# Replacing my Soliton Jr



## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

Another dead Soliton... like mine in few months I bet 
Why don't try to repair it with the help of members? 
It's what I will try when mine will die another time.

If no, you are lucky to run at this ''low'' voltage since Zeva controller accept up to 175v.
It will be my choice if something wrong happen another time with my Soliton 1, but I will need to reconfigure my battery from 196v to 98v full charge... sad situation!


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Yep, look at zeva controllers, they are great! To bad they don't make 400V max model


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## WolfTronix (Feb 8, 2016)

I would like to acquire some bad Soliton Jr. controllers, to see if they can be repaired. 

I repair a lot of obsolete Solectria controllers now:
http://www.wolftronix.com/motorControllers.htm

Thanks, 
Wolf


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

Thet look to be easily repairable, mine failed, has been heat sensitive and so now its open while I go circuit tracing.

Got a quote from evnetics for $1300 to repair plus shipping.


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

I now have the cash to actually replace the Soliton Jr. Has anyone used a ZEVA MC1000C in their build?

Since the Soliton had a build in solenoid and pre-charger circuit, I'll need to add those components as I re-work my EV's control system. Anyone have suggestions on those components?

Oh, big question: Is CAN bus the only way to control the ZEVA? My EV is a 91 Geo Tracker so it never had anything to do with the CAN bus technology.


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## Semper Vivus (Apr 13, 2011)

The ZEVA CAN is for configuration and diagnostics as I understand. So not mandatory for a basic operation.
Maybe it could also be delivered preconfigured if you need custom setting for max amps etc and have no CAN tool? 

Regards


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## EVfun (Mar 14, 2010)

This is what I've been running. They can be programmed with a terminal program using a laptop and a USB to serial adapter. Mine is set for 360 battery amps and 600 motor amps with the low voltage warning set at 103 volts and the low voltage limit set at 91 volts (the pack is 39, 60 amp hour Thundersky cells.) The motor voltage max is set to 117 volts (old Prestolite MTC.)


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

I've ordered and received an MC1000C ZEVA controller and the necessary accessories from EV West, to replace my Soliton Jr. 

I'm trying to host the pics on google drive. If you know of a better place or a different way to share them on this forum, please let me know.

This is what I'm working with:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8JWxIX5Wg_XeVJpN3Y4RlFSUjA/view?usp=sharing

This is what is going in, to replace the Soliton Jr.: 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8JWxIX5Wg_XZUJ5MnJNWUl1S1E/view?usp=sharing

I've removed the Soliton and will be re-arranging things in the motor compartment for the new parts needed to make this work. I've also decided to put a series of holes beneath the controller to increase cooling air flow. 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8JWxIX5Wg_XRGdpaV9McFliWFU/view?usp=sharing

I will also be mounting a fan above the controller to force air across the controller. I asked about a water cooling plate but EV West never got back to me... so going with air cooling to see how that works. I had to water cool the Soliton Jr.

I attached the provided brackets for the MC1000C controller and placed the controller in place. A couple of days later, I got back to work and removed the controller, and discovered that the 3D printed plastic brackets are so brittle, that they broke as soon as any sort of pressure was put on them. 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8JWxIX5Wg_XVTdBQXhhMHhHZmc/view?usp=sharing

Yes, my garage isn't heated, and it is winter so it was below freezing temp... but I still think they shouldn't be that brittle. I've switched to aluminum brackets for a better way to attach the controller to the aluminum shelf on which everything is attached.

I'll update this thread with more information as I make progress. Please reply if you have any questions or comments about this "upgrade."


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

Wow! 1000 Amps in your small truck will be nice... if your Kostov can take it


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

If it's 11 inch, it will without any problem


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

For about 30 seconds. Or at least that what it looks if you extend the motor graph


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## Batterypoweredtoad (Feb 5, 2008)

30 seconds of 1000 Amps would take a load that you are unlikely to ever see outside of tying your car to a tree a matting the throttle. Even then you would likely spin the tires and the amps would drop.


