# Lightning runs over 200mph @ Bonneville!!!



## major (Apr 4, 2008)

toddshotrods said:


> How is this not a big topic of discussion here? I suspect Major is still out there shaking salt out of his boots, but why aren't the rest of us drooling over it on the forum? My excuse is I have had an insane schedule for the past week. As soon as I came up for air I started looking for a thread here...
> 
> http://gas2.org/2011/08/16/lightning-becomes-first-evmotorcyclelandto-go-over200-mph/
> 
> Also noteworthy is the article in Gas 2.0 says it's running a Remy motor?


Thanks for starting a thread about it Todd. I was out there for more than a week and just got home Saturday. Still trying to catch up. Great effort by team Lightning and I am proud to be part of the first electric 2-wheeler to do a record run over 200 mph. The salt demons denied us last year, but we prevailed last week. No small feat. 

http://backmarker-bikewriter.blogspot.com/2011/08/some-of-deets-on-paul-thede-breaking.html?spref=tw 

http://www.scta-bni.org/Bonneville/Speedweek%202011/results.html 

Record stands at 215.960 mph.

Top recorded speed was 218.637. We had the second fastest speed on the short course for the event barring none; 2, 4, 6 and 3 wheelers regardless of engine or fuel type  And there were hundreds of passes. Most I've ever seen on the salt. Huge event.

Todd, you'd loved it. Roadsters are "in". All types. Rat rods ruled the streets of Wendover. Paint....we don't need no stinkin paint. Original 80 yr old patina is surface treatment of choice seemingly.

More later,

major


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

major said:


> Thanks for starting a thread about it Todd....
> 
> ...Huge event.
> 
> Todd, you'd loved it. Roadsters are "in". All types. Rat rods ruled the streets of Wendover. Paint....we don't need no stinkin paint. Original 80 yr old patina is surface treatment of choice seemingly...


Congrats Major!!! 

I am doing everything I can to be there next year, making some shakedown passes in the Inhaler. Here's hoping...


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## ken will (Dec 19, 2009)

If you look at the horizon, you can see the bike is leaning to the right.
When he slows down and sits up the bike centers again.
This is probably because when in his speed position his body weight is to far to the left, which causes the bike to lean and run on the side of the tires instead of the middle. 
If he moves his body to the right so the bike rides on the center of the tires he could get several more MPH!


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

ken will said:


> If you look at the horizon, you can see the bike is leaning to the right.
> When he slows down and sits up the bike centers again.
> This is probably because when in his speed position his body weight is to far to the left, which causes the bike to lean and run on the side of the tires instead of the middle.
> If he moves his body to the right so the bike rides on the center of the tires he could get several more MPH!


Hi Ken,

It's called crosswind  Just a few mph crosswind vector will do that. And the rider is very limited to how far he can move before he gets sucked off the bike at those speeds. But from the horizon in the vid, you'd think he's making a sweeping turn, but no, straight down the middle. And yes, without that going on, there would be a few more mph.

major


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Credit to Bikewriter.com.


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

major said:


> Hi Ken,
> 
> It's called crosswind  Just a few mph crosswind vector will do that. And the rider is very limited to how far he can move before he gets sucked off the bike at those speeds. But from the horizon in the vid, you'd think he's making a sweeping turn, but no, straight down the middle. And yes, without that going on, there would be a few more mph.
> 
> major


Having never been on the salt before, but having spent a good bit of my life on two wheels, that was my guess as I watched it. It was actually hard to not lean my head with him and "help" keep the bike pointed towards the mountain! In drag racing, back in my heyday, we called it Body English. Either due to side wind, or just the bike pulling towards something in the track, you had to steer it straight like that - especially when the front wheel was often in the air or barely skimming the asphalt. Ditto, for Major's point about being sucked off. Even at sub-200mph speeds, you only have so far before you become a sail in the wind - maybe more like a kite!


