# [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

All,
I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very excited. I am trying to spec out a system for a jeep wrangler. I know aerodynamics suck etc but it's a jeep thing most don't understand. 
So, my question is more around the motor first then the batteries to support. I was looking at DC motors that only support up to 2200 vehicle weight when bolted to the transmission. I'd like to have increased torque out of this in the process so I don't want under do it  but I also don't want to fill up the inside with stacks of batterries. Any ideas on what motor would work well with a stock wrangler setup?
Thanks,
David

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

David,

I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This project
has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
components.

Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not sure
on which controller or charging system.

Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires on,
but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries, and
a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.

Brett

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > All,
> > I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hi if you go to evalbum.com search for jeep wrangler theres one there
.Perhaps can get ideas from that builder . I know what you mean ie jeep
thing , mines a 82 usps amg jeep rwd ive converted . Its like 0 aero
..butttt ... lonnie


David Knestrick
> All,
> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> excited. I am trying to spec out a system for a jeep wrangler. I know
> aerodynamics suck etc but it's a jeep thing most don't understand.
> So, my question is more around the motor first then the batteries to
> support. I was looking at DC motors that only support up to 2200 vehicle
> weight when bolted to the transmission. I'd like to have increased torque
> out of this in the process so I don't want under do it  but I also don't
> want to fill up the inside with stacks of batterries. Any ideas on what
> motor would work well with a stock wrangler setup?
> Thanks,
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>

_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be 
able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling 
isn't it? Later, Bob
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project


> David,
>
> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This 
> project
> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
> components.
>
> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not 
> sure
> on which controller or charging system.
>
> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires 
> on,
> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries, 
> and
> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>
> Brett
>
> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> > <[email protected]>wrote:
> >
> >> All,
> >> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer 
wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the 
heavy cast iron transfer case and front drive shaft. The front differential 
& axles are next. That should save several hundred pounds. I've already 
upgraded the rear drum brakes to disc for better stopping. Planning to use 
a WARP9, would like a 144V system, but haven't tried to actually place the 
batteries yet. The project is on hold until I get my Escort back on the 
road.

Barry

>
> Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be
> able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling
> isn't it? Later, Bob
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
>
>> David,
>>
>> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This
>> project
>> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
>> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
>> components.
>>
>> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not
>> sure
>> on which controller or charging system.
>>
>> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires
>> on,
>> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
>> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
>> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries,
>> and
>> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>>
>> Brett
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> >> <[email protected]>wrote:
> >>
> >>> All,
> >>> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Thanks Barry,
Yeah I do go wheelin pretty regularly and coulnt stomach chopping up my crawler yet. I am going to put all this in a stock jeep with drivetrain intact if possible. I, just really wondering about how many batteries we are talking. I might need/have/want to do some mods to build one of thoase aev brute trucks, they are sick. http://www.aev-conversions.com/products/brute/ But that might losing focus of the project and this thread.

How many batteries do you expect to need for your 144V system?

D


-----Original Message-----
From: Barry Reicher <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 10:48 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer 
wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the 
heavy cast iron transfer case and front drive shaft. The front differential 
& axles are next. That should save several hundred pounds. I've already 
upgraded the rear drum brakes to disc for better stopping. Planning to use 
a WARP9, would like a 144V system, but haven't tried to actually place the 
batteries yet. The project is on hold until I get my Escort back on the 
road.

Barry

>
> Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be
> able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling
> isn't it? Later, Bob
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
>
>> David,
>>
>> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This
>> project
>> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
>> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
>> components.
>>
>> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not
>> sure
>> on which controller or charging system.
>>
>> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires
>> on,
>> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
>> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
>> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries,
>> and
>> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>>
>> Brett
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> >> <[email protected]>wrote:
> >>
> >>> All,
> >>> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

You can choose between 12V batteries and 6V batteries.

With 12V batteries, you will have much shorter range, and your pack won't
last nearly as long before needing to be replaced, but it will weigh much
less.

With 6V batteries, your pack will last much longer and have more range, but
it will be very heavy.

-Morgan LaMoore

On Sat, Sep 6, 2008 at 10:13 AM, David Knestrick


> <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > Thanks Barry,
> > Yeah I do go wheelin pretty regularly and coulnt stomach chopping up my
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Keeping all the stock jeep gear is gonna give you a really short range unless you get a ton of batteries. As a quick comparison, I have a 49 willy's jeep but the suspension is now a lightweight VW. The entire car was 1700 lbs before conversion and 2500 after. With. 12 x 12 v floodies my range is a tight 50 miles, but that is NOT freeway 50, it is mainly in town. Range calculations mean nothing if you dont also talk about speed. My car is at www nogas.us

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: David Knestrick <[email protected]>

Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 11:13:48 
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project


Thanks Barry,
Yeah I do go wheelin pretty regularly and coulnt stomach chopping up my crawler yet. I am going to put all this in a stock jeep with drivetrain intact if possible. I, just really wondering about how many batteries we are talking. I might need/have/want to do some mods to build one of thoase aev brute trucks, they are sick. http://www.aev-conversions.com/products/brute/ But that might losing focus of the project and this thread.

