# [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

For a 240V circuit, you would install a GFI breaker (not unlike one required
for a hot tub). These can be found at any big box store (Home Depot, etc).
Should solve your problem. BTW, the chargers from Manzanita are non- iso's
as well. -Thos



> voganni <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to this, and
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hello Bill,

You got to be kidding, the electrical shop said there is no 240 volt GFI. 
This is like saying there is no transistors and only tubes.

Tell them to look in the circuit breaker catalogs and look in the GFI 
circuit breaker section. There are two pole 120/240 volt GFI circuit 
breakers. Many type will fit a standard home plug in breaker panel.

If your panel will not accept a GFI circuit breaker, then get a small power 
surface mount panel that will hold just one of these breakers. Install a 
cord to the panel to plug into a 240 volt receptacle that goes to a standard 
240 v 2 pole C/B in your panel.

Then plug in a 240 GFI circuit breaker into the breaker enclosure. You then 
can attach a surface outlet box with a 240 volt receptacle to this power 
box.

I am using a PFC-50 battery charger that is not isolated, but I made it some 
what isolated, by installing the charger inside a fiberglass enclosure. 
Only the case of the charger is ground. I do not get any voltage between 
any battery post and the frame of the vehicle.

The battery pack is also totally enclose in a fiberglass box. When the 
vehicle is turn off, the battery pack power leads are then open by two 
contactors. This is done, because I do not want the charging current going 
to the controller which the negative goes right to the motor which could 
cause leakage by the conduction of the brush dust.

If the battery charger is not in use I have a 2 pole 100 amp DC contactor 
that opens up the charger leads to the battery. I found that if this 
charger is connected up all the time, and when you disconnected a battery 
link, it may cause a spark which is cause by the capacitors in the chargers.

Now if you let your batteries get any battery vapors on the surface of the 
batteries, the battery containers and frame of the vehicle, you could get 
some conduction path to these units. If you are standing on bare wet ground 
with un-insulated boots, it will then trip the GFI breaker.

Roland




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "voganni" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 8:45 PM
Subject: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?


>
> Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to this, and 
> my
> local electrical shop didn't know either. In the case of non-isolated
> chargers, running on 240 volts, is a GFI used? I have never seen a 240 
> volt
> GFI and neither had my electrical shop. I thought possibly that in the 
> case
> of 240 volts where there is not a current-carrying neutral wire grounded 
> to
> the panel a GFI would not be used. However, my present Russco charger only
> trips its or the houses GFI when there is some battery leakage due to dust
> and acid to the battery frame. If this happened with 240 volts, how would 
> I
> know? I am considering upgrading to a 144 volt pack and Manzanita Micro
> charger. Thanks, Bill Vogan
> -- 
> View this message in context: 
> http://n4.nabble.com/240-volt-GFI-tp1202008p1202008.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at 
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
> 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I knew I came to the right place! Thanks Roland and Thos. I had just never
seen a 240v GFI and neither had the electrician/counterman (bit of a rooky I
guess) here in Colville. My house has a Square D QO commercial panel so I'm
sure they make a 2-pole GFI to fit it. I kind of like the idea of a separate
box though, as it would provide protection in opportunity charging
situations also. 
-- 
View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/240-volt-GFI-tp1202008p1223832.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

You can get GFCI breakers for 240V outlets. They are common on Hot Tubs.
I have one in my truck with my PFC-50 hooked to it. (Ebay has the best 
prices.)



> voganni wrote:
> > Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to this, and my
> > local electrical shop didn't know either. In the case of non-isolated
> > chargers, running on 240 volts, is a GFI used? I have never seen a 240 volt
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Disconnects for spas are 240v gfci protected. Available at Home Depot, 
or any electrical supply house.

Sent from my iPhone



> voganni <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

240 V GFCI receptacles are commonly used in spa tubs - check with your local 
electrical wholesaler, or building supply stores.

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "voganni" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 8:45 PM
Subject: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?


>
> Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to this, and 
> my
> local electrical shop didn't know either. In the case of non-isolated
> chargers, running on 240 volts, is a GFI used? I have never seen a 240 
> volt
> GFI and neither had my electrical shop. I thought possibly that in the 
> case
> of 240 volts where there is not a current-carrying neutral wire grounded 
> to
> the panel a GFI would not be used. However, my present Russco charger only
> trips its or the houses GFI when there is some battery leakage due to dust
> and acid to the battery frame. If this happened with 240 volts, how would 
> I
> know? I am considering upgrading to a 144 volt pack and Manzanita Micro
> charger. Thanks, Bill Vogan
> -- 
> View this message in context: 
> http://n4.nabble.com/240-volt-GFI-tp1202008p1202008.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at 
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I saw that others have mentioned GFCI breakers - note that 240V GFCI 
receptacles is what I mentioned, and are also available.

Joseph H. Strubhar

Web: www.gremcoinc.com

E-mail: [email protected]



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "joe" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 8:04 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?


