# A123 20ah battery source?



## Batter (Nov 11, 2011)

I see a website which sell the 20ah battery , It's an auction, 8pcs is just $199, I think if you want to buy this kind of battery,it's a good choose.It's really a bargin.
http://a123rc.com/auction-6.html


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## Rational (Nov 26, 2011)

Batter said:


> I see a website which sell the 20ah battery , It's an auction, 8pcs is just $199, I think if you want to buy this kind of battery,it's a good choose.It's really a bargin.
> http://a123rc.com/auction-6.html


If you can find this battery on Nextag you can find the price range that half the people paid for this. 
I guess 'a bargain' would mean the bottom end of the range should be $200/8 = $25.

E.g., for battery prices
7
25
35
80
half the people paid between 25 & 35 and I wonder what kind of battery the other 50% got.


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## Batter (Nov 11, 2011)

Rational said:


> If you can find this battery on Nextag you can find the price range that half the people paid for this.
> I guess 'a bargain' would mean the bottom end of the range should be $200/8 = $25.
> 
> E.g., for battery prices
> ...


 Actually I thought I found a good chance to save my money before I see your reply! Thank you !


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## A123rc002 (Nov 9, 2011)

Batter said:


> Actually I thought I found a good chance to save my money before I see your reply! Thank you !


 But I think it's really cheaper than other sites, you know it's a A123 20ah .
Have you see the 20ah in the same site not in the auction , they sold in their original price, make a comparison, the auction surrender part of profits.


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## Rational (Nov 26, 2011)

Thanks for your reply. Don't get me started on auctions! 

I've never bought batteries of this kind, mostly I do theory and number crunching, which is how I happened to blow the whistle on my former employer. I worked in low power electronics.
On this forum my background can be a plus [no biases] or a minus [ignorance].

But . . . while we're on the subject. . .would anyone care to post their battery lives, in time or charge cycles? 
I don't need more than 30 samples, which is considered to be a statistically 'large' sample. Excel will do the data reduction.

This question seems to come up frequently and since the manufs are not about to tell us the reliability, the least that can be done is to provide benchmarks.
Lack of reliability is a hidden cost of ownership.

Meanwhile, I'll do some searching for this kind of data on Web.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

Rational said:


> But . . . while we're on the subject. . .would anyone care to post their battery lives, in time or charge cycles?



I don't think anyone has run enough cycles on either cylindrical like a123 or prismatic to have them die of natural causes under 'regular' EV use...

before you gather a bunch of junk data you need to learn about possible qualifiers. i.e. average %DOD in use, max burst C loads and frequency, sustained C loads, top-balance, bottom balance, with or without BMS, whether the BMS was a monitoring system or active shunt management during charge.....

my point is there are LOTS of variables in use that are known to affect life. If you don't qualify your samples, you'll have junk data and junk results.


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## Genius Pooh (Dec 23, 2011)

EBay seller said me he can some amount battery about 18.5 $ without ebay and 19$ with ebay.. I hope it willl help you.


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## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

Genius Pooh said:


> EBay seller said me he can some amount battery about 18.5 $ without ebay and 19$ with ebay.. I hope it willl help you.



ebay sellers offering discounts off ebay tend to be sketchy.....


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## Genius Pooh (Dec 23, 2011)

dtbaker said:


> ebay sellers offering discounts off ebay tend to be sketchy.....


 
I don't understand what you mean?

I'm Korean. Living in Korea.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/70P-A123-20ah-Batteries-/250927848349?pt=US_Batteries&hash=item3a6c771b9d

ebay address..

[email protected] is email address email to him.


