I am unable to see the individual voltages or deltas, I think it has to do with my 2017 battery and 2013 other LEAF hardware. I remember the same thing happening when I first got it running.

The battery seems healthy from what I can tell. I parked it at 73% and it's at 71% now. The DC-DC works and the contactors are working also. It's at 377 volts. SoH is 89%.


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## nicklogan (Feb 4, 2010)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> I am unable to see the individual voltages or deltas, I think it has to do with my 2017 battery and 2013 other LEAF hardware. I remember the same thing happening when I first got it running.
> 
> The battery seems healthy from what I can tell. I parked it at 73% and it's at 71% now. The DC-DC works and the contactors are working also. It's at 377 volts. SoH is 89%.


What cell voltage and temperature restrictions does the Resolve-EV unit have built in or programmed?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

nicklogan said:


> What cell voltage and temperature restrictions does the Resolve-EV unit have built in or programmed?


Not sure, really, I don't think it's published. I have an email out to Isak from Resolve-EV and waiting on a response.

Temperature should be ok it's been in my garage slightly above freezing.

It's been cold and snowy so I haven't done a lot of troubleshooting but it's supposed to be warm and sunny today and tomorrow I'm going to dig into it.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Well I feel a little dumb. The sensor plug on the motor was not fully seating. I pulled one off a spare motor and now everything works. Was simply throwing a couple DTCs.

It works now. Boy does that motor spin smoothly!

Still won't charge, working on that and finishing installing the driveshafts and motor mount.

I had LeafSpy in the wrong mode I am able to view everything now. Battery survived hibernation.


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## Functional Artist (Aug 8, 2016)

Glad to hear it was something simple like that  

There seem to be some pretty "big spikes" (on that graph)
...& what does the blue line represent?


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Physical location in the pack of the four cells around number 55 would be interesting to know.

I wonder if they are in the middle of the sandwich and are the hottest temperature during charging? Or the end, where they're coolest? Would be nice data to try to pick apart.

@windraver: do you notice this in your cells, where the middle/end cells, physically, pick up a bit more charge than the others?


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Functional Artist said:


> Glad to hear it was something simple like that
> 
> There seem to be some pretty "big spikes" (on that graph)
> ...& what does the blue line represent?


It looks big on the graph buts it's only 26mv from the lowest to the highest cells which is actually pretty good.

I believe red lines are cells being shunted and blue lines are not.


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

remy_martian said:


> Physical location in the pack of the four cells around number 55 would be interesting to know.
> 
> I wonder if they are in the middle of the sandwich and are the hottest temperature during charging? Or the end, where they're coolest? Would be nice data to try to pick apart.
> 
> @windraver: do you notice this in your cells, where the middle/end cells, physically, pick up a bit more charge than the others?


I don't have enough data yet to say. On the original 24kwh pack most cells were pretty consistent. With all these 40kwh packs, its been inconsistent likely due to the modules possibly not being from the same battery pack.

The errors above sound familiar though. I need to check if I got those before and how I dealt with them.

edit:
@Electric Land Cruiser 

Have you done a hard reset? (disconnect 12v, disconnect HV battery (HV battery powers the BMS even while 12v is disconnected) 
What are the BMS DTCs?

Sometimes ghost problems occur when you had other errors and you have to clear them before things work again.


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

I don't think charging and the DTCs are related but just in case...


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

I solved the motor DTCs it was just a bad plug. It still won't charge I'm wondering if it's leftover like you said. I will try to disconnect everything, the 12v and the safety disconnect, and then see what happens.

The BMS says no DTCs found so I'm at a loss for the charge issue at the moment.

Still putting it back together. I welded in a motor mounting bracket and it looked beautiful then I realized it interferes with the front driveshaft so I have to redo it tomorrow


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

After a clear and restart, no DTCs on the Mtr/Inv side?

If no DTCs, I would recheck all connectors:
PDM charger connection.
The PDM to charge port (29/30)









If you modified the charge port (extension,etc), then I would check that continuity is all good still.

Also did you setup the quick charge? I know that part was separate (and I didn't have it on the 2013 so I didn't bother)










You can also switch Leafspy to a "year" instead of BMS or Mtr/Inv as it might instead return DTC for the PDM which I don't think the other modes will return.

I'm pretty certain something knows why the PDM or Resolve EV isn't starting the charger. If all else fails, I'd check with Isak at Resolve EV and see if he has some suggestions.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Isak got back to me with some generic stuff like "check connections." No DTCs on motor/inverter. No modifications have been done since I parked it. Yes I set up QC also. I'll see if I can read from the PDM.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

@windraver disconnecting the 12v and the safety disconnect didn't do anything for me. I can't get any communication when choosing vehicle years in LeafSpy either, I tried all of them. Mechanical changes are taking longer than expected but as soon as it's driving I'll go to a public charger close by and test it there.