How many batteries do you expect to need for your 144V system?

D


-----Original Message-----
From: Barry Reicher <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 10:48 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer
wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the
heavy cast iron transfer case and front drive shaft. The front differential
& axles are next. That should save several hundred pounds. I've already
upgraded the rear drum brakes to disc for better stopping. Planning to use
a WARP9, would like a 144V system, but haven't tried to actually place the
batteries yet. The project is on hold until I get my Escort back on the
road.

Barry

>
> Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be
> able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling
> isn't it? Later, Bob
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
>
>> David,
>>
>> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This
>> project
>> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
>> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
>> components.
>>
>> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not
>> sure
>> on which controller or charging system.
>>
>> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires
>> on,
>> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
>> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
>> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries,
>> and
>> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>>
>> Brett
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> >> <[email protected]>wrote:
> >>
> >>> All,
> >>> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

You have to decide what you want the vehicle to do before you make the
fundamental choices.
High performance, long range, reasonable cost. Pick 2

You seem to have fixated on yellowtops. Has someone told you that they
are superior batteries or do you have a source to get them cheaply?

Do you have space for 36 batteries?





> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Wouldn't two strings of D31 yellow tops, or three strings of D34
> > yellow tops be roughly equivalent in both storage and weight to one
> > string of T105s? And three times the price too, of course.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Awesome! Though it's kind of a shame, since the scrambler is so rare and
there will be one less out there 4-wheeling. I considered EV-ing my
scrambler...for about 2 minutes. I'll be cheering you one though.

Do you have a write up on it yet?

Brett


> Barry Reicher <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer
> > wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Barry, you could get into big trouble around the jeep communities for chopping the scrambler up but your secret is safe with me 

I currently have a tj and want to find a tj donor vehicle for the project. The ride between a tj and yj is night and day.To actually want to drive the thing everyday, my spine insists on a tj with coil springs... 

I started out thinking I could have the best of both worlds, EV AND retain the 4wd. It sounds like im better off just stripping it all down to a direst drive if I can't take it off road for some fun(i do have an ice one for that but was hoping for bragging rights).

D

-----Original Message-----
From: Barry Reicher <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 10:48 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer 
wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the 
heavy cast iron transfer case and front drive shaft. The front differential 
& axles are next. That should save several hundred pounds. I've already 
upgraded the rear drum brakes to disc for better stopping. Planning to use 
a WARP9, would like a 144V system, but haven't tried to actually place the 
batteries yet. The project is on hold until I get my Escort back on the 
road.

Barry

>
> Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be
> able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling
> isn't it? Later, Bob
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
>
>> David,
>>
>> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This
>> project
>> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
>> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
>> components.
>>
>> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not
>> sure
>> on which controller or charging system.
>>
>> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires
>> on,
>> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
>> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
>> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries,
>> and
>> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>>
>> Brett
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> >> <[email protected]>wrote:
> >>
> >>> All,
> >>> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

If I get lucky and have a jeep with a dana44(unlucky if you are an EV'r) then I have more options with gearing, for a dana 30, they are limited to a max of 4.88 gears. With stock tires I would think this should be enough?

D

-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Egan <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 2:41 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

Keeping all the stock jeep gear is gonna give you a really short range unless you get a ton of batteries. As a quick comparison, I have a 49 willy's jeep but the suspension is now a lightweight VW. The entire car was 1700 lbs before conversion and 2500 after. With. 12 x 12 v floodies my range is a tight 50 miles, but that is NOT freeway 50, it is mainly in town. Range calculations mean nothing if you dont also talk about speed. My car is at www nogas.us

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: David Knestrick <[email protected]>

Date: Sat, 6 Sep 2008 11:13:48 
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project


Thanks Barry,
Yeah I do go wheelin pretty regularly and coulnt stomach chopping up my crawler yet. I am going to put all this in a stock jeep with drivetrain intact if possible. I, just really wondering about how many batteries we are talking. I might need/have/want to do some mods to build one of thoase aev brute trucks, they are sick. http://www.aev-conversions.com/products/brute/ But that might losing focus of the project and this thread.

How many batteries do you expect to need for your 144V system?

D


-----Original Message-----
From: Barry Reicher <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2008 10:48 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

I'm preparing a Jeep project also, but mine is a CJ-8 Scrambler - longer
wheel base for more battery room. I don't go 4-wheeling so I removed the
heavy cast iron transfer case and front drive shaft. The front differential
& axles are next. That should save several hundred pounds. I've already
upgraded the rear drum brakes to disc for better stopping. Planning to use
a WARP9, would like a 144V system, but haven't tried to actually place the
batteries yet. The project is on hold until I get my Escort back on the
road.