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## powerhouse (Apr 1, 2011)

Not to mention the internal resistance is through the roof :O
6mOhm's per cell.... Way too high


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

powerhouse said:


> Not to mention the internal resistance is through the roof :O
> 6mOhm's per cell.... Way too high


If you look close it says 0.6mohms not 6....
0.6mohms is consistent with the measurements I've been getting using a PowerLab6 on my A123 cells. I can't comment on the absolute accuracy of the PL6 but the results have been consistent.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

_*Did some research on what these Chinese cells are and who is selling them:*_

*A123 Systems Prismatic Pouch Type 20Ah Automotive Class Lithium Ion Cell AMP20M1HD-A*  A123 Systems Prismatic Pouch Type 20Ah Automotive Class Lithium Ion Cell AMP20M1HD-A 30C (600A) discharge current per cell! I have contacted A123 USA and they say your cells are copies. Can you explain? 
___________________________________________________


Hi, Ronald,

They are not copies. But they might be lower grade. We got them from grey channel, not from A123 SYSTEMS. 
You can test samples to see if it fits your need.
Or buy directly from A123 SYSTEMS for best quality A grade.
Best regards,
Cindy
____________________________________________________

*From:* [email protected] 
*Sent:* Sunday, January 29, 2012 11:02 PM
*To:* [email protected] ; [email protected] 
*Subject:* [[email protected]]Inquiry from A123 Systems Prismatic Pouch Type 20Ah Automotive Class Lithium Ion Cell AMP20M1HD-A

____________________________________________________

_*I wish you guys luck, but these cells I would not trust!*_


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## kakheath (Jan 7, 2012)

I bought 500 A123 20Ah pouch cells from:

xin wang Shenzhen Victpower Technology Co., Ltd. [email protected] W:http://www.victpower.cn

I just got the tracking numbers for DHL yesterday. I'm very excited about the deal.  I wish the seller used sea freight. It would have taken a lot longer, but saved a lot of cash. 

The sea price only gets the batteries to your closest port. You are responsible for customs clearing and pickup or delivery to your location. If you do find a source that ships by sea, I have a source for a good customs broker that only charges about $125 per transaction http://www.rogers-brown.com/. They said the duty is about 3.4% of the declared price. If you're lucky the seller might declare a lower value to reduce this a bit. They quoted me about $175 freight from the port of Charleston to East TN where I'm building my car. This quote was for 420 16Ah Headways though. So the freight for 500 20Ah A123s would be a bit more. 

My guess is that shipping by sea would have saved about $1000. It's worth it if you can find a source willing to do this and can wait that long. Another problem with sea freight is that Paypal protection only lasts 45 days. So sea freight might eat most of this time up. Sea duration is estimated at around 30 days. Air freight is 3-5 days. If I'm lucky the batteries will arrive by the end of this week .


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

It is great to get a deal, but is it worth it playing Russian Roulette? I am only posting on this matter to save some from have serious battery issues. All these Chinese sales outlets selling A123 Pouch cells are giving out damaged cells, these sells have NOT passed QC from A123 because they failed testing. They should have been thrown in the garbage, it will hurt the industry (and your pocket) if one of you guys burn your garage down due to a failed cell. I hope all goes well, but I would watch these cells like a hawk.



kakheath said:


> I bought 500 A123 20Ah pouch cells from:
> 
> xin wang Shenzhen Victpower Technology Co., Ltd. [email protected] W:http://www.victpower.cn
> 
> ...


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

I have a history with Chinese companies, some build their own cells, like what Carl is selling from http://www.electriccarinternational.com/

Ask Carl about some of these companies, most are traders selling crap. They MUST be a manufacturer with Chinese Certifications to build/ sell a quality cell. There are only 3 Chinese companies that produce their own pouch cell that is 10AH or higher. Non produce a cell similar to A123 Amp 20 cells.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

This company seems to be more of a trader than a producer:

http://www.victpower.cn/product/423655255-210338518/sanyo_18650_2_25ah_battery_cell.html

They are selling Sanyo cells made in Japan, most likely defects. So, the A123 Amp20 cells they bought through the back door as defects.

These cells can be purchased directly from Sanyo, along with their Panasonic products. A123 cells can be purchased through Mavizen.

This link tells all you need to know:
http://victpower.en.gongchang.com/cert


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

*Here are two legit Chinese companies that you can trust:*

http://www.xcgdbattery.com/index.php?typeid=3
http://www.xcgdbattery.com/cp_look1.php?typeid=1&id1=67
_____________________________________________________

http://www.herewin.com/en_index.asp
http://www.herewin.com/en_rzlb.asp


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## kakheath (Jan 7, 2012)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> It is great to get a deal, but is it worth it playing Russian Roulette? I am only posting on this matter to save some from have serious battery issues. All these Chinese sales outlets selling A123 Pouch cells are giving out damaged cells, these sells have NOT passed QC from A123 because they failed testing. They should have been thrown in the garbage, it will hurt the industry (and your pocket) if one of you guys burn your garage down due to a failed cell. I hope all goes well, but I would watch these cells like a hawk.


