# [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I "think" I want to install a 10K NTC to a motor brush. Any ideas? Looking
for the hottest spot to monitor? The correct spot to monitor?

Mark Grasser

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/ADC-Temperature-Sensor-tp3172613p3172613.html

The thread above has some discussion and Lee mentions that the brush is the
spot that heats up quickest.

I've been curious about the best way to monitor motor temp as well. Seems
like measuring brush temp would be the best way in a racing application, but
would it still be best for a commuter vehicle? maybe field temp instead?



> Mark Grasser <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > I "think" I want to install a 10K NTC to a motor brush. Any ideas? Looking
> > for the hottest spot to monitor? The correct spot to monitor?
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Mark, would it be feasible to drill a small hole in the top side of the bru=
sh and put the sensor down in the hole and then fill with epoxy? You never =
really wear the brushes down to the nubbin anyway. Might even use some of t=
hat metal bearing epoxy to increase the conductivity? Then use a flexible i=
nsulated pigtail on the thermistor. David Chapman. =




________________________________
From: Mark Grasser <[email protected]>
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List' <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2011 10:40 AM
Subject: [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install

I "think" I want to install a 10K NTC to a motor brush. Any ideas? Look=
ing
for the hottest spot to monitor? The correct spot to monitor?

Mark Grasser

_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
|
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I like this. =


Maybe solder Teflon jacketed leads to the NTC. shrink tube the leads. Dip in
epoxy and let harden(to be sure of insulation when put into the hole). Drill
a hole just big enough, probably ~3/8" deep. Fill the hole about 1/3 full
with epoxy. Put the NTC in the hole. =


Might be better to use a 2 part potting compound?

Any opinions? =


Sincerely,
Mark Grasser
=




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-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of David Chapman
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2011 4:26 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install

Mark, would it be feasible to drill a small hole in the top side of the
brush and put the sensor down in the hole and then fill with epoxy? You
never really wear the brushes down to the nubbin anyway. Might even use some
of that metal bearing epoxy to increase the conductivity? Then use a
flexible insulated pigtail on the thermistor. David Chapman. =




________________________________
From: Mark Grasser <[email protected]>
To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List' <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2011 10:40 AM
Subject: [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install

I "think" I want to install a 10K NTC to a motor brush. Any ideas? Look=
ing
for the hottest spot to monitor? The correct spot to monitor?

Mark Grasser

_______________________________________________
| Moratorium on drag racing discussion is in effect.
| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
|
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Mark Grasser <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > I like this.
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Chris Tromley wrote:
> > I think you're on the right track with this approach. My only
> > concern is the epoxy. IIRC, the brush temp you shouldn't exceed is
> > around 250 F, so you need an epoxy that can withstand maybe 300+.
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I once used JB quick on a catalytic converter leak. Worked for over a year,
then sold the car. Why not instead of glueing it into the hole put a flange
on it and hold it into the hole by putting the flange under the brush
spring? Gets rid of the expansion contraction problem. There is also a
copper based silicone good for 500 degreesF. I might look at that also.
Being full of copper it might have good thermal characteristics. Will have
to look at the chemical aspect and try to understand what eats what in the
brush.

Mark Grasser
Balyntec Products
>From my shop PC


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Chris Tromley
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2011 8:38 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install

On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 5:12 PM, Mark Grasser


> <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > I like this.
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Gene,



> Gene Stopp <[email protected]> wrote:
> > If the blower is off, would enough air get sucked through the motor throu=
> gh the shroud and stopped blower rotor by the existing centrifugal fan in t=
> he motor, to cool it in normal operation?
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Gene Stopp wrote:
> > I have an EVSource Dayton blower with a 2" flex hose that goes to a
> > brush cooling shroud on the motor (ImPulse9)... This blower is the
> > loudest thing in the car and if it was turned off the car would be
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Why-ever can't we get any info from Netgain on this issue? Surely it 
is in their interests as much as ours to be able to specify how to 
attach a temp sensor to their motors and use it in a consistant and 
tested way that protects the motor for given power use situations at 
varying ambient temperatures? They could even sell them.

But then they don't even publish proper info on their motor 
characteristics either, just that rather useless '72V' data sheet.

Come on Netgain! Lets have some real-life data - graphs at 120V and 
144V would be a start and temperature performance at 20 deg C (or 
whatever) measured by a bolt on sensor, say, under one of the field 
winding bolts at different fixed current flows from 25A to 800A in 25A 
steps... Something!

MW




> Gene Stopp wrote:
> 
> > After some weeks of successful EV driving there are a few minor
> > things that I ignored at first but are becoming items on my to-do
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

All the Dayton blowers I have are from the 1975-1985 years that I got from 
my whole electrical supplier. I noted that you can get them from EV Source 
which I see are the same cost today as back in 1975. So they may not be made 
the same anymore from some where else.

There is hardly any noise from the early years blowers. The motors are 
totally enclose whisper quite type. One thing when you mount these blowers, 
do not mount them directly to any body, frame, or motor directly by metal to 
metal contact. Use motor rubber mounting bushings that you can get from a 
motor shop or use thick multilayer rubber gasket between the outlet flange 
and mounting structure.

Back in 75, GE mounted this type of blower right to the brush cover with the 
outlet on a 1/8 inch soft rubber sheet which is bolted to a curved hard 
rubber block which is tap for 10/32 screws. Then there is another 1/8 inch 
soft rubber sheet between this hard rubber block and fasten to the solid 
steel brush cover with 10/32 flat head screws that are inserted in the from 
the bottom of the brush cover.

We are not done yet. There is another layer of 1/8 inch soft rubber that is 
glue to the bottom of the brush cover that contacts the motor housing.

On the WarP motors, I use these same mounting technic, except the curved 
steel adapter I made from 10 and 12 inch steel tubing is not bolted to the 
brush screen cover. This curve adapter has a rubber sheet glue to the 
bottom which contacts the screen. This adapter is flush with the front of 
the motor housing and has two steel mounting tabs coming down the front face 
of the motor which is bolted to two existing bolt holes.

I can removed this blower fan by just unplugging it and removing the two 
mounting bolts in with 3 min and 35 sec. Make every thing in your 
installation maintenance ease. Unlike some ICE's that have a hour labor 
charge of 8 hours to replace a heater fan. I can replace my heater fan in 
with 15 minutes.

Roland






----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Lee Hart" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2011 10:23 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] temp sensor to brush install




> > Gene Stopp wrote:
> > > I have an EVSource Dayton blower with a 2" flex hose that goes to a
> > > brush cooling shroud on the motor (ImPulse9)... This blower is the
> > > loudest thing in the car and if it was turned off the car would be
> ...


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