Barry

>
> Hey, I have a YJ Wrangler and was toying with some EV ideas. I need to be
> able to tow a small utility trailer, so that's similar to rock crawling
> isn't it? Later, Bob
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brett Davis" <[email protected]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 11:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
>
>> David,
>>
>> I plan on the wrangler build too, so I'll be following along. This
>> project
>> has to wait until the cabin and basement are finished...so probably next
>> spring/summer for me. I'm in the process of learning the lingo and the
>> components.
>>
>> Right now I'm thinking 9" ADC motor, 12 Optimas for a 144V system. Not
>> sure
>> on which controller or charging system.
>>
>> Which wrangler? YJ's are cheaper, and easier to put big axles and tires
>> on,
>> but TJ's have a better stock ride, and if limited to 32" tires, are very
>> simple to build for 4-wheeling (which is a key use for me). I figure a
>> steel gastank skid plate is a ready-made holder for the rear batteries,
>> and
>> a shelf under the hood around the motor for the rest of the batteries.
>>
>> Brett
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 11:33 AM, David Knestrick


> >> <[email protected]>wrote:
> >>
> >>> All,
> >>> I'm new to the list.. Having said that, i'm new to EV's too and very
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

If you limit me to pick two out of three, id have say 1) cost 2) range... I have 2 1/2 kids 

The yellowtop fetish came from simply reading they could be used. I use one currently in my crawler that powers 1000w (one 10F cap)stereo system and a winch nicely. They are very expensive and I don't have any deals on them. I'm surprised to hear they wouldn't last very long though. And 36 batterries? Were you talking golf cart or yellow tops?

I gotta get my head around this.. I guess i'd be open to the 6v batteries too if it works better

D


-----Original Message-----
From: storm connors <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:09 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project

You have to decide what you want the vehicle to do before you make the
fundamental choices.
High performance, long range, reasonable cost. Pick 2

You seem to have fixated on yellowtops. Has someone told you that they
are superior batteries or do you have a source to get them cheaply?

Do you have space for 36 batteries?





> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Wouldn't two strings of D31 yellow tops, or three strings of D34
> > yellow tops be roughly equivalent in both storage and weight to one
> > string of T105s? And three times the price too, of course.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

David,

Any progress? In another thread on the same subject, someone recommended
the yellowtop because of the intended use of a jeep/rockcrawler. Did you
read about the kid named Nicki that built a Cherokee?

On a related subject, my buddy picked up a sweet X90 with a blown engine. I
mentioned EV'ing it, and he got excited, so we are probably gonna do that
one first. I think we'll use the same basic recipe. I want a jeep, (for
jeeps sake) but an X90 or sidekick/tracker is a much better platform, in my
opinion for what an EV4x4 can do. Smaller, lighter. I've been torn on
choosing between a tracker/sidekick and a jeep since I first considered
doing this...we'll see.

I still need to figure out the controller and charger.

I first thought you could get a charger that does the whole pack, and then
further reading led me to believe that the best way (for each battery) is to
charge them indiviually. Hooking up 12 chargers every night seems like a
pain in the butt to me.

Brett

On Mon, Sep 8, 2008 at 2:33 PM, David Knestrick
<[email protected]>wrote:

> If you limit me to pick two out of three, id have say 1) cost 2) range... I
> have 2 1/2 kids 
>
> The yellowtop fetish came from simply reading they could be used. I use one
> currently in my crawler that powers 1000w (one 10F cap)stereo system and a
> winch nicely. They are very expensive and I don't have any deals on them.
> I'm surprised to hear they wouldn't last very long though. And 36
> batterries? Were you talking golf cart or yellow tops?
>
> I gotta get my head around this.. I guess i'd be open to the 6v batteries
> too if it works better
>
> D
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: storm connors <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:09 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <xxx[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Davids Jeep Wrangler Project
>
> You have to decide what you want the vehicle to do before you make the
> fundamental choices.
> High performance, long range, reasonable cost. Pick 2
>
> You seem to have fixated on yellowtops. Has someone told you that they
> are superior batteries or do you have a source to get them cheaply?
>
> Do you have space for 36 batteries?
>
>
>
>


> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > Wouldn't two strings of D31 yellow tops, or three strings of D34
> > > yellow tops be roughly equivalent in both storage and weight to one
> > > string of T105s? And three times the price too, of course.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> read about the kid named Nicki that built a Cherokee?
That would be Nick Viera of San Antonio, Texas
http://www.evalbum.com/589
Where is Nick?
rod

_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> On 22 Sep 2008 at 18:06, Brett Davis wrote:
> 
> > I first thought you could get a charger that does the whole pack, and then
> > further reading led me to believe that the best way (for each battery) is to
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Oops, not sure how that extra "i" ended up in there. Reading about 
Nick's EV is what got me interested in doing a conversion.

Brett



> Rod Hower wrote:
> 
> >>read about the kid named Nicki that built a Cherokee?
> >>
> ...


----------

