# VW Golf II EV conversion: any experiences?



## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

Hi, 
I am planning to upgrade my VW Golf2 (19E), from its original DC motor rated 15KW continous - 25KW peak for 5 minutes, at under 2500rpm. 96V, 200A fused, meaning the maximum available power peaking at 19KW. With the current battery consisting of 8 12V - 70 Ah I get 20 -30Km in city traffic.

I would like to upgrade to Ac, max. 144V, comming up to a peak of 29KW, while the continous rating could stay at 15KW. 
I think the existing wiring will suffice the increased electrical power.
Since the VWGolf II employes a manual transmission the RPM doesn`t really matter.
Since the larger batterypack would render thje usefull load to zero, I´ll probably have to go for lipos.


Has anyone arready mounted an engine on a VW Golf 19E Transmissieon train?
What Engine controller should I look at, and how should I go about deciding which engine would even fit? 
Do I have to remove the old engine first, to decide what new engine to buy?
Since I never did pull an engine on any car, I have a little fear about it, even I did change engines on recip airplanes. I guess its about the same, using an engine hoist.
An other thing that bugs me is the following thought. I am driving my VW every day, on this very small battery, (<7KWh). Despite of only 70Ah capacity I use 200A quite frequently. Needless to say, that my gelcell batteries are in not very good conditions, and the range came down. 
From what I read, I understand that everybody is using 100Ah and over, and draw currents up to 500A. Shouldn`t the maximum amount of amps for a 100Ah pack be under 100A? Doesn`t it kill any battery using amperage in excess of the battrery capacity rating?

I would appreciate any advice, for this VW Golf 2 upgrade project.
Thanks,
truely 
Johannes


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## Yabert (Feb 7, 2010)

Citystromer said:


> Has anyone arready mounted an engine on a VW Golf 19E Transmissieon train?


You can see below few pictures of my VW transmission coupled to my motor (really big). A smaller motor can be used for your power requirement.
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/smart-fortwo-ev-high-power-version-51472p7.html




> I would like to upgrade to Ac


Why?... I'm not sure to understand your goal. Many DC systems can achive your requirement for lower price.


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## Citystromer (May 2, 2009)

Yabert said:


> You can see below few pictures of my VW transmission coupled to my motor (really big). A smaller motor can be used for your power requirement.
> http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/smart-fortwo-ev-high-power-version-51472p7.html
> 
> 
> ...


Well, actually the DC motor is in good shape, I also get some regen which I really want because i live in a hilly terrain. I heared that the efficiency is much higher on AC systems. Another thing is, that with the installed DC motor I can`t use PWM, since the brush arcing destroyed any fets that I tried and even an 600V 600A IGBT. Thats why I use a batpack with 8 steps. Thought to get rid and upgrade to AC. YOu don`t tghink it`s worth the trouble? I saw 89% on some Ac motors, I don`t know what mine has.


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## omonoid (Aug 30, 2009)

im 90% done with my 1986 gti conversion. Check it out here


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## Guest (Jul 1, 2011)

Citystromer said:


> ...... I heared that the efficiency is much higher on AC systems.


They are not that much more efficient. In hilly areas it can be a nice thing but not a requirement. 



> Another thing is, that with the installed DC motor I can`t use PWM, since the brush arcing destroyed any fets that I tried and even an 600V 600A IGBT. Thats why I use a batpack with 8 steps.


I don't understand your statement here. All of us use PWM controllers with no troubles. Are you trying to REGEN with them with a series motor that is advanced? If so it's not the controller that is at fault. The controllers are not designed for REGEN. 



> Thought to get rid and upgrade to AC. YOu don`t tghink it`s worth the trouble? I saw 89% on some Ac motors, I don`t know what mine has.


89% efficiency is pretty normal for both DC and AC motor systems. 

Pete


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## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Hi. I bet you know this already but your Citystromer is a one of a kind vehicle that might be worth preserving in it's original form. From what I've read on other discussions here, you might not gain much from switching to AC. Perhaps changing the battery from LA to Lithium might give you enough performance boost.

Got pictures?

JR


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## mora (Nov 11, 2009)

I'd say upgrade batteries only. I don't know what your current battery pack weights but I guess it is something like 150-200kg. For the same weight you could fit 160Ah - 200Ah lithium cells and have 150km+ range. Or put smaller cells and save weight. Also saves lots of money, hehe.

This link is for mk3 Golf Citystromer, but see what they achieved by going lithium: http://www.auto88.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=48

I've converted mk2 Golf to lithium too: http://www.evalbum.com/3698

Most lithium cells can stand 3C continous discharge. That means you can pull 160 x 3 = 480A continously from 160Ah cell. Lead batteries are not happy with 3C discharge rates.


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## JRoque (Mar 9, 2010)

Hello Mora, that's a very nice Mk3 you got there. I'm amazed at the range you're getting. Any guesses as to why your MK3 range is so much greater than your MK2 conversion? I understand the higher Ah in the MK3 but still, even if you double the MK2 Ah it wouldn't be anywhere near the MK3.

Another thing that jumped at me is your MK2 curb weight. My MK3 Cabrios - which are essentially Golfs minus the hard roof - weigh 2800 lbs, the fat pigs. Your MK2 is only 2100 lbs curb. Is that right? What is the curb weight for your MK3 Citystromer?

JR


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## tomofreno (Mar 3, 2009)

> I'm amazed at the range you're getting. Any guesses as to why your MK3 range is so much greater than your MK2 conversion?


 Seems high to me too. My Swift weighs about 1025kg with a 20.76kWh LiFePo4 pack, and based on it's energy/mile usage I estimate that at 60 km/hr I could go about 170km with 80% DoD on a 23kWh pack like that in the mk3.


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## mora (Nov 11, 2009)

I don't own that Mk3 Golf. It is really sweet though. That's factory made electric car but with lead battery. They only replaced original lead batteries with LP-bricks, which aren't really meant for traction battery (meant to replace 12V battery in any ICE car). Those bricks hold closely matched cells without any BMS or circuitry but are sure easier to work with. They got 71km with 96V/80Ah pack with 100% DOD. ~170Wh/mile, seems real. After parallering three bricks they got over 200km. I also know a Bulgarian mk2 Golf conversion which gets 50 miles with 84V/90Ah pack. (http://www.evalbum.com/3241)

My cells are in bad shape (high internal resistance) but seem to deliver almost full capacity. I know I could go longer distance if I travelled at steady speed but unfortunately the city I live in is pretty hilly. Lots of stop'n'go here. Energy consumption figures in level road driving are very similar.

Mk3 Golfs are way heavier than mk2's. I have no idea what makes the difference. Maybe cabrios have some heavy structural reinforcement as they don't have hard roof. Mine was weighed during inspection so that figure in evalbum is real. ICE version was less than 2000 lbs, or at least registration paper showed that weight. It was really light to push around without engine & all the other removed stuff.


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