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

Sweet, felt like I was making the run  Can you provide any details on the pack, motor and controller, or are you sworn to secrecy?


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## Dink (Jun 3, 2010)

Congrats, on the record gentlemen. You all are doing a great effort to show the validity of electric power to the public, along with staggering performance. Thumbs up! This is in my opinion, is what this site is about. Helping others and showing what can be done that BIG OIL doesn't want the public to see, or hear of.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

*Design details*



JRP3 said:


> Can you provide any details on the pack, motor and controller, or are you sworn to secrecy?


I guess I can share a bit without making the boss mad  First off---THANKS --- to all of our sponsors and supporters.

Motor uses the guts from Remy. That is stator and rotor. The housing was designed by us and fabbed from billet aluminum. Weighs something like 90 pounds. Integral part of bike structure. Swing arm pivots on bosses each side of the motor and single reduction chain drive has sprocket concentric with swing arm pivot so no center distance change with suspension travel. Motor frame also provides structure to front frame housing battery up to the headstock.

Motor is IPM (Imbedded Permanent Magnet) interior rotor with 10 poles and unique hairpin coil stator. The usual 3 phase. It is oil cooled and lubed. I won't reveal dyno numbers, but I have seen 140 hp in print, so I will confirm we have at least that much 

The controller is from Rinehart Motion Systems. It is custom designed, liquid cooled, compact and attaches to the motor.

The battery is composed of cells from Ener1. These are a pouch style LiPoly. Nominal pack voltage is like 350. BMS is made by Lightning.

Regards,

major


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

How have you found the Rinehart to work with? I know Jack Rickard has had some issues with his but felt the company has been very responsive in helping out.
Any of the recent goings on at Ener1 likely to affect your cell choice? I hear they are on the edge of bankruptcy after the Think fiasco.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

JRP3 said:


> How have you found the Rinehart to work with?


Strong product and no problems working with them 



> Any of the recent goings on at Ener1 likely to affect your cell choice? I hear they are on the edge of bankruptcy after the Think fiasco.


Again, great product and some 'over and beyond' support getting it to us where and when needed, like IOM. I personally think Ener1 is around to stay. Too bad about trouble with Think.


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## tomofreno (Mar 3, 2009)

*Re: Design details*

Impressive work! Congratulations major!


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## tomofreno (Mar 3, 2009)

Have you spoken with Rinehart about a 650A/170V controller JRP3? Those poor little 100Ah cells.


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## DavidDymaxion (Dec 1, 2008)

I share some blame for this topic not coming up sooner. I was on the Salt Flats on Tuesday but didn't post about it yet -- been too busy trying to get my own car ready for the Salt!

Anyway, it was great fun to see the bike run. Many of the gassers wobble unsteadily, motor rpm fluctuates as they try to feather the clutch on a bike geared way higher than stock, and get a tail wag as the wheel suddenly breaks traction in 3rd or 4th gear. The Lightning bike was straight as an arrow, and I didn't see any wheelspin. Maybe electric propulsion is steadier and less likely to spin, or maybe easier to modulate, or maybe easier to hear wheel spin start, or maybe just had a better than average rider.

It was great fun to meet Major in person, and hear his insights on the bike and general electric car technology.


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## JRP3 (Mar 7, 2008)

tomofreno said:


> Have you spoken with Rinehart about a 650A/170V controller JRP3? Those poor little 100Ah cells.


I was leaning in that direction, until Jack mentioned the price  The lower current version he's using in the Mini is over $8K I think


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

DavidDymaxion said:


> ...Many of the gassers wobble unsteadily, motor rpm fluctuates as they try to feather the clutch on a bike geared way higher than stock, and get a tail wag as the wheel suddenly breaks traction in 3rd or 4th gear. The Lightning bike was straight as an arrow, and I didn't see any wheelspin. Maybe electric propulsion is steadier and less likely to spin, or maybe easier to modulate, or maybe easier to hear wheel spin start, or maybe just had a better than average rider...


