# LOGISYSTEMS 144-156V/1000A Controller



## CroDriver (Jan 8, 2009)

Can't find ANY information about this controller.

http://www.cloudelectric.com/category_s/464.htm

Got some?

Thanks.


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## redbull (Mar 4, 2009)

CroDriver said:


> Can't find ANY information about this controller.
> 
> http://www.cloudelectric.com/category_s/464.htm
> 
> ...


 
Hi! Crodriver

Look here http://www.grassrootsev.com/control.htm
They are the agency for Logisystems controller.


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## CroDriver (Jan 8, 2009)

redbull said:


> Hi! Crodriver
> 
> Look here http://www.grassrootsev.com/control.htm
> They are the agency for Logisystems controller.


That's what I've been looking for. Thank you!


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

I bought one of the first of these, I've probably got more experience with this model than anyone outside of logisystems. Was used on my 240z project, first with [email protected] of AGM, then [email protected] of AGM, and then later with [email protected] of gel cells all with a 9" Kostov motor (last configuration was to be used as a commuter with less performance and more range, better battery life). Grassroots prices are too high IMHO, can be had much cheaper. I even found a workaround to the jerkiness on startup issue many complain about. 

So.... What do you want to know?


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## redbull (Mar 4, 2009)

AmpEater said:


> I bought one of the first of these, I've probably got more experience with this model than anyone outside of logisystems. Was used on my 240z project, first with [email protected] of AGM, then [email protected] of AGM, and then later with [email protected] of gel cells all with a 9" Kostov motor (last configuration was to be used as a commuter with less performance and more range, better battery life). Grassroots prices are too high IMHO, can be had much cheaper. I even found a workaround to the jerkiness on startup issue many complain about.
> 
> So.... What do you want to know?


 
Then where can i get them cheaper, are they strong enough for racing?


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

redbull said:


> Are they strong enough for racing?


I've been meaning to find that out myself. I can tell you that I put mine through alot of abuse, 30+ second burnouts, lots of "drifting" (quick punch of the throttle makes it easy in an electric), generally trying to break things. It could always take more than the motor could, I never had to stop due to an overheating controller, but did occasionally due to a "hot smelling" motor or low batteries. 

I did blow it eventually, it was about 15-20 seconds into a start from a dead stop up a moderate incline in 3rd gear (simulating direct drive) with freshly charged AGMs. Loud pop and that was it. Thought it was a just a fuse at first but when I replaced it and pre-charged it I got another bang and the endcap popped off. It was replaced quickly; I was told it was the first failure ever, and that a voltage regulator had blown. I had no problems with the replacement but sold the vehicle before I logged very many miles on it.

I have since purchased 2 more Logisystems controllers for some of the projects I'm working on. Reliability is at least as good as curtis, though I've never actually owned one, I have seen that failure after a few years is pretty common in EV appslications and just an accepted fact.  Logisystems got their start rebuilding and upgrading curtis controllers (as I understand it....) so I'd hope that they would have found effective ways to improve on the shortcomings. Plus, there isn't any other choice for this power level right now, besides Kelly or DIY. Kelly is getting better, but their prices are still higher and track record worse as far as I can tell. 

Though I have read that Kelly is working on some new high-amp and high-voltage stuff that might change things. 156v is about the minumum for racing, and even then I think it mandates a transmission to keep the amp draw up. All the sucessfull EV racers use high voltages for this reason, direct drive makes it critical.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

What did you do to deal with the jerky starts?


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

JRP3 said:


> What did you do to deal with the jerky starts?



jrp3 I am curious to see what he did do for his starts as well but I got to tell ya the new pot I made is ssoooooooooooooooooo smoothhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,, if yours is jerky especially in reverse , make one?? I can send ya a set og gears if you want??/


Brian


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

JRP3 said:


> What did you do to deal with the jerky starts?


I added a "throttle retard" function in the little controller I made that switches resistance in parallel with the throttle pot, limiting its effective range on demand. So instead of no pressure = 0%, floored pedal = 100% power, you get no pressure = 0% and floored pedal = 50% power, or some variation based the resistance you choose. Then you switch this in when you need it. Mine was activated automatically in reverse (before it was so bad I couldn't back up without burning rubber), and whenever I flip a switch (for parking manuevers or whatever). 