Ron, with your experience what would you recommend in order to check out these cells? As a newbie, I want to know exactly what should be done to verify the cells are good. As you explain the steps, assume I know nothing about them. For example:

1. Check the current as-arrived voltage for consistency between the cells
2. Check the capacity using an analyzer like a powerlab 6
3. ???

I just bought the PL6, but haven't used it on anything yet. I have a volt meter. What could you share to help us newcomers protect ourselves from potentially bad batteries?


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

The only true source for valid A123 APM20 Pouch cells:

http://www.mavizen.com/A123.html
Notice Link: http://www.mavizen.com/A123/Special_Notice.html

*From A123 Systems Inc. and Mavizen Ltd on the supply of grey market cells*


Mavizen/A123 have been made aware of a number of outlets offering A123 Systems products for sale. These outlets claim to be able to offer vast quantities at very low prices. Some of the outlets for unauthorised A123 products include websites, eBay, and Alibaba to mention just a few.

Working alongside A123 Systems Inc, Mavizen has ascertained that these resellers may be supplying quality control failures, intercepted during the recycling process and passed of as new.

We are concerned for the reputation of our product and services as well the safety of those customers who have been led to believe that these cut price channels are authorised and that their supplies are genuine and safe. A123 Systems Inc., does not supply any product other than through authorised channels. These unauthorised traders represent poor value and are supplying a potentially dangerous product.

Aggressive steps have and are being taken to stop these activities. They pose a real danger to would be purchasers, and in some circumstances could lead to a catastrophic failure.

In the meantime, we would like to remind you that Mavizen _is_ an official channel partner of A123 Systems Inc. and all of our products come directly from the factory and are subject to the quality control and performance that delivers the best performance, safely and consistently.


Please let us know of any sources offering A123 products. We appreciate your understanding and help in this matter.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

kakheath said:


> Ron, with your experience what would you recommend in order to check out these cells? As a newbie, I want to know exactly what should be done to verify the cells are good. As you explain the steps, assume I know nothing about them. For example:
> 
> 1. Check the current as-arrived voltage for consistency between the cells
> 2. Check the capacity using an analyzer like a powerlab 6
> ...


Call your credit card company and get money back!
These cells can fail months into use causing a fire or ???


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## kakheath (Jan 7, 2012)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> Call your credit card company and get money back!
> These cells can fail months into use causing a fire or ???


That was the purpose of the 3.9% I paid to PayPal. It was for protection against any major defects/problems with the batteries. I need, however, to evaluate the batteries to ensure they are usable. IF JR from EVTV has the same quality A123s in his Dec 30th episode, http://jackrickard.blogspot.com/,then they seem to be "good enough" for me. 

I just thought you might elaborate on your statement about them failing after installment. Are there any tests that could be performed to verify them in advance of putting them in a car? I suppose I'll just take a sampling and start cycling them through the capacity test on the PL6.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

You can perform every test known to man for cell testing, internal failures can happen weeks to months away. Good Luck! 



kakheath said:


> That was the purpose of the 3.9% I paid to PayPal. It was for protection against any major defects/problems with the batteries. I need, however, to evaluate the batteries to ensure they are usable. IF JR from EVTV has the same quality A123s in his Dec 30th episode, http://jackrickard.blogspot.com/,then they seem to be "good enough" for me.
> 
> I just thought you might elaborate on your statement about them failing after installment. Are there any tests that could be performed to verify them in advance of putting them in a car? I suppose I'll just take a sampling and start cycling them through the capacity test on the PL6.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

kakheath said:


> That was the purpose of the 3.9% I paid to PayPal. It was for protection against any major defects/problems with the batteries.


Paypal will only refund your money if you can prove a defect, are you a certified battery shop or testing facility? Does it state on their website that these cells are refundable if found defective? They can blame you and your build to fight any refund. Just trying to help.


