# performance EV on a budget!



## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

Hello, 

This is my first post here, so let me introduce myself I am a 16 year old looking to build an electric car from a 1968 Datsun 510 for my first car... My dad has been racing ICE Datsun 510s for about 14 years, it has been my favorite car for a looooonnng time!
I'm looking for good performance (100-120Km/h) and good range on a charge (100-150km on a charge enough to make it from my house to grandmas). I don't have a lot of cash, so I'm looking to spend around $3000- $6000 (electronics only)... I have connections with the owner of a forklift maintenance company, who I could get parts at a very very good price from. Could any one help me with any ideas on Motor/ Controller/ Battery pack items. I'd like to keep the motor DC and around 150-200lbs, and would Optima batteries be in the question?

EXTRA INFO:
1968 Datsun 510 four door sedan stock diff, and 5spd tranny from a 240sx...
available Nissan Racing clutch 
little rust, and two parts cars on hand...
Have '72 Datsun 510 ICE powered race car (oval track)...
This will be my first car...


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## Woodsmith (Jun 5, 2008)

Hi and welcome.

I have moved your thread to a more suitable forum. You should get more replies here.

Your budget isn't big so you will be limited in speed and/or range.

First stop would be to look a the Paul and Sabrina Open Revolt controller kit. That will be a lot cheaper then buying a ready made controller.

Have a read of the sticky threads in this forum and the motors forum. It will give you some good starting information about what you can do and what sort of motor to look for.

At your budget you will probably be limited to lead acid batteries.


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

tdbeasley said:


> good performance 100-120Km/h, 100-150km on a charge, spend around $3000- $6000.


Sorry, but it's impossible these days!


You need to reduce the range need or increase the budget.

The best you can do with this low budget is:
Build your controller (400-600$)
Rebuild a used forklift motor (200-500$)
Put all the rest of your money on battery, charger, BMS (4000-5000$)

And expect a range around 50-70Km at relatively low speed (50-60km/h) and probably less than 30km at 100-120 km/h.

Good luck, your Datsun 510 seem a nice car!


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## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

Thanks for the reply!

So I should expect be able to roughly 30km at 100km/h, that's highway speed, and not too bad of a range. What should I expect for torque? good enough to have a sporty feel? What size of a forklift motor should I look for?


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2011)

9" Motor if possible. 
120 volt system and lithium if possible. Do better than 100 AH cells if possible. 
Synkromotive controller will do you well for the performance you desire and the controller can be configured to suite your needs. A good DC DC converter and an amp and volt meter and if possible an amp counter. You might want to just use the amp counter built into the controller I mentioned. 

An adaptor and use the clutch. The 510 will be a kicker to convert. I had wanted to do that too. Start now and find good parts and don't just go buy the first thing that comes about. Plan and be very very frugal and picky. 

Pete 

Even though your budget seems tight I know you can work and save and scrimp but don't cut corners to get what you need. You can do it. Patience will be a great help. We are all happy to help you build your ride. There is lots to learn so dig in and begin your project.


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## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

Thanks for the reply!

Thanks for that info, should be very useful! My dad has TONS of 510 parts for his racecar, and two parts cars so I think we should be able to put a good one together, but its really hard to find one that's not been rusted out or full of bondo. 
Say if I came across a 1500lb (or heaver) Toyota lift truck with roughly 220 kW motor (180lbs to 210lbs in weight), could I use the controller/ throttle pedal/ wiring from that machine with new batteries, or would you recomend going for the new Synkromotive controller that you mentioned hands down? also, I was told, that with a big motor like the one I just mentioned; It would tear a clutch apart (even a racing one) upon take off; so they recommended using a heavy duty automatic tranny... never really heard this before :/


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi TD

You seem to have some contradictory figures, 
1500lbs is very small for a fork lift
220Kw is HUGE for an electric fork lift

I have an 11 inch forklift motor, it cost me $100 and weighs 102Kg - it is rated at 10Kw
For preference you need its little brother a 9 inch unit (that what I need as well but it was such a good buy..)

10Kw is continuous at 48v - I will be running at 150v and I expect it will be OK at ~ 30Kw continous and 100+ Kw for a short time

Read the thread on using a forklift motor

Also read the thread on the OpenRevolt controller


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2011)

Hunt for a good 9" motor for a decent price. If your not sure take some excellent photos of the motor and the motor info plate and post it here. We can help. If possible both ends and the commutator/brushes too. 

