# Miles ZX40S 2007 (Learing as I Go!)



## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

Well to update my own post; good news and bad. 
The battery pack appears to be ok. I tried charging it with the onboard charger but some of the batteries must have been below the discharge thresh hole settings in the charger program. I disconnected all of them and tested each, finding a wide range for batt. voltages. 
I then set to charging each batt. with my Vector Smart charger, this went well and none of them "faulted" out and completed to a full charge after about 2 hrs each. While in this process, I cleaned all of the connections and buss bars with a wire S/S wire brush. At the end of the charging, I reconnected the lot and torqued all the connector bolts. The combine voltage at the DC to AC converter was 80.9 volts. Very encouraging.
All systems seem to work except the noisy vacuum pump I had noticed earlier. 
Took it for a test drive, down the block and back. Things seems good so I headed out for another run but things didn't go so well this time, when the car no longer had much power, so I turned around and could smell something was overheating. Pulled over and checked the batteries under the rear seat and found one that was hot enough to melt the plastic top. Pulled the main power plug and then disconnected/isolated the bad battery. The voltage still read 12.9 volts as did the others. Not sure what that means. The area effected was over one cell in that battery and only overheats when the battery is under load. But do know that I'll need to replace this one or switch over to the Lithium Ion set up I have in my Prius. That will be a project that may take a while to sort out the charging details and re-program the power converter. Something that Scott has suggested. 

Well at least I got to check out the rest of the cars systems. Need to work on that electric vacuum pump and need some advise on that. 

Thanks for following my progress. Comments and suggestions are welcomed.

Steve


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

Hmmm! I feel like I'm talking to myself but sometimes it helps to put ones thoughts into word on the way to finding a solution. A little outside wisdom, experience would also be welcome, of course. 

I have replaced the one bad AGM battery and have the pack charged and have combine pack voltage or 80 volts. The dash display shows this full charge graphically also. 

However, it won't go. I have error codes on the two status indicator lights.
The flash pretty fast but I am trying to read these sequences and look them up in the Curtis inf I downloaded. 

If I read this correctly: Code 39 has to do with the Main Contactor not closing. 
The possible cause are varied from oxidized tip, or external load on capacitor bank (B+ terminal) preventing cap. bank from charging or blown B+ fuse. 

I have checked the B+ fuse, that being the easiest. The rest will be a bit more involved since I'm not that sure where to start on them.

The Set/Clear Conditions recommendation is also a bit involved for a novice and I might ask here, what Cycle KSI means. KSI is a controller line designation and I might assume it is Key Switch Input. But prior to Clear KSI I am to Set: "Just prior to contactor closing, the capacitor bank voltage (B+) was loaded for a short time and the voltage didn't discharge." Hmmm!

One thing I have observed while removing and reconnecting the battery pack, with all systems off and the charger disconnected, I am getting a spark between the cables and the battery terminals as I complete the series connections. This is with the Pos and Neg. connected to the controller and power relay. Something is drawing current with the system turned off. 

I think I know where the DC contactor is located and will pull that out tomorrow and check it over. That might be the source of my problem.

Edit:/Followup: I disconnected the main pack and 12v battery before removing the contactor. I found no problem but after re-installing it, the status lights went back to normal and I had power to the wheels again. Whew!.. Took a spin around the yard and then felt confident enough to head out for a road test again. The sate of charge indicator show a full charge (but I was skeptical) eased into the test drive, not knowing the speed limitation on this model. Reached about 38 mph and notice the charge indicator begin to drop so I eased off to about 25 mph and turned around. Made it home ok with 2/3 charge yet but glad I didn't press it farther this time. (Shhhh! I don't have plate or insurance on it yet.) my insurance covers me but the cops won't except that and not having plates as well. "Next week Officer!"


Thanks for following my ramble.

Steve


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## GoAhead92 (Dec 16, 2012)

Way to go, trying to recycle a NEV. I considered buying a Miles, but purchased a different Low Speed Vehicle instead. I believed by 07, Miles were 72 volts & by 08, they used the Curtis AC motor controller & HPEVS AC31 motor. 
It sounds the like your battery charger is a Delta Q model, which is what my car came with. When I changed to CALB lithiums, Frodus helped me get the charger reprogrammed. He's posted a lot of helpful info about the battery charger.
I bought EVTV's older 'blue' batteries which so far have been a good value.
As for a spark while the key is off, I was told by Wheego that the DC DC converter says on 24/7. If your Miles uses the same design, perhaps that could be a load causing a spark while your working with the batteries.
My car has an emergency disconnect behind the passenger seat. Does yours have one in a different location?


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

*Re: Miles ZX40S 2007 (Learning as I Go!)*

Thanks GoAhead,
I was thinking I was all alone here, talking about my Miles. I did post in the only other recent Miles thread and Scott Glen responded with similar info on how my model/year is equipt. While I had the front pair of batteries out I was able to confirm the drive motor model is as you state and controller is the Curtis is Mod. 1238-65826 programmable, rated at 48-80V @ 550 amps. (now I want to find a good deal on a hand programmer but kinda pricey at $400 to $500 on ebay. Rental is $30/mo. and that seems fair but it would be nice to have one on hand while I'm upgrading to the Lithium batteries. Also, there appears to be great potential in these motor and Curtis controller combination to adapt to ones driving requirements. 
I have ask Scott Glenn, who deals in the Chevy Volt battery modules and I have ask for more info on these and might go that route from scratch. I have a set of Calib Lithium in my Prius that could give me 72 volts but I'd like to go to 90v if I go to the Volt batteries. 