When I plug in I get both contactor clicks and the DC-DC charges the 12v battery and the OLED comes on but it never actually charges. I used a power strip with a power meter and confirmed it is pulling 0 watts. The Nissan EVSE I am using lights up charging and no fault.


----------



## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> @windraver disconnecting the 12v and the safety disconnect didn't do anything for me. I can't get any communication when choosing vehicle years in LeafSpy either, I tried all of them. Mechanical changes are taking longer than expected but as soon as it's driving I'll go to a public charger close by and test it there.
> 
> When I plug in I get both contactor clicks and the DC-DC charges the 12v battery and the OLED comes on but it never actually charges. I used a power strip with a power meter and confirmed it is pulling 0 watts. The Nissan EVSE I am using lights up charging and no fault.


Has anything changed with the battery, current sensor, BMS, PDM, Resolve EV controller since the last time it charged?

Your scenario sounds like back when I was trying out my new 40kwh batteries.

Specifically when using the 40kwh battery with a new BMS and not having the right current sensor, plugging it in would cause the little LED screen to light, contactors click, but yet it wouldn't light up.

I would check the current sensor, service plug, the plug to the service plug, and the BMS. Maybe fully unplug the BMS as well.

Another thing to try is this custom screen for Leaf spy that Isak sent me back when I was debugging the 40kwh BMS:








All Variables L.csv


Shared with Dropbox




www.dropbox.com





He sent me to this page to find instructions on how to install custom screens:
LeafSpy Pro Custom Screens - Page 5 - My Nissan Leaf Forum 

One important thing to note is the screen will only appear if you have Leaf spy in landscape mode. Not portrait mode.

These are some notes he sent me regarding the screen:


> You need to set the year to 2020 in the app and it will say it isn't connecting even though it shows information.


These are some things I got from the screen. Try to see what shows up and screenshot it after you plug in


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks for that I will give it a try.

Nothing has changed on the vehicle at all except I removed the motor and transfer case. I can't really unplug the BMS as it's sealed inside my battery box. Same with the current sensor.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

The custom screen is cool but not showing anything new. The PDM/charge details are blanked out so possibly that is an indicator of an issue with the PDM?

The screen shows the same data whether plugged in or not. What does your show @windraver


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Truck drives amazing now! 55MPH is smooth! Still has more in it.

Tried a Semaconnect public L2 charger, no dice. I was hoping it would give me an error but it just sat there with a green light.

Will be focusing on this obviously important issue.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Washed it for the first time since Moab


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

I plugged my car in to charge and I get the following on BMS only.










It shows significant bat amps going into the battery.

When I turn on the car to drive (but at stand still), the following bat amps show which means I'm consuming power it seems.










What mode is your Leaf spy in? 2020? Or BMS only?

Let try BMS only and plugged in and see what you get.

The weird part is you can drive so it's not current sensor or BMS.

Can you also share what your current BMS cell voltages are? The only time I've been unable to charge was when a cell was under voltage. Seeing you max min volts for the cells should remove that possibility.

The resolve EV must know when it's plugged in and when to charge. That or the PDM does. I wonder what messages are being sent and if Isak can give some advice or share some ways we can see that data.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Thanks for that. I think it must be an error in the PDM causing it to not charge. I'm wondering if I can use a PCAN or something to send clear commands to the PDM.

Yes I can drive and everything else is fully functional, max regen no problem either. I have a second PDM to install if I need to but it would be a lot of effort. Hoping I can fix it.

I did post the cell voltages and they are all pretty good. Here it is again:


----------



## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

Something I remember reading was that some Nissan Leafs had an issue with a diode that prevented them from charging. I wonder if its possibly related?






Leaf not Charging - My Nissan Leaf Forum







www.mynissanleaf.com










DIODE FIXED! - My Nissan Leaf Forum







www.mynissanleaf.com













And here's what we want. The skinny white wire (not the fat one!). Check and make sure - this is the pilot wire as shown in the earlier shot of the front of the inlet.


Darell Dickey Father, EV driver, bicyclist, basic goob.




darelldd.smugmug.com





Some other misc fixes:





edit:
This explains the video pretty well for diagnosis





2011 Not Charging. Bad diode. Aerovironment Works. - My Nissan Leaf Forum







www.mynissanleaf.com


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

The diode issue only occurs on 2011 and 2012 LEAFs. I actually fixed my buddy's that had that problem.

It's gotta be a DTC in the PDM that the Resolve-EV cannot read for whatever reason. At least that's what I'm focusing on now.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Money shot




























Battery is happy after yesterday's drive but still won't charge. No luck trying anything else recommended in LeafSpy. I ordered a PC-USB to CAN Bus analyzer tool which I will connect directly to the PDM and see what I can do. I've only have a little bit of CAN experience.

