# Zoe question



## scottherrington (Jul 3, 2020)

I think the Zoe modules are 373x204x140mm, or is that the cell size? Can anyone confirm, also how many modules in a pack please?

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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

scottherrington said:


> Does anyone have the sizes of the Renault Zoe battery modules please?
> I can find the size of the cells and the pack but not the modules.
> Assuming I'm correct in thinking that the cells are made into a module then modules are put together to form the pack


That is how essentially every production EV pack is built, but Renault does some strange things...

Here's thread in this forum with images and some information about the Zoe modules (and other Renault modules):
Renault lithium-ion battery pack

There is actually substantial information about Zoe packs available online, although without dimensions - Inside EVs has several articles, and PushEVs has a summary: Renault Zoe ZE 40 battery details. Both original and 41 kWh packs appear to have 192 LG Chem cells in 12 modules (16 cells per module; presumably 8S2P) configuration. The new third-generation Zoe still has the same module and pack configuration (even still forced air cooled), but capacity is up to 52 kWh.

I think that there are six modules in a row on each side of the pack, so the module long dimension (a bit more than the cell long edge length) would be under half the pack inside width), module height (a bit more than the cell short edge length) would be under the pack inside height, and module width would be under one-sixth of the pack inside length.. but you can compare your known cell and pack dimensions to check that.


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## scottherrington (Jul 3, 2020)

brian_ said:


> That is how essentially every production EV pack is built, but Renault does some strange things...
> 
> Here's thread in this forum with images and some information about the Zoe modules (and other Renault modules):
> Renault lithium-ion battery pack
> ...


Thank you so much [emoji16]

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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

scottherrington said:


> I think the Zoe modules are 373x204x140mm, or is that the cell size? Can anyone confirm, also how many modules in a pack please?
> 
> Sent from my moto g(8) power lite using Tapatalk


That would be the module, which is a stack of 16 cells each apparently almost 373 x 140 mm; each cell must be roughly 8 mm thick.

As noted in my previous post (which I was writing as you were posting), there are 12 of these modules in a pack.

Six modules with their cell-sized faces adjacent in a horizontal stack would total a bit over 1224 mm long (so the pack inside length would be about that plus wiring and airflow space), two of those stacks side-by-side would be 746 mm wide (so the pack inside width would be about that plus wiring and airflow space), and inside pack height would be about 140 mm plus wiring and airflow space.


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## scottherrington (Jul 3, 2020)

brian_ said:


> That would be the module, which is a stack of 16 cells each apparently almost 373 x 140 mm; each cell must be roughly 8 mm thick.
> 
> As noted in my previous post (which I was writing as you were posting), there are 12 of these modules in a pack.
> 
> Six modules with their cell-sized faces adjacent in a horizontal stack would total a bit over 1224 mm long (so the pack inside length would be about that plus wiring and airflow space), two of those stacks side-by-side would be 746 mm wide (so the pack inside width would be about that plus wiring and airflow space), and inside pack height would be about 140 mm plus wiring and airflow space.


Thanks
These might be ideal for my mini conversion

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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

The cells and modules are very similar in format and size to the LG Chem cell and modules in a Chrysler Pacifica Hybrid (the early Zoe has lower capacity and the second generation has higher capacity), but they are internally configured as 8S2P instead of the Pacifica's 16S. This means means about twice as much capacity (and of course volume and mass) with the Zoe modules than the Pacifica modules for the same voltage, which can be a better match for a EV (in contrast to the Pacifica plug-in hybrid).

The other difference, of course, is that in salvage the Zoe modules are presumably only readily available in Europe, while the Pacifica modules would likely be more available in North America.


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## scottherrington (Jul 3, 2020)

Thanks Brian
Sooner or later I'll get round to doing some cardboard mock ups and try them in the car

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## tomrock (May 1, 2020)

Hi Scott,

A bit late to the party, but my project is using Zoe modules, here's some photos, hope they help. These are from a "22kWh" pack from a 2017 model. I don't seem to have their height measurement to hand, but can measure them if you would like.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

tomrock said:


> A bit late to the party, but my project is using Zoe modules, here's some photos, hope they help.


Excellent illustrations! 

The whole-pack photos confirm the arrangement which I described in post #3.

The 373 mm length spec apparently doesn't include the tabs on the ends, judging from the first photo. The later photo confirms the 204 mm width.


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## scottherrington (Jul 3, 2020)

Thanks Brian and Tom,
I'm currently looking for a donor car, my first choice will be the i3 but if I can't find one I can afford I will look for a Zoe

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## pickmeup (May 8, 2018)

tomrock said:


> Hi Scott,
> 
> A bit late to the party, but my project is using Zoe modules, here's some photos, hope they help. These are from a "22kWh" pack from a 2017 model. I don't seem to have their height measurement to hand, but can measure them if you would like.


Where did you manage to source the Zoe battery? Most of them are leased through renault and cant be bought usually?


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## tomrock (May 1, 2020)

pickmeup said:


> Where did you manage to source the Zoe battery? Most of them are leased through renault and cant be bought usually?


It was from a crash damaged "i" model, with corresponding details in the door shut that indicate it was a "bought out right" battery model


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## tomrock (May 1, 2020)

I have uploaded a video presenting some of what I learnt working with these modules, here is if you are interested:


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## 18650 (May 20, 2016)

I can admit that I managed to pull 10C from those modules in short burst. Very low voltage drop but the temp increased pretty fast. Very solid and good cells


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

tomrock said:


> I have uploaded a video presenting some of what I learnt working with these modules, here is if you are interested:


That is an excellent video! Very informative, and efficient (especially playing at 1.5X speed, which I do with almost all web videos). The use of printed photos seems strange at first, but works very well in combination with the live component presentations. Thanks for making and sharing this.


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## tomrock (May 1, 2020)

brian_ said:


> That is an excellent video! Very informative, and efficient (especially playing at 1.5X speed, which I do with almost all web videos). The use of printed photos seems strange at first, but works very well in combination with the live component presentations. Thanks for making and sharing this.


Cheers Brian - the easy low-tech presenting technique was inspired by YouTuber "bigclivedotcom"

He disassembles and reverse engineers electronics. Not EV related but absolutely worth a watch for anyone into this kind of stuff


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## alvasilev91 (Nov 20, 2021)

Hi guys. I wonder, why all the modules themselves weight 190kg and the whole battery is 290kg? is it the fasteners and the base of the pack so heavy? Also other things im wondering: Is there someone that have figured out a way of using the stock BMS as it is?


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

Yup - battery boxes are heavy.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

alvasilev91 said:


> Hi guys. I wonder, why all the modules themselves weight 190kg and the whole battery is 290kg? is it the fasteners and the base of the pack so heavy? Also other things im wondering: Is there someone that have figured out a way of using the stock BMS as it is?


Fasteners... and interconnecting high-voltage cabling, BMS cabling, BMS system, contactors, fuses and holders, connectors, and the entire structure and shell of the case. 100 kg sounds high, but all that stuff is substantial.


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