# AWD Subaru outback for donor car?



## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

for me, the biggerst concern would the car's curb weight and if it is a manual or automatic transmission.. Also, I believe the awd is on all the time correct? If you could turn it off, that'd be great. Having it on all the time will give you less range, but you could do it. I did read something about Subaru.. I'll have to see if I can find that again.


----------



## PatricioIN (Jun 13, 2008)

"Convert It" says: "Subarus and rotary Mazdas have a design that recesses the flywheel into the back of the engine. This requires a very thick and expensive adapter plate for the electric motor."

I don't know what a Subaru tranny looks like; I'd get the factory manual and go through it before you decide about using it. You might just have to spend a bit more for the adapter. IMO, not a big deal in itself. But then, I'm not doing mine on a beer budget like ForkenSwift either!


----------



## rwcreed (Nov 12, 2008)

thanks for the info. The curb weight is 3100lbs and it is a manual transmission. Is this too heavy? Do you know if there is a company online that custom makes adaptor plates that I could call? Also it is a full time awd.

Thanks again


----------



## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

rwcreed said:


> thanks for the info. The curb weight is 3100lbs and it is a manual transmission. Is this too heavy? Do you know if there is a company online that custom makes adaptor plates that I could call? Also it is a full time awd.
> 
> Thanks again


Thats on the heavy side, the average 'new' sub compacts are down around 2400, and the older ones like a geo metro are down around 1900. It might be worth a call to the guys at CanEV.com to see if they could come up with an adaptor. The AWD will put more of a drag on the system and reduce your range....

I am thinking that if the flywheel is that far over though, it might not leave enough room for a big enough motor... you need at least 17 or 18" from the face of the clutch plate. HHHmmmm, if you got REALLY creative you might be able to build a motor cradle ABOVE the tranny and connect with a chain-drive or heavy belt-drive. kinda wild, but possible. Alignment would be critical.


----------



## rallyshark (Sep 19, 2008)

I've owned 3 subarus and taken one of them completely apart. You car probably has an EJ22 engine, maybe an EJ25. Either way, it's the same transmission type.

Yes, the flywheel, pressure plate, and clutch disc are attached to the engine. And yes, you'd need a lengthy adapter to utilize them.

As far as I know, you can fit an 18 inch motor easy in front of the transmission. Without a radiator it should certainly not be a problem. You can fit a 6 cylinder boxer engine in an outback with a radiator and minimal modification.

(Also, Don't use a chain or belt, that's asking for trouble).

Also, the outbacks of that time are built with alot of steel body panels. The front fenders, hatch, hood and doors are all steel. You could replace at least some of those with fiberglass versions or aluminum versions. You can also put on lightweight bumper beams.

I want to use a WRX-STI getrag transmission on my EV (with full-time AWD), so i'm in the same boat as you, as the STI tranny will bolt directly to your EJ18, EJ22 or EJ25 just as your stock tranny will.

I've decided on using an impreza as a donor of sorts but have a completely custom tube chassis and body.


----------



## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

rallyshark said:


> As far as I know, you can fit an 18 inch motor easy in front of the transmission.


aha, I never looked in the engine bay of one, I thought they would be transverse mounted. Inline should be ok spacewise. Maybe a 'long' adaptor could use a large dia AL or steel tube as a spacer to avoid machining a massive block of AL.


----------



## rallyshark (Sep 19, 2008)

dtbaker said:


> aha, I never looked in the engine bay of one, I thought they would be transverse mounted. Inline should be ok spacewise. Maybe a 'long' adaptor could use a large dia AL or steel tube as a spacer to avoid machining a massive block of AL.


Yep, inline mounted, the transmission is huge compared to that of a front-wheel drive car. It basically looks like a beefy RWD transmission (with the driveshaft coming out the back) with the addition of two CV axles coming out both sides of the transmission.

As for a spacer, Yeah, that's possible. although the block of aluminum would probably be more stable in regards to possible torquing forces between the motor and tranny.


----------



## rwcreed (Nov 12, 2008)

Thanks for all the valuable information:

Do you know if I can bolt the motor with adaptor directly to the tranny and not use the flywheel pressure plate and clutch disk?

Also I was wondering if it is possible to disconnect either the front or rear wheels driveline to reduce drag?


----------



## dtbaker (Jan 5, 2008)

rwcreed said:


> Do you know if I can bolt the motor with adaptor directly to the tranny and not use the flywheel pressure plate and clutch disk?


there are pros/cons to clutchless designs, but certainly possible. Canev.com uses clutch designs, and the guys at ev-america.com prefer clutchless.

d


----------



## Bottomfeeder (Jun 13, 2008)

If you can greatly simplify the adapter by going clutchless, you should do it. Clutchless shifting is simple and there are less things to break!


----------



## rallyshark (Sep 19, 2008)

Bottomfeeder said:


> If you can greatly simplify the adapter by going clutchless, you should do it. Clutchless shifting is simple and there are less things to break!


True, there are less things to break, but if something does break, it'll be very expensive.

Normally the clutch is the weakest link in the system, if you burn out the clutch, you are down a few hundred dollars at most (probably less). 

If you make the electric motor or the tranny the only parts of the system, then it's likely that if something breaks, it'll be a gear tooth or the entire tranny will "explode" (not literally, but catestrophic failure).

I'd rather have to replace a clutch, than break-open a tranny and fix it.

Also, you were wondering about making the outback 2WD instead of AWD. It's easy, in the owner's manual, it talks of a fuse that you remove in order to change it to FWD. It states in the owners manual that you shouldn't do it for a long time, but I think you will be okay as long as you don't start doing an excessive amount of burnouts.

If you decide to make it FWD all the time, then you can remove the rear diff, CV axles and drive shaft--however, you'll need to plug the rear part of the transmission somehow. Once you take out the driveshaft going to the rear, the gear oil will leak out.


----------



## Ioku (Sep 27, 2007)

Im also planing on converting a Subaru I'm going to use and early modle Impreza coupe lightest of the Imprezas, and best looking imo, but as far as the drivetrain its basically Identical to the legacy outback and really any other Subaru from 89 on. 

As for making it fwd by using that fuse, I dont know if that will help tried that on my car to see if my mpgs would improve but I saw no change. maybe by removing the rear half of the driveline you might. I'd recommend just getting a fwd transmission and putting that in, it will bolt right in no problem, and would be easier than trying to remove the center diff on the awd trans and cap it off and have it work properly I know the ones that come in fwd got about 4 to 5 mpgs better than the awd's did.


----------



## Jimdear2 (Oct 12, 2008)

Just a weird thought,

Instead of removing the AWD Transaxle when you take out the RWD stuff. Place a generator in place of the rear diff., then hook it to the drive shaft and create regenerative braking and a hill retarder system and recover some enegery.

Jim


----------



## rallyshark (Sep 19, 2008)

Jimdear2 said:


> Just a weird thought,
> 
> Instead of removing the AWD Transaxle when you take out the RWD stuff. Place a generator in place of the rear diff., then hook it to the drive shaft and create regenerative braking and a hill retarder system and recover some enegery.
> 
> Jim


That's actually an interesting thought. Good thinking. I'm not sure if it'd provide better regen than a controller would provide, or less, or if it would just hinder the range of the vehicle...interesting concept though.


----------

