# Tripolar lead cobalt battery?



## JRK5150 (May 18, 2008)

I stumbled across talk of these tripolar lead cobalt batteries online. They look cool. I think this link should work, if not just google it. www.electricauto.com/_pdfs/new_batt_Ecar_Whitepaper.pdf

Anyway, the claim is a cheaper, more powerful alternative to lead acid and lithium. What do you folks think?


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## saab96 (Mar 19, 2008)

JRK5150 said:


> I stumbled across talk of these tripolar lead cobalt batteries online. They look cool. I think this link should work, if not just google it. www.electricauto.com/_pdfs/new_batt_Ecar_Whitepaper.pdf
> 
> Anyway, the claim is a cheaper, more powerful alternative to lead acid and lithium. What do you folks think?


Given the fact that this has been hawked for the last 40 years, I'd say it's an R&D scam along the lines of the Moller Skycar.


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## JRK5150 (May 18, 2008)

Yeah, it does reek of a scam, but some of the tech they present in the pdf _seems_ to make sense. For instance, the lead "foam" they use to increase the surface area sounds plausible. Anyone know if this is just another scam, or if any of this tech really works? It would be nice to have a cheap alternative to lithium ion!


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## saab96 (Mar 19, 2008)

JRK5150 said:


> Yeah, it does reek of a scam, but some of the tech they present in the pdf _seems_ to make sense. For instance, the lead "foam" they use to increase the surface area sounds plausible. Anyone know if this is just another scam, or if any of this tech really works? It would be nice to have a cheap alternative to lithium ion!


It sounds to me like this tripolar stuff is just some old guy tinkering in his garage. Even if he is able to make a prototype, he can't scale it out.

Considering that Firefly is having great difficulty finishing their fully developed carbon foam technology, and is doing a limited rollout of its half-assed version, and they actually have some funding, I'd say it's harder to move this theory into practice than it seems.


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## JRK5150 (May 18, 2008)

Even though it may not enter production with this manufacturer, could the basic technology, lead foam, multiple connection points, and cobalt, do what is claimed? Also, would it be possible for any other manufacturers to build with similar technology or is this all patented? The lead foam seems like a no-brainer in terms of having much more surface area than plates. Would these still have a memory like traditional lead acid where charge drain shouldn't exceed 80%, or would they behave like other batteries and allow a complete discharge?


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## saab96 (Mar 19, 2008)

JRK5150 said:


> Even though it may not enter production with this manufacturer, could the basic technology, lead foam, multiple connection points, and cobalt, do what is claimed?


Personally, if it's not going to be mass produced, I don't care whether it's possible or not. Given that this hasn't been manufactured for 40 years, it's not wise to wait for it now.



JRK5150 said:


> Also, would it be possible for any other manufacturers to build with similar technology or is this all patented?


Everything under the sun has been patented. Firefly has its own patents that certainly must overlap with this technology, for instance. The patent office is a joke. Look what happened with Cobasys.


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## manic_monkey (Jun 24, 2008)

is it childish of me to want these batteries just cause they have a cool sounding name?


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## JRK5150 (May 18, 2008)

Haha, I hope that isn't seen as childish because that's what caught my attention too!  After reading about it, I want these even more than ever! They have the price of lead acid with the energy density of lithium ion...  If these ever go on the market by *ANYONE* I'll be all over it! I'm sure I'm not the only one.


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## rmay635703 (Oct 23, 2008)

I know this is an old thread but these WERE used in a couple Nasa related satelites and WERE produced in the 1950s in Central America by the Atlas battery company.

Their advantage is the cobalt prevents the positive plate from rusting away in heat, their structure supporting the uniquely shaped redundant plates in various locations reduces the likelyhood of plates breaking and shorting. The acid pump they recommend also helps eliminate shorts.

The Mars EV cars that were pilotted in the 60's and 70's had these batteries, a couple folks got the cars 2nd hand and the batteries lasted 30years or so.

So yes lead acid can do more but the cost is likely also not competitive with lithium.


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