I would guess electric is much easier to modulate. One of the biggest challenges to riding a bike with a lot of power is applying it through the relatively tiny rear contact patch. It takes a deft touch with the clutch/throttle. Being able to simply roll the throttle in, and program the desired ramp-in accordingly in the controller, has to make that a much smoother process.

All that being said, from the rider's perspective, that wooble doesn't feel like it looks to the casual observer. It actually communicates what's going on with the rear tire very well. My hands were sort of hard-wired to that sensation, making constant adjustments in throttle and clutch, until I felt it bite. It never felt unsteady, even when the rear end of the bike was a foot to one side or the other. I was still just riding through it, waiting for it to find some traction. Ditto for the lean in the video, and "body English" to correct the bike's course - that stuff is all just riding.

I have made the decision of going back on two wheels next year, to complement my efforts on the Inhaler. I realized after a while that the very things we're talking about here (on a bike), would be useful in sharpening my reflexes, and fine-tuning my brain to race mentality again - even if I'm not going that fast (relatively speaking). This whole conversation has me chomping at the bit, and wishing I could do it this year. Maybe I'll bring my bike to Bonneville too.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

*THANK YOU for 200mph @ Bonneville!!!*



major said:


> Credit to Bikewriter.com.


Although there were 3 on Lightning’s way team as shown in the photo, many more make up the effort. I want to mention those names and this is as good place and time as any.

First off, the 3 idiots in the photo: Yours truly at left, crew chief (are you still chief when you’re the only one on the crew?). Center is Paul Thede, rider extraordinaire and founder/owner of RaceTech. Paul has been riding the salt on 2 wheels since ’05 and holds a number of records on ICEers. He assisted Lightning in ’09 aligning the electric bike on the salt when Aaron Frank was riding in the 160 range with some handling issues. After Aaron had to leave for his real job as editor of_ Motorcyclist, _Paul road the bike naked to 166 mph, IIRC. We hooked him. He has been Lightning’s salt rider ever since. At the ‘010 Bub Speed Trials, with Paul atop, Lightning set the FIM world record of 173.321. This year, Paul, atop the ‘011 Lightning bike, set the SCTA world record at 215.960. This was Paul’s first record over 200 mph and got him into the “Red Hat Club”. They give that to those who set records over 200 mph. Only 64 have red hats for 2 wheelers in the 50 years of existence. This was also the first in history to set a record of 200 mph or faster on a electric 2 wheel vehicle.

The other in the photo is Richard Hatfield. What can I say? Like I told him recently, thanks Richard for including me in your hair-brained adventures 


Behind the scenes, back in San Carlos, many folks help in some very big ways. Ray at A&A Racing is always at the shop as we work on the bikes. He shares his 50 years experience in MC racing as well as his equipment and tools. John machines parts and builds with great skill. Charles (who reads this board) has spent countless hours wiring BMS and building batteries and whatever. And a host of volunteers who drop by and work, like Bob G. and Dave from Remy. Thanks guys. You’re a big part of 200MPH+.

At the Salt Flats, a big THANKS to the SCTA. A volunteer organization with hundreds working in, let’s say, unfriendly conditions to set up a 1000 traffic cones, timing equipment, officiate, and run the tech, certification and safety crew. Also thanks to every participant and spectator there. Must have been like 10,000. Particularly the participants. Eager to help with tools, parts and advice. Special thanks to Paul & Becka Livingston. And to Joe Amo and Rory. Joe is like the fastest ICEer APS bike on the salt with like 277mph. He and Rory spent like 5 hours on “our” bike’s aero package tuning Monday and were a big part of us bumping up the record Tuesday by almost 10mph.

