# [EVDL] rear coil spring upgrade



## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

By fixing the suspension, what do you mean?

If you mean you want to reset the a vehicle to the original height with the 
original weight, or is to restored the ride height with added weight to the 
vehicle.

What I did before I remove any of the components from the ICE, is to measure 
the existing ride height. Also while I was add it, I measure the jog or the 
maximum up and stop motion of the vehicle by jacking the vehicle off grade, 
while the tires where still touching the floor.

I am using a rear wheel drive, so I measure the difference of drive line 
angle while the vehicle was off grade and on grade and the amount of forward 
and backward motion of the drive line.

I left the existing suspension in place for now and when the EV was 
completed, I weigh the whole vehicle, the front axle, and the rear axle. I 
than measure the height of the vehicle off grade at the front and act the 
rear.

If you order a set of custom springs, then they will have to know what the 
existing weight on each wheel was as compare to what it will have on. They 
will need to known the full length of the existing spring loaded while in 
the vehicle and unloaded while they are off the vehicle. You also have to 
give them the diameter of coil and also the diameter of the coil wire.

I found that my rear was lower by 1.125 inch and the front was up 0.875 
inch. So all I did was use a heavy duty load type spring for the rears and 
pump up the Monroe air shocks I had on the air to 80 psi and that brought up 
the rear to the stock height.

The front was still high by 0.625 of a inch, because the front springs was 
design for a large engine. So I remove them, and took them to a Spring 
Service place to match them up to a shorter set of springs that also may 
have a different spring rate.

Look in your yellow pages, and look for springs or spring service. These 
places are not allow to modified any springs, by heating by heating or 
cutting. Only replace with a standard duty or heavy duty types.

Roland


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "m gol" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 2:42 PM
Subject: [EVDL] rear coil spring upgrade


> Hello
>
> I want to fix the suspension on a 81 vw rabbit.
>
> Is coilsprings.com the best place to go?
>
> Is there another way? Supposedly you could get a cup to compress the 
> spring,
> but not sure how that would help?
>
>
> thanks
>
>
> Mike G.
> Fairbanks
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
> 


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hello

Thanks for your response.

With the Geo Metro I didn't change the coil springs, I was able to add air
bags in the rear coils to bring the rear end back up.

However on the 81 vw rabbit you can't do that because you have a coil that
goes over the shock...

since I paid only $100 for the air bags for the geo I was wondering if their
was an inexpensive way of improving the rear height of the rabbit....

I don't have any local coil spring shops in this state, but
coilsprings.comseems reasonable at about $279 for the pair...I just
wanted to know if I
need to do that?


thanks!



> Roland Wiench <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > By fixing the suspension, what do you mean?
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> "m gol" <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> >Hello
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Lookup Coil Spring Specialties in Kansas. They did a pair for the front of 
my rabbit for $168 shipped. You just tell them how much weight you want them 
to handle.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neon John" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2008 9:18 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] rear coil spring upgrade


>


> "m gol" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>Hello
> >>
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Admittedly, I did not do much price comparison research, but I had a 
good experience with

www.springworks.com.

John


> m gol wrote:
> 
> > Hello
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Just ordered a set for my '87 VW Cabriolet (fronts) for $189 from 
coilsprings.com (Coil Spring Specialties in St. Mary's, KS).

My mechanic coaxed 2" of height into the REAR of my car by placing a 2" 
length of steel pipe around the rear shock absorber. The pipe sat between 
the spring cup and it's original perch on the shock. Of course it didn't 
help with the spring rate, but it kept me from draggin along the ground 
until I got some beefier springs.

My new springs have a great rate, but the ride height was too low. 
Couldn't reproduce the steel pipe trick due to slightly different 
construction on my new shocks  I ended up stacking a few large washers 
between the top of the spring/shock assembly and the rubber mount that 
fits over the threaded rod at the top. Not the best solution, but it 
works...

I can get some drawings/pics if you'd like.