I will look up the threads on the charger programming, however I have to trace out the vehicle wiring. The control/monitor wiring simply goes thru a hole in the bottom of the battery box and I don't know were it goes to since there isn't any function display in the vehicle, nor in the charger either. 

Does anyone have a Miles wiring or harness diagram?? This is a very simple car with very basic systems and I would at least assume someone has already "hand-over-hand" traced out these systems. Mine has had a what appears to be "alterations", like cables sniped off and zip tied back, while I find wire bundles with open/unused connectors similarly bundled under the hood. I did ID the programmer 4 pin connector for the Curtis. I also see a few Scotch Splices in and around the 12V battery wiring. One is for Rev/backup horn. 

Will try and document the general wiring layout as I explore.

Steve


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

*Re: Miles ZX40S 2007 (Learning as I Go!)*

Made some progress over the weekend. Can't get it registered until tomorrow, so I focused on figuring out the elect. components and wiring. 
I had been experiencing an intermittent problem with the Curtis status going to fault code 39 which has to do with the main contactor not closing. This was happening almost every time I would turn it on and eventual wouldn't clear by simply turning off KSI or even disconnecting both power and 12v battery. 
I finally tracked the problem to what I thought was the relay located behind the main contactor. However, after removing it I found the terminals slip on connector were badly corroded. Cleaned them up and the problem seems to have been solved. 
Sure would be nice to have a wiring diagram but I am developing some notes as I feel my way thru the wire harness and components. I found the Molex connector that would fit the Curtis programmer or model 840 display if I ever get a good deal on one. 

I'm looking forward to a road trip tomorrow once I get plates on it and will see what my range really is with refurbished 72 volt AGM battery pack.

Steve


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## rmay635703 (Oct 23, 2008)

http://www.milesev.com/

Miles will sell you a service manual / repair book for around $35

There are digital modules available on their hidden website if you ask them nicely.

Used to be info on here for the repair manual
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MILESEVOWNERSGROUP/info

Also I strongly recommend taking out the chinese interconnects and setting up your own wiring for the ignition side.

The grounds on these cars are ALWAYS bad, on the old simple DC Miles cars it didn't matter, could drive all day with errors but on the AC version it bricks the car.

If you want to mess with it, run 12v ground wires from critical points (not the HV side) to various points in the car (like on the column off the ignition) to the battery directly.

Wires/connectors around and under the ignition tend to go bad and get too much resistance causing all sorts of chaos.



SteveWlf said:


> The voltage still read 12.9 volts as did the others. Not sure what that means. The area effected was over one cell in that battery and only overheats when the battery is under load.
> 
> Steve


Those batteries have a tendancy to have bad bus bars internally or a "dried out cell"
They are very durable and actually quite advanced for a lead battery but they do not like overcharge/overdischarge and also could "dry out" despite being sealed.

Take the battery out of service, remove the cover and batting with a knife and put a small amount of water in each cell. (couple teaspoons)
Replace the caps and tape the plastic cover back on, Charge the battery slowly on a DUMB trickle charger for a minimum of 24 hours.
Then use a battery discharger, you need to discharge/recharge many times at a high rate of charge/discharge (try to keep the battery over 10 volts). The battery "may" come back, 2 of mine did.
Also these batteries when new sit above 13 volts fully charged, their chemistry is on the high end in terms of voltage for lead acid.

Also the car can be made to physically go on 60 volts of power, just need to "tweek" a few things, also your onboard charger won't work and the dash power gauge will be useless.

2x 6v 240ahr trojan deepcycles will take the place of one miles battery though.

Also for the price of the miles battery you could just buy a genuine set of Firefly batteries or lithium. Either have a much better track record.

Good Luck
Ryan


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

Thanks for all the tips. 
I have temp. replaced the bad China battery (only 5.5 yrs old) with about 2000 miles on them. But as I observed earlier, in this or another post, they must have been seriously abusing and deep discharging both sets of batteries. 
What I put in was a 100 AH industrial battery from a man lift I'm not using. It fits nicely and seems to work out well with the charger, as is. The one road test I managed to take, they all seemed to discharge uniformly down to the 60% charge indication. 

Since my electrical problems seem to persist from day to day. I have been progressing thru the under hood harness. Cleaning all of the main battery terminals and control connections. I am now ready to go under the dash and look into the ground circuit you recommend. I agree here since I have for years worked on old cars that had corrosion problems to this same point. Chassis grounds can't be relied upon. A few feet of good gage/quality copper with and solid crimped connectors. (I use to do Mil Spec. work as a contractor and know how that is done and have the tools.) Good termination is the rule.