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> Paypal will only refund your money if you can prove a defect, are you a certified battery shop or testing facility? Does it state on their website that these cells are refundable if found defective? They can blame you and your build to fight any refund. Just trying to help.


Paypal will almost always side with the customer, it's rather annoying. So the buyer only has to prove that the item is not exactly as described to win. And if there is a dispute the sellers account is often put on hold so they will usually try to resolve it quickly.


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## frodus (Apr 12, 2008)

Sellers CANNOT charge a different amount for using paypal, i.e. they can't make you pay the paypal fee just because you chose that route. The price with using a CC, doing transfer or doing paypal must all be the same.

just something to consider.....


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## phairno (Dec 16, 2011)

kakheath said:


> I bought 500 A123 20Ah pouch cells from:
> 
> xin wang Shenzhen Victpower Technology Co., Ltd. [email protected] W:http://www.victpower.cn
> 
> ...


 You said that you bought them from victpower, but I see a bad news from another forum, maybe it is useful for you ,http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=33939
Good luck!


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## powerhouse (Apr 1, 2011)

phairno said:


> You said that you bought them from victpower, but I see a bad news from another forum, maybe it is useful for you ,http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=33939
> Good luck!


As a rebuttal to this comment, I read this entire thread last night to see what the verdict was. 

In summary, the company sent the man bad cells
man makes paypal claim
Company promises to fix the problems
They ship new cells to him
He receives them, they are all above 19Ah
He cancels paypal claim

That thread actually allowed me to gain a little trust in the company


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## phairno (Dec 16, 2011)

powerhouse said:


> As a rebuttal to this comment, I read this entire thread last night to see what the verdict was.
> 
> In summary, the company sent the man bad cells
> man makes paypal claim
> ...


 different people have different views, in this situation, they have no idea, 'cause the man made paypal claim, why not send him good batteries at the very start. Obviously, this company didn't test their batteries before they sent it.It only shows that their quality control is not perfect. It's just a personal view.


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

phairno said:


> different people have different views, in this situation, they have no idea, 'cause the man made paypal claim, why not send him good batteries at the very start. Obviously, this company didn't test their batteries before they sent it.It only shows that their quality control is not perfect. It's just a personal view.


These company's don't typically test anything. It's usually a trading company and they simply buy goods and sell them for a profit. Sometimes they don't even have the goods on hand that they sell you, they have a source and when you buy them, they buy them and send them on to you. I would say for A123's this is about as reliable a company as you will find (I haven't purchased from them but I bought my A123's from a similar company).


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

frodus said:


> Sellers CANNOT charge a different amount for using paypal, i.e. they can't make you pay the paypal fee just because you chose that route. The price with using a CC, doing transfer or doing paypal must all be the same.


I've been complaining about this for years. I know the rules, (what is part of the merchant agreement between a business and a credit card company, or part of the paypal agreement,) but nobody seems to be following them. 

Fuel stations have a different price for cash or credit card, and have been doing that for decades. Tons of sellers on ebay and everywhere else charge a Paypal or a convenience fee that is actually more than the percentage the banks or paypal charge them. Its all so improper and a violation of everyone's agreement and all that, and its standard operating procedure.

Sucks...


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

Paypal is by far the highest leverage way to pay.

They have a horrible "charge back first, get the facts later" policy that is really hard on sellers, but a great boon to a buyer with a defective product. Just make sure there is "buyer protection" for the transaction with Paypal. This applies to almost every ebay purchase, and some others, but not all transactions.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

PayPal sucks, I use Authorize.net. 

In regards to the batteries, good luck, but would never buy rejects. The problem with A123 is they have plants in many countries including China, so when bad cells go out the back door and down to the traders warehouse, it is very hard to file charges against a Chinese company. A123 has a huge problem here, they should allow all EV parts distributors sell their prime product and maybe more will buy. If it was me, I would pay $60 bucks for the real deal, than $20 or $30 for a ticking time bomb.