The problem before was that it was _*so powerfull*_ that the slightest tap in reverse would cause a quick jump, which lurched your whole body forward thus mashing your foot even harder into the throttle. Would have made a good hidden camera gag, but a bad commuter vehicle.

I think I used two 4.7k resistors in parallel to get mine just right. I left an extra relay to make it a two stage limiter but found it to be unnecessary. This amount of resistance still left plenty of power to reverse up an incline, out of a driveway, but made it infinitely more controllable.


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

rctous said:


> jrp3 I am curious to see what he did do for his starts as well but I got to tell ya the new pot I made is ssoooooooooooooooooo smoothhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,, if yours is jerky especially in reverse , make one?? I can send ya a set og gears if you want??/
> 
> 
> Brian


Home made pot helped too, adjusted so there is just the tiniest, slightest amount of pedal movement before resistance starts climbing. Once the throttle linkage slop was removed I only really needed the limiter for reverse, starts in first gear could be done perfectly smoothly with nothing but a steady foot (still much more sensitive than a normal ICE car though....the price you pay for instant torque)


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

rctous said:


> jrp3 I am curious to see what he did do for his starts as well but I got to tell ya the new pot I made is ssoooooooooooooooooo smoothhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,, if yours is jerky especially in reverse , make one?? I can send ya a set og gears if you want??/
> 
> 
> Brian


My question was mostly curiosity since I'm not using a Logisystems but have heard a lot of people complain about the jerky starts. However, I'm still early in the build process so I may be interested in your setup if I have problems.


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## rctous (Jun 18, 2008)

after putting on a few more miles today on the new Saturn this pot is very smooth in reverse as forward. I am able to move at start and not go ove like 1/2 mph in reverse I meseed around with paralleling resistors but found that it effected the controller and it would even react at all. as soon as I removed the paralled resistor it was back to normal? I asked the question as to wht but never heard from any one.

Brian


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

rctous said:


> after putting on a few more miles today on the new Saturn this pot is very smooth in reverse as forward. I am able to move at start and not go ove like 1/2 mph in reverse I meseed around with paralleling resistors but found that it effected the controller and it would even react at all. as soon as I removed the paralled resistor it was back to normal? I asked the question as to wht but never heard from any one.
> 
> Brian


Hmm, were you adding them in series or parallel? Well it made all the difference for me, but only after I got the pot set up correctly without them. The first pot I tried was junk, even had a flimsy feel to it. Instead of 0-5k smoothly it went 0-0-0-.5k-.7k-.8k-.9k...etc, not a true linear progression. I found a surplus military linear 25k pot on ebay (I needed 0-5k in 1/5th of a rotation for my setup, this will vary based on the length of the arm and the pedal travel I think) and it was so much better. 

I think the jerkiness really has more to do with instant torque than anything - people arent used to it. Just a little extra throttle travel and you're blasting forward. Its much worse in lower gears; I had new drivers start out in second to make the pedal a little more "mushy" like a normal car when I let them drive the EV.

Plus I think Logisystems ships the controllers with the throttle ramp pretty quick, its adjustable via pots under those screws (for anyone who doesn't know).


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## blackpanther-st (Apr 4, 2009)

"jerkiness"

There are two types of pots (refering to the actual variable resistor inside the assembly) one is linear and the other is audio taper which uses an exponential progression. If the standard linear comes on to fast you may want to try an audio taper to soften the light end of the accelerator and condense the heavy end where all the power should be. 

you may have to switch ends, as one side will make it worse rather than better, because it will condense the begining rather than the end.


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## AmpEater (Mar 10, 2008)

blackpanther-st said:


> "jerkiness"
> 
> There are two types of pots (refering to the actual variable resistor inside the assembly) one is linear and the other is audio taper which uses an exponential progression. If the standard linear comes on to fast you may want to try an audio taper to soften the light end of the accelerator and condense the heavy end where all the power should be.
> 
> you may have to switch ends, as one side will make it worse rather than better, because it will condense the begining rather than the end.


Very good point! I forgot to mention that, many of the pots you see are linear taper because that is the most common app. If it doesn't specifically say "linear" it probably isn't.


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## chrisst907 (Mar 27, 2008)

I have blemished ones listed in the classifieds, 1000amp 120-156volt will run you $1150 plus $99 for a pot box. It is listed in the classified section.


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