-Adrian


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

pictures would be wonderful.

not sure if I have a cup,



> Adrian DeLeon <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Just ordered a set for my '87 VW Cabriolet (fronts) for $189 from
> > coilsprings.com (Coil Spring Specialties in St. Mary's, KS).
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Hi Guyz;

For what it's worth I Found a set of rear springs and shocks from a BMW 
sedan, in the junk yard, a 526 I I think?About an 85 or so? Bolted right in 
to the wabbit, only had to bore out the lower arms. Fit perfectly, good ride 
height with 14 batteries in back, 5 under the rear seat, 9 in the rear 
BEHIND the seat, in a well cut into the sheet metal. No spare tire THERE 
anymore!

My too wats too late post!

Bob, 82 Wabbit.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "m gol" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 2:00 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] rear coil spring upgrade


> pictures would be wonderful.
>
> not sure if I have a cup,
>
>


> Adrian DeLeon <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> Just ordered a set for my '87 VW Cabriolet (fronts) for $189 from
> >> coilsprings.com (Coil Spring Specialties in St. Mary's, KS).
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

did you mean BMW 528 ? I don't there is a 526..



> Bob Rice <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Hi Guyz;
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

so who has been down the 'spring path' for a mazda truck?

<my motor spoda be in today.....gettin excited!>


-- 
lyn williams <[email protected]>


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

tell more about audi 400... year? is that an american model number?



> Bill Dube <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Audi 4000 springs will add about an inch of height to a VW Rabbit.
> >
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

>tell more about audi 400... year? is that an american model number?

According to wikipedia, the 4000 was a US market model number used in 1980 to 1987 for the car marketed in Europe as the Audi 80. The same car was sold as the VW quantum (US name, Passat in Europe) '82 to '88.

Bill


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Bob and All,
I thought I had posted about my coil spring swap, and sure enough (see
below), from the evdl.org/help/Yahoo Groups Message Archive link,
the archives are your friend at:
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/evdl_post_archive/
Suck Amps,
BB

>Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 02:12:41 -0400
>From: "Bob Rice" <[email protected]>
>
> Hi Guyz;
>
> For what it's worth I Found a set of rear springs and shocks from a BMW 
>sedan, in the junk yard, a 526 I I think?About an 85 or so? Bolted right in 
>to the wabbit, only had to bore out the lower arms. Fit perfectly, good ride 
>height with 14 batteries in back, 5 under the rear seat, 9 in the rear 
>BEHIND the seat, in a well cut into the sheet metal. No spare tire THERE 
>anymore!
>
> My too wats too late post!
>
> Bob, 82 Wabbit.


Sat Apr 21, 2007 10:58 pm
Re: Suspension and weight distribution 
John, Michael and All,
I hope you didn't put all 24 batteries in the bed, and if you did, it's
just temporary! I only have six floodies under the hood of the truck, and
it's still not enough weight to keep the front tires from breaking loose
under hard decelerating. Also, I would recommend putting the remaining
batteries under the bed for better handling, which you might already be
planning. As far as air shocks, I wouldn't recommend them either for a
permanent solution, as there mounts aren't designed to carry the weight,
and it changes the suspension geometry. Also, air shocks have a harsh ride
and when they blow out, which they will eventually do, it will be at the
worst possible time! Either add a leaf (or two), or change out the coils.
And speaking of changing out the coils, our RX-7 was converted by someone
else with too many floodies in the rear and air shocks. When one of the
shocks blew out last year I replaced them with stock shocks and changed the
coil springs. I had an old '69 Bronco and the front coils were only
slightly larger inside, so they fit over the RX-7 coil mounts nicely. I
simply cut them to the same length as the stock springs after removing
them, and there larger thickness maintained the same ride height as the air
shocks! Now I can put on wider tires and not worry about a fender eating
them when the air shock blows. And Michael, you know how to tell the
difference between a ******* and a progressive *******(tm) like myself? A
progressive ******* drives an eelectric pickup truck!
Hope this helps,
Suck Amps...
50,000 plus pure eelectric miles on the buggies, and a countin',
Dave (B.B.) Hawkins
Member of the Denver Electric Vehicle Council:
http://www.devc.info/
Card carrying member and former racer with The National Electric Drag
Racing Association:
http://www.nedra.com/
Lyons, Colorado
1979 Mazda RX-7 EV (192V of Orbs for the teenage daughter)
1989 GM (General Murderers of the pure EV!) S10 (144V of floodies, for Pa
only!)

