# [EVDL] EVLN: Corbin Motors wants a Sparrow 2 for 2013 market



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

[ref
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Corbin-Motors-wants-a-Sparrow-2-for-2013-market-tp4431421p4431421.html
]

Perhaps Mike Corbin is trying to re-live what he considers are his 
past glories
http://www.sparrowmotors.com/Sparrows%20History.html
http://youtube.com/watch?v=8uMISMPxONE
Way back when the Sparrow was new to the scene, it was way-cool, and 
driving one made you a star.

But NMG already has the Sparrow market sewn up.

Today is a different story, and a different market. Much has changed. 
IMO what is not needed is a single seat enclosed EV that barely has 
enough room for a sack of groceries.

Bu Mike stubbornly hangs on to trying to sell a single seater
http://www.sparrowmotors.com/extended.html

What is needed, is a lower priced EV, targeting the $20k range when
in high production, that is a two seater with room for at least 
two bags of groceries (or a large sack of dirty laundry).

Leave the 4 seater EVs for the big boys to fight over and target the 
next step down. More than a motorcycle's carrying abilities, but not 
a small sedan like the Leaf EV.

Corbin was going to make a two seater, the Merlin (coupe)
http://matt_birchard.tripod.com/cars/blue_logo_web.jpg
http://www.janhauser.com/presentations/planetwork/sld040.htm
http://www.3wheelers.com/msmerlin2.jpg
but the battery technology was not as good as today. He abandoned 
that EV dream for an ice roadster version
http://files.conceptcarz.com/img/Corbin%20Motors/merlin_corbin_motors_roadster_05.pg.jpg
but some management mess-ups, and backers backed
out, left him declaring bankruptcy.

The piece mentioned Aptera, but again that isn't what I would target
for. More along the lines of the Triac
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triac_%28car%29
which also failed because of not enough funding, etc.

Both Tata and GM-India are poised to offer small no-frills Nano-like
EVs for the India-market, but both are holding back because there is
no public EVSE infrastructure.

Whatever Corbin produces might benefit in cost reduction of some of
their two-seater EV components were manufactured in India, and 
assembled in the U.S.A.

The first run of his EV would likely be by pre-order and at a 
higher cost. But once demand rose, manufacturing large quantities
would drop the purchase price.

Corbin could also offer a base model, and then offer lots of options
Level-1 & Level-2 3kW on-board charger with an option to go up to 7kW,
etc.


{brucedp.150m.com}

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I do not care how you place two seats, one on top of the other if 
that is better, but the two seat capability is more that just 
carrying two people.

When just the driver alone, the other seat is used for carrying 
other/more cargo. A business person would place on the passenger
seat their cases/satchels holding their laptop, presentation papers,
the carry-on bag for an over-nighter, etc. A parent would strap in
the baby/child carrier, plus throw in the diaper/bottle bag, the 
stroller/pram, favorite toys, etc.

In the case of businesses, they may find alternative uses of that
vehicle: the passenger seat is ripped out, and some business box is 
put in its place (i.e. a keep-hot pizza carrier, a frozen foods 
container, a locked security-box for important deliveries, etc.).
This is similar to how the pizza butt Sparrow came about, and how
GEM nEVs are being used for anything from workman tool carriers 
to food-truck uses.

What would be touted to the consumer is a fully loaded capability 
of: two people, and a couple sacks of groceries. But as we all know, 
owners of vehicles find interesting ways to always carry more things 
than a vehicle was designed for. I was amazed to see how a Sparrow 
driver squeezed in the longer pfc-50 charger into his EV (wow!).

The Sparrow NMG is a way-cool EV, but not as marketable as a two seat
sized EV. That is my point. To get the production numbers up high
enough to start bringing priced down is why I say look at a two seat
EV design. With less capability than a Leaf EV, the two seater would
be lighter thus using less costly components. I am suggesting the two 
seat design would be between a Sparrow and a Leaf EV.

The Indian EVs I previously mentioned that Tata and GM have ready 
for manufacture but are waiting on publicly available EVSE to be in 
place, are the size, weight, performance, and no-frills price that 
match what I am talking about. But theirs is targeting for a four
seat EV design, whereas I am targeting for a two seat EV design.

