# Tesla 3 battery pack with Tesla ldu and Ingenext battery controller



## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

dlud said:


> My current questions relate to whether anyone else has successfully used the Ingenext battery controller with the ldu...


I don't know, but it seems unlikely that many people have combined the battery pack from a current design EV and the motor of a discontinued and inferior (in efficiency and cooling) design from a different model. I don't know of any reason that it wouldn't work - I just don't think you're likely find examples.


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## brian_ (Feb 7, 2017)

dlud said:


> Current project is a scratch build frame with a Tesla S ldu and rear suspension dropout. I have a complete Tesla 3 battery pack that I have designed and contructed the frame around.


I look forward to seeing this when you're ready to share it. I assume that this is the project with C5 suspension that you mentioned earlier, although if the rear suspension choice has gone from C5 to Model S, perhaps the front suspension has changed too.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

This is the same project. Using C5 front suspension. Rather than splitting the drive and the inverter to fit into the C5 rear suspension I sourced a full rear suspension/drive from a S (Sport). Solved several issues at one time (axles, brakes, e brake). Worked out much better dollar wise as well.


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## DANTM (Feb 4, 2019)

dlud said:


> This is the same project. Using C5 front suspension. Rather than splitting the drive and the inverter to fit into the C5 rear suspension I sourced a full rear suspension/drive from a S (Sport). Solved several issues at one time (axles, brakes, e brake). Worked out much better dollar wise as well.


That is a lot of problems to solve as the custom axles are about $1500, but since you are building a whole frame, didn't you pretty much start out with quite a big problem? Not to mention the whole custom body/interior?


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

Not really as I started out intending on building pretty much from scratch. The question was what was the platform. Seemed like a good opportunity to go ev. Admittedly there are a lot of pieces to this puzzle..


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

The Model S struts are total crap for building a low height car


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## DANTM (Feb 4, 2019)

I have been eyeing that Ingenext solution for another conversion one day as I have an extra LDU in the garage. As to your initial post, I used the 057 control solution and it was dead easy to use regular switches for controls. As for the capacitors in the LDU, I used a ZEVA precharger. Works well.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

DANTM said:


> I have been eyeing that Ingenext solution for another conversion one day as I have an extra LDU in the garage. As to your initial post, I used the 057 control solution and it was dead easy to use regular switches for controls. As for the capacitors in the LDU, I used a ZEVA precharger. Works well.


Yes, I looked at 057 but at the time they only sold with the drive unit. I'm hoping that I can use the Tesla 3 battery pack complete with their charger, dc-dc and contactors.


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## Brute Force (Aug 28, 2010)

I purchased the Ingenext controller to run a conversion project. I'm transplanting a TM3 AWD drivetrain and battery into an older semi-classic cruiser (story for another day). The controller is more of a gateway as it relies on an external source of CAN commands to make the system function. While their web site indicates that digital inputs can be used to as an alternative to the CAN commands, the system still requires the CAN commands to function. Your choices to make it work are either be a CAN expert, or pony up another $3500 for their touch screen controller (which is currently sold out).

I'm working with them to try to get their "controller" to actually control the system.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

Brute Force said:


> I purchased the Ingenext controller to run a conversion project. I'm transplanting a TM3 AWD drivetrain and battery into an older semi-classic cruiser (story for another day). The controller is more of a gateway as it relies on an external source of CAN commands to make the system function. While their web site indicates that digital inputs can be used to as an alternative to the CAN commands, the system still requires the CAN commands to function. Your choices to make it work are either be a CAN expert, or pony up another $3500 for their touch screen controller (which is currently sold out).
> 
> I'm working with them to try to get their "controller" to actually control the system.


So am I but no solution yet. A little concerning.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> So am I but no solution yet. A little concerning.


I am doing a TM3 RDU and Battery Pack conversion in to my VW Transporter VAN.
I have watched Super Fast Matt - 



He used a CAN command to bring the battery out of standby, then used buttons to select the drive mode.

I'm looking to use a PolyKup - https://polykup.com
Base Tier MCU to send and receive CAN commands but this is pre-configured, so no user adjustments or customisation.

I may also use a ECUmaste - Ecumaster
ADU. This is fully customisable but is not a touch screen.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

Ingenext says that the way it is now, the only way to operate the battery or charger is through CAN. I have just the battery controller as they don't have an integrated controller for the T3 battery and the ldu. And, they can't say whether the battery's contactors will work with the ldu. I may have to return the controller and ditch the idea of using the T3 battery.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Ingenext says that the way it is now, the only way to operate the battery or charger is through CAN. I have just the battery controller as they don't have an integrated controller for the T3 battery and the ldu. And, they can't say whether the battery's contactors will work with the ldu. I may have to return the controller and ditch the idea of using the T3 battery.


Did Ingenext say when 'CAN control only' was implemented?