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

One feasible scenario is overtaking someone on highway on uphill with full car. But yeah, it wont be a problem.


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

I selected the 1000 amp capable controller so that I'd normally operate WAY under its max capacity. Hoping this controller lasts longer than the Soliton did.

I have the major components installed and wired up. 









Now I am working on the smaller control circuits. Been stuck looking for information on the throttle assembly I have. I just found the info on the EVWest site. 

My throttle is the Evnetics Billet Aluminum Throttle Potentiometer. What I was missing was the wiring info.

Red: 5V Supply Positive
Black: 5V Negative
White: 5V Output

I ordered a DC DC buck converter to provide the 5VDC signal previously provided by the Soliton Jr.so now I can spend another weekend working to get my rig back on the road!


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

PeterH said:


> I ordered a DC DC buck converter to provide the 5VDC signal previously provided by the Soliton Jr.so now I can spend another weekend working to get my rig back on the road!



Are you sure you need it?

Check the zeva manual:


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Hi, interesting that you would post that...you are right, I don't need it. Well, I'll use it for another project. After re-reading the manual it is apparent that the controller provides the 5V supply. In fact, it looks like my throttle should connect to the controller very easily.

But, now I'd like to confirm my reading of the manual. I wish they would simply have marked the drawing in the manual with the corresponding pin numbers on the plugs. This is how I've interpreted the correct pin locations:









These are supposed to be "as viewed on the controller case." Always found this sort of thing confusing so I'm trying to be VERY careful to make the correct connections. Can anyone verify that I've made the correct interpretation?


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

Just imagine you are looking directly at the controller


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Yesterday I completed as much of the rewiring as could. As it turned out, the aviation style 4-pin plug disintegrated when I removed the backshell so I may be delayed until I can obtain a replacement. Sent ZEVA a of request yesterday for a part number. Meanwhile, I made the connections "manually" using other female pins I had; all carefully isolated with shrink-wrap and carefully installed over the pins.

I'm just about ready for the smoke test but one question lingers. As I am sitting here rereading the manual, I noticed the description of the second throttle connection. The manual says it is for a second throttle input or an enable switch.

Does that mean I MUST use one or the other? I won't be adding a second throttle, but I could add an enable switch if I have to. If I were to add an enable switch, is that a simple toggle switch between the second throttle input and the +5VDC output from the controller, just to complete the circuit?


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Sunday April 16, 2017, my EV hit the road again with a new controller at the heart of it. The "heart transplant" appears to have been successful. 

I have one minor issue to resolve before I can start driving it to work daily. With the Soliton Jr. I could calibrate the throttle so that the controller knew the 0 throttle voltage setting and the max throttle setting voltage. It seems to be that I don't have that ability with my new ZEVA controller. Which means that my full throttle, produced by the physical movement of the throttle assembly, is producing no more than half of the 0-5VDC value it takes to get full output from the controller. 

So during my first test drive this morning, it was feeling very weak in terms of acceleration. In fact, I had a difficult time getting it up to 45 mph on my short test drive. I have 5 minutes of highway speeds on the way to work so that isn't going to cut it for me. 

My only option is to change the point where the throttle cable connects to the arm on the position sensor so that it is closer to the pivot point. That way, the output from the throttle sensor will be closer to 5 VDC. I have one more hole left on that sensor arm that I can use. Just need to find the right hardware.

If anyone feels there is a better way, or that I'm missing something, please let me know. 
Pete


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## piotrsko (Dec 9, 2007)

250 k ohm resistance across the wiper and ground perhaps should reduce the minimum resistance but not significantly. Or use a 100 k pot and adjust until happy. Shouldn't need more than 20 k.

Crude and scary? You bet.


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Now that I have installed this new ZEVA controller, I can't get my rig to go over 45 MPH... with my old Soliton Jr. I could get it going as fast as 70 MPH. The ONLY change is the controller.