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## NabilAhmad (Feb 26, 2011)

kakheath said:


> Ron, with your experience what would you recommend in order to check out these cells? As a newbie, I want to know exactly what should be done to verify the cells are good. As you explain the steps, assume I know nothing about them. For example:
> 
> 1. Check the current as-arrived voltage for consistency between the cells
> 2. Check the capacity using an analyzer like a powerlab 6
> ...


You might do a series of high load tests and watch for thermal variations as well.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

NabilAhmad said:


> You might do a series of high load tests and watch for thermal variations as well.


I agree, A123 found something wrong with these cells. It is vital you know what the defect is.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> If it was me, I would pay $60 bucks for the real deal, than $20 or $30 for a ticking time bomb.


Not everyone has $3000 to spend on bus bars. If I had that much to spend on batteries, I'd be fairly happy.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

Ziggythewiz said:


> Not everyone has $3000 to spend on bus bars. If I had that much to spend on batteries, I'd be fairly happy.


I apologize if I offended anyone with my opinion, just trying to save you guys serious problems in the future. Yes, my pack is very expensive, and yes it has cost me a small fortune to build a second EV Drag Car, but hopefully it will promote more EV use and additional sponsors in the near future. Trust me, my wife is not happy neither.


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## TomA (Mar 26, 2009)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> If it was me, I would pay $60 bucks for the real deal, than $20 or $30 for a ticking time bomb.


That's the net of it, and the beauty of markets. 

For me, a pack plus spares will be 200 cells. $4000 or so is doable, even for a "time bomb" that most likely will never go off, and might not be ticking at all. 

No matter. At $12k the numbers just don't work for me.


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## alvin (Jul 26, 2008)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> You can perform every test known to man for cell testing, internal failures can happen weeks to months away. Good Luck!


 This is not to be a smart a$$. But what test would the manufacturer use to reject them?

Alvin


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

alvin said:


> This is not to be a smart a$$. But what test would the manufacturer use to reject them?
> 
> Alvin


There are all sorts of defects that could be found. Cosmetic, Capacity, Internal Resistance, Physical defect etc.

Since most of these grey market cells are coming in below rated capacity there is a good chance that is the defect. (at least for some cells, there could be multiple defects in some cells)

I agree and disagree with Ron, I wouldn't use these cells in a race car, he's pushing things to the limit and that's where cell like this may fail quickly. In a street car that isn't pushing these cells to the limit they will probably last a long time. Long term reliability simply isn't known, so Ron can't say they will fail any more than I can say they will 3000 cycles. I would go as far as saying these cells are a *potential* time bomb. We don't know the origins, we don't know what might be wrong with them or they could be perfectly fine. I'm using them and so far I love them, I will have a cell level battery monitoring system (not management, just monitoring). The cells will be grouped the best I can, top balanced and monitored. My pack is also designed in such a way that I can pull a 12 cell (4S3P) module and quickly replace it. The 12v system will also use one or two of these 4S3P modules so I will always have a backup or two on board. No idea if it could ever help me, but Ron is correct in warning people of the possible dangers of these cells simply because we don't know how/where/why these cells came from.


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## Salty9 (Jul 13, 2009)

http://electricporsche.ca/ Is well worth reading for pack construction details.


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## LithiumaniacsEVRacing (Oct 9, 2010)

I agree with Rwaudio, his comments make sense. I didn't mean to scare anyone with the time bomb statement, just would like to see caution when using a defective product. I also like the idea of a modular pack design in which you can easily remove a bad parallel set without rebuilding your entire pack. I have adopted the same design for my racing pack, we can remove any 10P pack very easily and replace on site.


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## phairno (Dec 16, 2011)

Their price changes again, I mean it changes unpredictably. http://www.a123rc.com/goods-468-Excitingly+Powerful+A+123+20ah+PRISMATIC+CELLS.html
I 'm confused about how do they set the price. Should I bought it now?


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## rwaudio (May 22, 2008)

phairno said:


> Their price changes again, I mean it changes unpredictably. http://www.a123rc.com/goods-468-Excitingly+Powerful+A+123+20ah+PRISMATIC+CELLS.html
> I 'm confused about how do they set the price. Should I bought it now?


That's a decent price, but still much higher than you can get from one of the other sellers (victpower for example)


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## kakheath (Jan 7, 2012)

LithiumaniacsEVRacing said:


> I agree, A123 found something wrong with these cells. It is vital you know what the defect is.