> 240 V GFCI receptacles are commonly used in spa tubs - check with your 
> local
> electrical wholesaler, or building supply stores.
>
> Joseph H. Strubhar
>
> Web: www.gremcoinc.com
>
> E-mail: [email protected]
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "voganni" <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 8:45 PM
> Subject: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?
>
>
>>
>> Hi all, I have searched the archives and can't find an answer to this, 
>> and
>> my
>> local electrical shop didn't know either. In the case of non-isolated
>> chargers, running on 240 volts, is a GFI used? I have never seen a 240
>> volt
>> GFI and neither had my electrical shop. I thought possibly that in the
>> case
>> of 240 volts where there is not a current-carrying neutral wire grounded
>> to
>> the panel a GFI would not be used. However, my present Russco charger 
>> only
>> trips its or the houses GFI when there is some battery leakage due to 
>> dust
>> and acid to the battery frame. If this happened with 240 volts, how would
>> I
>> know? I am considering upgrading to a 144 volt pack and Manzanita Micro
>> charger. Thanks, Bill Vogan
>> -- 
>> View this message in context:
>> http://n4.nabble.com/240-volt-GFI-tp1202008p1202008.html
>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
>> Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
>> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
>> Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
>> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Available, yes, but much harder to come by....unless you are able to buy at
a wholesale electrical supply house.
As I suggested in my 1st comment, a hot tub GFI set is the most readily
available (either internallly or externally mounted in a sub panel).-Thos



> joe <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > I saw that others have mentioned GFCI breakers - note that 240V GFCI
> > receptacles is what I mentioned, and are also available.
> ...


----------



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Is there a GFCI that can be used for both120v and 240v? Only one connected 
at a time obvisouly...

Would the Leviton Hi-Current #6895-B (which should be #8895-00E), ebay 
#230405418587 work?

Thanks
Rush Dougherty
www.TEVA2.com 

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Yes that should work for both 110V and 220V. =


Note the diagram posted is misleading. The contractor contacts are rated fo=
r 240V but the coil should be 110V

When using for 110 just use L1 and N for 220V use L1, L2, and optionaly N


Later,
Peter



My EVs and other projects:
http://www.wire2wire.org/




> From: [email protected]
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 11:41:28 -0700
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?
> =

> Is there a GFCI that can be used for both120v and 240v? Only one connecte=
d =

> at a time obvisouly...
> =

> Would the Leviton Hi-Current #6895-B (which should be #8895-00E), ebay =

> #230405418587 work?
> =

> Thanks
> Rush Dougherty
> www.TEVA2.com =

> =

> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
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> =

=

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Thanks I thought so. I figured out that the coil is 120 because it is only =

using one leg of the 240.
Thanks for the confirmation.

Rush
Tucson AZ
www.TEVA2.com

----- Original Message ----- =

From: "Peter Shabino" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 2:11 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?



Yes that should work for both 110V and 220V.

Note the diagram posted is misleading. The contractor contacts are rated fo=
r =

240V but the coil should be 110V

When using for 110 just use L1 and N for 220V use L1, L2, and optionaly N


Later,
Peter



My EVs and other projects:
http://www.wire2wire.org/




> From: [email protected]
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 11:41:28 -0700
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] 240 volt GFI?
>
> Is there a GFCI that can be used for both120v and 240v? Only one connected
> at a time obvisouly...
>
> Would the Leviton Hi-Current #6895-B (which should be #8895-00E), ebay
> #230405418587 work?
>
> Thanks
> Rush Dougherty
> www.TEVA2.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

All 240V GFCI units that I have seen intended for permanent attachment
require a neutral connection to work. That's fine for installing in
your garage, but if you want one for opportunity charging, you may not
have a neutral wire. For example in a NEMA 6-20, you have 2 hot wires
and ground. Assuming you connected the ground wire to the case of
your car, you don't want the GFCI sensing that ground wire. Otherwise
you could have current flowing from some part of your electrical
systems through you to the case of the car, and the GFCI wouldn't
trip. (I'm sure you'd never work on your car with it plugged in, but
still it's best to be careful.)

An alternative is the TRC-25000-016. (Thanks to rod864 for letting me
know about this unit). It is intended to be built into a cord. It
does work on 240V or 120V, it does disconnect both hot wires, and it
does not require a neutral wire. It does have the slight disadvantage
that it turns off when not plugged in. If you keep this unit in
a cord in your car, you have to remember to turn it on after plugging
it in to your power source.

Ken




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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

From: Evan Tuer <[email protected]>
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2010 16:02:50 +0000

You should be able to source an "RCD" device which will work from the
UK/Europe. Our 240V mains has no centre tap.

But would such a breaker disconnect both hot wires? Your 240V is one
hot wire and one neutral, isn't it? In the US both wires are hot, so
that each wire carries 120V relative to ground.

Ken

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