I have a controller from May 2021, brought unused from a guy in the Netherlands.
I have been emailing Ingenext and they say the controller can be modified to use push buttons on digital inputs but best to use CAN control.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

tesla_transporter said:


> Thats worrying news!
> 
> Did Ingenext say when 'CAN control only' was implemented?
> I have a controller from May 2021, brought unused from a guy in the Netherlands.
> I have been emailing Ingenext and they say the controller can be modified to use push buttons on digital inputs but best to use CAN control. The documentation supplied does not mention anything about modifying the controller!


Not sure. I just received mine last week and after looking at the schematics and instructions I didn't see any method for digital control. Emailed and was advised that it was not included in my kit: 
*"We did not include it in the kit we sent you. The reason is simple, you can adjust the charging current, the percentage of end of charge and you have access to the limitation of the battery via the CAN bus. Using the battery via digital inputs is possible but if you discharge the battery too much or if you use too much current, the pyrofuse will be triggered. In order to use the battery safely it is better to use it via CAN commands."*
That does sound like the same message you received. We'll learn CAN programming together (I hope).


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## oudevolvo (Mar 10, 2015)

What kind of “CAN controls” are we talking about?
Thinks like making sure the VCU from the LDU obeys the max. current in and out indicated by the BMS?
Then it could be a gateway making sure messaged with a certain ID and structure are translated into another ID and structure if not by default compatible.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

oudevolvo said:


> What kind of “CAN controls” are we talking about?
> Thinks like making sure the VCU from the LDU obeys the max. current in and out indicated by the BMS?
> Then it could be a gateway making sure messaged with a certain ID and structure are translated into another ID and structure if not by default compatible.


Hi Lars!
I just emailed you from my work account


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Not sure. I just received mine last week and after looking at the schematics and instructions I didn't see any method for digital control. Emailed and was advised that it was not included in my kit:
> *"We did not include it in the kit we sent you. The reason is simple, you can adjust the charging current, the percentage of end of charge and you have access to the limitation of the battery via the CAN bus. Using the battery via digital inputs is possible but if you discharge the battery too much or if you use too much current, the pyrofuse will be triggered. In order to use the battery safely it is better to use it via CAN commands."*
> That does sound like the same message you received. We'll learn CAN programming together (I hope).


Have a loom at this, should answer your questions-


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

tesla_transporter said:


> Have a loom at this, should answer your questions-


 Yes, I watched that yesterday. It did answer my question (implicitly) regarding the compatibility of the ldu with the T3 battery, In other words, they were able to get them to work together.They indicated that they had to have some "remote" CAN programming done. Not sure if they were referring to that peformed by Ingenext or some other vendor. I did ask some question in the comments section related to that. Also, it sounds like they had to do some workaround with the hvil system...not sure what the problem was or how they resolved it.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Yes, I watched that yesterday. It did answer my question (implicitly) regarding the compatibility of the ldu with the T3 battery, In other words, they were able to get them to work together.They indicated that they had to have some "remote" CAN programming done. Not sure if they were referring to that peformed by Ingenext or some other vendor. I did ask some question in the comments section related to that. Also, it sounds like they had to do some workaround with the hvil system...not sure what the problem was or how they resolved it.


Let me know what they said.
I tried to find your post in the comments but there are too many comments go through!


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

tesla_transporter said:


> Let me know what they said.
> I tried to find your post in the comments but there are too many comments go through!


Haven't heard from S to S but I'm going to SEMA and I hope to find their booth and ask some questions. I did contact Polykup and they said that they can integrate their vcu and display with the Ingenext controller and already have the DBC files to do so. I already purchased a drive controller from EV Controllers but I may return that and go the Polykup route. That would make for a much cleaner install and display.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Haven't heard from S to S but I'm going to SEMA and I hope to find their booth and ask some questions. I did contact Polykup and they said that they can integrate their vcu and display with the Ingenext controller and already have the DBC files to do so. I already purchased a drive controller from EV Controllers but I may return that and go the Polykup route. That would make for a much cleaner install and display.


Man I wish I was going to SEMA!


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Haven't heard from S to S but I'm going to SEMA and I hope to find their booth and ask some questions. I did contact Polykup and they said that they can integrate their vcu and display with the Ingenext controller and already have the DBC files to do so. I already purchased a drive controller from EV Controllers but I may return that and go the Polykup route. That would make for a much cleaner install and display.


Did you get any further info from S to S?