I will assume the buyers of those India EVs are a smaller stature 
people than big tall Californians (not me, but 6'2" 250lb galoots). 
If that Nano sized, light weight EV only had two seats, placed for 
larger taller Californians' with longer arms & legs, it would suit 
the purposes of many more buyers than just the California market.


{brucedp.150m.com}






> Lee Hart wrote:
> > On 2/29/2012 7:57 AM, Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
> > > Mike [Corbin] stubbornly hangs on to trying to sell a single seater
> > > http://www.sparrowmotors.com/extended.html
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Recently there have been a few posts on the EVDL concerning the possibility
that the Corbins would resurrect the Sparrow. 
I believe that, in all fairness, the positive spin of those articles needs
to be balanced by a reminder of how badly the Corbin Sparrow story ended.

Ten years ago, the Corbins took people's money for Sparrows that they
couldn't deliver, and then shut their doors. 
I was not among those people (I got my Sparrow early on), but I was
heartbroken by the pain of those who lost more money they could afford to
lose. 
What could they do? 
Live and learn!

As I read today's articles, I feel that now we can put that learning to use.
Do we reward the Corbins for what can be most charitably called their "poor
management skills"? 
Can we let history repeat itself?
Or should we learn from the experience of the people who got burned? 
What makes us think that this time would be different?

The turn of events 10 years ago put a black eye not just on the Corbins, but
on the cottage EV industry in general. 
Sparrow? Yes, please.
Corbin? Not so sure about that.

Here are some articles from that time:
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/sparrow_ev/message/14747
"The Corbins lied about the financial solvency of their electric
car company in an attempt to gain investors, attorneys for the State
of California have alleged in a lawsuit filed against them."
The announcement:
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/sparrow_ev/message/14421
The aftermath:
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/sparrow_ev/message/14807

-----
Davide Andrea
Elithion 
--
View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Corbin-Motors-wants-a-Sparrow-2-for-2013-market-tp4431421p4435356.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Although some of Corbin's financial woes were reported at the time, I've 
forgotten a lot of it now. I do recall reading that he rode round town not 
in a Sparrow or other EV, but in a chauffeur driven Bentley!

I also recall that posts on the EVDL reporting that Corbin Motors hired (or 
contracted with) a succession of very competent EV engineers and then 
(according to those engineers) largely ignored their advice on such crucial 
matters as series motor brush timing. This didn't affect just Corbin 
Motors, but also their customers and suppliers. 

For example, if I'm not mistaken, at least one of their controller suppliers 
(DC Power?) was pretty seriously stressed financially by the mortaility of 
their controllers when trying to drive an incorrectly timed motor.

(Originally the Sparrow was to have been powered by a DC brushless motor. 
Corbin bought the motor company! But they were never able to make it work 
properly.)

If you have an inclination to get involved with the Sparrow II in some way - 
as a customer, supplier, worker, or designer - knowing the company's history 
may be of value to you. Many of the EVDL posts from that era should still be 
floating round the net. Try this for a few hundred of them :

http://www.mail-archive.com/search?q=corbin&l=ev%40listproc.sjsu.edu

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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| Please take those discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
|
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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> Elithion <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Recently there have been a few posts on the EVDL concerning the possibility
> > that the Corbins would resurrect the Sparrow.
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

It does sounds pretty grim when you compare it to a car, but what about if =
you compare it to a motorcycle? A motorcycle suffers from the same short wh=
eelbase and rear wheel skidding issues. Has anyone been killed or seriously=
hurt in a Sparrow? All the mishaps I've heard about had minor or no injuri=
es. I'd guess it is safer than a motorcycle and less safe than a car.



________________________________
From: Chris Tromley <[email protected]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]> =

Sent: Thursday, March 1, 2012 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Corbin Motors wants a Sparrow 2 for 2013 market
=



> Elithion <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Recently there have been a few posts on the EVDL concerning the possibili=
> ty
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> David Dymaxion <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > It does sounds pretty grim when you compare it to a car, but what about if
> > you compare it to a motorcycle? A motorcycle suffers from the same short
> ...


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