# First wrecked GMC Hummer EV on COPART



## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

I see it's the much-coveted 3 wheel steering edition with amputated-crab walk.

These trust fund babies in Florida should have to get a special license endorsement for anything over 300hp, just like private pilots have to.


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## CliffordK (Oct 8, 2011)

Bid up to about $96,000 now. Plus auction fees.



remy_martian said:


> I see it's the much-coveted 3 wheel steering edition with amputated-crab walk.





















So it is supposed to have independent rear suspension and quad steering. With the front end and the rear end looking very similar.

And what they call a "skateboard" design with all the batteries and drive in a frame unit.










If it was a conventional vehicle with front end steering, it is not uncommon to blow out the upper and/or lower control arms. This one appears as if it may be sitting on all 4 wheels, so it may be a blown out steering knuckle (tearing the tie rod ends off of the knuckle). Also possibly blown out CV joints).

I'd be very surprised if this vehicle isn't rebuilt and put back on the road.


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## Electric Land Cruiser (Dec 30, 2020)

Love the ludicrous nature of these beasts. TFL Trucks bought one, Andre plugged it into 120v socket and it said it would take 4 days to charge up 😂


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## CliffordK (Oct 8, 2011)

Electric Land Cruiser said:


> Love the ludicrous nature of these beasts. TFL Trucks bought one, Andre plugged it into 120v socket and it said it would take 4 days to charge up 😂




So far I've been charging my Azure Transit Connect on 110V. I haven't done a deep discharge, but it can take a day to give me about 20 miles of range. Two days for about 40 miles range. I can imagine it could be longer if I do a deep discharge.

I did find a 220V public charger once. I goofed on getting it started, but about 10 miles range in a half hour.

I could imagine a vehicle with a 212.7 kWh battery pack would take some time to do a full charge at 110v.

It should do OK with 30A or 40A 220V. Hmmm.... 212,700 Wh / (30*220) = about 32 hours for a full charge. Probably fine for normal daily commutes, but anything long distance, and one will need DC charging.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

My 99 Silverado ICE also has a skateboard design, with gas tank, gearbox, and motor all in a frame. In other words, it's a term Musk popularized, but it means nothing.

This will likely go over MSRP and will get loaded into a sea container (if it fits, lol...it has clearance lights because it is wide, not for tough looks), bound for some rich dude in a country where they can't import a new or used one without paying nutso excise & duty - this will likely get classified as car parts for import purposes, if it's a salvage title.

They, Rich Rebuilds, Leaf battery swappers, and the solar people, ruined EV auctions.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

CliffordK said:


> So it is supposed to have independent rear suspension and quad steering. With the front end and the rear end looking very similar.
> ...
> If it was a conventional vehicle with front end steering, it is not uncommon to blow out the upper and/or lower control arms. This one appears as if it may be sitting on all 4 wheels, so it may be a blown out steering knuckle (tearing the tie rod ends off of the knuckle). Also possibly blown out CV joints)...


Yes, collision damage can leave one rear wheel pointing an odd direction, just as similar damage can leave a front wheel pointing an odd direction. This is true of double-wishbone and multilink independent suspensions in general, even the ones that don't deliberately steer.

Anyone considering either fixing a vehicle like this or using it as a source for salvaged rear-end parts would, of course, be crazy to do that without a real examination. The Copart listing is crap, because it doesn't show or describe the mechanical or structural damage.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

CliffordK said:


> ...
> And what they call a "skateboard" design with all the batteries and drive in a frame unit.
> ...


A skateboard is literally a board, with nothing on top and the mechanics (two axle-suspension assemblies called "trucks") attached to the bottom. A skateboard-style vehicle would similarly have a structural floor with all of the chassis and powertrain below it, and any body installed on top. There are no skateboard vehicles in production, and I don't recall one ever being built.

This GMC Hummer EV is not a skateboard. There is no flat structural floor on top of the chassis, and the components shown in the marketing mockup are not even structurally complete (note the upper control arms suspended in the air with no frame mounts). As already mentioned, it is a relatively conventional body-on-frame design, as are the Ford F-150 Lightning and Chevrolet Silverado EV.

No other production EV is a skateboard, either. Tesla models all have conventional unibody structures. The powertrain and chassis components were often displayed it the early days without the body, making the battery case look like a "skateboard" platform, but that battery case is not a part of the structure, is not even structurally connected to the chassis subframes, and actually hangs under the body rather than supporting anything. A classic Volkswagen Beetle is sort of close to a skateboard; a Tesla is not.


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## CliffordK (Oct 8, 2011)

Ok, starting very early, Ford offered the TT truck with a chassis only option. Not flat on top like the EVs, but not much more than an engine, frame, and suspension.