Going to try a Chademo that is close by in a little bit. If Chademo works then it's probably wiring/broken PDM if it doesn't work I'm betting that means it has a DTC. At least that's my best guess.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Chademo doesn't work either. From what I understand if both chargers don't work it usually means there's a DTC...at least in a LEAF maybe not a home made conversion.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I still think it needs a ground strap between the chassis and the drive unit now that it's a money shot on rubber isolators. That would easily explain the failure to charge...


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

remy_martian said:


> I still think it needs a ground strap between the chassis and the drive unit now that it's a money shot on rubber isolators. That would easily explain the failure to charge...


The motor? Thats possibility. Normally PDM+Inv+Motor are all connected and thus PDM ground cable grounds all the other portions. Its a bit weird though that Motor Ground would affect PDM but at this point, grounding the Motor is as easy as a screw driver or pry bar so might as well try it.

Those mounts look nice though.. almost makes me want to redo my engine bay lol...

Has Isak said anything about getting PDM DTCs? I noticed too that Leaf Spy only get INV/MTR/BMS and not PDM....

I went through the DTC index searching for PDM and found that a bunch of PDM errors basically "disable charging"











edit: every "solution" for these DTCs, if they come back after a clear is to replace the PDM 

edit 2: Just in case it helps, this thread was focused on getting the Leaf PDM to function as a standalone battery charger:





Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015 - SOLVED - My Nissan Leaf Forum







www.mynissanleaf.com


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

windraver said:


> The motor? Thats possibility. Normally PDM+Inv+Motor are all connected and thus PDM ground cable grounds all the other portions. Its a bit weird though that Motor Ground would affect PDM but at this point, grounding the Motor is as easy as a screw driver or pry bar so might as well try it.
> 
> Those mounts look nice though.. almost makes me want to redo my engine bay lol...
> 
> ...


The motor is grounded, same with the t-case. I also grounded the inverter and PDM cases.

I think I'm going to replace the PDM and go from there.

Yes I think it's a lack of ability for the Resolve-EV to clear DTCs in the PDM. Unfortunately, Isak hasn't gotten back to me on the subject. It's definitely not ideal, if you get DTCs in your charger you can't really do anything about it.


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## kennybobby (Aug 10, 2012)

Is lack of OBC and Chademo charging a new issue--have they ever worked in the past?

Are all the HV connector interlocks intact? Seems like it is a serial daisy chain where the system gets disabled if any IL is missing.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

kennybobby said:


> Is lack of OBC and Chademo charging a new issue--have they ever worked in the past?
> 
> Are all the HV connector interlocks intact? Seems like it is a serial daisy chain where the system gets disabled if any IL is missing.


Yes they worked before. Then I removed the motor and parked the truck for a period of time. I reinstalled the motor but the sensor plug was loose and it threw a couple DTCs. I was able to fix the loose plug and clear the DTCs in the inverter. I'm guessing it also threw DTCs in the PDM but I can't do anything about it, a limitation of the Resolve-EV controller.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

It's charging!! I'm so happy and relieved. I replaced the PDM today with a spare. Plugged it in and it's charging fine. 

All I can figure is that the previous PDM either has DTCs stored or maybe it's just broken. Don't have any way to definitively prove it one way or the other so for now it's going back on the shelf.

Turned out to be a relatively easy swap, Nissan engineered it to come off without removing the wiring looms which is handy.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Had to wire in a new plug for my L2 at home. Got the motivation to do that today


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## windraver (Aug 29, 2021)

Nice! Congrats on Charging again! So you confirmed the PDM was the issue but it does make me wish we had a way to know what were the exact DTC or issues with the "broken" PDM.

I'm rather surprised that Leaf Spy won't give us DTCs from the PDM.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Got the coolant and t-case oil systems plumbed and realized the reason I didn't use this PDM was because it had a broken coolant inlet. I was able to goop enough silicone on it to hold for now. Luckily there is not much heat or pressure in an EV cooling system vs. ICE.

I drove it a bunch today and did a 0-60 test. It was able to do 0-60 in 14.5 seconds! That's not too shabby and not far off from a stock brand new 1996 Land Cruiser. I know some of my Land Cruiser friends have trucks slower than that lol!

New top speed 64 mph 

Battery was around 75F so theoretically it may be faster if the battery was a little bit warmer. Either way this is an excellent result because a stock 1996 Land Cruiser does 0-60 in about 12 seconds and that's with small tires and at sea level etc. I'm really happy with that! Will be a good benchmark for the 160kw inverter upgrade also.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

A top speed of 64mph implies it takes 80kW to run at that speed or an efficiency of around 1 mile/kWh, or it's speed limited by the truck's gearing/tires.

If the latter, 160kWh is not going to make a lick of difference except acceleration or grade climbing at highway speeds, which may cook the motor/battery due to inadequate cooling.

I'd leave it alone and build something else.


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