# ADC FB1-4001A noise?



## ARti (Oct 27, 2008)

Hi. I'd like some help in diagnosing a potential motor/adapter noise.

I posted a 20 second video to YouTube that shows me hand turning the motor to illustrate a noise that popped up a little over a year ago.

Please review the video (with volume up...): http://youtu.be/kze5XrIgxiY

Problem: Squeaky noise, frequency relative to the motor shaft speed, not wheel or transmission speed. It started when the weather got cold in the fall of 2011. I thought it might go away when it got warm again, but never did. It's not always present, but is probably audible 75% of the time at low speed. I assume that it's there at higher speed, but the road noise probably covers it up.

Background:
Project: 1997 BMW 318ti hatchback
Components Ordered from EVA: January 2009
Project initiated and completed myself, with mechanical help from local buddies with a fab shop and Tool/Die experience. They also built the adapter from the motor shaft to the flywheel (yes, I decided to keep the clutch). The first electric drive was in April of 2010. I have around 2500 electric miles on it. I haven't noticed any growing vibrations or shuddering associated with the noise. I haven't noticed any slop in the linkage or any running issue, it's just that the noise embarrasses the kids and kills the whole "Electric Cars are Quiet" message. I can continue to live with it, but suspect that someday it may strand me somewhere. 

Does anybody recognize this squeak as brush wear, commutator problems, or bearing issues? Please note that the video was shot without power to the motor, so it's not the Curtis low switching frequency whine...

Suggestions welcome,
Phillip


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## Electric Forklift Guy (Dec 13, 2012)

ARti said:


> Hi. I'd like some help in diagnosing a potential motor/adapter noise.
> 
> I posted a 20 second video to YouTube that shows me hand turning the motor to illustrate a noise that popped up a little over a year ago.
> 
> ...


It sounds like the bearing is slipping

Pop the commutator end bell off and I bet you'll find out the bearing is loose and can spin inside the housing

There's a lot of inexpensive ways to fix it.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Sounds like something rubbing on the brush cover screen. Check inside for any thing touching. Could be the internal fan rubbing on something. Remove the cover and check for wear marks and get a good strong light in there and have a real good look around. The sound is kind of tinny. I imagine it is quite loud while driving. 

Could it be a bearing. Yes. but check all other avenues first. Check the brushes. If you can get some photos too. Just sound won't be enough but it sounds tinny not grinding. 

Here is a bad bearing video. Yes that Ghia is all electric.


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## onegreenev (May 18, 2012)

Not likely an adaptor issue.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

ARti said:


> Hi. I'd like some help in diagnosing a potential motor/adapter noise.
> <snip>
> Suggestions welcome,
> Phillip


Pull the coverband off so you can get to the brushes. Chock the car and disconnect the battery. Inspect the brushes. You should be able to pull each brush outward and sort of latch it against the spring so it no longer touches the commutator. Once all 8 brushes are lifted, see if the noise is still there. If so, then it is not brush squeal. If the noise is determined to be caused by the brushes on the comm, you need to stone the comm (that is to use a dressing stone on the comm).

Be sure to set the brushes back down to the comm and make sure each moves freely with good spring force.

It does not sound like a bearing to me. Anyway, report back with some photos of the comm.


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## dragonsgate (May 19, 2012)

I remember you posting this problem but not the details. Have you pinpointed where the noise is coming from? If not cut a length of about two feet of heater hose to use as a listening device. While turning the motor or having someone else turning it put one end of the hose to your ear and move the other end close to each end of the motor. This should help zero in on the noise. While it doesn’t sound like one to get an idea of the bearings use an automotive stethoscope or a good sized screwdriver. Put the blade of the screwdriver as close as possible and firmly against the area around the bearing and your ear firmly against the end of the handle while turning or having someone turning the motor. The motor should be spinning a little faster than just hand speed for the bearing test. I take it you have not pulled the motor to have a look? It could be the springs in the clutch disk or throw out bearing.


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## ARti (Oct 27, 2008)

That's good stuff. This weekend is remarkably free, so I'll put the Bimmer back on the jack stands and get the covers off, take some pix etc. While I'm under it, I'll have a chance to spin and listen at either end and the flywheel. It'll have to be hand speed only though, as noted in another post, I've also got battery issues currently, so they're all out of the car, on the bench.

Dragonsgate, next time you're planning an art supply run to Fayetteville, send me a note and you can stop by for a listen.

Thanks all; I'll let you know what I find.

[major: thanks for your reasoned assistance on that other post]


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## ARti (Oct 27, 2008)

Well, there it is then.
It's not the motor at all, it's in the Clutch as Dragonsgate suggested. I took the control board out and the coverband off. Everything looks fine on the commutator end (see attached pic). Listening more closely and placing a sonic damper (shop towel) over the Commutator, Drive End vents, and Adapter, was able to clearly tell that the sound comes from the adapter area. 

Looking at it up close, listening to the noise, thinking about the various parts in that area, it could only be the clutch. It's definitely not the rear bearing (thanks for the video onegreenev) because it's not chatter. Luckily, back in December, I finally fixed the clutch slave cylinder**. So, I had my daughter push the clutch pedal while I hand spun, and the noise goes away (see long-winded explanation below for why I hadn't had the ability to test whether the clutch drove the noise previously). 

So, it's good to know that it's not a motor or adapter issue; just a run of the mill clutch issue. Still loud and annoying though.

Thanks everybody for the suggestions,
Phillip

**Even though I wanted to retain the clutch in my conversion, the slave cylinder blew out during disassembly or reassembly. I never bothered to fix it; instead, I quickly got used to driving clutchless like all the other clutchless conversions. In December, I decided that since I had the batteries out, I'd go ahead and install my new slave cylinder and have that ready to go once I got my battery issue fixed. I don't know how much I'll use it; shifting without it is fine. However, there are times when I'd like to start in first gear for a quick start, but the shift between first and second takes forever to synchronize and rapidly kills any real acceleration you've got going. I assume some of that delay is due to carrying the flywheel around even though I'm not getting the benefit of using the clutch. It sort of like I've got the worst of both worlds.


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## dragonsgate (May 19, 2012)

If you still have the noise you might try backing off the clutch linkage so the throughout bearing has a 16th to an 8th inch clearance between it and the pressure plate spines. Try that first.


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