2004 Toyota Prius (for Ma, and Pa if Ma is a supervising!)


>Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 20:31:26 -0700 (PDT)
>From: Michael Barkley <[email protected]>
>
>I'm looking at adding "Air Shocks" to my EV. You can adjust the air pressure

<snip>


> >John O'Connor <[email protected]> wrote:
> > HOUSTON WE HAVE A PROBLEM.
> >
> >I loaded all my batteries in the back of my pick-up conversion
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I took some pictures http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/
See "Beefing up the rear suspension"

http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/dsc00085.jpg


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Jeff?

Sorry, just noticed your response...

Could you have just cut the orignal springs and still used the spacers?

What about the shocks?



> Jeff Shanab <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > I took some pictures http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/
> > See "Beefing up the rear suspension"
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Whoa, 6 months, that is tenacity.
If I cut the stock spring, it would not be as stiff and wuold have a 
destructive end on it.
Using the short stiff spring allowed me to get the higher rate and using 
it and the spacer allowed me to assemble it without a spring compressor.
The rubber has a hole thru it so the stock shocks were re-inserted, but 
they are toast. When I go thru a dip the back end will oscillate pretty bad.
It doesn't oscillate so much, but the initial deflection is to fast. 
More dampening is needed. (so is more $)

> Jeff?
>
> Sorry, just noticed your response...
>
> Could you have just cut the orignal springs and still used the spacers?
>
> What about the shocks?
>
>


> Jeff Shanab <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> > I took some pictures http://cvevs.jfs-tech.com/
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

I thought that if you cut a coil spring it actually increases the 
spring rate. In an earlier day we lowered vehicles that way and they 
rode a little stiffer. Probably not enough to make a difference in 
your case.

Kelly Hales

Sent from my iPhone



> Jeff Shanab <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Whoa, 6 months, that is tenacity.
> > If I cut the stock spring, it would not be as stiff and wuold have a
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

Isn't difficult to cut the spring?
How did you do it, so that it would still fit correctly?



> Kelly Hales <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > I thought that if you cut a coil spring it actually increases the
> > spring rate. In an earlier day we lowered vehicles that way and they
> ...


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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

> I thought that if you cut a coil spring it actually increases the 
> spring rate. In an earlier day we lowered vehicles that way and they 
> rode a little stiffer. Probably not enough to make a difference in 
> your case.
>
> Kelly Hales
>
> Sent from my iPhone

First of all, everyone should realize that a coil spring is just a 
torsion bar that has been coiled up.
So, while it is true the same amount of deflection is now spread across 
a shorter torsion bar, the diameter of that bar makes a much bigger 
difference.
In olden days of heavy V8 cruisers and heavy suspension components and 
wheels and poor shocks, it was more common to have progressive springs, 
cutting off the first few coils got rid of the softer part of the spring.

But given that I was interested in both restoring ride height and 
stiffening it a bit, and I didn't have adjustable perches, the shortened 
stock spring would of needed spacers and may of gone coil to coil on me.


This is by the way a common thing they do in designing suspension.
given a corner weight of 600 lbs.(and a hypothetical 1:1 ratio) You can 
support it an infinite number of ways, 2 of which could be

A) spring constant K= 300 lbs/in and 2" of preload. It now takes an 
additional 300lb to deflect 1"
or
B)spring constant of 150 lbs/in and 4" of preload. it now takes an 
additional 150lbs to deflect 1"

This effects roll rate, dive and squat, and compliance(keeping tire on road)

The choices are not without compromise. and suspension geometry plays a 
huge role as well as center of gravity.

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## EVDL List (Jul 27, 2007)

a cut off wheel in a grinder does it just fine. On the truck I cut, 
one end was just a plain straight end cut, the other end had a closed 
and flattened (don't know the proper terms). I wouldn't do it on a non- 
strait cut end.

Kelly Hales

Sent from my iPhone



> "m gol" <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Isn't difficult to cut the spring?
> > How did you do it, so that it would still fit correctly?
> ...


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