Controllers are another issue for budget minded folks. Yes the OpenRevolt is a good choice if you have the ability to put it together. I say the Synkro because it will give you more available power and will be good if you decided later to upgrade your voltage level. It is a 180 volt 750 amp controller. Price is less than the competition so it makes it an affordable option. Not a requirement. That is your choice to make. But the lower the peak amps and lower the continuous amps the less power you get. 750 Peak is very good. I have that in my MG right now. My MG is quite spritely and will giddyup pretty good. You'd be happy. If you want to know about the OpenRevolt check the site and ask others who are using it. But I'd think if you want a get up and go you need as much peak amps as possible for the price. I run mine at 700 amps and 120 volts. 

Motors can be found for good prices from forklifts and can be ran at 120 volts no problem. I'd say try to get up to 144 or even 156 volts if possible. 

I remember seeing a huge performance improvement from 72 to 96 volts then even more from 96 to 120. So if I go up to 144 or 156 I will see even more. It is amazing the power of the electric motor at high voltages and usually you only run at that high for less than a minute or so at a time anyway. 

Pete 

Happy hunting. Get us those photos. Look for old abandoned electric vehicle projects too. They may be a good low cost source for parts. Maybe even all the parts except an adaptor and batteries. Think about it and go hunting. Don't forget to do your reading on the subject. Lots to read about.


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## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

Duncan said:


> You seem to have some contradictory figures,
> 1500lbs is very small for a fork lift
> 220Kw is HUGE for an electric fork lift


Duncan,
Sorry that was my bad I meant to put 2500lbs and heavier (realistically anywhere from 3000lbs to 8000lbs). As far as the 220Kw part, that does seem like huge power! I spoke to the electric motor specialist at the forklift shop, and he said that I could potentially have that much power once mounted and with the right controller/ battery option. This was in reference to a specific lift truck. With the forklift motor that you have, are you using any of the other original elctronics ie, throttle by wire, or any of the wiring or gauges?

Pete,
Your MG sounds like a hoot! Those figures and set up sound very promising! I may be able to stick very close to that. With your MG, do you have it set up with an automatic or a standard transmission? If its standard, are you using any special set up? ie, *no* clutch or flywheel, or are you running a performance/ heavy duty clutch and shaved flywheel?


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2011)

MG uses stock 4 speed clutch and flywheel. I can smoke the clutch in 1st. I rarely use 1st. I also don't push 2nd too hard either.


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## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

Huh, interesting! Thanks


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## Duncan (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi gottdi_

MG uses stock 4 speed clutch and flywheel. I can smoke the clutch in 1st. I rarely use 1st. I also don't push 2nd too hard either.

_You mean tires don't you? the clutch is heaviest loaded in top and lowest load in 1st


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2011)

Duncan,

No, I smoke the clutch. The tires stick too good and it just smokes. I can floor it in 2nd and it just launches. It launches even better in 1st but it smokes the clutch. I know clutch stink quite well. So I stay out of it in 1st. I never do 4th gear starts because if I floor it there it too will smoke the clutch. So I never start out in 4th. I do only hard 2nd or 3rd starts and never smoke the clutch in those gears. 

I know about the gearing issue and what your saying. It should be the least possible to smoke the clutch in 1st and greatest in 4th but reality does not always follow what might be. I think it's my tires that are the deciding factor. 

Anyway I can smoke the clutch if I am not careful. I usually ease into but once moving I can put the hammer down and it just scoots. Love the MG but it's too small for me.


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## tdbeasley (Jul 13, 2011)

gottdi said:


> Controllers are another issue for budget minded folks. Yes the OpenRevolt is a good choice if you have the ability to put it together. I say the Synkro because it will give you more available power and will be good if you decided later to upgrade your voltage level. It is a 180 volt 750 amp controller. Price is less than the competition so it makes it an affordable option. Not a requirement. That is your choice to make. But the lower the peak amps and lower the continuous amps the less power you get. 750 Peak is very good. I have that in my MG right now. My MG is quite spritely and will giddyup pretty good. You'd be happy. If you want to know about the OpenRevolt check the site and ask others who are using it. But I'd think if you want a get up and go you need as much peak amps as possible for the price. I run mine at 700 amps and 120 volts.



Hey all,
Just looking about, and reseaching things. I found this Revolt controller on an EV classified site. Is it something i could consider? say with forklift motor running at 120v? What would the range and pep be like? Im not expecting to have amazing performance right away, just something i can work with for the time being that i could upgrade later.

http://evtradinpost.com/index.php?m...ory&fromfrommethod=showhtmllist&fromfromid=30

TD


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