I have a theory about the A123 cells. I could be wrong, but it seems like a simple explanation to very important question. 

Why would these cells from China be cheaper ? Perhaps it's because the spec says 19.6Ah minimum. See attachment below: A123-20AH-AMP20M1HD.pdf

All my cells have ranged from 18.2-19.2Ah. (This is from a very small percentage that I've tested so far.) If you look at rwaudio's postings, he has seen ranges from 17.8-18.9Ah (from 75 cells), and JR from EVTV has similar results as well.

My theory is that these are out of spec low Ah cells and that's it.

My cells look brand new with full sized tabs and have Made In USA on everyone. I'm very happy to pay 70% less for only 10% less capacity . I hope you're wrong about the "failure down the road" comment, but right now, this purchase still seems like a good decision to me.


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

I suspect you're right about them being rejected for not meeting spec, but I wouldn't put much stock in the made in USA label. That usually means most of the profits were made here, by making the product elsewhere.


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## Guest (Feb 15, 2012)

Not likely that the amount of cells being sold are all rejects. The original customers are not buying them because they went out of business. You really think that the manufacturer is going to just hang on them when they can actually sell the product? 

Korean Made Cells with MADE in USA printed to deceive the american public so they can get money from the US Government. It is a CLASSIC American SCAM job to the people and government. 

Now we can buy them from the Chinese. 

By the way, the original specs are actually under 20 AH which is another American Trade Mark. Go to your local lumber yard and see if you can buy a TRUE 2X4. 



I am down for a shit load of these cells. Looking to get about 600 or more. Waiting for the price to drop into the $15 each and I will jump on them.


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## phairno (Dec 16, 2011)

rwaudio said:


> That's a decent price, but still much higher than you can get from one of the other sellers (victpower for example)


 Thank you for your suggestion, but I think I won't buy from victpower 'cause I see another post http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=33939
That's why I don't believe it. Just my personal opinion.


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## stone3333 (Feb 15, 2012)

Genius Pooh said:


> EBay seller said me he can some amount battery about 18.5 $ without ebay and 19$ with ebay.. I hope it willl help you.


I got mine @ $19.45

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/making-a123-li-ion-battery-48v-69773.html


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

How about $9.50 each? lol check it out.... 

http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forum...eplace-upgrade-batteries-could-use-69796.html


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## Ziggythewiz (May 16, 2010)

I don't read chinese, but it looked like it said they were 20ah cells, with capacity of 14-18ah


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

Ziggythewiz said:


> I don't read chinese, but it looked like it said they were 20ah cells, with capacity of 14-18ah


ya, that's strange. No tabs on these either. They appear to be the same AMP20 cells tho... ??


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## ga2500ev (Apr 20, 2008)

This thread needs a bump. So I'll ask a question:

Has anyone identified a reliable source of these cells that can be purchased in small quantities (1-25) for 25 USD or less each? Tabs preferred of course, but will consider alternatives.

I'm itching to build a test pack.

ga2500ev


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## ga2500ev (Apr 20, 2008)

ga2500ev said:


> This thread needs a bump. So I'll ask a question:
> 
> Has anyone identified a reliable source of these cells that can be purchased in small quantities (1-25) for 25 USD or less each? Tabs preferred of course, but will consider alternatives.
> 
> ...


No takers? So are these cells from a123rc.com the only viable option?

A123rc.com cells

It is with free shipping at 32 USD/cell and there have been good reports here. Also they have tabs. So the 7 USD a cell more than my wanted price may be a good tradeoff.

Thoughts?

UPDATE: EndlessSphere has a good thread on the subject going on here:

A quote of 100 cells from victpower for $2331 shipped from China is quoted. It seems to be Jack Ricard's source.



ga2500ev


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## Batter (Nov 11, 2011)

ga2500ev said:


> This thread needs a bump. So I'll ask a question:
> 
> Has anyone identified a reliable source of these cells that can be purchased in small quantities (1-25) for 25 USD or less each? Tabs preferred of course, but will consider alternatives.
> 
> ...


Maybe a123rc.com is ok, just for your reference.


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