I am a bit surprised the upper control arms seem to be designed to attach to the body panels. I'll have to look at some of them in conventional gasoline vehicles. I'm not surprised the struts also seem to attach to the body panels.

Aptera is supposed to have a structural battery pack, but the front suspension is attached to the body.

Via Motors is showing a fully self supporting Chassis... at least on some of their prototypes.










A fairly modular rolling chassis (skateboard?) would make assembly easier for some smaller companies.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Again with the Muskisms. "structural battery"

The guy excels at bullshitting. 

The 4680 cells are mounted on ABS, a 4 year old decided to pour goo everywhere, and mounting seats on the lid all of a sudden became "structural."

Pull the battery from a Model S, and run it over Belgian bricks in circles while plugged into an extension cord...the glass will crack because the pack is part of the vehicle's structural calculations. That battery box is built like a brick poophouse.


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## CliffordK (Oct 8, 2011)

remy_martian said:


> This will likely go over MSRP and will get loaded into a sea container (if it fits, lol...it has clearance lights because it is wide, not for tough looks), bound for some rich dude in a country where they can't import a new or used one without paying nutso excise & duty - this will likely get classified as car parts for import purposes, if it's a salvage title.
> 
> They, Rich Rebuilds, Leaf battery swappers, and the solar people, ruined EV auctions.


The bidder back was $102,000 to Utah.
The auction sold for $103,000 to Armenia.

I'm not sure the reserve was met. If not there will be a couple of days of negotiation, and it may pop back up.

I'm not quite sure what the MSRP is. I think somewhere from $110,000 to $120,000.

I had seen some "new" Hummers on COPART a while ago for about $130,000.

Copart was listing the Estimated Retail Value of this Hummer at $198,059.00 USD.

And, I'm seeing used listings at around $190,000 to $200,000. 

I think what may have happened is that the major EV Pickup manufacturers primarily built their deluxe models for 2022 (most features, most expensive). And built them in quantities much lower than demand. So, there is some level of rapid turnaround of them (or dreamer prices). And, of course, bonkers gas prices. 

But, it will take a lot of gas to pay for that.

Say 200,000 miles.
10 MPG
$10 / gallon gas.

Well, that comes out to about $200,000. We aren't quite there yet, but California could hit $10 average within the next few years.

If the infrastructure could support it, I could imagine some hotshot truckers being interested in EVs, but 300 mile range empty won't be nearly enough.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

CliffordK said:


> Ok, starting very early, Ford offered the TT truck with a chassis only option. Not flat on top like the EVs, but not much more than an engine, frame, and suspension.


Yes, that's called a bare chassis or stripped chassis. They have driver controls and a bit more sticking up, to be integrated with the body; if it also has a cowl panel that's called a chassis-cowl. You can buy one today from various manufacturers. That's how RV companies make Class A motorhomes; mine is a Damon body on top of a Ford F53 chassis. "Step vans" (traditionally used as bread trucks and now as delivery vans such as UPS brown boxes) are similarly built by van manufactures on stripped or chassis-cowl; traditional school buses are on chassis-cowls that come complete with a hood.



CliffordK said:


> I am a bit surprised the upper control arms seem to be designed to attach to the body panels. I'll have to look at some of them in conventional gasoline vehicles. I'm not surprised the struts also seem to attach to the body panels.


They presumably just left some less-than-pretty bracketry off of the demo unit; it would make no sense to attach the control arms to the body in a body-on-frame vehicle.
It is common for cars with unibody structures and subframes to mount the top of the struts to the body (rather than the subframe), because the body is the vehicle structure. That's unlikely to be the case in the Hummer EV.

Here's a GM marketing image via Jalopnik that shows more upper front structure, using large aluminum castings:











CliffordK said:


> Via Motors is showing a fully self supporting Chassis... at least on some of their prototypes.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Some of the recent startups have shifted from complete vehicle to stripped chassis, because they can't find a market for the complete vehicles or can't fund the start of complete vehicle manufacturing, and there are other companies that build vehicles on commercially available chassis and can add an EV to their lineup this way.

It's not a skateboard, but there is lots of flexibility in body design, in part because no engine sticks up.


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## bwikene (7 mo ago)

CliffordK said:


> So far I've been charging my Azure Transit Connect on 110V. I haven't done a deep discharge, but it can take a day to give me about 20 miles of range. Two days for about 40 miles range. I can imagine it could be longer if I do a deep discharge.
> 
> I did find a 220V public charger once. I goofed on getting it started, but about 10 miles range in a half hour.
> 
> ...


My Tesla S Plaid charges on a 220v 60amp circuit in 4-5 hours from 20% to 80-95%


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Which is great if you only sleep 4-5 hours cuz you gotta work, and also commute to, two jobs to make payments on it 😂

For the rest of us, 14 hours of charging at home is perfectly fine, with the car on the road or at work for the other ten hours of the day.