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

No more response on UTube comments. I did go to SEMA but didn't see them. They weren't listed as an exhibitor and I learned after the fact that they were not in the convention hall but out in a parking area and were associated with another exhibitor. 
I did decide to return the EV Controller drive controller and am going with Polykup as they have a more integrated system with lots of features.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> No more response on UTube comments. I did go to SEMA but didn't see them. They weren't listed as an exhibitor and I learned after the fact that they were not in the convention hall but out in a parking area and were associated with another exhibitor.
> I did decide to return the EV Controller drive controller and am going with Polykup as they have a more integrated system with lots of features.





dlud said:


> No more response on UTube comments. I did go to SEMA but didn't see them. They weren't listed as an exhibitor and I learned after the fact that they were not in the convention hall but out in a parking area and were associated with another exhibitor.
> I did decide to return the EV Controller drive controller and am going with Polykup as they have a more integrated system with lots of features.


Polykup do seem to be getting things sorted on the Model 3 battery pack.
I'm still waiting for them to confirm that their testing is successful.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

tesla_transporter said:


> Polykup do seem to be getting things sorted on the Model 3 battery pack.
> I'm still waiting for them to confirm that their testing is successful.


I wasn't aware that they were developing a controller for the T 3 battery pack.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> I wasn't aware that they were developing a controller for the T 3 battery pack.


They are not developing a battery pack controller far as I know.
What I meant is, they are testing their MCU with the CAN signals that the Ingenext battery controller uses.


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

tesla_transporter said:


> They are not developing a battery pack controller far as I know.
> What I meant is, they are testing their MCU with the CAN signals that the Ingenext battery controller uses.


Still waiting on Ingenext to respond to questions about wiring and to schedule reprogramming (remote). Their "support" is glacial in responding. Polykup said that they could integrate the Ingenext CAN files into their system. Waiting for the hardware from them.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

dlud said:


> Still waiting on Ingenext to respond to questions about wiring and to schedule reprogramming (remote). Their "support" is glacial in responding. Polykup said that they could integrate the Ingenext CAN files into their system. Waiting for the hardware from them.


Happy New Year!

I have been speaking to a software engineer, and he said he will be able to 'build' me an ecu that will be able to accept analogue inputs and output them as CAN signals to the Ingenext controller. 
This will allow me to use buttons for drive mode select, and a seperate display for system information. 

I'm waiting for my van to be completed at the fabricators, then I will be straight on to the electronics.


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## remy_martian (Feb 4, 2019)

dlud said:


> Yes, I looked at 057 but at the time they only sold with the drive unit.


They still do, which is a mistake for those of us having an entire donor car:

"Please note: Due to quality and reliability issues with third-party supplied drive units, we do _not_ offer control packages for drive units not purchased from us." - 057tech.com


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## wigman (Oct 16, 2019)

This is Dave with the Mercedes’ 300cd ldu swap. I’m a new employee at salvage and have been tasked with finishing up the Tesla truck. As far as my understanding the charging works and the ldu outputs control the contactors but there is no data display to show SOC, charging parameters, error codes, etc. the pack is powering two ldu’s with zero ev boards. When you ask for full acceleration there is a reduction in current (power lag) and sometimes a full stall that shuts down the contactors. I was planning on contacting ingenx to see what is needed for display and data. I’ll let everyone know if there’s a solution. We have an AEM screen in the truck that I assume can put up data through CAN but I don’t know if there is some in between software to translate the ingenx control into AEM display data.


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

wigman said:


> This is Dave with the Mercedes’ 300cd ldu swap. I’m a new employee at salvage and have been tasked with finishing up the Tesla truck. As far as my understanding the charging works and the ldu outputs control the contactors but there is no data display to show SOC, charging parameters, error codes, etc. the pack is powering two ldu’s with zero ev boards. When you ask for full acceleration there is a reduction in current (power lag) and sometimes a full stall that shuts down the contactors. I was planning on contacting ingenx to see what is needed for display and data. I’ll let everyone know if there’s a solution. We have an AEM screen in the truck that I assume can put up data through CAN but I don’t know if there is some in between software to translate the ingenx control into AEM display data.


Hi Dave,
Nice Merc!
I think you should be able to use Tea-Lax - tes𐫴LAX
You will need the Ingnext Battery Controller CAN file, uploaded to Tes-Lax.

I will be using the same in my van but with the Battery / motor CAN file.


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## wigman (Oct 16, 2019)

I put the tes-lax ap on my phone. Eventually I want to put it on the AEM screen and then have the data come to it via CAN bus from the ingenx controller? How would I get the tes-lax onto the AEM screen?


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## dlud (Jul 19, 2021)

Why not load the Ingenext dbc’s directly to the AEM display? I don’t understand why you need the tes lax app to do that?


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## tesla_transporter (Aug 20, 2021)

wigman said:


> I put the tes-lax ap on my phone. Eventually I want to put it on the AEM screen and then have the data come to it via CAN bus from the ingenx controller? How would I get the tes-lax onto the AEM screen?


As dlud says.
Just load the DBC's directly to the AEM if that's where you want the information.
Tes-Lax won't be able to run on the AEM.


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