I've rigged the throttle cable so that the travel on the throttle is within a few degrees of 100% which means I should be getting nearly 5 VDC to the controller's input circuits.

With the Soliton I could tell the controller to read the minimum voltage and the maximum voltage and use those two points to determine throttle setting and react accordingly. With the ZEVA, I don't have that option so I'm assuming it is just looking for 0 to 5 VDC for the input signal.

The slew rate is also very slow. I'm wondering if I've handicapped myself because this car never had a CAN bus and as a result, I have no way to communicate with the controller to change any settings.

Any thoughts or suggestions?


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## Weisheimer (May 11, 2009)

You could measure the voltage that is actually going to the controller from the pedal.
That measurement would be from the ground pin to the Throttle A pin.

You can use a CAN device with your computer to send and receive the controller CAN data.
It doesn't matter whether the vehicle has CAN or not.

But still, I don't see much information from Zeva in that very small manual that is online at their site.
Do you have any further information on their CAN protocol?


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Hello Weisheimer,

I've taken some measurements of the throttle output this morning and got some interesting readings.

All of these pin references are to the ZEVA MC1000SP controller, Plug 1 as illustrated in the manual.

Ignition on, throttle at zero position:

voltage betweeen the ThrA pin and Gnd is 0.1403 VDC.

voltage between the 5V pin and Gnd is 4.79 VDC.

Throttle pedal pressed firmly against the floor board, voltage between ThrA and Gnd was only 3.268 VDC.

With the throttle sensor at max deflection, moved by hand, voltage between ThrA and Gnd was only 3.63 VDC.

I am using this throttle sensor which I originally purchase from Evnectics with my Soliton Jr. controller (noticed today the Evnetics web site is advertising a liquidation sale, including all their intellectual property). EV West is where I purchased my ZEVA controller and they carry what looks like the same controler : 

http://store.evtv.me/proddetail.php?prod=throttlepot

Looks like I'm getting only 68% of max possible out put from the throttle sensor. At best, I could only get 75% of the possible output if the linkage were to move the sensor to its absolute maximum deflection.

Would you agree I might have a throttle sensor problem which might explain why I can't get my rig over 45 MPH?


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

I've exchanged a few emails with EVWest and I've sent one off to Ian in Australia. Seems I don't have a compatible throttle sensor on my rig. By default the ZEVA is expecting what the manual calls a Type 1 sensor. It produces 0 to 5 VDC to indicate throttle position.

I thought that is what I was using because I recall the Soliton was looking for 0 to 5 VDC on its throttle input. 

Since I can't communicate with the controller to change it's input setting to match what I have, I am considering changing my throttle sensor to match what the ZEVA is expecting.

I THINK that would be something like the Toyota Prius throttle assembly. But I'm waiting to hear back from EVWest to see what they think. They sell the assembly, new and used.


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## Weisheimer (May 11, 2009)

Sorry that I missed your initial response with the measurements...

It sure looks like you've got the culprit cornered here.
Testing with a handheld 5K pot would be a test that could tell you if 5v out of the pot does get the controller to output full power.
It would also be an easier way to clip a voltmeter on the wires to measure while you tested.

Still, setting the slew rate for acceleration response is going to require CAN communications.


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## PeterH (Mar 20, 2009)

Since my last post I've purchased and installed the ZEVA monitor module so I can see the data over the CAN bus from the controller. 

I've not tried to change the throttle input because I also need to replace the throttle assembly. 

However, my problem now is that the controller will get to 60 degrees C easily. I suspect it is the limited air flow under the hood. So, now I'm looking for a water cooling block that I can use to help cool the controller.

Anyone know where I can find a cooling block that is roughly 300 mm long and maybe 120 mm wide? Haven't been able to find one on ebay or Amazon. Closest I can find are smaller blocks that I guess I could chain together but that would require 4 of them together to the top of the controller.


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## riba2233 (Apr 29, 2015)

You can use standard aluminum radiator and fan, it would be enough. BTW 60 C is really OK temp, not hot at all.


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