# [EVDL] Best LiFePO4 chemistry, T-Sky, Calb or ?



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Winston has the cook book.

My experience is that the big W has the best price/quality ration.
When quality is translated to reliable and cost effective EV use. Not
37,5C discharge and super-duper-nano-sales-bs-rap with 38 second full
charge.

-akkuJukka

p.s.- how did the yttrium get to set the EOC voltage ? How about the
particle size and coherency ?

http://www.google.com/profiles/jarviju#about



2011/6/20 Mark Hanson <[email protected]>:
>
> Hi Gottdi,
>
> If yttrium makes LiFePO4 have better longevity and more tollerant to high=
er final taper voltage, who has this magical potion? Is it T-Sky, Calb, =
Winston? Who makes the best lithium batteries?
>
> Thanks,
> mark
> www.reevadiy.org
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 05:52:36 -0700 (PDT)
> From: gottdi <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] figuire LFP life
> To: [email protected]
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii
>
> Yttrium introduces a contaminate into the structure much like carbon is
> introduced into iron to make steel. Iron is soft and not so strong but wi=
th
> the introduction of a tiny amount of carbon the structure of iron now
> becomes very strong and we call it steel. It is a deliberate contamination
> of the parent substrate to change its properties. In the LiFePO substrate
> yttrium is introduced in small amounts during manufacture and it strength=
ens
> the structure in a way to allow a much slower break down and therefore
> increase the life of the cell and maybe even increase the max voltage
> allowed and decrease the internal resistance by keeping the structure open
> better to allow a better exchange of ions.
>
> You get a lower internal resistance which allows a higher amp draw with
> little to no degradation over time.
> A higher voltage limit though it really is not needed.
> Much longer cycle life. From 3000 cycles to 5000 cycles. Impressive.
>
> All that extra by adding in a tiny bit of yttrium.
>
> -----
> If you don't understand, be patient, you will. Now I understand. 
> --
> View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413=
529.n4.nabble.com/figuire-LFP-life-tp3594540p3599309.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Na=
bble.com.
>
>
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Is there anyone in the US that is selling the Winston yttrium batteries ?
Looks like most are coming directly from China.

Has anyone done any high current draw testing on these batteries.
Especially the larger 160 - 200 ah cells.


Thanks;
Dennis=
=

Elsberry, MO=
=

http://www.evalbum.com/1366



-----Original Message-----
From: Jukka J=E4rvinen [mailto:[email protected]] =

Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 2:44 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Best LiFePO4 chemistry, T-Sky, Calb or ?

Winston has the cook book.

My experience is that the big W has the best price/quality ration.
When quality is translated to reliable and cost effective EV use. Not
37,5C discharge and super-duper-nano-sales-bs-rap with 38 second full
charge.

-akkuJukka

p.s.- how did the yttrium get to set the EOC voltage ? How about the
particle size and coherency ?

http://www.google.com/profiles/jarviju#about



2011/6/20 Mark Hanson <[email protected]>:
>
> Hi Gottdi,
>
> If yttrium makes LiFePO4 have better longevity and more tollerant to high=
er final taper voltage, who has this magical potion? Is it T-Sky, Calb, =
Winston? Who makes the best lithium batteries?
>
> Thanks,
> mark
> www.reevadiy.org
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 05:52:36 -0700 (PDT)
> From: gottdi <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] figuire LFP life
> To: [email protected]
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii
>
> Yttrium introduces a contaminate into the structure much like carbon is
> introduced into iron to make steel. Iron is soft and not so strong but wi=
th
> the introduction of a tiny amount of carbon the structure of iron now
> becomes very strong and we call it steel. It is a deliberate contamination
> of the parent substrate to change its properties. In the LiFePO substrate
> yttrium is introduced in small amounts during manufacture and it strength=
ens
> the structure in a way to allow a much slower break down and therefore
> increase the life of the cell and maybe even increase the max voltage
> allowed and decrease the internal resistance by keeping the structure open
> better to allow a better exchange of ions.
>
> You get a lower internal resistance which allows a higher amp draw with
> little to no degradation over time.
> A higher voltage limit though it really is not needed.
> Much longer cycle life. From 3000 cycles to 5000 cycles. Impressive.
>
> All that extra by adding in a tiny bit of yttrium.
>
> -----
> If you don't understand, be patient, you will. Now I understand. 
> --
> View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413=
529.n4.nabble.com/figuire-LFP-life-tp3594540p3599309.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Na=
bble.com.
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20110620/1f0ba6=
cd/attachment.html
> _______________________________________________
> | Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
> | Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
> |
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I believe there are several places selling them. Here is one that people seem happy with http://currentevtech.com. I believe that is what the Y in LiFeYPo4 designates.
damon

> Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2011 09:10:13 -0500
> From: [email protected]
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Best LiFePO4 chemistry, T-Sky, Calb or ?
> 
> Is there anyone in the US that is selling the Winston yttrium batteries ?
> Looks like most are coming directly from China.
> 
> Has anyone done any high current draw testing on these batteries.
> Especially the larger 160 - 200 ah cells.
> 
> 
> Thanks;
> Dennis 
> Elsberry, MO 
> http://www.evalbum.com/1366 
>

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 03:03:30PM +0000, damon henry wrote:
> 
> I believe there are several places selling them. Here is one that people seem happy with http://currentevtech.com. I believe that is what the Y in LiFeYPo4 designates.

I agree that CurrentEVTech seems to be a good and reliable source of TS 
cells.
> > 
> > Has anyone done any high current draw testing on these batteries.
> > Especially the larger 160 - 200 ah cells.

I have about 21K miles on a pack of 45 TS-LFP260 (now 48). My shunt 
for my TBS meter is 500 amp so I don't think I've ever seen more than 
500 on the meter. Currently, I have my Soliton controller set to limit 
battery amps to 550.

I may soon have a pack of 40 TS-LFP160 on the road so I may be able to 
report if 3C is achievable. I expect it is, but I wouldn't expect 
much more than that.

-- 
Willie, ONWARD! Through the fog!
http://counter.li.org Linux registered user #228836 since 1995
Debian3.1/GNU/Linux system uptime 4 hours 35 minutes

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Recent deliveries of CALB cells have had the cells all grouped within less
than 1% variation in capacity, which I consider quite good. From what I've
seen previous shipments of TS have not been that close but I don't know
about recent ones. Can anyone confirm or deny measured capacity variation
of TS/Winston cells?




> Mark Hanson-2 wrote:
> >
> > Hi Gottdi,
> >
> ...


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