Because, with an EV you plug in when you get home and you unplug when you leave.

Unless you are hotseating the car with your housemate, it's a totally silly brag.

Now, tell us how many laps it'll do on a track before it overheats, because your motor is only rated for about 85kW continous power 🤨


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## bwikene (7 mo ago)

remy_martian said:


> Which is great if you only sleep 4-5 hours cuz you gotta work, and also commute to, two jobs to make payments on it 😂
> 
> For the rest of us, 14 hours of charging at home is perfectly fine, with the car on the road or at work for the other ten hours of the day.
> 
> ...


I can go about 300 miles on a charge at 80-85 mph in Florida temps. In town driving about 350 miles. I would get higher mileage but in Florida, I use my A/C and seat coolers all the time. I drive in Chill mode, (grandpa mode) 340hp mode. I don't know if you have driven on Florida highways but 15 mph over the speed limit is common. If I was working I would be charging my car probably once a week. I run it down to 20% battery and up to 80% for around-town use, and up to 95% for trips of 200 miles or more on the freeway. A super charger will charge my car to 100% in 40 minutes from 20% battery. The batteries are water cooled, At 1020HP you will run out of battery very quickly, less that 75 miles. 1/4 mile runs are fine and it beat a Porsche on the Nurburgring track 11 mile course in Germany. So it will go at least 11 miles at speed. It has a track mode for race courses, a launch mode for dragraces. I bought the plaid because I could get it 3 months sooner than a the standard S model that had a 6 month wait list.
I am all for electric vehicles, but I have a small collection of 50s and 40s ICE cars. I will be converting one of my 50s cars to EV with Tesla components. I am a little concerned about miles per charge on pickupsand SUVs when towing at this time.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Yes. You're preaching to the choir here on what a Tesla Model S has spec'd (Plaids are rare - congrats on overbuying a car you drive in chill for the status), but none of your reply has anything to do with 4 hour charging in your garage. It's pointless to put that big of a wall unit up unless you have 2 EVSEs charging two cars simultaneously, which is then an 8-10 hour charge time.

The 50's conversion sounds interesting. How will you live with a dozen hours to charge, 100-ish miles of range, and no Supercharging, though?


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## bwikene (7 mo ago)

remy_martian said:


> Yes. You're preaching to the choir here on what a Tesla Model S has spec'd (Plaids are rare - congrats on overbuying a car you drive in chill for the status), but none of your reply has anything to do with 4 hour charging in your garage. It's pointless to put that big of a wall unit up unless you have 2 EVSEs charging two cars simultaneously, which is then an 8-10 hour charge time.
> 
> The 50's conversion sounds interesting. How will you live with a dozen hours to charge, 100-ish miles of range, and no Supercharging, though?


I will still be able to use supercharger station as the Plymouth body will be on the Tesla chassis. and will be registered as a salvage titled Tesla S. I will still have the range of a Tesla S, minus a little for the lack of Tesla's drag coefficient. It will be a Tesla with the Plymouth body mounted on it. Another fellow put a Packard body on the Tesla platform. His was a 30s Packard. I will have to split the Plymouth down the middle lengthwise and widen it about 5". My 51 Plymouth is the Belvedere 2 dr ht.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Last I heard was that salvage titled Teslas are blacklisted from Supercharging unless they get recertified by Tesla. 

You should be able to do your 60amp garage charger in any case.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Here's the writeup on what happened with that CoPart Hummer:









YouTuber Says His Viral Hummer EV Crash Cost Him $80,000


A dip in the road bent the truck's frame, destroyed the suspension, and tweaked most of the body panels.




www.roadandtrack.com





Gotta feel sorry for someone thinking it just needed some rear axle tweaking. Unibody for trucks sux.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Video of it getting bent:


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## CliffordK (Oct 8, 2011)

@ remy_martian

That photo was stolen from COPART. Exact image posted above. However, it doesn't match the body damage that was suffered going through the ditch in the video. There was no damage to the rear passenger door and bed in the video.

You can even see the vehicles in front of it that weren't cropped out of the image in the video.

It could have tweaked the frame, but really just looks like a blown steering knuckle or tie rod.

I am a bit surprised he was able to wipe out the radiator. And more surprised he chose to drive it home without coolant and the damage to the rear drive.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

That moneybags chimp is the reason you should have a special license for >300hp....he was totally out of control of the truck for a good part of that drive. Claims to be a race car driver, but doesn't notice a ditch (that was not a "dip") coming up?

Yeah, nose diving a 4-1/2 ton urban assault battle tank into a ditch will take out the radiator when you are offroading with a soft suspension setting (another stupid thing he did).

He clearly did further damage to it afterwards by driving it with the cocked rear wheel.

The sad part is he's clearly self-insured and he got most of his money back at the auction. Pocket change for Youtube clicks.


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