Steve


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## josefig7 (May 27, 2015)

http://www.publicsurplus.com/sms/do...shooting_Manual.pdf?auc=1034394&docid=8691690

This is an electrical troubleshooting manual for the zx40st. May be similar enough to help you out.


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## josefig7 (May 27, 2015)

I have a 2009 zx40s Advanced Design. It has 6x 12v 150Ah Fullriver batteries. I am not sure how old they are but I'm not getting very good distance. I am sourcing some Chinese manufactures for some LiFePo4 battery packs at the moment.


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## josefig7 (May 27, 2015)

LIFEPO4 battery 3.2V100Ah is USD108/pcs; MOQ 50pcs will be USD5400. 
LIFEPO4 battery 3.2V150Ah is USD165/pcs; MOQ 36pcs will be USD5940.
LIFEPO4 Battery 3.2V200Ah is USD210/pcs; 24pcs will be USD5040.

That is all I have so far. Still not cheap enough for me, still looking..


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

Agree. 
I'll just re-purpose my 2 yr old CALB pack from my Prius conversion. 
Cost me about $3500.

Steve


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## SteveWlf (Oct 25, 2012)

josefig7 said:


> http://www.publicsurplus.com/sms/do...shooting_Manual.pdf?auc=1034394&docid=8691690
> 
> This is an electrical troubleshooting manual for the zx40st. May be similar enough to help you out.


I do appreciate the link to this manual. At first glance I thought it might provide the electrical details that I need to trouble shoot my 2007 ZX40S. However, I'm no finding that the component locations don't even begin to resemble those illustrated or described. The DC-DC convertor and Charger Controller board isn't located under the seat. Not a biggie. I found (I think) the Charge Controller under the left days and the DC-DC us under the hood. 

When I found mention of the various interlocking relays that might be the cause for my current problem of Main Power Relay not closing, I now find that there is no switch signal from the charge door because there is no switch there at all and never has been.
There so no info on where these other relays are located and when I find some tucked under the dash, no indication as to which one might serve what purpose. Wire colors are not indicated on the manual diagrams. Only pin numbers. And if if I take the wire color from a pin in the 35 pin Curtis controller connector, I have no assurance or hope that it will continue to be that same color with it reaches the relay that may be controlling the single to that pin. 

Someone has suggested that I rewire all ground connections on the 12v circuits to the chassis since that is a known source or trouble in these cars. The problem remains, the block diagrams (non schematics) don't show what is a chassis ground or wire color that I should trace out. Again wire colors may not be reliable from end to end since I have found splices to different colors even inside the harnesses. No Method to the Madness!

Like, if I need to directly go to 12v neg. on the TPS, I don't see a ground wire indicated in the block diagram. Are we talking about the Controller Ref. Bus?? Then we are not talking about the Chassis Ground, right?

Still puzzling over this.

Steve

_


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## rmay635703 (Oct 23, 2008)

The truck is no relation to the Micro van, they aren't even made by the same company overseas.

I uploaded a manual here
http://minitrucktalk.com/threads/en...atsu-move-care-of-miles-zx40.4778/#post-33826

once but sadly its down (time will do that)



SteveWlf said:


> Again wire colors may not be reliable from end to end since I have found splices to different colors even inside the harnesses. No Method to the Madness!
> 
> Like, if I need to directly go to 12v neg. on the TPS, I don't see a ground wire indicated in the block diagram. Are we talking about the Controller Ref. Bus?? Then we are not talking about the Chassis Ground, right?
> 
> ...


Its a chinese car, they use whatever wires are cheap and sometimes splice, a voltmeter and nerves of steel are required.

Also I recommend contacting miles directly, they still exist, just very slow at responding.


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## DeLorean dude (Oct 14, 2015)

Do any of you know what the part number is for a zx40s advanced design rear window? I am about to purchase a almost new 2008 and the only issue is the back window is broken. I am a auto glass installer by trade, and the fy glass is a easy brand to get ahold of. No glass warehouse has a listing for the miles cars, so I can't order it without a part #. It isn't on the glass so I was hoping someone might know. It starts with "fb" for foreign backglass and should have a 4 digit number after that. Anything helps... glad to know about this forum, I thought I was the only one who really likes these awesome little cars! Thanks for your support
-Ryan


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## Hagnbuchner (Sep 18, 2019)

Hi rmay635703
can you by chance share the MILES ZX40 owners manual / repair Manual with us?

Thanks


daniel


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## steveclunn (Sep 5, 2011)

I have a few of these for sale.. they all need TLC.. email me for info: [email protected]


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## LkOutMtnMan (Mar 26, 2021)

SteveWlf said:


> I notice that the two other post on the Miles aren't very active being several years old. The info contributed in them has, however, be very helpful.
> However, I will start-a-new here with my own purchase and discovery background.
> 
> I found this one on Public Surplus Auction here in WA (where I have purchase many other nice items including a 2005 Prius for my son and family).
> ...


Hey Steve , was just wondering how your van project turned out? I bought a Miles 72VAC van several years ago and just now putting it to use as it has very low miles on it. I have a couple of problems to fix on it, windshield wipers come on in delay all the time and charge door switch bad. I did replace the brake booster pump with Volvo unit as one member on here suggested. Thanks to whoever that was.


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