Thanks to the other go-fast electric 2 wheel guys who gave us the sense of urgency to be the first to 200. There is Mr. Riches, who’s 176 record we bested. He showed up and recorded a 192 run. Nice improvement. There’s Yates, who plans an attempt at the Bub this year. He’s got a lot of hp and has done like 190. MotoCzysz has been to Bonneville and could get into the mix. Then guys like Lawless and Dube. Or some unknown. Only one was to be the first, and Lightning did it. Next mark???? 250? 300  

Lastly, thanks to the Wendover cop who let me off with a warning after busting me for rolling thru a stop sign


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## drivin98 (May 9, 2008)

Thanks for all that Major, and congratulations!

Personally though, you look more like a Colonel than a Major.


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

drivin98 said:


> ...Personally though, you look more like a Colonel than a Major.


I forgot to comment on that! Your appearance does fit your snippy replies here on the forum, Major.  Were you a military commander in a former life?


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## DIYguy (Sep 18, 2008)

Congrats to you and the rest of the team Major! Awesome accomplishment.

Gary


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

toddshotrods said:


> I forgot to comment on that! Your appearance does fit your snippy replies here on the forum, Major.  Were you a military commander in a former life?


I only remember _some _of my former lives, so am unsure about the military. 

Here's another photo I like. Happy rider is a good thing


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## favguy (May 2, 2008)

Congratulations on the run guys, a fantastic achievement 

Paul


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## Jonah Templeton (Aug 29, 2011)

Oh my goodness this is a major achievement! It is very exciting to see and I can only imagine how exhilarating that ride must have been. Congratulations to all of you and your sponsors for making a huge step for electric drive.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

DIYguy said:


> Awesome accomplishment.


Thanks guys. Been sorting some photos. So here are a few for those interested.









We were paddocked in a hanger at the Wendover airport (about 10 miles from the Bonneville Speedway).










It was a big hanger.










The hanger which housed the Enola Gay during the preparation for the mission which brought WWII to an end. A couple of other teams were also using it. Plenty of floor space, but shy on comfort. Better than the Nugget parking lot where we worked on the bike last year.










Dawn at the zero mile marker short course 3 as Lightning waits in queue for a back-up run for a record.


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

Here is a good article, mostly about our rider Paul. 

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/287/11106/Motorcycle-Article/Salt-Addiction--Paul-Thede.aspx


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

major said:


> Here is a good article, mostly about our rider Paul.
> 
> http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/287/11106/Motorcycle-Article/Salt-Addiction--Paul-Thede.aspx


Very nice article.  Actually, his perspective on the ride makes the bike more real - at least to a motorcycle rider...


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

Hey Major, did you see that the Maxton Mile is supposedly moving to our back yards? I'm chomping at the bit!  My Team, however, is moving very slowly though (and I can't force anything, because they're all volunteer right now).


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

toddshotrods said:


> Hey Major, did you see that the Maxton Mile is supposedly moving to our back yards? I'm chomping at the bit!  My Team, however, is moving very slowly though (and I can't force anything, because they're all volunteer right now).


And my team is in California  Hell, get your ride done and I'll crew for ya


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## toddshotrods (Feb 10, 2009)

major said:


> And my team is in California  Hell, get your ride done and I'll crew for ya


That makes me  I will push it, and them, as hard as I possibly can. I really, really, want to start beating up on this thing next year. I'll keep my eye out for more details, and dates...


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## major (Apr 4, 2008)

major said:


> Here is a good article, mostly about our rider Paul.
> 
> http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/287/11106/Motorcycle-Article/Salt-Addiction--Paul-Thede.aspx


I hadn't seen this picture before.










I wonder how they shot it  Must have been on our last run which was on the long course.

In the article Paul says he had to baby it up to 130. He told me he used half throttle up to 150 mph and then pegged it. All this in less than a mile....on salt


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## MalcolmB (Jun 10, 2008)

Great photos Major. I've driven on salt roads a few times, but that was in a 4x4 Toyota truck. It's good fun drifting on it in a truck, but I wouldn't fancy it on a bike and can't imagine what it must be like at 200+ mph. I'm too attached to my skin to even contemplate it.

Belated congratulations to you and the rest of the team!


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